Canada’s Military current state & equipment

55Mercury

rigid member
May 31, 2007
4,272
987
113
That's how government works because they know that the taxes coming in can be arbitrarily altered by simply raising them and we've no choice but to pay. God forbid that we have any accountability on government spending. Both parties have been guilty of this and it's about time it stops. Our taxes are already high enough as it is.
oh, I hear ya, Dix

and hubby might not appreciate me sayin so, but as much as I despise bureaucrats, the only thing worse than a bureaucrat is a military bureaucrat, ex- or otherwise. 'Ex' because they have that idiot military mind-set drilled into their skulls; 'current' because they swap them out every 3 or 4 years with posting changes. And each new CO wants to leave their 'mark' so a whole new set of rules 'n hoops come out for everyone to jump through.

as you can imagine after a few decades of this change for the sake of change nonsense you develop an attitude of "fuck your stupid rules. you'll be gone in four years and then it's more rules" you just ignore them after a while, barely paying lip-service to any rules. I just dismiss them with "rules are made by idiots for idiots" and don't pay 'em no nevermind.
 
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Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
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Edmonton
oh, I hear ya, Dix

and hubby might not appreciate me sayin so, but as much as I despise bureaucrats, the only thing worse than a bureaucrat is a military bureaucrat, ex- or otherwise. 'Ex' because they have that idiot military mind-set drilled into their skulls; 'current' because they swap them out every 3 or 4 years with posting changes. And each new CO wants to leave their 'mark' so a whole new set of rules 'n hoops come out for everyone to jump through.

as you can imagine after a few decades of this change for the sake of change nonsense you develop an attitude of "fuck your stupid rules. you'll be gone in four years and then it's more rules" you just ignore them after a while, barely paying lip-service to any rules. I just dismiss them with "rules are made by idiots for idiots" and don't pay 'em no nevermind.
Ya well hubby got out short of his 25 years so he was penalized on his pension but that's ok cuz he was still young enough to get another job and learn a new trade. Now, what little pension he gets subsidizes our CPP & OAS so it's good. He was sick n tired or all the B.S. going on at that time so he has no regrets, even with the loss of (almost) 1/2 of his pension, he still thinks it was worth it.
 

bob the dog

Council Member
Aug 14, 2020
1,025
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Hearing that Fighter Jets are not doing well in Eastern Europe makes me wonder why Canada is spending $20 billion on new F35s. They will be awesome for training purposes though.

Drones seem to be doing okay.
 

bob the dog

Council Member
Aug 14, 2020
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The old saying is "Generals are always preparing to fight the last war."
As in previous I assume? Better than nothing technology outdated before it is ordered that will tie up the procurement system and flow of money for the next thirty years. That is the beauty of the captive market.
 
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Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
22,541
7,553
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Regina, Saskatchewan
Tact, wrote Abraham Lincoln, is the ability to describe others as they see themselves.

Justin Trudeau was in Latvia on Monday, ahead of this week’s important NATO summit in neighbouring Lithuania, patting himself and his government on the back for the contribution toward resisting Russia’s threat to “freedom, international law and a shared set of democratic values that generations of soldiers have fought to defend.”

Latvian prime minister Krijanis Karins stood alongside him, full of praise for his “friend and ally.”

In his remarks, Karins thanked Canada for its contribution of an 800-member battle group to help defend his country — a force that Trudeau announced will double within three years to reach brigade level.

The Latvian prime minister also said his country’s investments in defence will reach three per cent of its GDP next year, three years ahead of schedule.

But in stellar diplomatic fashion, he kept to himself his thoughts on Canada’s comparatively meagre defence contribution, which accounts for just 1.3 per cent of its economic output.

In April, the Washington Post reported that Trudeau told our NATO allies that Canada will not meet the target of two per cent of GDP that was agreed to in Wales in 2014.

Yet last Friday, Reuters reported that all 31 NATO allies have agreed to “an enduring commitment to invest at least two per cent of GDP in their militaries in the future.”

