Casey Anthony trial

[Ariadne]

PS......... personally, I do think Baez was right when he said that Cayless was not missing. Casey knew where she was all along. That is probably why she did not "report her MISSING". the missing info is HOW SHE ENDED UP where she did.....WHO bagged her body and who dumped it there??? WHEN did the tragic incident happen??

Sociopaths don't have the ability for remorse. and that comes through clearly with Casey. But even that does not prove that she committed PRE-MEDITATED murder.

Apparently the jury thought that it was quite acceptable to duct tape, bag and dump a body in a swamp if they couldn't figure out how the child died ... crazy stupid if you ask me, but hey, the jury has spoken. Baez may have baffled the jury with his BS, but I don't think he anticipated the financial mountain that would fall on his client if he managed to help her get away with murder. First, she said her daughter was missing. Then she said her daughter was kidnapped by an imaginery nanny. Then, she was simply missing and kidnapped, perhaps by the ex-fiance. The final story about the drowning in the pool is a good story, but when Anthony had every opportunity to offer that story at earlier times, she turned down the offer. The child drowned so now I suspect that she will be financially responsible for an awful lot of effort that was put into search, rescue, analysis and prosecution based on a "missing child" scenario.

Ms Anthony will continue to do what she has always done, so it's only a matter of time before she breaks the law again.

What has not been clearly defined is the trigger . What triggered the crisis that snowballed out of control ?? The ony thing that comes to mind is Cindy wanting to take care of Cayless on a full time basis. Did Cindy threaten to report Casey to the authorities in an effort to gain full custody of the child???

My understanding is that Cindy threatened to seek sole custody of Caylee if Casey didn't shape up ... shortly before the murder.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Apparently the jury thought that it was quite acceptable to duct tape, bag and dump a body in a swamp if they couldn't figure out how the child died ... crazy stupid if you ask me, but hey, the jury has spoken. Baez may have baffled the jury with his BS, but I don't think he anticipated the financial mountain that would fall on his client if he managed to help her get away with murder. First, she said her daughter was missing. Then she said her daughter was kidnapped by an imaginery nanny. Then, she was simply missing and kidnapped, perhaps by the ex-fiance. The final story about the drowning in the pool is a good story, but when Anthony had every opportunity to offer that story at earlier times, she turned down the offer. The child drowned so now I suspect that she will be financially responsible for an awful lot of effort that was put into search, rescue, analysis and prosecution based on a "missing child" scenario.

Ms Anthony will continue to do what she has always done, so it's only a matter of time before she breaks the law again.



My understanding is that Cindy threatened to seek sole custody of Caylee if Casey didn't shape up ... shortly before the murder.

Yes, Casey will continue her lifestyle choices , making up for lost time. Not only that.......if she gets a windfall or two from some high paying "tell all " interview or book.........she can even enhance her lifestyle considerably....... and completey ignore her parents / family as she would no longer need to manipulate them for funds. (until she runs out of course)

Thanks for the info re her mom. I thought I heard something about that......but that makes sense. And that could well have been the "precipitating" factor......or trigger .

IF only the main question of HOW DID SHE DIE could be answered.......other answers might fall into place.

IF you were to hypothesize given what you know........what working theory would you consider as a probability?? Thx.

 

[Ariadne]

I don't have any problem figuring out how she died. She had a hot date with her new boyfriend, the one she met over the internet, and she didn't have a babysitter. She called her mom a bunch of times around 4 on the day Caylee died but her mom wouldn't answer the phone because she had late Monday meetings. Casey probably had some ruse about having to work and the imaginery nanny being in another car accident. Casey wanted her date, and the boyfriend had told Casey that he didn't think his place (drugs, alcohol, electronic gaming, etc) was the correct place for a toddler ... so Casey knew not to bring Caylee. I suppose she chloroformed her daughter and put her in the trunk. I suspect that her daughter died as a result of this. The next day, or whenever Casey came to, she discovered that she had murdered her daughter and proceeded to party hard and enjoy the freedom.

