Automakers Bailout

scratch

Senate Member
May 20, 2008
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juan,
I know what you are saying. My Dad bought a big finned Plymouth 2 dr -- 1957 and ran the hell out of it until `64 or `65 then bought an Audi..bad idea..never buy a car the first year it comes out..but as you well know live and learn..

rgs
 

#juan

Hall of Fame Member
Aug 30, 2005
18,326
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juan,
I know what you are saying. My Dad bought a big finned Plymouth 2 dr -- 1957 and ran the hell out of it until `64 or `65 then bought an Audi..bad idea..never buy a car the first year it comes out..but as you well know live and learn..

rgs

Around 1962 I used to go to Lincoln Park in Calgary to watch the drag races. Chrysler showed up with a couple "Hemi" Ram Chargers that blew everybody away. We're talking under twelve seconds at a hundred and twenty eight mph in the quarter mile. Not particularly fuel efficient but..........................................impressive.........;-)
 

scratch

Senate Member
May 20, 2008
5,658
22
38
juan,
My first car was a 2 dr Chevelle SS (originally a 283) but bored out to a 305, full suspension kit, dual glass mufflers, small tires in front and raised slicks on the back...3 on the floor...but you could rev out 1st to almost 6 grand and 60mph in 7 flat...scared the hell out of me...but I got used to it...too bad street racing was the thing then...

scratch
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
212
63
In the bush near Sudbury
I've had a few ground-pounders in my time. In an era of .45.9/gal gas, brute force moved mountains and passed everything but gas stations. Somehow, it's just hard to think Toyota or Nissan when I think Cayuga Speedway....
 

talloola

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 14, 2006
19,576
113
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Vancouver Island
These BAILOUTS must stop. It has become the fashion these days. I know many people on our Motor City who are the greediest batards on the face of the earth and they are not the owners of the car companies but the union members and their leaders.
More, more, more pay less hours, higher wages to make a pathetic product.
More than one company has been forced out of Windsor because of union greed and more will face the same.
Their problem is a greedy snake of a `man` Buzz Hargrove who decides along with the UAW when the iron is hot to strike.
Justify a floor sweeper making $32.00/hr.

Justify an individual who drives bus with no more than a grade eight education and pulls down $80,000yr. It is the owners and buyers being held hostage by these blood-suckers. Their problem. They find a solution.

In and around the Toronto area there are large Honda and Toyota plants and they do not have these problems. Why?

Let the big three die and all those who chose to go on the `screw` the owners and public ride.

scratch

Don't agree, when a company is pulling down big bucks, and has a union to keep balance,
from owner to worker, all who work for that company should make decent wage, doesn't
matter what they do, the floor sweeper would not make the money a high end worker
would, but if he did make a good wage, good for him, because he sweeps floors, doesn't
make him worthless by any means. I've had many an arguement with those who hate the
unions, but I remember when there was no unions, if you are in that catagorie, and would
treat workers like they were treated 'then', we have nothing incommon at all.
There is greed on both sides, and the reason for that is , they are all 'human beings'.
Before unions were formed workers were at the 'whim' of the owners, could be fired for
ANY reason whatsoever, took bribes from workers, so worker would keep jobs, were paid
a horrible low wage for long hours, and no security at all, working conditions were horrible.
no medical care, poor safety conditions, etc etc.
Those days were horrible, my grandfather was treated poorly as a result, and my father.
Companies nowadays who have no unions, usually pay a decent wage, but that is a result
of unions, as they do try to keep pace, within reason, they have to.
If you want to lay the blame on the union for the auto industry having their problems,
you are missing the point.
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
212
63
In the bush near Sudbury
You'll find a lot more Japanese CEOs who will tighten their belts than you will North American ones ... and a lot less who make million dollar salaries. Can you blame a union for that? Wait ... Japanese workers don't feel a need for unions.....
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
These BAILOUTS must stop. It has become the fashion these days. I know many people on our Motor City who are the greediest batards on the face of the earth and they are not the owners of the car companies but the union members and their leaders.
More, more, more pay less hours, higher wages to make a pathetic product.
More than one company has been forced out of Windsor because of union greed and more will face the same.
Their problem is a greedy snake of a `man` Buzz Hargrove who decides along with the UAW when the iron is hot to strike.
Justify a floor sweeper making $32.00/hr.

Justify an individual who drives bus with no more than a grade eight education and pulls down $80,000yr. It is the owners and buyers being held hostage by these blood-suckers. Their problem. They find a solution.

In and around the Toronto area there are large Honda and Toyota plants and they do not have these problems. Why?

Let the big three die and all those who chose to go on the `screw` the owners and public ride.

scratch

Think of sports celebrity business agents getting the company gold for their clients or movie stars. The CAW was a professional union for people who valued their time and cooperated to ensure the best return on their investment by engaging competent managers, negotiators, diplomats, educators, researchers and organizers. It is known that non union shops lag behind union shops in every aspect overall. None of the corporations operate without binding contracts why should the most important group.
I'v heard lots of storys about the opulent working conditions of union members and their inherant greed. That's class discrimination for you. That floor sweepers deal with grown up seasoned corporate negotiators is his private completely legal business. Is it just good business sence you don't like scratch or upitty janitors?
 

Nuggler

kind and gentle
Feb 27, 2006
11,596
141
63
Backwater, Ontario.
:thumbup:Those days were horrible, my grandfather was treated poorly as a result, and my father.
Companies nowadays who have no unions, usually pay a decent wage, but that is a result
of unions, as they do try to keep pace, within reason, they have to.
If you want to lay the blame on the union for the auto industry having their problems,
you are missing the point.""

