Letter to us from the Taliban!

lone wolf

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Nov 25, 2006
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Look Lone, I was mad when the Liberals agreed to be involved there..............
It is the stupidist thing to do.... today the world of pissed off people are looking for an excuse to get even, and Afganistan is that excuse.......
Canada should get out of other peoples wars........
Canada has in the past been the country of peace keepers.
Today Canada is on the sh!t list which we should not be in it......

So ... you'll admit you're dumping on your own boots now? I'm no fan of Tories either ... but let's give hell where hell is due.

It wouldn't matter if we were armed with fishing rods, hockey sticks and Molson's, and played euchre instead of stepping on a battlefield. We live next door and we speak the same language as the United States. Do you really think those pin-headed extremists care that we're not yankee? An infidel is an infidel is an infidel and they want to kill anyone who they can't control. If Afganistan wasn't the excuse, it would be because we offer hope and home to run-away Muslims.
 

dancing-loon

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It goes back a lot farther than that, DL. One would have to be terribly naive to think it's all over Afghanistan or Taliban or Ali Baba and the Forty Thieves. Way back in the Crusades, Christian butt got kicked. The victors (Islam) should have all the spoils - if not for the industrial revolution. The western world - the losers - gained wealths and power beyond anyone's wildest dreams. All Islam had was its religion. Now, Islam's fanatics demand their due as winners in an ancient jihad.
You could in part have a point, but I don't see it that way, because I have never studied that era. It seems to me we only need to go back to the time of the Russian invasion of Afghanistan:
In 1979 "the largest covert operation in the history of the CIA" was launched in response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in support of the pro-Communist government of Babrak Kamal.2:
With the active encouragement of the CIA and Pakistan's ISI [Inter Services Intelligence], who wanted to turn the Afghan jihad into a global war waged by all Muslim states against the Soviet Union, some 35,000 Muslim radicals from 40 Islamic countries joined Afghanistan's fight between 1982 and 1992. Tens of thousands more came to study in Pakistani madrasahs. Eventually more than 100,000 foreign Muslim radicals were directly influenced by the Afghan jihad.3​
The Islamic "jihad" was supported by the United States and Saudi Arabia with a significant part of the funding generated from the Golden Crescent drug trade:
In March 1985, President Reagan signed National Security Decision Directive 166,...[which] authorize[d] stepped-up covert military aid to the mujahideen, and it made clear that the secret Afghan war had a new goal: to defeat Soviet troops in Afghanistan through covert action and encourage a Soviet withdrawal. The new covert U.S. assistance began with a dramatic increase in arms supplies -- a steady rise to 65,000 tons annually by 1987, ... as well as a "ceaseless stream" of CIA and Pentagon specialists who traveled to the secret headquarters of Pakistan's ISI on the main road near Rawalpindi, Pakistan. There the CIA specialists met with Pakistani intelligence officers to help plan operations for the Afghan rebels.
The Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) using Pakistan's military Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) played a key role in training the Mujahideen. In turn, the CIA sponsored guerrilla training was integrated with the teachings of Islam:
Read on....http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO109C.html

Can you handle this kind of truth, dear Wolf?;-)
The chickens the West raised are coming home to roost!!! Now they are cowards, scumbags, our worst enemies we have to fight ferociously!! Ha... we have made ourselves the laughing stock of the Muslim world. :lol:

To save face the Christian Right has sprung to life! Here is a short excerpt:

"Most egregious, and certainly paralleling terrorism’s culture of death is the fundamentalist Christian contempt for life—I repeat: contempt for life. Forcing females to have children without providing what they need financially, emotionally, and educationally is a pro-birth agenda that murders countless bodies and souls. Because they don’t think the Sermon on the Mount is really very important, these individuals have an appalling disconnect, fawning over the decaying body of a woman in a permanent vegetative state while praising the demise of over 100,000 innocent Iraqi citizens and touting the patriotism of some 1,600 dead U.S. troops. (the # has changed since 05)

The religious right of twenty-first century America is anti-American, inherently violent, and a cruel, tyrannical, punitive, force of death and destruction. (how true!!) In its mindset, adult human lives do not matter because the human condition itself is inherently evil resulting in eternal and everlasting punishment in hell unless its members are redeemed in a prescribed manner by the fundamentalist God/man/savior, Jesus Christ. Moreover, with an embarrassingly adolescent flamboyance, Dominionists shamelessly rape, pillage, and desecrate the earth because in the first place, their Bible has given them authority over all things human, and in the second place, their “imminent” apocalyptic rapture, transporting them from the human “veil of tears” to live happily ever after in heaven, entitles them to do so. Meanwhile, we the unredeemed, the unbelievers, the poor, the feminists, the gay and lesbian, the disabled, the homeless, the mentally ill, the addicted, and those who are conscientiously following divergent spiritual paths of their choice, are suffering in the wake of Christian fundamentalism’s devastation of the economy, the earth, and the human race. etc"

Now, does anybody still want to toot we in the West are not capable of religious fanaticism? The question is who is worse... we or "them"?

