tactics of the NRA

[Doryman]

Re: RE: tactics of the NRA

The NRA pushes for NOTHING in Canada.
Personally, I don't think pistol grips, flash hiders, and bayonet lugs are all that lethal. Those are the ONLY difference between "assault" rifles and sporting rifles.

I'm not exactly a foaming enemy of gun ownership, Colpy, but you can't really say that you see no difference between a bayonet lug-less pistol-grip-less, AK-47 and a bolt action .303, can you? I mean, the automatic 30-round clip vs. the 5 round bolt-action clip makes up the main difference, me thinks.

But really, if Bono has the right to repeatedly talk to our Prime Minister about feeding aids-stricken vegetarian children in Africa or whatever, doesn't the NRA have the right to talk to political candidates about the issues they deem important? Personally I think the NRA is comprised of nut-case militiamen and Rambo fanboys, but even I have to admit that they shouldn't be banned from even communicating with our country.

 

[Colpy]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1534305/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1534305/posts
The organization that has been fighting Canada's gun-control laws has offered election help to the Conservatives, and is bringing in a top gun from the U.S. National Rifle Association to show it how to be more effective, it said yesterday.

The link I could access (from the Toronto Star, now there is a shining beaxcon of truth...NOT) actually supports every word I said.

The NRA is up here to help teach Canadian shooters how to have more political influence.

The NRA is not devoting money to the cause, just advice.

Canadian shooting associations have no affiliation to any party.....but that may change, since every party but the CPC is foaming at the mouth at the chance to steal from Canadian shooters.

So what is your problem? Do you think unions associated with the NDP never have speakers or advisors from the USA come to help them?

It is exactly the same thing, except you agree with one, and not the other.

 

[Colpy]

From the front page of the province newspaper in british columbia.

David Carrigg, The Province; with a file by Canadian Press
Published: Tuesday, December 06, 2005

The U.S.-based National Rifle Association has entered the Canadian political fray as gun violence spirals out of control in B.C. and Ontario.
"This is absolutely appalling. I say, 'Go Home' to the NRA," said Svend Robinson, federal NDP candidate for Vancouver Centre. "The NRA has no place in Canadian politics. Especially when we have all these local concerns with gun violence."

Gee, I thought you guys have insisted for the last ten years that gun violence would be decreased by us registering our guns. Guess not, eh? So why should we believe you when you insist stealing my .357 Magnum will stop gun crime in Toronto?

This is especially silly when you take a closer look at murder rates in Canada. They are low.

A Canadian Shooting Sports Association spokesman told the national media that his group was working with the federal Conservative Party.

But James Moore, Conservative MP for Port Moody-Westwood-Port Coquitlam, said last night that Tory Leader Stephen Harper has not met with the association.

"I believe in gun control that works, and getting tougher on violent criminals," Moore said. "Anybody who commits a violent crime should receive a mandatory prison sentence. We disagree with the NRA position that anybody should be able to have a gun."

First of all, doesn't the Coalition for Gun Control work with the Liberal government?

The Canadian National Firearms Association (of which I am a member) proposes and supports a gun control regimen called the Practical Firearms Control System that includes strict licensing of gun owners. They are definitely not the NRA.

"I don't know why the NRA has any role to play in a Canadian election," Fry said. "I'm very upset. They are interfering with our democratic process. The right to bear arms is not something we have in the Canadian constitution."

Hedy ought to read more.

Deputy Prime Minister Anne McLellan also condemned what she called the intervention of the NRA.

"The NRA and their U.S.-style, big-money gun-lobby efforts are not welcome here," she said.

No, McLellan thinks the only voice allowed should be the Coalition for Gun Control, which is bought and paid for by the Government of Canada.

The CGC exists on gov't grants and its 12,000 members.

The Canadian NFA stands on its own, with money from its 110,000 members. Which is the more legitimate organization?

McLellan said NRA "efforts to foist a U.S.-style gun agenda on Canadians are inappropriate, especially given that this is the week when we remember the murder of 14 young women at the Ecole Polytechnique [in Montreal] 16 years ago."

This is getting a little tired. Gun owners have already paid for Marc LePines's hatred twice, through tough legislation in 1993, and again in 1995.

Did you know Lepine was an Arab?

"I don't pretend to have the answers," she said. "I sure hope folks get together to talk about what needs to be done to curb this increasing insanity that we're seeing in our country.

"What are the underlying social issues that make somebody want to carry a gun around?"

The "underlying social issue" that makes me carry a handgun around every day is a desire to keep my arse intact.

I guess that's alright, as long as I'm protecting the banks' money, eh?

 

[Colpy]

Re: RE: tactics of the NRA

The NRA pushes for NOTHING in Canada.
Personally, I don't think pistol grips, flash hiders, and bayonet lugs are all that lethal. Those are the ONLY difference between "assault" rifles and sporting rifles.

