Should God the Father adore man for teaching him better morals and ethics than what h

[L Gilbert]

I'm in Ontario and yes we have many religions but we are predominantly a Christian nation and that is why I try to correct Christian moral thinking.
Regards
DL

Well, if you mean predominantly secular with most citizens having Christianity as their religion, ok.
Um, aren't you being a bit presumptuous in that you deem yourself competent enough to be the judge of other people's morality?

What is wrong with choosing to change the thinking of others if you think they are not thinking right?

Imagine how backwards we would still be if no one corrected anyone else. We would still be in the caves and trees.

Regards
DL

There's a difference between changing someone's thinking and changing something like the way they mow the lawn or build a skyscraper. Religions and rulers have been cajoling, conniving, forcing, etc. people into behaving and thinking "properly" almost since humans first walked upright.
Very few are content to let people just be human. I think that's extremely arrogant and self-righteous.

 

[DaSleeper]

During my apotheosis all I received were words and those words changed my way of thinking. I was an adult of 39 at the time.

Regards
DL

Hmmmm
I thought there was something strange about you......now I'm sure.................

 

[L Gilbert]

Hmmmm
I thought there was something strange about you......now I'm sure.................

Yeah, it's megalomania; specifically Grandiose Religious Delusion".

 

[DaSleeper]

Yeah, it's megalomania; specifically Grandiose Religious Delusion".

I knew a guy like that before the days of the internet.......It would happen every time he forgot to take his lithium

 

[L Gilbert]

lol.

 

[French Patriot]

Well, if you mean predominantly secular with most
citizens having Christianity as their religion, ok.

One you get for your more accurate rendition.

Um, aren't you being a bit presumptuous in that you deem yourself competent
enough to be the judge of other people's morality?

What can I say.
I have enough balls to state mine and argue it and no one has yet bested me.
I was born a loving child, but at about four my life went south thanks to my family, or lack of.
I developed a delinquent attitude and a -------

GOWAN ~ A CRIMINAL MIND ~ THE VIDEO - YouTube

From 20 to 39 I settled down and raised my first family and did well and developed a social conscience. I then rebelled for justice and my society and nearly lost 18 years of freedom for a society I have never been a part of because I am a loner.

I know the evil ways and that tells me what the moral ways are by default. I am not a good man yet but I know the path. I will continue my tough love path till proven wrong.

There's a difference between changing someone's thinking and changing
something like the way they mow the lawn or build a skyscraper. Religions and
rulers have been cajoling, conniving, forcing, etc. people into behaving and
thinking "properly" almost since humans first walked upright.


Very few are content to let people just be human. I think that's extremely
arrogant and self-righteous.

Arrogant. For sure. Not self-righteous. Confident in my position and try me on any of my positions and see why. I may not communicate well but I communicate from the right position.

You are basically speaking of the Noble Lie we have been living under. I have fought for repeal of it. Have you?

Regards
DL

Hmmmm
I thought there was something strange about you......now I'm sure.................

Yes. The un-enlightened and poor thinkers have no clue.

Regards
DL

Yeah, it's megalomania; specifically Grandiose Religious Delusion".

I do not put myself high but that is what those below see.

Regards
DL

 

[karrie]

I've seen people argue often against religion, LGilbert being one of the more intelligent I've discussed atheism with. I've seen plenty of people discuss the reasons they feel religion is wrong, the reasons they feel there is no god.

You sir, on the other hand, come across as having a chip on your shoulder, and a personal grudge against God. There's a world of difference between thinking there is no god, and thinking yourself better than God.

The morals of humanity and religion are not separate entities, thus the evolution of God in the Bible as society too evolved.

 

[JLM]

Should God the Father adore man for teaching him bettermorals and ethics than what he has taught man?

Does God the Father have any moral responsibility to hischildren?

I think so. God the Father’s first responsibility to hischildren is to insure that they live. God the Father does not do so. Is God theFather moral or immoral for this sin of omission?

Human Fathers have as their first moral responsibility theprotection of their children and a strong duty to insure that they live. Ourlaws make parents morally and legally responsible for the wellbeing of theirchildren. If God the Father were just one of many Gods in a God society thatsociety would demand that he take responsibility in the same way human societyhas decided that a human child’s parent must take responsibilities.

I believe that if a God the Father’s society were real, theywould demand this of God as care/harm and reciprocity are the corner stones ofall moral systems and because man, a moral creature, demands that of himselfand others and that should be the universal standard.

The fact that God the Father punishes or rewards us seems toindicate that he at least thinks that he has some moral responsibility to hischildren. If not, he could not morally retain the right to punish or reward.That being the case, it would be immoral for God to passively and negligentlyallow any of his children to die or take any active part in killing them.

God is doing these immoral, unethical and satanic thingsconstantly.

