Common citizenship for Canada and the US?
- Thread starter Machjo
- Start date
Man oh man, which tongue in cheek response to post?
uhm, there is no low brow in US peelers, I thought...since they can't go completely nude? or has it changed?
k, I'll just stick to one tongue in cheek response...or should that be tongue on cheek? your not allowed to touch them either...so tongue in cheek it is....
Not sure I understand what you're getting at. You don't watch much tv so ergo, you're closer to understanding your national identity?
What I was getting at is that often the ones who fear American cultural encroachment the most are the ones who take it in the most. How ironic. Imagine a person sitting in front of the TV watching American programming and thinking 'ah too much American programming!'. For crying out loud, are your fingers broken? Change the channel. We don't need government censorship for that. Yet those of of who can change the channel or move on to other things don't see this encroachment.
And besides, what I'd presented in the OP was common citizenship only. So even with that, the government could still feel free to impose more Canadian content in programming etc. Just that we'd see more boogey men.. Uhm, I mean, Americans on our streets. You know, those strange people with two eyes, a nose, a mouth, two arms with hands on each end. You know waht I'm talking about.
I think French Canadians have and can enjoy a distinct culture and heritage within Canadian nationality. Like First Nation People. But like everything that is worth while, it requires working on it and teaching it to children so that they carry on with it as they grow and become adults. Canada is a better place for that.
And how would a common citizenship stop us from continuing this? Irrelevent.
The EU does what the EU does. I don't care much about that as I don't go visit the EU I go to London, France, Greece and Germany. But you can't really say that when the Ukraine was annexed by Russia as part of the Soviet Union, they weren't culturaly and nationally altered. And that is how it would be here should the US decide it's time to control our land. Only instead of holocaust at the point of a gun, it's arrests, internment for the upstarts and a hostile take over of convenience for those who will just go along to get along.
How did we just go from charing a common citizenship (which does not even involve forming a new country per se) and annexation by military force. According to the model presented i the OP, the Canadian government would still reserve the right, if it wanted to, to ban all US programming, cut ties with NATO, boot all US troops off our soil, and heck, even scrap NAFTA and become protectionist again. Not that it would be a good idea, but just to emphasize that the OP only talked about common citizenship, no more. This would simply mean that private citizens would be free to cross the border, study, mary work, move, etc. without restrictions.
I don't buy the nothing to fear line. The French had plenty to fear when the Germans rolled over the border.
So you're comparing private US citizens with the Wehrmacht! Oh wow, I think Anti-Americanism has just hit a new low.
What I was getting at is that often the ones who fear American cultural encroachment the most are the ones who take it in the most. How ironic. Imagine a person sitting in front of the TV watching American programming and thinking 'ah too much American programming!'. For crying out loud, are your fingers broken? Change the channel. We don't need government censorship for that. Yet those of of who can change the channel or move on to other things don't see this encroachment.
And besides, what I'd presented in the OP was common citizenship only. So even with that, the government could still feel free to impose more Canadian content in programming etc. Just that we'd see more boogey men.. Uhm, I mean, Americans on our streets. You know, those strange people with two eyes, a nose, a mouth, two arms with hands on each end. You know waht I'm talking about.
I think French Canadians have and can enjoy a distinct culture and heritage within Canadian nationality. Like First Nation People. But like everything that is worth while, it requires working on it and teaching it to children so that they carry on with it as they grow and become adults. Canada is a better place for that.
And how would a common citizenship stop us from continuing this? Irrelevent.
The EU does what the EU does. I don't care much about that as I don't go visit the EU I go to London, France, Greece and Germany. But you can't really say that when the Ukraine was annexed by Russia as part of the Soviet Union, they weren't culturaly and nationally altered. And that is how it would be here should the US decide it's time to control our land. Only instead of holocaust at the point of a gun, it's arrests, internment for the upstarts and a hostile take over of convenience for those who will just go along to get along.
How did we just go from charing a common citizenship (which does not even involve forming a new country per se) and annexation by military force. According to the model presented i the OP, the Canadian government would still reserve the right, if it wanted to, to ban all US programming, cut ties with NATO, boot all US troops off our soil, and heck, even scrap NAFTA and become protectionist again. Not that it would be a good idea, but just to emphasize that the OP only talked about common citizenship, no more. This would simply mean that private citizens would be free to cross the border, study, mary work, move, etc. without restrictions.
I don't buy the nothing to fear line. The French had plenty to fear when the Germans rolled over the border.
So you're comparing private US citizens with the Wehrmacht! Oh wow, I think Anti-Americanism has just hit a new low.
By and large Canadians have a better reputation overseas and there is no way I would like to see us moving any closer to the neighbour to the south. US foreign poicy has made America the most hated nation on the planet, and I don't want anything in my pocket that links me personally to their actions.
American programming uses American advertising. Those dollars don't support Canadians at all. And so for every dollar taken out of Canadians pockets through foreign advertising, there is one less dollar to put into Canadian production and development.