I've been reading about a case in Japan where an Australian woman was chloroformed to death during a date rape, and the key was that chloroform gathers in the liver. I have wondered why, if chloroform was used, no one asked about the liver.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

I don't have any problem figuring out how she died. She had a hot date with her new boyfriend, the one she met over the internet, and she didn't have a babysitter. She called her mom a bunch of times around 4 on the day Caylee died but her mom wouldn't answer the phone because she had late Monday meetings. Casey probably had some ruse about having to work and the imaginery nanny being in another car accident. Casey wanted her date, and the boyfriend had told Casey that he didn't think his place (drugs, alcohol, electronic gaming, etc) was the correct place for a toddler ... so Casey knew not to bring Caylee. I suppose she chloroformed her daughter and put her in the trunk. I suspect that her daughter died as a result of this. The next day, or whenever Casey came to, she discovered that she had murdered her daughter and proceeded to party hard and enjoy the freedom.

I've been reading about a case in Japan where an Australian woman was chloroformed to death during a date rape, and the key was that chloroform gathers in the liver. I have wondered why, if chloroform was used, no one asked about the liver.

very interesting; and plausible. So the idea would be that the chloroform was to keep her sedated ( or baby sat) , but she either forgot about how long Caylee was in the trunk or didn't care....... Now was the duct tape applied after the choloform or after she was found dead??? OK.........let's work with that. What happened next???

 

[Ariadne]

It seems that after someone dies, especially in the hot Florida sun, bodily fluids begin to ooze out of the body. The duct tape may have been part of the "ooze prevention". She must have picked up the Henkel tape at home, because dad had it and it wasn't common. She then bagged her daughter in a couple of garbage bags, the Winnie the Pooh blanket, the Winnie the Pooh laundry bag and thought about burying her in the back yard. The smell of death was so bad she told a friend that her dad used the car and drove over a squirrel. She borrowed the neighbour's shovel, but probably thought it was too much work to dig a hole for a 2 year old so she returned the shovel and drove over to the Pet Cemetery, where she and her buddy tossed hamsters and other small animals, and tossed her daughter in the swamp/Pet Cemetery. I guess she had her own little ceremony and placed a heart sticker on the duct tape before feeding her child to the swamp creatures. Casey Anthony is a disgusting excuse for a human and should be fed to the swamp creatures when she kicks.

Florida should develop a mandatory jury course which explains the relevance of circumstantial evidence to all future jurors.

I don't think the death of her daughter was the first time she chloroformed her, or zanex/zannied her ... but this time she wanted to have the entire evening, night and day with the new beau, so she overdid it.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

It seems that after someone dies, especially in the hot Florida sun, bodily fluids begin to ooze out of the body. The duct tape may have been part of the "ooze prevention". She must have picked up the Henkel tape at home, because dad had it and it wasn't common. She then bagged her daughter in a couple of garbage bags, the Winnie the Pooh blanket, the Winnie the Pooh laundry bag and thought about burying her in the back yard. The smell of death was so bad she told a friend that her dad used the car and drove over a squirrel. She borrowed the neighbour's shovel, but probably thought it was too much work to dig a hole for a 2 year old so she returned the shovel and drove over to the Pet Cemetery, where she and her buddy tossed hamsters and other small animals, and tossed her daughter in the swamp/Pet Cemetery. I guess she had her own little ceremony and placed a heart sticker on the duct tape before feeding her child to the swamp creatures. Casey Anthony is a disgusting excuse for a human and should be fed to the swamp creatures when she kicks.

Florida should develop a mandatory jury course which explains the relevance of circumstantial evidence to all future jurors. LOL! Maybe not only in Florda.

I don't think the death of her daughter was the first time she chloroformed her, or zanex/zannied her ... but this time she wanted to have the entire evening, night and day with the new beau, so she overdid it.

what you describe hangs together quite well. Yes, I too think she used Choroform etc as a "baby sitter." Too bad she was too lazy to do a better job at cleaning up and deorderizing the car. Too sloppy for a true PRE-MEDITATED situation. Wonder how long the body was in the trunk and if it has begun to decompose before she bagged it. The amount of smell described suggests that a body decomposing/ decomposed would have been in the hot truck for a peroid of time . Do you think her dad had a role in any of this??

Re: The duct tape may have been part of the "ooze prevention".

...maybe. OTOH......... she might have put the duct tape on after Caylee fell asleep from the choroform.(in case she woke up and started to cry) And then added more as ooze prevention when she saw what was happening.

.......if ever there was a case for having her tubes tied to prevent further pregnancies it is this one. At the very least , the suspicion of murder should serve as a legal footing for forcing her to have it done.

