Life after death

[Dexter Sinister]

Can the purpose of this existence be seen in hope of a better life?

I suppose, but I don't see any good reason to think this life has any purpose beyond what we can give it ourselves.

If this life is all there is, why do any good at all?
Why not be mean, mad murderous, selfish individuals with hope that this is all there is?

Precisely because this life is all there is; that's a prescription for a nasty, coarse, brutal, and probably fairly short, life. You really think anybody but a psychopath would get any joy out of a life like that? We are social animals who need love and friendship and belonging to a group, that's not the way to get those things. Monotheisms seem to assume we'd all be psychopaths but for the influence of some benign deity in our lives, an idea I find insidious and nasty. Read the Old Testament lately? Worst psychopath there is god himself.

 

[ahmadabdalrhman]

I suppose, but I don't see any good reason to think this life has any purpose beyond what we can give it ourselves.

Allah says in His Quran that He did not create all of this for any foolish purpose. He tells us that He created us for the purpose of worshipping Him, Alone and without any partners.

Precisely because this life is all there is; that's a prescription for a nasty, coarse, brutal, and probably fairly short, life. You really think anybody but a psychopath would get any joy out of a life like that? We are social animals who need love and friendship and belonging to a group, that's not the way to get those things. Monotheisms seem to assume we'd all be psychopaths but for the influence of some benign deity in our lives, an idea I find insidious and nasty. Read the Old Testament lately? Worst psychopath there is god himself

Allah tells us that He is Pure, Loving, and absolutely Just in every respect. He says that He is the Best of Judges. He also tells us that the life that we are in is a test. He has created all the things that exist and He has created all that happens as well. There is nothing in this existence except what He has created. He also says in the Quran that He created evil (although He is not evil). He is using this as one of the many tests for us.

 

[lone wolf]

Allah says in His Quran that He did not create all of this for any foolish purpose. He tells us that He created us for the purpose of worshipping Him, Alone and without any partners.



Allah tells us that He is Pure, Loving, and absolutely Just in every respect. He says that He is the Best of Judges. He also tells us that the life that we are in is a test. He has created all the things that exist and He has created all that happens as well. There is nothing in this existence except what He has created. He also says in the Quran that He created evil (although He is not evil). He is using this as one of the many tests for us.

I've had a couple of girlfriends who were exactly the same....

 

[Dexter Sinister]

He tells us that He created us for the purpose of worshipping Him, Alone and without any partners.

No, people who wrote down what other people remembered Mohammed as saying what Gabriel told him what Allah told Gabriel to tell Mohammed to say, tell us that. More to the point, it makes no sense that a supposedly perfect being would have any need or desire for worship. There's no point in testing us either, god already knows the outcomes, there's nothing we can do to change them, the list of who gets to paradise and who goes to hell is already written. None of it makes any sense, it's utterly incoherent.

 

[ahmadabdalrhman]

No, people who wrote down what other people remembered Mohammed as saying what Gabriel told him what Allah told Gabriel to tell Mohammed to say, tell us that. More to the point, it makes no sense that a supposedly perfect being would have any need or desire for worship. There's no point in testing us either, god already knows the outcomes, there's nothing we can do to change them, the list of who gets to paradise and who goes to hell is already written. None of it makes any sense, it's utterly incoherent.

Does God know everything that is going to happen? - Does He have absolute control on the outcome of everything? - If so, how is that fair for us? Where is our free will then?

Allah knows everything that will happen. The first thing that He created was the "pen" and He ordered the pen to write. The pen wrote until it had written everything that would happen. And then Allah began to create the universe. All of this was already known to Him before He created it. He does have absolute and total control at all times. There is nothing that happens except that He is in total control of it at all times.

..Allah accepts the repentance of whom He wills. Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise.[Holy Quran 9:15]

..Truly He! Only He, is the All-Knowing, the All-Wise.