That will mean a massive increase in defence spending in the coming years — if Trudeau has any intention of living up to the pledge.

According to the Parliamentary Budget Office, Canada spent $36.3 billion in 2022/23 on defence, including funding for the Canadian Coast Guard and veterans’ pensions. But to reach two per cent would require the government to spend a further $18.2 billion a year.

The CBC’s Murray Brewster reported on Monday that Canadian officials have been lobbying NATO allies for months to expand the definition of what can be included in the defence spending benchmark, so the government can make progress toward its goal without spending any more money. Canada apparently wants space, cyber and artificial intelligence research to be included in the calculation.

But why stop there? To add another few billion, why not throw in dental-care and child-care spending? Napoleon is said to have commented that an army marches on its stomach, but soldiers also need a working set of choppers and a serene home life to operate at peak performance levels.
1689025432266.jpeg
This is a government that knows there are very few votes in spending more on defence, so while Trudeau heads overseas and talks about how the western world is invested in collective security more than ever before, at home he ensures that Canada continues to be a relative free-rider.

The numbers don’t lie. In 2023, only 11 of the 31 NATO members will hit two per cent: the U.S., the U.K., Poland, Greece, Estonia, Lithuania, Finland, Romania, Hungary, Latvia and Slovakia.

At the other end of the scale, only Spain, Belgium, Slovenia and Luxembourg spend less on defence as a percentage of their economy than Canada does.

The impact of this underfunding is apparent on the ground, at sea and in the air. Trudeau said a year ago that this country will increase the size and capability of its battle-group in Latvia, but it will take three years before it completes the full implementation of 2,200 permanently deployed troops.

Last month, NATO held its largest ever air exercise — Air Defender — that involved 25 nations, including Japan and Sweden, which are not NATO members.

Canada didn’t take part, despite being invited, because too many of its planes and pilots were grounded or involved in “modernization” activities.

Trudeau’s argument for many years was that capability was more important than crude accounting metrics, and that Canada always answered the call. That assertion no longer holds true.

Demands for the federal government to take national security and defence more seriously are becoming stale.

In April, 60 of the country’s former top security officials — including five former defence ministers and nine ex-chiefs of the defence staff — wrote an open letter urging the Liberal government to live up to the commitments made to allies to share the burden of collective security, “commitments which are enacted to safeguard our peace, prosperity and way of life.”

Among the requests was that the government improve the ability of the Department of National Defence “to spend its budget in an expeditious and timely manner” — a major problem in recent years.

Trudeau’s response was the verbal equivalent of his pinched, passive-aggressive, dismissive smile. “To govern is to choose,” he said, before hinting that the people who signed the letter were lobbyists working in “these industries,” who were motivated by unworthy goals.

But the prime minister cannot prevaricate and dodge indefinitely. If he signs up to the two-per-cent target this week, he will have to make meaningful progress in short order, or lose whatever credibility he still has in Washington, London, Berlin and Paris.
 

pgs

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 29, 2008
26,445
6,851
113
B.C.
Tact, wrote Abraham Lincoln, is the ability to describe others as they see themselves.

Justin Trudeau was in Latvia on Monday, ahead of this week’s important NATO summit in neighbouring Lithuania, patting himself and his government on the back for the contribution toward resisting Russia’s threat to “freedom, international law and a shared set of democratic values that generations of soldiers have fought to defend.”

Latvian prime minister Krijanis Karins stood alongside him, full of praise for his “friend and ally.”

In his remarks, Karins thanked Canada for its contribution of an 800-member battle group to help defend his country — a force that Trudeau announced will double within three years to reach brigade level.

The Latvian prime minister also said his country’s investments in defence will reach three per cent of its GDP next year, three years ahead of schedule.

But in stellar diplomatic fashion, he kept to himself his thoughts on Canada’s comparatively meagre defence contribution, which accounts for just 1.3 per cent of its economic output.

In April, the Washington Post reported that Trudeau told our NATO allies that Canada will not meet the target of two per cent of GDP that was agreed to in Wales in 2014.

