Baird to Palestinians, You’ll face ‘consequences’

[earth_as_one]

I can agree with you in principle. However, if most Canadians support Haprer, then what can we do about it?

You could write a letter to the UN.

The UN is well aware of what is going on in Israel. They have observers present who witness Israeli atrocities.

The UN has received many reports like this since Zionists began an ethnic cleansing war over 60 years ago:

Israeli atrocities in Gaza: a political impasse and moral collapse

The premeditated slaughter yesterday of innocent men, women and children sheltering in the UN-run al-Fakhora school in Gaza is a war crime for which the Israeli government and military general staff are directly responsible. As atrocity piles on atrocity, it is clear that the Israeli military is using Hamas’s rocket attacks as the pretext for terrorising and subjugating the entire Palestinian population.

At least 42 people were killed when Israeli shells struck just outside the school in the Jabalya refugee camp in northern Gaza. Another 55 were injured—at least five critically. Witnesses described a scene of horror with victims cut down by shrapnel lying in pools of blood on the street. Following the attack, a hospital official, Fares Ghanem, told the Associated Press: “I saw a lot of women and children wheeled in. A lot of wounded were missing limbs and a lot of the dead were in pieces.”

The deliberate character of the attack was underscored by the fact that the school was hit not by a loose bomb dropped from 10,000 feet, but by precisely targetted shells. John Ging, operations director in Gaza for the UN Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA), said that the Israeli army had been given the precise coordinates of the school, which was clearly marked. Noting the school was located in a built-up area, he said: “Of course it was entirely inevitable if artillery shells landed in that area there would be a high number of casualties.” Some 350 people were taking refuge at the time inside the school.

The Israeli military issued a statement suggesting its forces had responded to mortar fire coming from the school and that Hamas had once again used civilians as “human shields”—a claim routinely made to justify Israeli Defence Force (IDF) atrocities. UNRWA official Ging denied that Hamas fighters were using its refuges. “There’s nowhere safe in Gaza. Everyone here is terrorised and traumatised,” he said. UN official Maxwell Gaylard demanded an independent investigation, saying those responsible for any breaches of international law must be held accountable...

Israeli atrocities in Gaza: a political impasse and moral collapse | Global Research

But nothing ever happens because of US and UK vetos at the UNSC.

I don't expect that Canada can stop these atrocities. But we don't have to support them or be complicit. Canada should stand with the majority of the world and condemn these sorts of war crimes. Instead our government is silent.

The problem is most Canadians are unaware. We should know where Harper stands when it comes to international laws and human rights. His support for Israeli war criminals is consistent with his support for American war criminals during the Bush regime. He should have been roasted politically for trying to get Canadian soldiers involved in that war crime.

I donate money to the NDP nationally and the Liberal Party locally. (They have the best chance of defeating the local Conservative incumbent). I don't a problem with my local MP who is a Conservative backbencher. He seems like a nice person, but he's on the wrong team.

I recommend Canadians vote strategically in elections. If you don't want Canada to continue supporting war criminals, then I recommend voting strategically for the opposition party candidate that has the best chance of defeating the Conservative candidate.

 

[Goober]

My main beef is with the Harper government.

Canada should be a force for international freedom and justice. But the Harper government has turned Canada into Israel's bitch. Canadians should elect governments that recognizes and upholds international laws and treaties, while imposing sanctions against all countries and individuals who commit war crimes and crimes against humanity.

Nope- Jews- Israel, then Harper. Also add to that list any any other country or individual that supports the right of Israel to a State with secure borders.

 

[earth_as_one]

My primary concern is Canada. Canada should not support war criminals or stick its nose in an ethnic cleansing war on the side of the side behaving like Nazis.

Your primary concern is Israel's secure borders and vilifying anyone who might have Canada's interests above Israel's interests. If you really care about Israel more than Canada, please leave Canada and go to Israel, where you can volunteer to secure their borders.

Meanwhile, I'm going to continue base my opinions on what's best for Canada as well as international laws and treaties:

The Palestinians’ first attempt to join the I.C.C. was thwarted last April when the court’s chief prosecutor at the time, Luis Moreno-Ocampo, declined the request on the grounds that Palestine was not a state. That ambiguity has since diminished with the United Nations’ conferral of nonmember state status on Palestine in November. Israel’s frantic opposition to the elevation of Palestine’s status at the United Nations was motivated precisely by the fear that it would soon lead to I.C.C. jurisdiction over Palestinian claims of war crimes.

