Can you really just ignore the constitution if you feel like it?

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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All of those free speech hating, SJWs are trying to abuse our constituti-- oh wait, it's actually Brad Wall and the Muslim haters.

Huh.



Can you really just ignore the constitution if you feel like it? Canada's notwithstanding clause explained

It’s been a big week for Canada’s famed notwithstanding clause. Quebec is hinting that it might use the clause to protect their new anti-niqab law from a federal court challenge.

And in Saskatchewan’s speech from the throne, outgoing premier Brad Wall again promised to use the clause to override a court order mandating that the provincial government stop paying for non-Catholics to go to Catholic school.

“We will introduce legislation that will protect the right to school choice by invoking the notwithstanding clause of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms,” it read.

The notwithstanding clause (section 33 of the Constitution Act) is exactly as strange as it sounds: It’s a magical section of the Canadian constitution that allows provincial governments to simply ignore a key section of the constitution if they don’t like it.

The only rule is that the governments have to first announce that they’re doing it. Specifically, they have to stand up in their legislature and announce that they’re going to pass an act “notwithstanding” whatever it says in the constitution.

What’s most surprising about the clause is that it allows provinces to override what are arguably the most important parts of the constitution: The “fundamental freedoms” and “legal rights” of Canadian citizens.

Freedom of religion, freedom of association, freedom of the press, protections from arbitrary imprisonment and search, “the right to life, liberty and security of the person” — all of these can technically be ignored by a provincial government provided they announce it first.

To be sure, the Constitution does insert a time limit on how long a province can get away with this. “A declaration … shall cease to have effect five years after it comes into force,” reads the clause.

However, this is easily overridden by the fact that the province can simply “re-enact” their constitution-flouting declaration.

Naturally, other democratic countries don’t this. As our own Library of Parliament notes in a summary, the idea of building an escape clause into a human rights code “appears to be a uniquely Canadian development.”

The Constitution of Japan specifically states that the document overrides every other “law, ordinance, imperial rescript or other act of government.” It’s a similar deal in South Africa, where the constitution is held as “supreme” and any other contradictory law is declared “invalid.”

The U.S. Constitution, which is taken particularly seriously by its adherents, definitively states that it “shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby.”

Can you really just ignore the constitution if you feel like it? Canada’s notwithstanding clause explained | National Post
 

JLM

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Nov 27, 2008
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All of those free speech hating, SJWs are trying to abuse our constituti-- oh wait, it's actually Brad Wall and the Muslim haters.

Huh.



Can you really just ignore the constitution if you feel like it? Canada's notwithstanding clause explained

It’s been a big week for Canada’s famed notwithstanding clause. Quebec is hinting that it might use the clause to protect their new anti-niqab law from a federal court challenge.

And in Saskatchewan’s speech from the throne, outgoing premier Brad Wall again promised to use the clause to override a court order mandating that the provincial government stop paying for non-Catholics to go to Catholic school.

“We will introduce legislation that will protect the right to school choice by invoking the notwithstanding clause of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms,” it read.

The notwithstanding clause (section 33 of the Constitution Act) is exactly as strange as it sounds: It’s a magical section of the Canadian constitution that allows provincial governments to simply ignore a key section of the constitution if they don’t like it.

The only rule is that the governments have to first announce that they’re doing it. Specifically, they have to stand up in their legislature and announce that they’re going to pass an act “notwithstanding” whatever it says in the constitution.

What’s most surprising about the clause is that it allows provinces to override what are arguably the most important parts of the constitution: The “fundamental freedoms” and “legal rights” of Canadian citizens.

Freedom of religion, freedom of association, freedom of the press, protections from arbitrary imprisonment and search, “the right to life, liberty and security of the person” — all of these can technically be ignored by a provincial government provided they announce it first.

To be sure, the Constitution does insert a time limit on how long a province can get away with this. “A declaration … shall cease to have effect five years after it comes into force,” reads the clause.

However, this is easily overridden by the fact that the province can simply “re-enact” their constitution-flouting declaration.

Naturally, other democratic countries don’t this. As our own Library of Parliament notes in a summary, the idea of building an escape clause into a human rights code “appears to be a uniquely Canadian development.”

The Constitution of Japan specifically states that the document overrides every other “law, ordinance, imperial rescript or other act of government.” It’s a similar deal in South Africa, where the constitution is held as “supreme” and any other contradictory law is declared “invalid.”

The U.S. Constitution, which is taken particularly seriously by its adherents, definitively states that it “shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby.”