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article8816.htm

Lone Wolf: We went there because we are members of NATO and an allied member was attacked. We are there because Canada's peace-keeping and humanitarian heritage sees a place where we can help. We fight there because we have to.
No, we don't have to!! We didn't need to keep extending and extending and increasing our troops. Where does it say so? Our present government wants to, that's why we are still there and keep increasing troops. Harper is a secretive, conservative Christian, just like or even better than Bush.
We will stay there because Taliban doesn't know Canadians. When someone threatens us or tells us we can't, it's the Canadian way to close ranks and kick butt - with hockey sticks if we have to.
Yes, that is 18th century mentality!!! Where fathers beat their sons, and teachers did likewise! We now live in the 21st century, we have made progress in our development as humans, or at the least we should have. Personally, I like to see WWII as the dividing line for humanity to have grasped that wars do not solve conflict, war rather creates more conflict and more war. That insight is sorely lacking in the minds of most of the participants in this thread. They want to be heros, want to be proud of our troops, want to emphasize how kind and helpful and selfless we are, but they do not hesitate to put a bullet through little Omar's head! Hypocrites!!:roll:

One important thing I learned as a small child from my Nazi parents through their example... be polite, friendly and helpful to POW, whether they be Poles, Russians or French. (We only had those three nationalities working on the farm)

I apologize for the length of my post, but I hope you, lone Wolf, will read it nevertheless.
 

lone wolf

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Nov 25, 2006
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You could in part have a point, but I don't see it that way, because I have never studied that era. It seems to me we only need to go back to the time of the Russian invasion of Afghanistan:Read on....http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO109C.html

Can you handle this kind of truth, dear Wolf?;-)
The chickens the West raised are coming home to roost!!! Now they are cowards, scumbags, our worst enemies we have to fight ferociously!! Ha... we have made ourselves the laughing stock of the Muslim world. :lol:

Good.... They need to laugh about something to lighten up

To save face the Christian Right has sprung to life! Here is a short excerpt:

"Most egregious, and certainly paralleling terrorism’s culture of death is the fundamentalist Christian contempt for life—I repeat: contempt for life. Forcing females to have children without providing what they need financially, emotionally, and educationally is a pro-birth agenda that murders countless bodies and souls. Because they don’t think the Sermon on the Mount is really very important, these individuals have an appalling disconnect, fawning over the decaying body of a woman in a permanent vegetative state while praising the demise of over 100,000 innocent Iraqi citizens and touting the patriotism of some 1,600 dead U.S. troops. (the # has changed since 05)

The religious right of twenty-first century America is anti-American, inherently violent, and a cruel, tyrannical, punitive, force of death and destruction. (how true!!) In its mindset, adult human lives do not matter because the human condition itself is inherently evil resulting in eternal and everlasting punishment in hell unless its members are redeemed in a prescribed manner by the fundamentalist God/man/savior, Jesus Christ. Moreover, with an embarrassingly adolescent flamboyance, Dominionists shamelessly rape, pillage, and desecrate the earth because in the first place, their Bible has given them authority over all things human, and in the second place, their “imminent” apocalyptic rapture, transporting them from the human “veil of tears” to live happily ever after in heaven, entitles them to do so. Meanwhile, we the unredeemed, the unbelievers, the poor, the feminists, the gay and lesbian, the disabled, the homeless, the mentally ill, the addicted, and those who are conscientiously following divergent spiritual paths of their choice, are suffering in the wake of Christian fundamentalism’s devastation of the economy, the earth, and the human race. etc"

Now, does anybody still want to toot we in the West are not capable of religious fanaticism? The question is who is worse... we or "them"?

Nobody ever said there weren't Christian nutbars. They come in every faith and one is as rabid as the next. I don't think we've heard any rousing choruses of Onward Christian Soldier as troops headed off to Afghanistan ... as we have curses of Infidel.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article8816.htm

No, we don't have to!! We didn't need to keep extending and extending and increasing our troops. Where does it say so? Our present government wants to, that's why we are still there and keep increasing troops. Harper is a secretive, conservative Christian, just like or even better than Bush.