Israeli leaders are unnerved for good reason. The I.C.C. could prosecute major international crimes committed on Palestinian soil anytime after the court’s founding on July 1, 2002.

Since the outbreak of the second Palestinian intifada in 2000, the Israel Defense Forces, guided by its military lawyers, have attempted to remake the laws of war by consciously violating them and then creating new legal concepts to provide juridical cover for their misdeeds. For example, in 2002, an Israeli F-16 dropped a one-ton bomb on an apartment building in a densely populated Gaza neighborhood, killing a Hamas military leader, Salah Shehadeh, and 14 others, including his wife and seven children under the age of 15. In 2009, Israeli artillery killed more than 20 members of the Samouni family, who had sought shelter in a structure in the Zeitoun district of Gaza City at the bidding of Israeli soldiers. Last year, Israeli missiles killed two Palestinian cameramen working for Al Aksa television. Each of these acts, and many more, could lead to I.C.C. investigations. .

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/30/o...d-take-israel-to-court-in-the-hague.html?_r=0

Baird is an @sshole, the only people who should fear the law are criminals. I'm embarrassed that Baird would attempt to threaten the victims of war crimes with cutting off support for a dictator they hate if they attempt to seek justice.

Go ahead Baird, cut off the flow of Canadian tax dollars to Abbas's mercenaries... I'm sure Palestinians are worried.

 

[MHz]

Nope- Jews- Israel, then Harper. Also add to that list any any other country or individual that supports the right of Israel to a State with secure borders.

If that is your order of priority (compared to doing a psych-evaluation on some poster) are you sure you are in the right country?
Most countries would view that as bordering on treason if you were an important person in Government.

Looks like we take goods produced in the West Bank and Gaza and in return spy on them for Israel. I would think they would welcome our exit. $500M may sound like a lot of money until it is spread over 20 years and the money is given to Israel and they spread it around if they are in the mood. (We spent twice that on security in Toronto for a meeting of the big-wigs just a few years ago to put that amount into proper perspective)

Canada began a bilateral assistance programme in the West Bank and Gaza following the Oslo Accords. Since 1993-1994, the Canadian International Development Agency (CIDA) has provided more than $500 million for development initiatives in the West Bank and Gaza, assistance to Palestinian refugees, and support to the Middle East Peace Process.
Over the past several years, the Canada-Palestine bilateral relationship has benefited from increased ministerial contacts. In 2012, Canada’s Minister of Foreign Affairs John Baird, Minister of Finance Jim Flaherty, Minister of Agriculture Gerald Ritz, Governor of the Bank of Canada Mark Carney, as well as numerous provincial and municipal parliamentarians and officials visited their Palestinian counterparts and met with key Palestinian leaders in Ramallah.
Commercial Relations

Pursuant to the Paris Protocol, Palestinian exports to Canada benefit from preferential treatment offered in the 1997 Canada-Israel Free Trade Agreement (CIFTA). Furthermore, in 1999, Canada concluded the Joint Canadian-Palestinian Framework on Economic Cooperation and Trade with the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO) on behalf of the Palestinian Authority (PA), which confirmed PA approval of the application of preferential tariffs and any future concessions under CIFTA to goods produced in the West Bank and Gaza Strip. Recent developments indicate that the Information and Communication Technology sector holds the most opportunity for Canadian businesses within the Palestinian economy.
http://www.canadainternational.gc.c...lations_bilaterales/canada-wbg-cg.aspx?view=d

 

[CDNBear]

The Nazis of our time

We don’t have the slightest doubt that the Israeli military-political establishment and those backing it politically, financially and militarily represent the Nazis of our time.

We know the word “Nazi” is a loaded term that shouldn’t be used arbitrarily to describe evil actions or evil people. We are also mindful of the fact that ascribing the “Nazi” epithet to Jews and Jewish behaviour is a tightly guarded taboo in many Western countries.

However, the truth must be told regarding what Israel is doing to the Palestinians. Indeed, when Jews, or anybody else, think, behave and act like Nazis, they become Nazis, which begs the question: Does Israel think, behave and act in a Nazi-like manner toward the helpless and unprotected Palestinians in the streets and hills of the West Bank and Gaza Strip?

You bet, it does!

Over the past few days and weeks, the Nazi nature of Israeli behaviour was amply conspicuous....

The Nazis of our time

That's not criticism EAO. That's Nazi-esque demonization.

You would fit well in the ranks of the Nazi's of our times. You spread propaganda better than they ever could.

 

[earth_as_one]

If calling someone a Nazi makes them a Nazi too, then CB must be a Nazi, by his warped logic.

