New Mexico Abolishes Death Penalty.

[JLM]

Closure is subjective, ironsides. In Canada when the criminal is convicted and finally locked up, it gives closure to the family. So it does (I assume) in the states which do not have the death penalty).

Speak for yourself Sir Rupe, if something happened to one of my grandchildren or my friend's grandchildren, locking the S.O.B. up would not give me any closure- I'd be forced to commit some serious but less heinous crime to get locked up next to the S.O.B., then there'd be closure.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Speak for yourself Sir Rupe, if something happened to one of my grandchildren or my friend's grandchildren, locking the S.O.B. up would not give me any closure- I'd be forced to commit some serious but less heinous crime to get locked up next to the S.O.B., then there'd be closure.

Whatever floats your boat, JLM. If that is what you want, go for it. I just hope the joy of revenge, the feeling of satisfaction you getting after killing the S.O.B. will be worth it, because it will have to last you a lifetime (you will be locked up for life).

 

[JLM]

Whatever floats your boat, JLM. If that is what you want, go for it. I just hope the joy of revenge, the feeling of satisfaction you getting after killing the S.O.B. will be worth it, because it will have to last you a lifetime (you will be locked up for life).

That's debatable, I'd probably get a reduction in time off the original sentence for doing society a favour- judges are capable of nudging and winking I'm sure.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

I doubt it, JLM, not when it comes to murder. After all, a judge did give Latimer 10 years in prison. If ever a killer deserved compassion and understanding (and perhaps probation), it was Larimer. But he got ten years.

But if you want to take that chance, it is up to you. As I said, whatever floats youth boat.

 

[JLM]

I doubt it, JLM, not when it comes to murder. After all, a judge did give Latimer 10 years in prison. If ever a killer deserved compassion and understanding (and perhaps probation), it was Larimer. But he got ten years.

But if you want to take that chance, it is up to you. As I said, whatever floats youth boat.

Yep, I sure thought Latimer got a raw deal, like about 91/2 years too much time, but there's a lot of people putting pressure on about "mercy killings"- likely the same ones who are all for abortions............:lol::lol::lol:

 

[petros]

if something happened to one of my grandchildren or my friend's grandchildren, locking the S.O.B. up would not give me any closure- I'd be forced to commit some serious but less heinous crime to get locked up next to the S.O.B., then there'd be closure.

There is no spiritual closure only closure for the ego.

 

[EagleSmack]

A simple majority cannot change our Constitution.


Yes they can, at the state level, at least in some states.

.

A state constitution can be changed by majority rule but a state cannot tamper with the U.S Constitution.

Not so fast about changing the state constitution...

Like I said. In Massachusetts when petitions are brought forward for a State Constitutional referendum and the petition is not Politically Correct the State Legislature just refuses to vote on it. They do not bring it to the table for a vote and let it just die in committee. That happened with the Death Penalty a number of times, it happened with Gay Marriage twice before they had the votes to not overturn the petition. Basically the state legislature refuses to give the people a chance to vote for themselves. That's Massachusetts for you.

 

[EagleSmack]

Look, even in California which has the death penalty Charles Manson is still breathing and peacefully getting old. Jeffrey Dahmer recieved life and was murdered by fellow inmates in 1994. Point being that he outlived his victoms by 16 years. (for those who forget In 1992 he confessed to killing, dismembering, and, in some cases, cannibalizing 16 young men, chiefly near his Milwaukee home.) Why should people like this live?

Manson and the three women who participated in the Tate-LaBianca murders were sentenced to die but the Supreme Court ruled the Death Penalty as Unconstitutional and their death sentences were commuted to life. When the Supreme Court reinstated the death penalty they could not put them back on death row. I am not sure about Tex Watson... he was the man that participated but was tried seperately.

Oddly enough they are all eligible for parole and have come up a number of times in front of the parole board. They get rejected every time because of the nature of their crimes.

 

[JLM]

Manson and the three women who participated in the Tate-LaBianca murders were sentenced to die but the Supreme Court ruled the Death Penalty as Unconstitutional and their death sentences were commuted to life. When the Supreme Court reinstated the death penalty they could not put them back on death row. I am not sure about Tex Watson... he was the man that participated but was tried seperately.

Oddly enough they are all eligible for parole and have come up a number of times in front of the parole board. They get rejected every time because of the nature of their crimes.

With one exception I think they are where they deserve to be and should die there. I think Leslie Van Houten is different, she was young and impressionable and is truly remorseful and I think she should be given a chance at parole.

 

[EagleSmack]

With one exception I think they are where they deserve to be and should die there. I think Leslie Van Houten is different, she was young and impressionable and is truly remorseful and I think she should be given a chance at parole.

I disagree. They all were young and impressionable and all express remorse now. Van Houten is just as guilty. She stabbed Rose Marie LaBianca over 40 times until Rose Marie asked her to stop as she was already dead. Her behavoir at the trial showed no remorse and it was only after years in prison that she decided it wasn't so smart.