 

[Ariadne]

what you describe hangs together quite well. Yes, I too think she used Choroform etc as a "baby sitter." Too bad she was too lazy to do a better job at cleaning up and deorderizing the car. Too sloppy for a true PRE-MEDITATED situation. Wonder how long the body was in the trunk and if it has begun to decompose before she bagged it. The amount of smell described suggests that a body decomposing/ decomposed would have been in the hot truck for a peroid of time . Do you think her dad had a role in any of this??

Re: The duct tape may have been part of the "ooze prevention".

...maybe. OTOH......... she might have put the duct tape on after Caylee fell asleep from the choroform.(in case she woke up and started to cry) And then added more as ooze prevention when she saw what was happening.

.......if ever there was a case for having her tubes tied to prevent further pregnancies it is this one. At the very least , the suspicion of murder should serve as a legal footing for forcing her to have it done.

I'm pretty sure the decomposition was beginning by the time Ms Anthony finally decided to check on her daughter. I suspect she suspected that her daughter was dead. The fluids were leaking into the trunk cover and high levels of chloroform were found in the trunk. Although there a several causes for chloroform, the extremely high (unheard of) levels of chloroform suggested that extra chloroform, used as a sedative, was added to the mix.

I still can't figure out why the coroner didn't examine the liver for chloroform ... or was that done. I don't know, but I never heard about the liver levels of chloroform. Either it wasn't there or it wasn't tested. If it wasn't there, it could mean that Casey's first experiment with chloroform killed her daughter.

Carita Ridgeway was drugged/murdered with chloroform but it wasn't identified at the time of death. However, she was a healthy, young Australian working hostess clubs in the Japan red light district. She wasn't a prostitute, but rather an evening companion hostess that could be hired to talk with him; appear interested ... she was encouraged to arrange dinner dates with customers. She unexpectedly died of liver failure/brain dead after a "date" with a murderer.

A book was recently written about the investigation that led to the realization that Carita Ridgeway had been poisoned, and it gives interesting insights into the Japanese legal system. Casey Anthony and Amanda Knox are lucky they didn't murder someone in Japan.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Casey Anthony Dreams in Jail of Having Another Baby

Jailhouse Letters Reveal Casey Anthony's Desire for a Baby After Caylee : People.com

...Oh my.

I'm pretty sure the decomposition was beginning by the time Ms Anthony finally decided to check on her daughter. I suspect she suspected that her daughter was dead. The fluids were leaking into the trunk cover and high levels of chloroform were found in the trunk. Although there a several causes for chloroform, the extremely high (unheard of) levels of chloroform suggested that extra chloroform, used as a sedative, was added to the mix.

I still can't figure out why the coroner didn't examine the liver for chloroform ... or was that done. I don't know, but I never heard about the liver levels of chloroform. Either it wasn't there or it wasn't tested. If it wasn't there, it could mean that Casey's first experiment with chloroform killed her daughter.

Carita Ridgeway was drugged/murdered with chloroform but it wasn't identified at the time of death. However, she was a healthy, young Australian working hostess clubs in the Japan red light district. She wasn't a prostitute, but rather an evening companion hostess that could be hired to talk with him; appear interested ... she was encouraged to arrange dinner dates with customers. She unexpectedly died of liver failure/brain dead after a "date" with a murderer.

A book was recently written about the investigation that led to the realization that Carita Ridgeway had been poisoned, and it gives interesting insights into the Japanese legal system. Casey Anthony and Amanda Knox are lucky they didn't murder someone in Japan.

Seems that the decomposition was so advanced that there was not much left of that little body. The inner organs would go very quickly. I think just some skeletal portions remained ...So there was probably no liver to examine.

Wonder how much longer she would have gone on ignoring the fact that she no longer had a child , if her mom had not demanded some answers and called the authorities???

 

[Ariadne]

I agree that more Henkel duct tape was probably added over the next few days while the ooze dampened the tape, and the car trunk cover got more stained. I think it was around June 24 that she actually went to the house looking for a shovel. This was after the car really started to stink, friends noticed, she blamed it on her father having driven over a squirrel and it being attached under the hood or frame of the car. This was before she drove her car to the same credit bank her mother used, parked next to the dumpster, and abandoned the car. She told friends it was being serviced by her father.

As the prosecutor so aptly put it, she tells a lie to achieve a result - a convenient result for her.