By my logic a person would have to act like a Nazi to earn the label.

I point out Human Rights Abuses and speak up for the victims of human rights abuses, just like the people who opposed the Nazis.

Nazis supported and/or committed human rights abuses. When CB supports Israel's human rights abuses and smears anyone who criticizes Israeli human rights abuses, he is acting just like those who supported Nazis.

From the link: The Nazis of our time Are these the actions of Nazis:

...the Israeli army forced Palestinian policemen to take off their clothes at gunpoint and then paraded them naked before TV cameras, very much like the Nazis did in Europe more than 60 years ago. The disgraceful act, which was meant to humiliate, debase, and hurt, served no logical purpose other than satisfying sadistic tendencies, using the words of veteran Israeli writer Uri Avnery.

Why do Israeli leaders and army generals do these things to the Palestinians? Are we talking about a subconscious or probably conscious urge to emulate their former tormentors? Do Israeli leaders and generals think that humiliating their victims is the ultimate test of their virility? Do some Jews in Israel subconsciously admire the Nazis?

Moreover, why did Jewish leaders and public figures—who move quickly to condemn the slightest censure of Israeli behaviour—remain silent about this abominable act? Just imagine how these hypocritical Jewish leaders would have reacted had Jews, not Palestinians, been paraded naked before the eyes of the world!

The second Nazi-like act carried out by the Zionist child killers took place at the village of el-Yamon near Jenin in the northern West Bank on 17 March. There, the Israeli army dispatched a death squad of undercover soldiers who disguised themselves as Palestinians to assassinate those Palestinians the Israeli army suspects were involved in the resistance.

However, after milling around for more than an hour, and the person or persons to be murdered didn’t show up, the soldiers, worried that they would return to base “empty- handed,” decided to murder an 8-year-old child named Akaber Zayed.

The child was sitting in the backseat of a taxi cab when a bullet pierced her tender head, killing her instantly. Having carried out their mission, the soldiers returned to base, probably receiving a citation for valour from their superiors.

The Israeli army, adding insult to injury (in this case to murder), initially claimed the soldiers acted in accordance with standing orders and violated no laws. Well, the Gestapo, the SS and Wehrmacht were also acting in accordance with standing orders and violated no laws.

The cold-blooded murder of Akaber Zayed is another stark reminder, if one were needed, of the phantasmagoric murder of Iman al-Hams in Rafah in southern Gaza three years ago. Then an Israeli army soldier shot the 9-year-old child while on her way to school, seriously wounding her in the upper part of her body. However, instead of trying to save her life, the beast, using the words of an Israeli newspaper, emptied his entire magazine of bullets into her body to make sure that she was dead and posed no risk to the Israeli “defence” forces in the area. In Israeli army jargon, they call this “verification of the killing.” (This author witnessed a barbaric act as such in Hebron several years ago.)

We are not talking about two or ten or even a hundred cases of deliberate murder of Palestinian children. We are talking about as many as 1,400 Palestinian minors and children, murdered knowingly and deliberately by the Israeli occupation army and paramilitary Jewish terrorists, also known as settlers, in less than six years by the Nazis of our time.

The Israeli State, along with its parroting mouthpieces in the capitals of North America and Europe, claim, mendaciously, of course, that Israeli soldiers don’t deliberately target Palestinian children and that the estimated 1,400 Palestinian kids were killed by mistake.

Well, mistakes happen once, twice, even ten times. But when children are killed nearly on a daily basis, it means the killing is institutionalized State policy.

And, now, we are entering the era of a new Nazi-like policy adopted by the government of Israel, designed to starve the Palestinian people through hermetic blockades and closures of Palestinian population centres in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank.

This did not happened by coincidence. Two months ago, Dov Weisglass, Advisor of the now-comatose Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, told the Israeli public radio that “the idea is to put the Palestinians on a diet but not make them die of hunger.” Other Israeli officials made similar virulent statements, which, unfortunately, failed to draw any reactions from Western capitals.

Mass starvation is nothing short of mass genocide, pure and simple. And Israel is only doing it gradually in order to predict and pre-gauge Western reactions. Israel has done it for two months this time and must be very pleased with the absence of any angry reactions from the capitals of Europe and North America.

Next time, the blockade will last longer, and the prospects of real hunger will grow accordingly. This is not an exaggeration or hysteria. This is simply the honest impression that one, anyone, would receive after objectively examining facts on the ground.

We, Palestinians, will not appeal to the U.S. to rein-in Israeli Nazism. America has been crueler to us than Israel itself. America, whose policies are controlled by right-wing Jewish circles such as AIPAC, is our tormentor, par excellence.