[Holy Quran 12:100]
And Allah only, has Free Will, He Wills whatever He likes and it will always happen as He wills. We have something called, "Free choice." The difference is that what Allah "Wills" always happens and what we choose may or may not happen. We are not being judged on the outcome of things, we are being judged on our choices. This means that at the core of everything will always be our intentions. Whatever we intended, is what we will have the reward for. Each person will be judged according to what Allah gave them to work with, how they used it and what they intended to do with it.

As regards the actual "Judgment Day" - Allah tells us that everything we are doing is being recorded and not a single tiny thing escapes from this record. Even an atom's weight of good will be seen on the Day of Judgment and even a single atom's weight of evil will be seen too.

On That Day (of judgment) mankind will proceed in scattered groups and they will be shown their deeds.

So whoever does good equal to the weight of an atom, shall see it.

And whoever does evil equal to the weight of an atom, shall see it. [Holy Quran 99:6-8]


The one who will bring the evidences against us will be ourselves. Our ears, tongue, eyes and all of our bodies will begin to testify against us in front of Allah on the Day of Judgment. None will be oppressed on that Day, none will be falsely accused.

He could have put everyone in their respective places from the very beginning, but the people would complain as to why they were thrown in Hell without being given a chance. This life is exactly that; a chance to prove to ourselves who we really are and what we would really do if we indeed had a free choice.

Allah Knows everything that will happen, but we don't. That is why the test is fair.

allah ( the god )

 

[scratch]

Does God know everything that is going to happen? - Does He have absolute control on the outcome of everything? - If so, how is that fair for us? Where is our free will then?

Allah knows everything that will happen. The first thing that He created was the "pen" and He ordered the pen to write. The pen wrote until it had written everything that would happen. And then Allah began to create the universe. All of this was already known to Him before He created it. He does have absolute and total control at all times. There is nothing that happens except that He is in total control of it at all times.

..Allah accepts the repentance of whom He wills. Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise.[Holy Quran 9:15]

..Truly He! Only He, is the All-Knowing, the All-Wise.

[Holy Quran 12:100]
And Allah only, has Free Will, He Wills whatever He likes and it will always happen as He wills. We have something called, "Free choice." The difference is that what Allah "Wills" always happens and what we choose may or may not happen. We are not being judged on the outcome of things, we are being judged on our choices. This means that at the core of everything will always be our intentions. Whatever we intended, is what we will have the reward for. Each person will be judged according to what Allah gave them to work with, how they used it and what they intended to do with it.

As regards the actual "Judgment Day" - Allah tells us that everything we are doing is being recorded and not a single tiny thing escapes from this record. Even an atom's weight of good will be seen on the Day of Judgment and even a single atom's weight of evil will be seen too.

On That Day (of judgment) mankind will proceed in scattered groups and they will be shown their deeds.

So whoever does good equal to the weight of an atom, shall see it.

And whoever does evil equal to the weight of an atom, shall see it. [Holy Quran 99:6-8]


The one who will bring the evidences against us will be ourselves. Our ears, tongue, eyes and all of our bodies will begin to testify against us in front of Allah on the Day of Judgment. None will be oppressed on that Day, none will be falsely accused.

He could have put everyone in their respective places from the very beginning, but the people would complain as to why they were thrown in Hell without being given a chance. This life is exactly that; a chance to prove to ourselves who we really are and what we would really do if we indeed had a free choice.

Allah Knows everything that will happen, but we don't. That is why the test is fair.

allah ( the god )

What test?

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Allah Knows everything that will happen, but we don't. That is why the test is fair.

I didn't say it wasn't fair, I said it's pointless to run a test when the results are already known.

 

[ahmadabdalrhman]

What test?

believe no god just one god and muhamad prophet from the god

and do the god behests from quran and the hadith

 

[darkbeaver]

I don't believe in death. I've never personnally been involved with death and I can't say much about it although I have in the past on special occasions. Death is a rumour to the living, but a rumour we should listen to. I don't think I'll bother with death, it's not my cup of tea. By all means the rest of you can of course if you like. But I refuse to go anywhere before I've seen everything.:smile:

 

[ahmadabdalrhman]

I didn't say it wasn't fair, I said it's pointless to run a test when the results are already known.

no he no pointless because the god become wasn't fair If the god accompt humans and do not awarding humans In there chance to believe to him

but because the god is fair he is awarding the chance to people to live and do the right and the wrong in you freedom
and you do not have excuse after death

 

[darkbeaver]

I don't need my excuse after death, I'll give it away to someone needy. Here it is. The dog ate my bible.