Yet last Friday, Reuters reported that all 31 NATO allies have agreed to “an enduring commitment to invest at least two per cent of GDP in their militaries in the future.”

That will mean a massive increase in defence spending in the coming years — if Trudeau has any intention of living up to the pledge.

According to the Parliamentary Budget Office, Canada spent $36.3 billion in 2022/23 on defence, including funding for the Canadian Coast Guard and veterans’ pensions. But to reach two per cent would require the government to spend a further $18.2 billion a year.

The CBC’s Murray Brewster reported on Monday that Canadian officials have been lobbying NATO allies for months to expand the definition of what can be included in the defence spending benchmark, so the government can make progress toward its goal without spending any more money. Canada apparently wants space, cyber and artificial intelligence research to be included in the calculation.

But why stop there? To add another few billion, why not throw in dental-care and child-care spending? Napoleon is said to have commented that an army marches on its stomach, but soldiers also need a working set of choppers and a serene home life to operate at peak performance levels.
View attachment 18697
This is a government that knows there are very few votes in spending more on defence, so while Trudeau heads overseas and talks about how the western world is invested in collective security more than ever before, at home he ensures that Canada continues to be a relative free-rider.

The numbers don’t lie. In 2023, only 11 of the 31 NATO members will hit two per cent: the U.S., the U.K., Poland, Greece, Estonia, Lithuania, Finland, Romania, Hungary, Latvia and Slovakia.

At the other end of the scale, only Spain, Belgium, Slovenia and Luxembourg spend less on defence as a percentage of their economy than Canada does.

The impact of this underfunding is apparent on the ground, at sea and in the air. Trudeau said a year ago that this country will increase the size and capability of its battle-group in Latvia, but it will take three years before it completes the full implementation of 2,200 permanently deployed troops.

Last month, NATO held its largest ever air exercise — Air Defender — that involved 25 nations, including Japan and Sweden, which are not NATO members.

Canada didn’t take part, despite being invited, because too many of its planes and pilots were grounded or involved in “modernization” activities.

Trudeau’s argument for many years was that capability was more important than crude accounting metrics, and that Canada always answered the call. That assertion no longer holds true.

Demands for the federal government to take national security and defence more seriously are becoming stale.

In April, 60 of the country’s former top security officials — including five former defence ministers and nine ex-chiefs of the defence staff — wrote an open letter urging the Liberal government to live up to the commitments made to allies to share the burden of collective security, “commitments which are enacted to safeguard our peace, prosperity and way of life.”

Among the requests was that the government improve the ability of the Department of National Defence “to spend its budget in an expeditious and timely manner” — a major problem in recent years.

Trudeau’s response was the verbal equivalent of his pinched, passive-aggressive, dismissive smile. “To govern is to choose,” he said, before hinting that the people who signed the letter were lobbyists working in “these industries,” who were motivated by unworthy goals.

But the prime minister cannot prevaricate and dodge indefinitely. If he signs up to the two-per-cent target this week, he will have to make meaningful progress in short order, or lose whatever credibility he still has in Washington, London, Berlin and Paris.
To think , this is the same Canada that contributed so much to the war effort in the two great wars . Yikes F history we are just a bunch of colonists .
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
22,541
7,553
113
Regina, Saskatchewan
Just weeks ago, government endorsed NATO pledge to hit 2 per cent spending benchmark. The Liberal government is looking to cut almost $1 billion from the annual budget of the Department of National Defence (DND) — a demand the country's top military commander says is prompting some "difficult" conversations within the military.

Earlier this month, Eyre and Matthews released a joint internal statement warning that the department would be expected to contribute to the federal government's overall plan to reduce spending.

"There's no way that you can take almost a billion dollars out of the defence budget and not have an impact," Eyre told the four-party committee. "This is something that we're wrestling with now."

DND's main estimates for 2023-24 say the department's budget for this year is expected to be $26.5 billion

On Thursday, Eyre described how earlier in the day he'd had a "very difficult session" with the commanders of the various services. He said that meeting was intended "to explain this to our people" at a time when the international situation is becoming increasingly precarious — partly due to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.
 