But how about Europe? Should European peoples and European governments atone for one holocaust by allowing Israel to commit another, though a silent and almost imperceptible one?

This is the urgent question that the Old Continent must face now.

 

[CDNBear]

If calling someone a Nazi makes them a Nazi too, then CB must be a Nazi, by his warped logic.

Liar, not at all, that just something you made up, because I see through your facade and you don't like it.

And given how times I've proven you wrong and to be a liar, your opinion really carries no weight at all.

Your article from the Palestinian Times is about demonizing Israel, not criticizing Israel. Nothing you post is about criticizing Isreal, just demonizing it.

Face it EAO, you've been exposed for what you really are.

 

[earth_as_one]

Here's another example of IDF soldiers behaving like Nazis:

"Play something sad"
Israeli soldiers force Palestinian violinist to play at roadblock | World news | The Guardian

If I recall, some Nazis at the death camps forced Jewish violinists to play something sad while they murdered thousands in gas chambers

 

[CDNBear]

Here's another example of IDF soldiers behaving like Nazis:

"Play something sad"
Israeli soldiers force Palestinian violinist to play at roadblock | World news | The Guardian

2004?

There you go digging for anything to demonize Israel with, lol.

You do realize you prove me right more often than I prove you wrong, right? lol.

 

[earth_as_one]

You don't have to take my word. I'll reference an expert in Nazi behavior for an opinion regarding the Parallels between the way Nazis treated their undesirable non-citizens and the way Israel treats their undesirable non-citizens:

Auschwitz survivor: ‘Israel acts like Nazis’
Sunday 24 January 2010

One of the last remaining Auschwitz survivors has launched a blistering attack on Israel over its occupation of Palestine as he began a lecture tour of Scotland.

Dr Hajo Meyer, 86, who survived 10 months in the Nazi death camp, spoke out as his 10-day tour of the UK and Ireland – taking in three Scottish venues – got under way.

Dr Meyer also attended hearings at Edinburgh Sheriff Court on Thursday, where five pro-Palestine campaigners are accused of racially aggravated conduct after disrupting a concert by the Jerusalem Quartet at the city’s Queen’s Hall.

Speaking as his tour got under way, Dr Meyer said there were parallels between the treatment of Jews by Germans in the Second World War and the current treatment of Palestinians by Israelis.

He said: “The Israelis tried to dehumanise the Palestinians, just like the Nazis tried to dehumanise me. Nobody should dehumanise any other and those who try to dehumanise another are not human.

“It may be that Israel is not the most cruel country in the world … but one thing I know for sure is that Israel is the world champion in pretending to be civilised and cultured.”

Dr Meyer was born in 1924 in Bielefeld, Germany. He was not allowed to attend school there after November 1938. He then fled to the Netherlands, alone. In 1944, after a year in the underground, he was caught by the Gestapo and survived 10 months at Auschwitz concentration camp in Poland.

He now lives in the Netherlands, and is the author of three books on Judaism, the Holocaust and Zionism.

Dr Meyer also insisted the definition of “anti-Semitic” had now changed, saying: “Formerly an anti-Semite was somebody who hated Jews because they were Jews and had a Jewish soul. But nowadays an anti-Semite is somebody who is hated by Jews.”

A spokesman for the International Jewish Anti-Zionist Network, of which Dr Meyer is a member, said criticising Israel was “not the same” as criticising Jews.

Mick Napier, Scottish Palestine *Solidarity Campaign chairman and one of the five demonstrators facing charges when the court case continues in March, said: “Palestinians are happy to have him as an ally in their cause.

“Hajo knows that Israel has a long history of abusing the tragic history of the Holocaust in order to suppress legitimate criticism of its own crimes.

“Especially since Gaza, people are no longer taken in by their claim that anyone that criticises Israel is anti-Semitic.”

Auschwitz survivor: ‘Israel acts like Nazis’ | Herald Scotland

Arch Bishop Desmond Tutu: "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

 

[CDNBear]

You don't have to take my word.

I wouldn't, it lacks any credibility.

I'll reference an expert in Nazi behavior...

Liar, he's not an expert.

That's like saying I was incarcerated once for 6 months, so I' must be an expert on the penal system.

What were you saying about twisted logic earlier, lol.

Keep going troll, I'm home all day, and I love helping you expose yourself for what you are, lol.

Arch Bishop Desmond Tutu: "If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor."

LOL, how many times have you said Canada should be neutral?