No I'm not sure what you are on about here. But I don't think you understand what allegiance means.
The rules for American citizenship and Canadian citizenship are different.
You should examine the two to see what is different and why those differences are important to identity. That you unilaterally proclaim something irrelevant changes nothing.
An unrestricted border isn't a border at all. Canada as a country can't boot or ban anything American unless we have the consent and cooperation of the US. While it's easy to say we can just scrap NAFTA, in reality we can't do anything of the sort. For that matter, when we are completely and totally in the right, have proven in court and won the decision, appeal and further appeals, we still have no choice but to accept what is dictated by the US government.
So where do you get the idea that we can just scrap or ban something as big as NAFTA or American programming? Not to mention that we would then have something far more intrusive further down the road as this would be just a first step.
What would you call it if the Americans wanted something we own and decided that we weren't being reasonable and letting them have it?
Actually we can scrap NAFTA with the required amount of notice, I can't remember what the lead time is now, but there is a provision for such an action. I personally don't like the NAFTA agreement but it would cause a hell of a lot of misery to scrap the deal now. I believe we should have stayed out of such a deal and kept our resourses for ourselves and future generations.
NAFTA is really a form of economic colonialization so this country and be raped and pillaged by American profiteers and a few of our own in Canada I might add.
NAFTA is really a form of economic colonialization so this country and be raped and pillaged by American profiteers and a few of our own in Canada I might add.
Hey the snake only asked Eve to try one bite of the apple. Look what happend there.
Yeah, but that's not the whole story...
What is the Book anyway but a chronological history of the evolution of the society of mankind, a guiding hand to get us past the Cherbum with the flaming sword and find our way back to Eden...
The flaming sword of course is materialism...
That is a strange interpretation considering that Canada runs a fairly substantial trade surplus with the United States.
The amount of notice required to scrap NAFTA is 6 months.
Machgo
Interesting question for some of us - and the number of "No" is now 15 - I just voted.
After taking considerable time to get my citizenship in the U.S., I am too lazy to think that I might want to change yet again. I even refused the idea of duality having both allegiances. Getting my Canadian Passport posed more problems for me this past year than the Citizenship Oath - because I live in the U.S. and it's a long long way to Quebec with whom I had to deal.
My reason is strictly personal and has nothing to do with things like politics and how hated the U.S. is on the world scene and how Canadians dislike the thought of giving up their nationality (would it be giving anything up - if it were combined??? Could be the Americans would have to give things up too... Oh well....)
See - I don't believe in segregating into groups.... people who immigrate find after a year unless they begin integration into their community they will never 'belong' and consequently never 'be part of'....
Unification and integration and becoming one nation of like minded (if different philosophically speaking) people is the way to go for me. I like it.... and I hope all immigrants to the U.S. will feel as do I some day.
I hold little hope Canadians would ever integrate - certainly not in my lifetime. It is far too personal for them. To hold their identity - they should remain - singularly and strongly Canadian.
Interesting question for some of us - and the number of "No" is now 15 - I just voted.
After taking considerable time to get my citizenship in the U.S., I am too lazy to think that I might want to change yet again. I even refused the idea of duality having both allegiances. Getting my Canadian Passport posed more problems for me this past year than the Citizenship Oath - because I live in the U.S. and it's a long long way to Quebec with whom I had to deal.
My reason is strictly personal and has nothing to do with things like politics and how hated the U.S. is on the world scene and how Canadians dislike the thought of giving up their nationality (would it be giving anything up - if it were combined??? Could be the Americans would have to give things up too... Oh well....)
See - I don't believe in segregating into groups.... people who immigrate find after a year unless they begin integration into their community they will never 'belong' and consequently never 'be part of'....
Unification and integration and becoming one nation of like minded (if different philosophically speaking) people is the way to go for me. I like it.... and I hope all immigrants to the U.S. will feel as do I some day.
I hold little hope Canadians would ever integrate - certainly not in my lifetime. It is far too personal for them. To hold their identity - they should remain - singularly and strongly Canadian.
Machgo
A bit off topic but I think Canadians and the people of the U.S. have pretty much licked the problem of convenience in cohabitation of the long 49th parallel. Even with the passport requirements - we have it easy and travel between the two nations for people who choose to do so is relatively smoothly accomplished without having to swear to a flag.
We have many common products and name recognition so it isn't like travelling to a new world... and the common language seems to facilitate things as well.
I would hope this cross-border travel and exchange and friendship and even snowbirding will continue for a long long time.
A bit off topic but I think Canadians and the people of the U.S. have pretty much licked the problem of convenience in cohabitation of the long 49th parallel. Even with the passport requirements - we have it easy and travel between the two nations for people who choose to do so is relatively smoothly accomplished without having to swear to a flag.
We have many common products and name recognition so it isn't like travelling to a new world... and the common language seems to facilitate things as well.
I would hope this cross-border travel and exchange and friendship and even snowbirding will continue for a long long time.