When troops are under fire - whether helping an old lady across the street or rattling a Taliban cage - do you expect then to just line up like tin soldiers of old and fall like shooting gallery duckies? Can you imagine the sheer numbers of Afganis who would be murdered by these extremists for non-conformity if there weren't people there to witness - and shoot? Guys are being hurt, maimed and killed by improvised explosive devices while not even involved in combat. Do you really think these mines are selective and can tell the difference between a Canadian soldier, a goat handler or a three-year-old Afghani kid?

Yes, that is 18th century mentality!!! Where fathers beat their sons, and teachers did likewise! We now live in the 21st century, we have made progress in our development as humans, or at the least we should have. Personally, I like to see WWII as the dividing line for humanity to have grasped that wars do not solve conflict, war rather creates more conflict and more war. That insight is sorely lacking in the minds of most of the participants in this thread. They want to be heros, want to be proud of our troops, want to emphasize how kind and helpful and selfless we are, but they do not hesitate to put a bullet through little Omar's head! Hypocrites!!:roll:

You totally overlooked (or ignored) the analogy of Canadian stubborness - and how when things get tougher our resolve strengthens. There was no reference to abused kids. If that's the parallel you've drawn and the life you've known, I'm sorry for your sadness.

Yes ...people are comfortable in putting time constraints on timeless things. The world existed long before WW2 ... or the Declaration of Independence ... or Noah's Ark ... or the dinosaur extinction. You can't go putting arbitrary start dates on deep roots.

Omar has no part in this, but there is danger in the road he knows too. If the life you know causes you to see a father beating his kids, imagine what danger a "kid" who only knows how to hate, kill and be a terrorist for the good of Allah would be on streets full of rage, guns and vulnerable people.

One important thing I learned as a small child from my Nazi parents through their example... be polite, friendly and helpful to POW, whether they be Poles, Russians or French. (We only had those three nationalities working on the farm)

Friendly and helpful.... Were you in the Resistance?

I apologize for the length of my post, but I hope you, lone Wolf, will read it nevertheless.

Polite and friendly does not mean we have to accept being pooped upon....
 
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wallyj

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May 7, 2006
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Wally you are the classic moron. Get it through your little brain, Afghanistan is a complete ****up for Canada whether you like it or not………….
Canada and the US will come out of Afghanistan like a wet dog with their tail between their legs and your Conservatives will lose the election because Bush convinced Harper to engage in a war that isn’t theirs……………………….

Get a life Wally…………………………
You may be right. But to sit back and let Afghanistan become a training base for jihadists would be far worse. As I have said many times before,'truthers' should stick to their conspiracies and let the adults go about doing the right thing. If you are ever fortunate to have children,the females will not be happy being treated like breeding stock because people like Daddy lacked a spine to support his tiny brain. Cheers.
 

dancing-loon

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Oct 8, 2007
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Dancing Loon,

Why are the Taliban allowed to tell us to leave Afghanistan?
They are native Afghans - we are foreign bugs there!
We are both militaries foreign to Afghanistan, the difference is we were asked in, and they tried (unsuccessfully) to invade the country, only managing to hold onto and run PART of it.
Wrong! It has been discussed before.
The rest of it, asked us to come in and get rid of those foreigners who came to conquer and occupy their nation.
NATO is doing a good job!:x http://ukpress.google.com/article/ALeqM5imkYVlrNpEgZmTNx1S6cMhTSrd6w
Perhaps the Taliban should stay in their own country.
Which one would that be?
 

dancing-loon

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Loon:
One important thing I learned as a small child from my Nazi parents through their example... be polite, friendly and helpful to POW, whether they be Poles, Russians or French. (We only had those three nationalities working on the farm)

Wolf: Friendly and helpful.... Were you in the Resistance?

Loon: No. We were just ordinary decent people!

 

dancing-loon

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Loon:
No, we don't have to!! We didn't need to keep extending and extending and increasing our troops. Where does it say so? Our present government wants to, that's why we are still there and keep increasing troops. Harper is a secretive, conservative Christian, just like or even better than Bush.

Wolf:
When troops are under fire - whether helping an old lady across the street or rattling a Taliban cage - do you expect then to just line up like tin soldiers of old and fall like shooting gallery duckies? Can you imagine the sheer numbers of Afganis who would be murdered by these extremists for non-conformity if there weren't people there to witness - and shoot?