 

[talloola]

I've had a couple of girlfriends who were exactly the same....

Well, at least that is a realistic possibility, and believable.;-)

 

[Lester]

Some people better hope to hell there is a life after death.

And some should hope to hell there's no hell:lol:

 

[Avro]

Hey Boss you are too gnarly to die.

:lol:

 

[eanassir]

Certainly, there is a spiritual life following death which is the end of life in this World.​

In other words: You live twice:

• Life with the material body (with the soul within the material body),
• Life with the ethereal or spiritual soul (the material body will have decayed by death.)

What is man?

eanassir
http://man-after-death.t35.com​

 

[ahmadabdalrhman]

I don't need my excuse after death, I'll give it away to someone needy. Here it is. The dog ate my bible.

so ??? the excuse it do not work

 

[eanassir]

First,there is no life without death :no death without life .
Second ,we are a spirit with a body ,not the other way around
Third, what dies is the body not the spirit .
Do I believe in heaven and /or hell?,No I don't.

The admission to Hell or Paradise will only be after the Judgment, which will follow the Doomsday.​

While after death, the admission into Hell or Paradise will be for those who saw their apostle with their own eyes and yet denied him and stayed sticking to their association with God or the idolatry.​

The hell and paradise in the after-death world are not the same hell and paradise following the Judgment. ​

Hell after death is the volcano fire which is inside the earth; the volcano is a gate to this hell.​

Paradise in the after-death world is the lowest layer of the ethereal heavens that is near to us. ​

One that died (when he was child) looked up in the sky and saw some houses hanged there, and a man shouted to him: "Come to us; here are your brethren."
http://man-after-death.t35.com/#Was_It_Death_or_Fainting_​

This paradise is called the Paradise of Abode (or Resort), to which the souls of prophets, righteous men and martyrs go after death, which is other than the Paradise of Everlasting (or Prosperity).

But generally speaking, following death some people will live happily and others will live miserably. This depends on their faith and work in their life of the World.
http://man-after-death.t35.com/1.htm#The_torment_in_the_Barzakh_world​

eanassir
http://man-after-death.t35.com​

 

[Dexter Sinister]

... because the god is fair he is awarding the chance to people to live and do the right and the wrong in you freedom and you do not have excuse after death

Oh sure, god's fair and reasonable and lets us choose, but if we get it wrong he fries us in hell forever. What kind of a choice is that? That's not a choice at all, it's a pure coercive threat not worthy of a supreme being who claims to care about us.

 

[talloola]

All of those hundreds and hundreds of long winded posts lecturing 'what happens to people after they die is ridiculous. No one has ever come back to enlighten us as to how things
were while they were dead, so, that does it for me, it is not complicated at all, the book
he obeys is no better than some silly chrystal ball in a gypsy's tent.
He has a one track mind, and loves all the disagreement toward him, he is like a robot or a machine,
that just repeats the same thing over and over, blind obedience.

 

[ahmadabdalrhman]

Oh sure, god's fair and reasonable and lets us choose, but if we get it wrong he fries us in hell forever. What kind of a choice is that? That's not a choice at all, it's a pure coercive threat not worthy of a supreme being who claims to care about us.

002.213

Sahih International: Mankind was [of] one religion [before their deviation]; then Allah sent the prophets as bringers of good tidings and warners and sent down with them the Scripture in truth to judge between the people concerning that in which they differed. And none differed over the Scripture except those who were given it - after the clear proofs came to them - out of jealous animosity among themselves. And Allah guided those who believed to the truth concerning that over which they had differed, by His permission. And Allah guides whom He wills to a straight path.


for that the god give to we are the is the mind to know the truth way from devil ways ,
and the other way If we believers In behests from the god he will awarding to we what do not can we to horseman for ever ,