Humboldt Broncos bus crash

JLM

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Could be but in a moment of remiss, we could pretty well all be vulnerable!
You never know when you could be distracted by one crash and cause a worse one! Maybe people should forget about extracting their lb. of flesh (blood) and realize NONE of us are exempt from being guilty of something just as bad. Has your mind ever wandered from something else besides your driving? At horrendous cost this poor guy could likely be an asset to society in the future!
 
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gerryh

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You never know when you could be distracted by one crash and cause a worse one! Maybe people should forget about extracting their lb. of flesh (blood) and realize NONE of us are exempt from being guilty of something just as bad. Has your mind ever wandered from something else besides your driving? At horrendous cost this poor guy could likely be an asset to society in the future!
“I can confirm that Mr. Jaskirat Singh Sidhu has been referred to the Immigration Division of the IRB for an admissibility hearing on allegations of serious criminality based on convictions in Canada,” Pape said in an email.



“When this happens a member of the immigration division holds a hearing in the case to determine whether the allegations are founded and if so issues a removal order.”


There is no question that the allegations against him are true. He plead guilty to the charges. Therefore he should be deported poste haste.
 

JLM

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“I can confirm that Mr. Jaskirat Singh Sidhu has been referred to the Immigration Division of the IRB for an admissibility hearing on allegations of serious criminality based on convictions in Canada,” Pape said in an email.



“When this happens a member of the immigration division holds a hearing in the case to determine whether the allegations are founded and if so issues a removal order.”


There is no question that the allegations against him are true. He plead guilty to the charges. Therefore he should be deported poste haste.
I think there is no doubt he was guilty of gross neglect and possibly indifference. I don't think he was guilty of DELIBERATELY killing anyone.
 

gerryh

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I think there is no doubt he was guilty of gross neglect and possibly indifference. I don't think he was guilty of DELIBERATELY killing anyone.


Sorry, disagree. He made the choices to do what he did. He broke the law, and when he broke the law people died.

This isn't the same as legally driving down a highway, hitting black ice and losing control and hitting someone. That, one could say, is an accident and no one deliberately killed anyone. What he did was not an accident. What he did was not an ooops. What he did deserves the full force of the law which, in his case, includes deportation.
 

JLM

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Sorry, disagree. He made the choices to do what he did. He broke the law, and when he broke the law people died.

This isn't the same as legally driving down a highway, hitting black ice and losing control and hitting someone. That, one could say, is an accident and no one deliberately killed anyone. What he did was not an accident. What he did was not an ooops. What he did deserves the full force of the law which, in his case, includes deportation.
I agree with MOST of what you say. I think we've reached the point now where the most important lesson is what can be taught others. I'm pretty sure Mr. Sidhu has already got the picture. We can't do anything at this point to mitigate damage already done.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Sorry, disagree. He made the choices to do what he did. He broke the law, and when he broke the law people died.

This isn't the same as legally driving down a highway, hitting black ice and losing control and hitting someone. That, one could say, is an accident and no one deliberately killed anyone. What he did was not an accident. What he did was not an ooops. What he did deserves the full force of the law which, in his case, includes deportation.
Correct. If you do something illegal, like rolling a stop sign or punching somebody in a bar, you are criminally responsible for whatever your action leads to. If the guy you punched falls, hits his head on the bar rail, and dies, that's homicide. If rolling the stop sign causes a crash that kills people, that's homicide.
 
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JLM

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Correct. If you do something illegal, like rolling a stop sign or punching somebody in a bar, you are criminally responsible for whatever your action leads to. If the guy you punched falls, hits his head on the bar rail, and dies, that's homicide. If rolling the stop sign causes a crash that kills people, that's homicide.
I did read in a law book years ago that you can't be convicted of something you didn't mean to do, but I can see exceptions to that rule.
 

gerryh

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I did read in a law book years ago that you can't be convicted of something you didn't mean to do, but I can see exceptions to that rule.

I'm sorry, but that sounds too much like I didn't know it was illegal. Ignorance of the law is not a defence.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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I did read in a law book years ago that you can't be convicted of something you didn't mean to do, but I can see exceptions to that rule.
It's the concept of mens rea, the "guilty mind." That is satisfied when you choose to do something illegal, whatever it is. Once that is established, the results of your actions decide the exact crime, called "transferred intent." The intent to break the law is transferred to whatever results. Hence in my examples, the simple battery (usually a misdemeanour) of punching somebody in a bar ends up as homicide (probably manslaughter). Similarly, the intent to roll a stop sign is criminal intent, and whatever results from that act decides whether it's a ticket or homicide charges.

There are some other exceptions. Even without the intent to break the law, negligent or reckless behavior can rise to the level of criminal intent.
 

gerryh

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It's the concept of mens rea, the "guilty mind." That is satisfied when you choose to do something illegal, whatever it is. Once that is established, the results of your actions decide the exact crime, called "transferred intent." The intent to break the law is transferred to whatever results. Hence in my examples, the simple battery (usually a misdemeanour) of punching somebody in a bar ends up as homicide (probably manslaughter). Similarly, the intent to roll a stop sign is criminal intent, and whatever results from that act decides whether it's a ticket or homicide charges.

There are some other exceptions. Even without the intent to break the law, negligent or reckless behavior can rise to the level of criminal intent.
I didn't mean to rob the bank. I just wanted a loan.
 

Hoof Hearted

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The Highway sign read, 100km Max.

I got pulled over by a Cop for doing 130km per hour. I told him I would have only driven 100km per hour, but my name wasn't Max.
 
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JLM

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It's the concept of mens rea, the "guilty mind." That is satisfied when you choose to do something illegal, whatever it is. Once that is established, the results of your actions decide the exact crime, called "transferred intent." The intent to break the law is transferred to whatever results. Hence in my examples, the simple battery (usually a misdemeanour) of punching somebody in a bar ends up as homicide (probably manslaughter). Similarly, the intent to roll a stop sign is criminal intent, and whatever results from that act decides whether it's a ticket or homicide charges.

There are some other exceptions. Even without the intent to break the law, negligent or reckless behavior can rise to the level of criminal intent.
I wasn't aware that infractions under the motor vehicle act are classified as crimes, exceptions being impaired driving or leaving the scene of an accident are included in the criminal code.
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

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I wasn't aware that infractions under the motor vehicle act are classified as crimes, exceptions being impaired driving or leaving the scene of an accident are included in the criminal code.
He pleaded guilty to charges greater than motor vehicle violations. Therefore, in they eyes of the law he is guilty. Since he doesn't hold citizenship this pretty much triggers deportation. It may not be fair but since when is the law ever fair?
 
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Tecumsehsbones

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I wasn't aware that infractions under the motor vehicle act are classified as crimes, exceptions being impaired driving or leaving the scene of an accident are included in the criminal code.
Yeah, that's why I said "do something illegal," not "commit a crime."
 
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petros

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He pleaded guilty to charges greater than motor vehicle violations. Therefore, in they eyes of the law he is guilty. Since he doesn't hold citizenship this pretty much triggers deportation. It may not be fair but since when is the law ever fair?
He is a Citizen. They want to take that away from him even though he isn't a threat to Canada and isnt likely to reoffend.

Should we deport Trudeau to Quebec for running someone over while intoxicated in 1998 and getting away with it?
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

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He is a Citizen. They want to take that away from him even though he isn't a threat to Canada and isnt likely to reoffend.

Should we deport Trudeau to Quebec for running someone over while intoxicated in 1998 and getting away with it?
I thought he was a landed immigrant. If he is a citizen then how can they deport?