Can you really just ignore the constitution if you feel like it? Canada’s notwithstanding clause explained | National Post


Unless there's a law saying you can't! :) :)
 

Walter

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Wall is giving his citizens choice. The left loves choice as long as it's their choice everyone chooses.
 

Danbones

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Danbones

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Right, the part where "everyone gates to choose" even if it's the only choice you give them, is too complicated for you?
You would like to leave that part out so no one will ever know you nazicommiegloballists are making everything up for personal gain.
 

JamesBondo

House Member
Mar 3, 2012
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So a non catholic goes to a public school,and the government pays. But if the non catholic goes to a catholic school, it is a violation of the charter for the government to pay?

Can someone explain the issue here? I don't get it what the charter is attempting to acompljsh here.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Mar 18, 2013
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Can you really just ignore the constitution if you feel like it?

Yes, you can. And if you do, there may or may not be consequences, and those consequences range from punishment to the Constitution being interpreted to allow or even mandate what you're doing.

Your argument is just that, an argument. It is light-years away from being the last word.
 

JamesBondo

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Mar 3, 2012
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Typical mentalfloss article. 1000 words about nothing, and only 1 sentence about the issue that is vague enough that somoney who hasn't read about it might be left with more questions than it answers.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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The vast majority of people in SK are pissed about the decision in the Theodore Case.

1 angry person Vs 1.2 million.

Do they wait 5 years for the angry old Protestant to die then go back to status quo?
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Typical mentalfloss article. 1000 words about nothing, and only 1 sentence about the issue that is vague enough that somoney who hasn't read about it might be left with more questions than it answers.

As I said, he's making an argument (or rather, agreeing with somebody else's argument). That's fine. It just ain't the last word by a long road.
 

Danbones

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Sep 23, 2015
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The vast majority of people in SK are pissed about the decision in the Theodore Case.

1 angry person Vs 1.2 million.

Do they wait 5 years for the angry old Protestant to die then go back to status quo?

So people should not have the right to choose?
That's why the red thumb? Because you think they should not?

Why you little commie you
:)
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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As I said, he's making an argument (or rather, agreeing with somebody else's argument). That's fine. It just ain't the last word by a long road.

It's called a preamble, but I've taken no official position on this.

The question still remains as to whether a constitution should have an escape clause like this. And also, whether or not a constitution is a good thing to begin with.
 

Dixie Cup

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Sep 16, 2006
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The fact that it hasn't been used thus far means that first, there needs to be a serious issue before any of the provinces decide to use it, and secondly I suspect that any provincial government who intends to use it would have the support of its citizenry. Otherwise, it would be political suicide.


I agree, I have no problem with non Catholics attending the Catholic school. The Catholic school I attended had protestant pupils; it seemed there were some discipline issues in the public school that the parents weren't prepared to deal with. They were not "forced" to attend religious classes nor attend the odd mass we had at the gym. The protestant teacher in our school used the time to tutor those students while the rest of us were at mass. Didn't seem to be an issue and this was 40+ years ago so it's been going on for some time and isn't news to me. Why it's suddenly come it if a puzzle.


Besides, at least in Alberta, you designate your property taxes to either "public or separate" schools so if your kids attend a Catholic school, the education portion of your taxes go towards that school. So I don't know what the issue is at all.


As for Quebec using the notwithstanding clause, since the wearing of a niqab isn't a "religious" issue the courts should simply leave it alone. If the majority of Quebecers are against the ban, then the current government will suffer the consequences at voting time and the ban will eventually be reversed, but my understanding is that the public supports the ban..


In Canada, where the Federal government loves to intrude on provincial rights, it is a good thing that we have the "notwithstanding" clause as a condition for the repatriation the constitution. The way the population is distributed; the east has much more "power" simply because of representation by population aspect of our voting than central or western Canada. We would have been totally irresponsible not to have something like the notwithstanding clause inserted in the constitution as a "protection" of sorts from a federal government who could potentially over-step their jurisdiction on issues based on ideology as the Liberals are so fond of doing.


Right or wrong it's JMHO
 

TenPenny

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Jun 9, 2004
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Personally, I think the gov't should provide public schools, and if a religion wants their own, they should fund it, and if you want your kids to go to a religious school, you should pay out of pocket.


End of story.
 

Cannuck

Time Out
Feb 2, 2006
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I'm not Catholic but all my kids went to a Catholic school. Other than teaching my kids that the religious part was silly, I had no issues

Personally, I think the gov't should provide public schools, and if a religion wants their own, they should fund it, and if you want your kids to go to a religious school, you should pay out of pocket.


End of story.

That works for me but I would add that parents should have a choice in which public school their kids go to