She's actually a scary person to release with the message that she can get away with murder. Joran van der Sloot may have gotten away with murder in the case of Natalee Holloway, but with the murder of Stefanie 5 years later to the day, he got really sloppy. I guess we'll have to wait for Ms Anthony to do it again.

Casey Anthony Dreams in Jail of Having Another Baby

Jailhouse Letters Reveal Casey Anthony's Desire for a Baby After Caylee : People.com

...Oh my.



Seems that the decomposition was so advanced that there was not much left of that little body. The inner organs would go very quickly. I think just some skeletal portions remained ...So there was probably no liver to examine.

Right, thank you. What am I thinking! I do that from time to time ... forget a critical premise ... is that alzheimers or just plan stupidity.
Chloroform wouldn't show up in her bones as far as I know ... and if I had to guess, I would guess that the liver would give out sooner than say the heart or brain ... so the oozing may be moreso from the liver, intestines and stomach first. I understand that the uterus is the last to decompose based on the Laci Peterson case. If the liver decomposed and oozed between June 16 and June 24, when Ms Anthony's activities correlate with feeding her child to the swamp creatures, that would explain the exceptionally high levels of chloroform on the trunk liner.

Actually, I watched the judge's ruling today, and I was wondering about how the judge primarily addressed Mr Mason as looking after the case. He also made it clear that Baez will be dismissed as soon as any appeal is filed, if Ms Anthony decides to appeal today's ruling.

I wonder if and when Mr Baez will face sanctions for what he did before and during the trial. There is also question about filing perjury charges against Cindy Anthony. Her testimony attempted to eliminate the pre-meditation of computer searches, but it was proven that she was in another place - that the only person that had access to the computer at the time was Ms Anthony and her mother tried to lie and claim that she did the search. In terms of the defence case, this reinforced the argument put forth by Baez that Ms Anthony grew up in a lying, dysfunctional home.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

I agree that more Henkel duct tape was probably added over the next few days while the ooze dampened the tape, and the car trunk cover got more stained. I think it was around June 24 that she actually went to the house looking for a shovel. This was after the car really started to stink, friends noticed, she blamed it on her father having driven over a squirrel and it being attached under the hood or frame of the car. This was before she drove her car to the same credit bank her mother used, parked next to the dumpster, and abandoned the car. She told friends it was being serviced by her father.

As the prosecutor so aptly put it, she tells a lie to achieve a result - a convenient result for her.

She's actually a scary person to release with the message that she can get away with murder. Joran van der Sloot may have gotten away with murder in the case of Natalee Holloway, but with the murder of Stefanie 5 years later to the day, he got really sloppy. I guess we'll have to wait for Ms Anthony to do it again.



Right, thank you. What am I thinking! I do that from time to time ... forget a critical premise ... is that alzheimers or just plan stupidity.
Chloroform wouldn't show up in her bones as far as I know ... and if I had to guess, I would guess that the liver would give out sooner than say the heart or brain ... so the oozing may be moreso from the liver, intestines and stomach first. I understand that the uterus is the last to decompose based on the Laci Peterson case. If the liver decomposed and oozed between June 16 and June 24, when Ms Anthony's activities correlate with feeding her child to the swamp creatures, that would explain the exceptionally high levels of chloroform on the trunk liner.

Actually, I watched the judge's ruling today, and I was wondering about how the judge primarily addressed Mr Mason as looking after the case. He also made it clear that Baez will be dismissed as soon as any appeal is filed, if Ms Anthony decides to appeal today's ruling.

I wonder if and when Mr Baez will face sanctions for what he did before and during the trial. There is also question about filing perjury charges against Cindy Anthony. Her testimony attempted to eliminate the pre-meditation of computer searches, but it was proven that she was in another place - that the only person that had access to the computer at the time was Ms Anthony and her mother tried to lie and claim that she did the search. In terms of the defence case, this reinforced the argument put forth by Baez that Ms Anthony grew up in a lying, dysfunctional home.

May I ask you a question?? Do you have some legal background as in training?? You present your ideas and observations in very well articulated format.

...... there sure is a lot of blowback from the verdict. The anger is palpable..... Don't recall it being this volatile after OJ 's first verdict. But memory being what it is....;-)

 

[Ariadne]

No formal legal training. The difference between Ms Anthony and OJ is that OJ was a celebrity and everyone was watching him before he murdered his wife. Ms Anthony was a nobody until she murdered her child.