Crime and Punishment

 

[JLM]

I disagree. They all were young and impressionable and all express remorse now. Van Houten is just as guilty. She stabbed Rose Marie LaBianca over 40 times until Rose Marie asked her to stop as she was already dead. Her behavoir at the trial showed no remorse and it was only after years in prison that she decided it wasn't so smart.

Crime and Punishment

OK, perhaps your opinion is better than mine. Maybe I was sucked in a few years ago when at her parole hearing she stated words to the effect that she had made one terrible mistake in her life and ever since she's been working hard at being a decent human being, but talk is cheap, so who knows for sure?

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Oddly enough they are all eligible for parole and have come up a number of times in front of the parole board. They get rejected every time because of the nature of their crimes.

EagelSmack, I remember reading that for his last parole hearing Manson didn’t even bother showing up. He knew it was hopeless; no way he was going to get parole.

 

[EagleSmack]

OK, perhaps your opinion is better than mine. Maybe I was sucked in a few years ago when at her parole hearing she stated words to the effect that she had made one terrible mistake in her life and ever since she's been working hard at being a decent human being, but talk is cheap, so who knows for sure?

I know what you are saying. I have seen those parole hearing because the case interested me. Heck it was so interesting that they made two movies out of the case from the book.

They do seem genuine and I am sure they are remorseful after all these years. Patricia Krenweinkel and Susan Atkins have all expressed remorse but what they did was awful and not one bit of mercy was shown to the victims even though some begged. Seven people were killed at their hands and they laughed through the trial and made a mockery of it.

There was a 4th woman (Linda Kasabian) that was sent that night and was just as young and impressionable and when she eventually saw what was going on... after they shot Steve Parent... the most unlucky man in California that night who just happened to stop by and see if the care taker wanted to buy his cheap transistor radio... she freaked.

Tex Watson realised that she was not up for it and told her to wait outside the house and she saw Voiteck Frykowski and Abigail Folger running and bloodied from the house only to be chased down by Watson, Krenweinkel and Atkins and stabbed, kicked and beaten repeatedly. Linda screamed for them to stop, per her testimony, all to no avail. She turned states witness.

 

[Colpy]

The very idea that any of the Manson family might be released at any time in their lives make the case FOR capital punishment.

 

[EagleSmack]

They are getting old and in their cases the justice system is working. One has terminal cancer and requested to live her final days outside of prison and was denied. The same will happen to the rest. They will die behind bars.

 

[JLM]

Oddly enough they are all eligible for parole and have come up a number of times in front of the parole board. They get rejected every time because of the nature of their crimes.

EagelSmack, I remember reading that for his last parole hearing Manson didn’t even bother showing up. He knew it was hopeless; no way he was going to get parole.

Yeah, I think old Charlie is probably getting the picture that he is theirs for the duration.

 

[YukonJack]

SirJosephPorter wrote, rebuking JLM's claim that judges could be - perhaps - mischevious:

"I doubt it, JLM, not when it comes to murder. After all, a judge did give Latimer 10 years in prison. If ever a killer deserved compassion and understanding (and perhaps probation), it was Larimer. But he got ten years."

Not - however - juries. The predominantly black jury refused to convict brother O.J.Simpson, because it was charmed by a snappy but inane rhyme, dreamt up by a snake oil salesman of a lawyer who knew how to play to simple minds. (Remember? "If the glove don't fit, you must acquit").

That judicial abortion received a well-deserved parody on Seinfeld. Glove substituted by bra.

 

[YukonJack]

I am one of those rare individuals who oppose BOTH the death penalty and abortion, in spite of the fact that the former terminates the life of a criminal, while the latter terminates an innocent life.

I am, however, flexible enough for concessions and compromise:

When there is NO DOUBT, supported by confession, witnesses, DNA, fingerprints and perhaps even the request of the convicted person, let the death penalty be carried out. Contrary to some opinion expressed here earlier, the death penalty in itself is far cheaper than life in prison. It is the twenty-thirty years of appeal after appeal at taxpayers' expense that makes death penalty expensive.

Conversely, I would not oppose aborting a child that was beyond any doubt, and beyond any hope, defective and/or the mother's life was in danger and/or that child is the result of rape or incest.

 

[EagleSmack]

I am one of those as well.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Not - however - juries. The predominantly black jury refused to convict brother O.J.Simpson,

Yukon Jack, I think the prosecution did a terrible job presenting that case, the high priced, high powered defense walked all over the prosecution. Thus the glove really did not fit. Didn’t the prosecution know this beforehand?

But the main reason OJ got off was the high powered defense. If OJ had been poor (and couldn’t afford the several million dollars defense fee), he very likely would have hanged by now. But then that is always the way of democracies; rich get one justice, poor get another.

Anyway, OJ eventually got his comeuppance; he is rotting in prison right now.