Loon:
Wolf, you are steadfast on insisting we belong in Afghanistan - I don't. There is our fundamental difference. There is no mention by me to have our troops shot down like sitting ducks. Get out, is what I say.
You feel it is our holy duty to stop the Taliban from murdering unimaginable numbers of Afghanis. Do you have a number of how many Afghanis the NATO forces have killed in the process of trying to kill Talibanis? We don't really value human life. If we did, we would start a dialog with the Taliban. If our heart bleeds for the helpless people there, then we should find bloodless ways to help them.
Actually, all this talk is just a front for the real reason we are there. It has been mentioned here and there... we are standing by our closest friend and ally - the United States of America. Do you know why they are there?

Wolf:
Guys are being hurt, maimed and killed by improvised explosive devices while not even involved in combat. Do you really think these mines are selective and can tell the difference between a Canadian soldier, a goat handler or a three-year-old Afghani kid?

Loon:
The fact is they don't have the kind of weaponry we have. They are fighting with their bare hands, so to speak. Makeshift stuff. We should not even fight with them, because it is totally unethical to fight with someone who isn't armed to the same degree we are.
That's why we are to blame for the death of the goat handler and three-year old child.
That neither you nor our politicians and military brass can't see that is beyond me.
 

dancing-loon

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The whole world if we happen to run, quaking in our boots, because we got a nasty letter from a bunch of cowards who have to rely on fear to do their dirty work.
Oh! You are concerned what the neighbors will say???:lol:
Alright... it's a good enough reason to keep on killing people who haven't done a thing to us!!

Brains!!:roll:
 

gopher

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Jun 26, 2005
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"Canada is an incredibly soft target."


Gee whizzo! So you expect the wicked but resourceful Taliban to gather its forces and mount an attack on Canada despite the proximity of more vulnerable targets.

Umm, pray enlighten me: by land or by sea?
 

gopher

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By the way, why wouldn't those wicked and resourceful Taliban forces make themselves more meancing on their way to Canada by briefly detouring to the USA and imposing its wickedness on us? Can't guarantee a smiling welcoming committee but it should be interesting.

;)
 

dancing-loon

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Wolf:
You totally overlooked (or ignored) the analogy of Canadian stubborness - and how when things get tougher our resolve strengthens. There was no reference to abused kids. If that's the parallel you've drawn and the life you've known, I'm sorry for your sadness.

Loon:
Na, Na! YOU are trying to hit low, aren't you? You know very well what I meant to express with fathers beating their children!! The mentality of power producing fear, fear resulting in obedience. In this day and age we don't raise our children like that any more; we have made progress in our human understanding. The same should apply for dealing with other countries. Bombs have no place in the hands of educated and evolved people. From savages we can expect them, but not from ourselves, right?;-)

Stubbornness has its merits in the right place. Not in this situation we are in in Afghanistan. Here we should have insight, tolerance, and the sense of what is best for all concerned. It can never be the best to kill people. We are not God to be able to decide who shall live and who shall die.

Wolf:
Yes ...people are comfortable in putting time constraints on timeless things. The world existed long before WW2 ... or the Declaration of Independence ... or Noah's Ark ... or the dinosaur extinction. You can't go putting arbitrary start dates on deep roots.

Loon:
For me WWII is an important watershed: A whole continent was more or less in flames! The atom bomb was dropped on innocent people without regret!
I thought we humans had reached the end of our capacity to destruct. Canada was part of it, so were the Americans, and yet, they keep right on killing and destroying.

I think I have only now, as I'm getting older, started to digest and process my childhood experiences, combined with my belief there is a reaction to every action, as well as that we all will reap what we have sown.
The truth is - I expect better from Canada and the US.

Wolf:
Omar has no part in this, but there is the danger of the road he knows too. If the life you know causes you to see a father beating his kids, imagine what danger a "kid" who only knows how to hate, kill and be a terrorist for the good of Allah would be on streets full of rage, guns and vulnerable people.

Loon:
I only mentioned Omar because we had recently talked about him and I was appalled about the hate in this forum towards him. He is a Muslim and was a child soldier.
Wolf, I dislike on you this kind of sordid pessimism! How on earth do you know Omar knows nothing but hate, killing, and be a terrorist?? That is crazy!! - - Finito!
 

Colpy

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Nov 5, 2005
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I mean every word of the following: no joke.

The only good Taliban is a dead Taliban.

It is Canada's duty to transform Bad Taliban into good Taliban.
 

EagleSmack

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Feb 16, 2005
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"Canada is an incredibly soft target."