Serryah

Executive Branch Member
Dec 3, 2008
8,903
2,035
113
New Brunswick
Just weeks ago, government endorsed NATO pledge to hit 2 per cent spending benchmark. The Liberal government is looking to cut almost $1 billion from the annual budget of the Department of National Defence (DND) — a demand the country's top military commander says is prompting some "difficult" conversations within the military.

Earlier this month, Eyre and Matthews released a joint internal statement warning that the department would be expected to contribute to the federal government's overall plan to reduce spending.

"There's no way that you can take almost a billion dollars out of the defence budget and not have an impact," Eyre told the four-party committee. "This is something that we're wrestling with now."

DND's main estimates for 2023-24 say the department's budget for this year is expected to be $26.5 billion

On Thursday, Eyre described how earlier in the day he'd had a "very difficult session" with the commanders of the various services. He said that meeting was intended "to explain this to our people" at a time when the international situation is becoming increasingly precarious — partly due to Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

I have always, always, hated how our military is treated and how very little is spent on them. Regardless of WHO has been in charge as PM. And for 20 years it's been worse, IMO, not better.
 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
5,666
3,546
113
Edmonton
I have always, always, hated how our military is treated and how very little is spent on them. Regardless of WHO has been in charge as PM. And for 20 years it's been worse, IMO, not better.
Being a CAF member's spouse, I know all too well the treatment the military receives, especially under PET & now his son. They hate the military & have no compunctions when it comes to denying what the military needs i.e. new(er) equipment.

I remember one time my husband came home from a military exercise (this was under PET) and they didn't have any ammo so they had to go "bang bang" - I couldn't believe it but he insisted it was true. You can't make this crap up!!
 

spaminator

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 26, 2009
35,495
2,971
113
Military police under investigation over handling of sexual assault case
Author of the article:Canadian Press
Canadian Press
Sarah Ritchie and Laura Osman
Published Sep 28, 2023 • 2 minute read
The Military Police Complaints Commission is investigating the way officers handled allegations of sexual assault against a soldier who took his own life.
The Military Police Complaints Commission is investigating the way officers handled allegations of sexual assault against a soldier who took his own life.
OTTAWA — The Military Police Complaints Commission is investigating the way officers handled allegations of sexual assault against a soldier who took his own life, the commission announced Thursday.


Military police charged Maj. Cristian Hiestand, a flight instructor in a Royal Canadian Air Force flight training squadron, with two counts of sexual assault in November 2021.


The complainant alleged that Hiestand sexually assaulted her twice, after they had just ended a relationship.

Hiestand died by suicide two months later, and his parents and sister filed separate complaints with the military police, saying they “rushed to judgment” and didn’t take a statement from the accused before laying charges.

A military police officer has also filed a complaint alleging the investigating officers didn’t record the woman’s interview even though they could have, and that an off-duty sergeant tried to help with the investigation while intoxicated.


The commission denied the initial request for a public interest investigation in 2022, the interim chairperson Bonita Thornton said in her written decision Thursday. She considered the regular conduct complaint process would be adequate in this case.

Since then, the case has received media attention and two more complaints have been made.

“Due to these new circumstances, I have decided to revisit the issue of public interest with respect to the original complaint and the other two related complaints,” Thornton said in her written decision to launch an investigation.

The commission decided to launch a public interest investigation last November, but because the case is also the subject of an internal review, it delayed a public announcement of the probe until Thursday.


The alleged victim reported Hiestand to the local military police detachment and gave an initial statement two days after their relationship ended on Nov. 25, 2021.

The case was referred to the Canadian Forces National Investigation Service, and Hiestand was arrested five days later. He was charged with two counts of sexual assault.

Hiestand’s parents and sisters allege the investigation by the military police was inadequate, and that the service failed to take his statement before he was charged. The investigation service also failed to accept text messages between Hiestand and the alleged victim that could have proved the allegations false, the complainants claim.