I was also fascinated by the Anthony trial.
I've given the verdict a lot of thought. As a tv spectator I got to watch and hear many issues discussed that the jury did not....they were removed during the legal sidebars,and did not get to hear what I did.
The jurors also did not get to hear from the plethora of opinions,offered by lawyer "experts" on the various tv shows,nor to read the opinion pieces in newspapers.
The jury had reasonable doubt...they might not have approvd of Casey,but they had to make a judgement on the facts.
Trials seem to be a money-maker in the U.S. The meter reader will make money,the jurors will make money,Baez will make money,and Casey Anthony will undoubtedly make money from this.

Murdertainment at its best! Too bad a young child had to die for all those people to finally have a little money.

 

[EagleSmack]

She is talking about having more children, but I don't think she should be the primary custodian of any child for the remainder of her life ... any child raised by her will be as messed up as she is.

It does not matter what anyone thinks. She has been found not guilty and she can be the next Octomom if she wishes. Perhaps the state of Florida will keep a close watch but she walks out of prson in a few days to do and be whatever she wants.

 

[spaminator]

nancy grace and others also falsely accused a homeless man of kidnapping elizabeth smart. the stress caused him to have a fatal heart attack.

 

[Ariadne]

It would indeed be a mistake to think that talking heads like Nasty Grace have a scoup ... she has a bombshell every time her children step across a mud puddle.

Ms Anthony has been found not guilty, but do you expect the world to accept that she is innocent of murdering her child? Not even the jury believed that.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

It would indeed be a mistake to think that talking heads like Nasty Grace have a scoup ... she has a bombshell every time her children step across a mud puddle.

Ms Anthony has been found not guilty, but do you expect the world to accept that she is innocent of murdering her child? Not even the jury believed that.

exactly. But it was not about "innocence" as we discussed before. Just not enough evidence to justly prove her guilt.

the thing is, I would rather have a guilty person go free (in this kind of case with insufficint proof) than send a genuinely innocent person to death. And it HAS happened. Many prisoners have been cleared due to the advent of DNA and other scientific / forensic capabilities now.

........ the nosy part of me would like to know who the father is........and does he know he is the father and if so, where the heck has he been during all this???? After all , it is HIS KID that died. But given her lifestyle etc......that might be asking too much

 

[spaminator]

perhaps she could be hired to cull the baby population.

 

[Ariadne]

exactly. But it was not about "innocence" as we discussed before. Just not enough evidence to justly prove her guilt.

the thing is, I would rather have a guilty person go free (in this kind of case with insufficint proof) than send a genuinely innocent person to death. And it HAS happened. Many prisoners have been cleared due to the advent of DNA and other scientific / forensic capabilities now.

........ the nosy part of me would like to know who the father is........and does he know he is the father and if so, where the heck has he been during all this???? After all , it is HIS KID that died. But given her lifestyle etc......that might be asking too much

I knew a woman during my University days who had sex with 6 guys in one month ... and she got pregnant. For the next 18 years she tried to track down the 6 guys so she could get a DNA sample and pin the child support on the father ... right up until shortly before the child's 18th birthday .. because after age 18, it's all over in terms of child support. She didn't succeed ... it's quite possible Ms Anthony lived that same lifestyle.

 

[JLM]

perhaps she could be hired to cull the baby population.

I wonder if it's crossed anyone's mind that she might be a ****! :smile:

 

[Ocean Breeze]

I knew a woman during my University days who had sex with 6 guys in one month ... and she got pregnant. For the next 18 years she tried to track down the 6 guys so she could get a DNA sample and pin the child support on the father ... right up until shortly before the child's 18th birthday .. because after age 18, it's all over in terms of child support. She didn't succeed ... it's quite possible Ms Anthony lived that same lifestyle.

could well be. All the more reason for her to use birth control. It is doubtful that she will stop or contain her risky behavior. Mind you , there are loads of folks in the US that are prepared to give her some "good ol fashion justice the lynch mob way.. I am surprised that someone has not gone on a crazed shooting spree. by now.

They just keep inflaming each other. To begin with........might be an idea for Nancy Grace to take a Long vacation. The Val dez lady is just about as bad when it comes to theatrics.

and the soap opera continues. Latest is that she is free as of next Sunday. Don't know how "free" one can be when one is so collectively "hated" now.

 

[Ariadne]

I think the release date switch is to throw people off so they don't camp outside the prison, but that she will be released on Wednesday per the Judge's decision as previously announced.