Gee whizzo! So you expect the wicked but resourceful Taliban to gather its forces and mount an attack on Canada despite the proximity of more vulnerable targets.

Umm, pray enlighten me: by land or by sea?

How about by air? They are one for one in that category...well their Al Queda allies are and can sure give them some tips!
 

Colpy

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Nov 5, 2005
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"Canada is an incredibly soft target."


Gee whizzo! So you expect the wicked but resourceful Taliban to gather its forces and mount an attack on Canada despite the proximity of more vulnerable targets.

Umm, pray enlighten me: by land or by sea?

Canada is home to a large Islamic community.

Some small part of that community has been seduced by radical Islam.

Some small part of that group has become enamored of jihad, and the idea of martyrdom.

Some of that group have gone to Afghanistan, and now Pakistan, for training in the use of weapons.....and the production of explosives.

Being wonderful, upstanding citizens of the tolerant, multicultural nirvana called Canada (see the Khadr family).....they can easily re-enter the country.........

You have heard of suicide bombers, haven't you?
 

lone wolf

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Loon:
No, we don't have to!! We didn't need to keep extending and extending and increasing our troops. Where does it say so? Our present government wants to, that's why we are still there and keep increasing troops. Harper is a secretive, conservative Christian, just like or even better than Bush.


Wolf, you are steadfast on insisting we belong in Afghanistan - I don't. There is our fundamental difference. There is no mention by me to have our troops shot down like sitting ducks. Get out, is what I say.

Sorry to correct your faulty mindreading ability or your penchant for assumpton, but I am against the war. I do, however, support our troops. Having been in the position, I know you go where you are sent. It's people like you who caused a world of hurt to a previous generations guys in Vietnam. They didn't ask to go there either ... and they who did honestly believed they could change things - just like you are doing now.

You feel it is our holy duty to stop the Taliban from murdering unimaginable numbers of Afghanis. Do you have a number of how many Afghanis the NATO forces have killed in the process of trying to kill Talibanis? We don't really value human life. If we did, we would start a dialog with the Taliban. If our heart bleeds for the helpless people there, then we should find bloodless ways to help them.

What do you suppose those aid workers who were murdered by Taliban were doing? They were showing the women there was another way where they could be treated as equals to men. I don't suppose you'd want to be treated worse than a barnyard animal would you? ...AND I expect an answer to this one!

Actually, all this talk is just a front for the real reason we are there. It has been mentioned here and there... we are standing by our closest friend and ally - the United States of America. Do you know why they are there?

The reason we heard, saw, assisted with, felt was 9/11 and someone named Bin Laden who was holed up in Afghanistan. Whether they were all actual facts or not became immaterial once Canadian boots touched Afghani soil. We were there. We were committed. As I understand it, our mission was as peace keepers - until we came under fire ourselves. We don't walk out in the middle of a show.


The fact is they don't have the kind of weaponry we have. They are fighting with their bare hands, so to speak. Makeshift stuff. We should not even fight with them, because it is totally unethical to fight with someone who isn't armed to the same degree we are.
That's why we are to blame for the death of the goat handler and three-year old child.
That neither you nor our politicians and military brass can't see that is beyond me.

I maintain that's how the war is going to have to be fought on our front too - go native. I don't have a say though, do I?

How can you have so much pity for a 15 year old terrorist yet be so indifferent toward a legless three-year-old blasted away by a coffee can filled with nails and boom-boom. Taliban/Al Quaida are fighting to be in control of people who just want to live their lives. Those people will be slaves to Allah - mere chattals to religious clerics and fanatics. Maybe our way isn't the right way for them - but we don't deliberatly attack unarmed aid workers just to make them examples. That is the event that justifies our people being there in my heart....
 
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EagleSmack

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Loon:
The fact is they don't have the kind of weaponry we have. They are fighting with their bare hands, so to speak. Makeshift stuff. We should not even fight with them, because it is totally unethical to fight with someone who isn't armed to the same degree we are.
That's why we are to blame for the death of the goat handler and three-year old child.
That neither you nor our politicians and military brass can't see that is beyond me.

Are you serious! Do you have a clue on what war is!

They are fighting with their bare hands...if it was only that easy. Get your head out of the sand. If you equate bare hands to be Ak-47's, mines, IED's, RPG's etc then OK. Well no...it is not OK because it is ridiculous to suggest it is unethical to fight them because they don't have the same stuff.

We are not playing hockey here Loon...it is war.

Do you think Canada should have armed the Germans towards the end of the war because a lot of their stuff was broke?

I feel silly responding to this to be honest. You're just a defeatist.