I'm not exactly a foaming enemy of gun ownership, Colpy, but you can't really say that you see no difference between a bayonet lug-less pistol-grip-less, AK-47 and a bolt action .303, can you? I mean, the automatic 30-round clip vs. the 5 round bolt-action clip makes up the main difference, me thinks.

But really, if Bono has the right to repeatedly talk to our Prime Minister about feeding aids-stricken vegetarian children in Africa or whatever, doesn't the NRA have the right to talk to political candidates about the issues they deem important? Personally I think the NRA is comprised of nut-case militiamen and Rambo fanboys, but even I have to admit that they shouldn't be banned from even communicating with our country.

Here's an explanation.

I own an FN FAL rifle. It is a gas operated, semi-automatic, magazine fed rifle in 7.62 NATO (.308 Winchester) caliber.
It is only legal with 5 round magazines, but 10 and 20 round magazines are made for it elsewhere. It weighs about 10 lbs, and is huge, with a 22" barrel plus flash suppressor.

It is prohibited (grandfathered), and the government has just forbidden me to even take it to the range. I think it will be seized in this round of foolishness, as it is at the very top of the "undesirable" category.

I also owned a Remington model 742 Carbine. It is a gas operated, semi-automatic magazine fed rifle in .308 Winchester (7.62 NATO) caliber. It is only legal with 5 round magazines, but 10 and 20 round magazines are made for it elsewhere. It weighs about 8 lbs, and is short and handy.

This is a non-restricted rifle, among the least controled firearms in Canada. It is a nice deer rifle.

The only difference in these two weapons is appearance. They fire the same ammunition in exactly the same way, fed from exactly the same type of magazine.

In fact, the Remington is much handier, and would be much easier to handle in the seat of a car, say in a drive-by.

This whole system is nonsense.

 

[Cosmo]

Did you know Lepine was an Arab?

Colpy ... what, exactly, does that have to do with anything???? It's a racist comment and just plain dumb. It has nothing to do with gun control nor with Lepine's actions. Sometimes I wonder about you. :roll: :roll:

 

[Colpy]

Did you know Lepine was an Arab?

Colpy ... what, exactly, does that have to do with anything???? It's a racist comment and just plain dumb. It has nothing to do with gun control nor with Lepine's actions. Sometimes I wonder about you. :roll: :roll:

It simply had this to do with it; Lepine's father, an Algerian, hated women and mistreated Lepine's mother terribly.

He passed his hatred of women down to his son.

It is not a racial bias because of colour that I am expressing, it is a cultural bias against women-haters.

The culture that has borne the brunt of the backlash against Lepine has been Canadian gun owners.

 

[Cosmo]

It simply had this to do with it; Lepine's father, an Algerian, hated women and mistreated Lepine's mother terribly.

He passed his hatred of women down to his son.

It is not a racial bias because of colour that I am expressing, it is a cultural bias against women-haters.

The culture that has borne the brunt of the backlash against Lepine has been Canadian gun owners.

What a crock. Lepine's mother was French Canadian ... and equally responsible for his dysfunctional childhood. To intimate that it has anything to do with his race is absurd and self-serving on your part. The guy was the product of a bad home and a whack job. Wouldn't have made any difference if he were of Irish or English descent.

Colpy, I am against the gun registry laws. If you read my previous posts you'll see I'm a staunch supporter of the right to own guns without government intervention. I think using Lepine and his ilk as a support for gun control only tarnishes the memory of the unfortunate victims and sensationalizes something sad and horrible to serve a perverse purpose. It's wrong. But so is playing the race card. That is just as wrong.

Your words do more to harm the cause of freedom of gun ownership than a dozen pacifists ever could. You make us all look like gun toting KKK supporters. You're not helping and you are showing your own prejudice in the process.

 

[Reverend Blair]

LePine was an Arab, the shootings in Toronto are the Jamaican community's fault, native youth gangs and African immigrants are to blame for all of the crime in Winnipeg, and Asian gangs are to blame for every problem on the west coast.

Been here before. Heard the racism and bullshit. I've heard the cries of, "We're not racist," followed immediately by, "but..."

It's the Conservative way. Blame whole communities. Blame entire cultures. Blame races. Never address the root causes. Never consider the implications of neo-conservative policies. Gut social programs. Encourage the police to use racial profiling. Encourage police brutality until nobody in the targeted racial groups trusts a cop. Give everybody a gun. Build gated communities to keep "those" people out. Push for immigration from Europe only. Maybe not Eastern Europe though...they talk funny and have Christmas at the wrong time and there's that whole Russian Mafia thing.

The problem is cultural, Colpy. It's the culture of accepting discrimination that permeates the Conservative Party that's the problem.

 

[Colpy]

Okay guys, calm down.

Murder or assault is always the responsibility, and the fault of the person that commits the crime.

I would blame no community for the act of an individual.

I am not going to fight this battle, as it is impossible to win. My point was simply that Lepine was from a culture in which women are considered slightly more valuable than a goat. If you think I'm a racist monster for that, well, not much I can say.