Man seems to have developed a better moral code than God theFather.

What a game for your God the Father to play!

Create a place for eternal bliss on earth and heaven as wellas a place for eternal suffering or death. Then he creates beings that he lovesdearly and watches over. And in the end, decide which to consider"trash" and "throw away" into the place for eternalsuffering or death and which to cling to and love in the place of eternalbliss. Even man, with all his faults, is greater and more responsible, moraland ethical to his children than God the Father is to his.

Is man more moral, ethical, responsible and loving than Godthe Father?

Should God the Father adore man for teaching him bettermorals and ethics than what he has taught man?

Should man adore God for teaching us what not to do by hisimmoral, unethical, irresponsible and unloving example?

Regards
DL

I guess there are as many nutty angles this subject can be approached from as there are nuts!

 

[French Patriot]

I've seen people argue often against religion, LGilbert being one of the more intelligent I've discussed atheism with. I've seen plenty of people discuss the reasons they feel religion is wrong, the reasons they feel there is no god.

You sir, on the other hand, come across as having a chip on your shoulder, and a personal grudge against God. There's a world of difference between thinking there is no god, and thinking yourself better than God.

The morals of humanity and religion are not separate entities, thus the evolution of God in the Bible as society too evolved.

I am not an atheist and perhaps that is why I am dedicated to the cause of correcting foolish thinking. Apotheosis and belief as compared to faith without facts will do that to a person.

There is a Godhead, no proof of course, but it is a moral entity and has no relationship to the genocidal son murdering God.

If given the chance I even promote the teachings of Jesus but not the brand that the churches sell. The brand that the bible does.

1A Hidden Meanings In Bible - YouTube

Did you know that the largest statue at the Vatican is a representation of the pineal gland?

Regards
DL

I guess there are as many nutty angles this subject can be approached from as there are nuts!

Eh. Thanks for giving us your moral position. I take it you love the genocidal one.

Regards
DL

 

[karrie]

I am not an atheist and perhaps that is why I am dedicated to the cause of correcting foolish thinking. Apotheosis and belief as compared to faith without facts will do that to a person.

Do you refer to your own apotheosis?

 

[French Patriot]

Do you refer to your own apotheosis?

Yes. Lend me your ear for my anecdotal rendering.

The Godhead I know in a nutshell.

I was a skeptic till the age of 39.

I then had an apotheosis and later branded myself an esoteric ecumenistand Gnostic Christian. Gnostic Christian because I exemplify this quote fromWilliam Blake.

“Both read the Bible day andnight, But thou read'st black where I read white.”

This refers to how Gnostics tend to reverse, for moral reasons, whatChristians see in the Bible. We tend to recognize the evil ways of O T Godwhere literal Christians will see God’s killing as good.Christians are sheep where Gnostic Christians are goats.

This is perhaps why we see the use of a Jesus scapegoat as immoral,while theists like to make Jesus their beast of burden. An immoral position.

During my apotheosis, something that only lasted 5 or 6 seconds, theonly things of note to happen was that my paradigm of reality was confirmed andI was chastised to think more demographically. What I found was what I call acosmic consciousness. Not a new term but one that is a close but not exact fit.

I recognize that I have no proof. That is always the way withapotheosis.

This is also why I prefer to stick to issues of morality because no onehas yet been able to prove that God is real and I have no more proof than theyfor the cosmic consciousness.

The cosmic consciousness is not a miracle working God. He does notinterfere with us save when one of us finds it. Not a common thing from what Ican see. It is a part of nature and our next evolutionary step.

I tend to have more in common with atheists who ignore what they see asmy delusion because our morals are basically identical. Theist tend not to likeme much as I have no respect for literalists and fundamentals and think thatmost Christians have tribal mentalities and poor morals.

I am rather between a rock and a hard place but this I cannot help.

I am happy to be questioned on what I believe but whether or not Godexists is basically irrelevant to this world for all that he does not do, and Iprefer to thrash out moral issues that can actually find an end point. Thesearch for God is never ending when you are of the Gnostic persuasion. Myapotheosis basically says that I am to discard whatever God I found, God as aset of rules that is, not idol worship it but instead, raise my bar and seekfurther.

My apotheosis also showed me that God has no need for love, adoration orobedience. He has no needs. Man has dominion here on earth and is to be and isthe supreme being.

Regards
DL

 

[Sal]

I am happy to be questioned on what I believe but whether or not Godexists is basically irrelevant to this world for all that he does not do, and Iprefer to thrash out moral issues that can actually find an end point. Thesearch for God is never ending when you are of the Gnostic persuasion. Myapotheosis basically says that I am to discard whatever God I found, God as aset of rules that is, not idol worship it but instead, raise my bar and seekfurther.

My apotheosis also showed me that God has no need for love, adoration orobedience. He has no needs. Man has dominion here on earth and is to be and isthe supreme being.