The commission also received a complaint from Muhsin Warsame, an officer who served at the local military police detachment at the time and claims to have been present when the alleged victim reported the assaults.

He made several allegations about how the case was mishandled, including that a sergeant tried to assisted with the investigation while off-duty and intoxicated.

Warsame told the commission the warrant officer who interviewed the alleged victim didn’t record it, even though the equipment was available to do so, and that the officer complained with frustration about the victim’s choice to come to the military police instead of the local civilian police.
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
22,541
7,553
113
Regina, Saskatchewan
Just weeks ago, government endorsed NATO pledge to hit 2 per cent spending benchmark. The Liberal government is looking to cut almost $1 billion from the annual budget of the Department of National Defence (DND) —
Consistent.
"There's no way that you can take almost a billion dollars out of the defence budget and not have an impact," Eyre told the four-party committee. "This is something that we're wrestling with now."
What we need is innovation, so we can do more with less, or nothing at all.
The federal government announced plans this week to upgrade their dated military by hiring the most powerful weapon they can think of: an eight-year-old with a water gun.
“For years, our dedicated troops have struggled to be effective with broken and aging equipment”, explained Defence Minister Bill Blair. “But this weekend at a BBQ, I watched this kid decimate three grown adults with nothing but a grin and a single stream of water, and I knew it was time to bring in the big guns”.

Aiden Bradshaw, previously a third grader at Rosedale Primary School, is days away from being shipped overseas as Canada’s first line of defence between peace and the brutalities of war.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
108,480
10,933
113
Low Earth Orbit
Good thing all NATO members are sending their warn out junk to Ukraine. 3 years now there will a buying frenzy of the latest AI equipped arms.

Out with the old and 250,000 Ukrainians in with the new made in UNION FREE Ukraine at $4 an hr.

They already have enough scrap metal laying around to build 5000 new tanks.
 
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Taxslave2

House Member
Aug 13, 2022
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Being a CAF member's spouse, I know all too well the treatment the military receives, especially under PET & now his son. They hate the military & have no compunctions when it comes to denying what the military needs i.e. new(er) equipment.

I remember one time my husband came home from a military exercise (this was under PET) and they didn't have any ammo so they had to go "bang bang" - I couldn't believe it but he insisted it was true. You can't make this crap up!!
When I worked for DND 15 years ago, they were using wooden rifles on exercises. Then there is their retarded spending priorities. I was responsible for maintaining fuel and fire tucks.We couldn't get a scope to inspect the inside of hoses used on jet fuel trucks, but there was money to buy a picnic table and chairs for the shop crew. One crash truck needed new batteries, had to jump start it twice a day and make sure every shift ran it to keep batteries up. Couldn't buy new one locally because it come out of NATO budget, so they eventually were flown in on a jet from Ontario.
 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
5,666
3,546
113
Edmonton
So where exactly is Trudeau going to cut the one billion from the military budget from?
Good question. The military who were in Europe on exercise ended up paying for their own meals & equipment out of their pockets so if our government is already abdicating it's responsibility to those serving, where will the "cut" become? Will we have military families on welfare? WTF??? But again, I shouldn't be surprised as this government has already shown how inept & incapable of rational thought.
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
22,541
7,553
113
Regina, Saskatchewan
The federal Liberals have been embroiled in an inordinate number of political controversies THIS year.

Allegations of Chinese interference in our democratic election process, for instance.

Battling Facebook over the Online News Act.

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s high-profile separation from his wife, Sophie.

Global Affairs Canada’s ridiculous change to the travel advisory to warn members of the LGBTQ+ community visiting the U.S.

Accusing the Indian government of a possible connection to the murder of Sikh leader Hardeep Singh Nijjar on Canadian soil.

The House of Commons honouring a Nazi with a standing ovation.

Considering all of this, you would think the Trudeau Liberals would want to get out of the news cycle and lay low for a while. Maybe even attempt to rebuild their shattered public image.

That’s not the case. Far from it.
Ottawa is now reportedly considering cutting nearly $1 billion from the Department of National Defence’s annual budget.