To paraphrase Sun Tzu.....if you can't win 'em, don't fight 'em

 

[Reverend Blair]

My point was simply that Lepine was from a culture in which women are considered slightly more valuable than a goat.

Oh, you never said he was a mamber of the Reform/Alliance/Conservative Party.

 

[iamcanadian]

The problems that underpin the violence in Canada is the same that underpins the violence in France.

It's called "Favoratism". When people are favoured because they are of certain cultures or races, the ones that are held back or less Favoured have reduced opportunities in that society.

Over time this builds into a violent response, because "Favoratism" is the exact same thing as "Racism" only applied in reverse, more suttle and applied in a more polically correct way. People are a lot smarter today than 50 years ago, especially young people.

Racism, Bigotry, Favoritism, Incumbency - A rose by any other name smells just as sweet.

 

[Reverend Blair]

Do you have any proof to back that up, iam(not)canadian? The reason I ask is because all of the numbers I've seen show that the people rioting in France were disadvantaged due to their race, not favoured. Perhaps you have some verifiable numbers from someplace?

 

[iamcanadian]

Re: RE: tactics of the NRA

The problems that underpin the violence in Canada is the same that underpins the violence in France.

It's called "Favoratism". When people are favoured because they are of certain cultures or races, the ones that are held back or are less Favoured have reduced opportunities in that society.

Over time this builds into a violent response, because "Favoratism" is the exact same thing as "Racism" only applied in reverse, more suttle and applied in a more polically correct way. People are a lot smarter today than 50 years ago, especially young people.

Racism, Bigotry, Favoritism, Incumbency - A rose by any other name smells just as sweet.

Read it again Rev.

 

[Reverend Blair]

Give us some numbers. Back up your viewpoint with facts.

 

[Doryman]

Re: RE: tactics of the NRA

It's the Conservative way. Blame whole communities. Blame entire cultures. Blame races. Never address the root causes. Never consider the implications of neo-conservative policies. Gut social programs. Encourage the police to use racial profiling. Encourage police brutality until nobody in the targeted racial groups trusts a cop. Give everybody a gun. Build gated communities to keep "those" people out. Push for immigration from Europe only. Maybe not Eastern Europe though...they talk funny and have Christmas at the wrong time and there's that whole Russian Mafia thing.

The problem is cultural, Colpy. It's the culture of accepting discrimination that permeates the Conservative Party that's the problem.

The rest of it I don't agree with, but for racial profiling...

Rev, there's a reason cops sometimes use racial profiling. It works. For a police force that is too undermanned to check and watch every single citizen, it is much more efficient to have a general idea of who the suspect may be.

For example, if you believe some Islamic Fundamentalists are going to hi-jack a plane, you're going to logically check young Arab men over 60 yr old Norwegian Grandmothers. If you have intelligence that suggests a ne0-nazi gang is going to assassinate a black politician speaking at a stadium, you're probably going to spend your time checking the line-up for young White males with shaved heads over searching for Chinese or Indian individuals. Why? Because statistics show that these people are most often the perpetrators of such crimes. Hate criminals are pre-dominantly young white males; and Islamic Fundamentalist terrorists are usually young Arab Males. IN rare occasions it MAY be that the Norwegian Grandmother was the real threat, but you have more of a chance of preventing a crime by devoting you time to the other suspects.

If you hear that a stray dog has been mauling random people in the neighbourhood you're in, are you going to look out for a Rottweiler or a chihuahua that may know Kung-Fu... ?C'mon, be logical about this. The cops are doing what they do for a reason.

And rev... you're saying it's racist to believe that an Arabic upbringing at least partially influened Lepine's action through misogynist themes and a violent culture, but there isn't anything wrong with believing that the Conservative party is similarly misogynistic? That wouldn't be ,GASP, prejudism on you part would it????

And before I'm reamed out for the crime of being a Conservative... I think they're a pack of woman hating religious nut-jobs, just like the Islamic community.I don't blame race, I blame Culture/religion.

IamCanadian...

Didn't you post that exact same post in another thread? Dude, that's just plain lazy.

 

[peapod]

Doryman, we don't care who you hate, conservative, liberal, whatever, and iamcanadian does not need you to tell him how to post. Get back on topic, there is already a racism thread. Post your deep thoughts there.

 

[Reverend Blair]

Blame whatever you want, Doryman. You think racial profiling is okay? Why not ask JJ Harper about that? Oops, sorry, you can't. The cops shot him for being an Indian.

You might support institutionalised racism, but that's your problem.

 

[iamcanadian]

Re: RE: tactics of the NRA

You might support institutionalised racism, but that's your problem.

We have institutionalized "favoratism" so whats the difference?

If you apply favoratism to one group you are discriminating against some other group or groups. Canada is a very racist country that way which is well established in practices that are visible in many ways. Nowhere more evident that in our senior public servants.

 

[Reverend Blair]

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[cub1c]

Guns shouldn't be controlled.....they should be destroyed. And everyone getting caught with a gun should get automatic jail time.

My right to be protected is completely filled when there is no gun around. POINT FINAL!