Regards
DL

Sounds much like the born again experience except they go in a different direction afterward. Not sure why that is really but some become quite dogmatic.

I agree that God has no need for love, adoration or obedience. Actually we were just speaking of this the other day when we were saying Grace Before Meals which we frequently attempt to do. It is a reminder for us to live in gratitude, it certainly is not for god.

Over the years my concept of God has changed dramatically but since I have a Catholic base my god resembles that but really is closer to my father since he was awesome so I am aware I do some projecting.

 

[karrie]

My apotheosis also showed me that God has no need for love, adoration orobedience. He has no needs. Man has dominion here on earth and is to be and isthe supreme being.

Regards
DL

Well, if you can find a Christian who is rigidly adhered to the notions you claim Christians have, and who wants to debate that with you, all the luck to you.

I for one can't debate it as I don't hold to the literal interpretations you're attempting to base Christian belief on.

 

[Cliffy]

Here is another view: Jesus in India

Jesus in India - Beyond Belief Documentary - YouTube

 

[French Patriot]

Sounds much like the born again experience except they go in a different direction afterward. Not sure why that is really but some become quite dogmatic.

I agree that God has no need for love, adoration or obedience. Actually we were just speaking of this the other day when we were saying Grace Before Meals which we frequently attempt to do. It is a reminder for us to live in gratitude, it certainly is not for god.

Over the years my concept of God has changed dramatically but since I have a Catholic base my god resembles that but really is closer to my father since he was awesome so I am aware I do some projecting.

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I believe that they become dogmatic due to whatever environment they live in. I think it is to appease the tribal instincts that we mostly all have.

Richard Dawkins What if scientists worked like religions? - YouTube


God has changed but not fast enough for me. If you are more into spirituality and not religion then people like this bishop is who I would recommend.

Controversial retired bishop John Spong on religion. full sh - YouTube


As a Gnostic Christian, I follow my own God but good information or views are always good to hear.

Regards
DL

Well, if you can find a Christian who is rigidly adhered to the notions you claim Christians have, and who wants to debate that with you, all the luck to you.

I for one can't debate it as I don't hold to the literal interpretations you're attempting to base Christian belief on.

No problem. There is a God but just not the miracle working super God that Christianity has invented.

I have no objections to the more left leaning Christians. The harm, if any they do is to themselves and their children. I recognize our tribal instincts and know that most need to appease them.

I take the position I do to target the right wing literalists and fundamentals as they are the one's doing the greater harm.

It is my view that all literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us whoare moral religionists as well as those who do not believe. They all hurt theirparent religions and everyone else who has a belief or not. They make us allinto laughing stocks and should rethink their position. There is a Godhead butnot the God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution. Beliefs infantasy, miracles and magic are evil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HKHaClUCw4&feature=PlayList&p=5123864A5243470E&index=0&playnext=1

They also do much harm to their own.

African witches and Jesus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlRG9gXriVI&feature=related

Jesus Camp 1of 9
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=48b_1185215493

Death to Gays.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMw2Zg_BVzw&feature=related

For evil to grow my friends, all good people need do is nothing.
Fight them when you can. It is your duty to our fellow humans.

Regards
DL

 

[Goober]

Deleted

 

[DaSleeper]

Shoveling snow....as much as I hate it.....sure beats shoveling this.******

 

[karrie]

Shoveling snow....as much as I hate it.....sure beats shoveling this.******

so move to a condo somewhere warm, figuratively speaking. Or, give us something more interesting to shovel.

 

[Goober]

so move to a condo somewhere warm, figuratively speaking. Or, give us something more interesting to shovel.

I hope he does and has room for long term company.

 

[MHz]

My apotheosis also showed me that God has no need for love, adoration or obedience. He has no needs. Man has dominion here on earth and is to be and is the supreme being.

He is a stickler for details though and obedience of the Law is love.

Jer:4:28:
For this shall the earth mourn,
and the heavens above be black:
because I have spoken it,
I have purposed it,
and will not repent,
neither will I turn back from it.

Isa:55:11:
So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth:
it shall not return unto me void,
but it shall accomplish that which I please,
and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Proverb:8:32:
Now therefore hearken unto me,
O ye children:
for blessed are they that keep my ways.
Proverb:8:33:
Hear instruction,
and be wise,
and refuse it not.
Proverb:8:34:
Blessed is the man that heareth me,
watching daily at my gates,
waiting at the posts of my doors.
Proverb:8:35:
For whoso findeth me findeth life,
and shall obtain favour of the LORD.
Proverb:8:36:
But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul:
all they that hate me love death.

Do you really think it matters to God if you are gathered at the beginning or just before the end of salvation? That you get gathered is what He sees as being the important part, and we can't even get that little detail figured out correctly.