 

[earth_as_one]

IMO, Dr. Hajo Meyer is an expert in dehumanizing behavior because he lived through it. Ten months in an extermination camp was just part of what he experienced. But if anyone has doubts about his expertize, please feel free to listen to what has to say about Israel's treatment of Palestinians versus Nazi treatment of Jews:

Auschwitz Survivor on Palestine - YouTube

 

[DaSleeper]

Quark and the feelings of a Ferengi - YouTube

 

[CDNBear]

IMO, Dr. Hajo Meyer is an expert in dehumanizing behavior because he lived through it. Ten months in an extermination camp was just part of what he experienced.

Of course you would, he supports your demonization of Israel.

Anybody, no matter what their credentials that does, is an expert to you.

That's how we know you have no idea what critical thought is, lol.

But if anyone has doubts about his expertize...

Is he going to discuss physics? That is after all his field of expertise. Well that and making violins and violas.

 

[earth_as_one]

What's Israel's leaders believe:

Benjamin Netanyahurime Minister of Israel has advocated mass expulsions of Palestinians from the Occupied Territories.

Moshe Ya'alon: Israeli Cabinet Minister has been accused of war crimes for his involvement in the 1996 massacre of 106 Lebanese civilians in Qana, as well as his role in the 2002 assassination of a suspected Hamas commander in Gaza City that killed seven members of a neighboring family and 15 others.

Efraim Eitam.Cabinet Minister said in March 2002 that Arab citizens of Israel "resemble a cancerous growth." He has advocated for Israel's permanent control of the Occupied Palestinian Territories

 

[CDNBear]

What's Israel's leaders believe:

Benjamin Netanyahurime Minister of Israel has advocated mass expulsions of Palestinians from the Occupied Territories.

Meh, nothing I would support, but hardly Nazi like.

Your terrorist buddies are far more ignorant about what and how they would remove the Jewish menace.

Moshe Ya'alon: Israeli Cabinet Minister has been accused of war crimes for his involvement in the 1996 massacre of 106 Lebanese civilians in Qana, as well as his role in the 2002 assassination of a suspected Hamas commander in Gaza City that killed seven members of a neighboring family and 15 others.

There's more than enough evidence to call into question the Palestinian account at Qana.

But that would require you to use critical thought, so of course we'll see you post idiocy about Qana, time and time again.

Efraim Eitam.Cabinet Minister said in March 2002 that Arab citizens of Israel "resemble a cancerous growth." He has advocated for Israel's permanent control of the Occupied Palestinian Territories

Again, ignorant, but hardly Nazi like.

 

[earth_as_one]

BTW, Nazi supporters weren't known for standing up for victims of human rights abuses. They were known for minimizing and ignoring human rights abuses.... just like CB does.

 

[DaSleeper]

A little comic relief for this lousy propaganda thread......

Crazy Muslim Cleric Describes The Perfect Virgins In Heaven - YouTube

 

[CDNBear]

BTW, Nazi supporters weren't known for standing up for victims of human rights abuses.

True, but they sure did love to spread the propaganda put out by the Nazi's.

Just like you do for the Palestinian Authority. Which is funny. You diss the PA, condemn them, and yet when they spew propaganda that is filled with so many holes, inconsistencies, and is obviously meant to do nothing but demonize Israel, you believe it explicitly, post it without question, then defend it tooth and nail.

They were known for minimizing and ignoring human rights abuses.... just like CB does.

Liar, no I don't. That's just something you made up.

That's what the Nazi's did. Make stuff up. Just like your terrorist buddies. And useful idiots spread it for them.

You're doing a bang up job EAO.

 

[earth_as_one]

In case anyone takes CB's comments about me seriously....

I support Canada's policies regarding Palestinian war criminals and mass murderers.

I don't support Canada's unshakable support for Israeli war criminals and mass murderers.

CB's favorite lie about me is to claim that since I oppose Israeli war criminals and mass murderers, that I must support Palestinian war criminals and mass murderers... for example, he just insinuated this lie, by claiming I have "terrorist buddies"... even though I've repeatedly condemned Palestinian war criminals, mass murderers and all acts of violence committed by Palestinians against Israeli civilians. I oppose all war criminals, mass murders and anyone who would commit acts of violence directed civilians. That proves CB is a bold faced liar.

What "Never Again" means to me is that people must never again be silent in the face of injustice and oppression. Silence equals tacit support. If more people had spoken out against the Nazis before they took power, WW II and all the related Nazi atrocities could have been avoided.

You either believe in fundamental human rights for everyone, or you don't truly believe in fundamental human rights.