Thank you, Taloola. Great post.

Nugg.
 

scratch

Senate Member
May 20, 2008
5,658
22
38
Think of sports celebrity business agents getting the company gold for their clients or movie stars. The CAW was a professional union for people who valued their time and cooperated to ensure the best return on their investment by engaging competent managers, negotiators, diplomats, educators, researchers and organizers. It is known that non union shops lag behind union shops in every aspect overall. None of the corporations operate without binding contracts why should the most important group.
I'v heard lots of storys about the opulent working conditions of union members and their inherant greed. That's class discrimination for you. That floor sweepers deal with grown up seasoned corporate negotiators is his private completely legal business. Is it just good business sence you don't like scratch or upitty janitors?

db,

I cannot agree with you. Unions have outlived their usefulness. After the depression fine but now with foreign car makers and their admirable work ethic, unions are superfluous. I know that you may think that the unions are protection from the greedy capital owners but they are not.
We could go on about this forever, but this I will tell you I ran a retail store in Montreal with 125 employees that detested the union because of the union's greed and their loss when the unions decided to stick it to the company.
That would be the Steinberg Corporation which at one time had more employees that the Quebec gov't. The greed of the unions put some 37,000 people out of work.
Can this be justified? I think not. Yet let me know how you feel about this, Okay.

Sincere Regards,
scratch
 

scratch

Senate Member
May 20, 2008
5,658
22
38
Further to the above, whatever happened to the huge Heinz operation in Leamington.
8 or 9 yrs ago they were running full tilt making every product in Heinz's line, now they are down to producing tomato paste for export to Pennsylvania.
I will give you an example of one of their long time employees. He was my doubles dart partner. He ended up running a hopper(only because he had seniority-dumb concept) @ $42.00/hr and all he had to do was push two different buttons every hour and the rest of the time he practiced his darts on a board that he had set up near his work station.
Please explain to me how this works to anyone's advantage except his own.

scratch
 

GreenFish66

House Member
Apr 16, 2008
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www.myspace.com
Auto Bailout..What's bankruptcy for?

What causes a company go bankrupt?.

Would the other car companies not just buy up the failing car company?
..Perhaps 3 auto companies should merge??..Much like the investment companies and banks!..One aquires the other!!..

I owned a pontiac..It was crap.Put me in the hole trying to fix the useless piece of garbage..Had a chevy was pretty good!!..Ford lasted even longer,,...There seems to be an over supply of poorly made cars and trucks just sittin around right now!!...

Kinda a catch 22...

Build tough cars they last forever,,No one needs a new one..Build a cheap car ..No one wants them,,,!!!.

One company going Bankrupt will cause people to buy more of the other, better, cars!The Bankrupt companies cars will be more affordable..Cheap cars!.. cheap parts!!...


Places like Cuba still have ol' 50's ,60's cars kickin around!!!.


.Other car companies will benefit in a fair competitive market !!..They will aquire the failing car company, its parts, its valuable equipment..(IF it isn't just old junk machinery)!!..This is what happens in a free market,,Some companies fail..While others grow in their place..No??!!..



Who do we bail out next..Why not everyone??.

.For how long???


Some will fail while others grow and merge!!..

What truly is a fair,free market??.Doesn't exsist!!It's a falisy!..Auto companies are on roids!!..Cheatin in the competition..Can't keep up in the race!!..

Why is this??...Do Other car companies have an unfair advantage?.Or just better players??

Why have competition if you openly allow favorites to cheat at the expense of the honest ,hard working competitors?.This sytem has gotta clean up its act!!
There are many questions..We need a the solution from these failing businesses instead of all their problems.>We all got problems!!!..

...These companies will get their bail out..!It has already been decided.!!.Just a precedural game these companies continue to play with their payed off government interests!..So why waste all this time with B.S..trying to fool the people into believing things will be different this time..We will have to wait and see I guess...Take their word for it ,again,,Believe they will truly change this time!!/

All the Big interests will get bail outs and they'll be back to their bad business practises tommorow....Same ol' same ol'..

Someone better have a plan to hold these companies accountable and transparent..So we can say .When it happens again .Told you so..
Then we'll bail them out again next year!!!!....

We need new solutions ..Not the same ol'problems!!..

It is time we find/become the cure,, Instead of continuing to feed a growing ,unwanted Virus!!

All can be solved through
Green/technology

B.Greenfish66.
 

GreenFish66

House Member
Apr 16, 2008
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www.myspace.com

Thanks scratch!..

Auto companies had no good plan the first time they asked for money.Now they're gonna come back with another plan made in haste to get money?...Did they expect to get the money with their 1st plan?,.Maybe they didn't expect so many questions and Media attention??.Well ...Hope their plan B is better made in haste, than plan A ,made through careful planning, turned to waste!!..Makes ya wonder if these leaders have the insight for a good plan at all?

I believe A good plan "B"
should involve..

Green/technology

Shoulda been in plan"A" eh!
 

GreenFish66

House Member
Apr 16, 2008
2,717
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www.myspace.com
It all about Controllin the masses and taking over the world!.What ever gets you there!...HAHAHAHAHAHHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAH!!!..oh sorry ...get carried away sometimes..lol

Yeah... Bail out companies who aren't makin it ...at the expense of those who are !..If you have all the perks ,cheat,Get all the backing and still fail..Maybe it's time to find a new path!!..Get some new guys in there who know how to turn a Fair profit!..Ask the The healthy competiton!

I do believe auto leaders are getting the hint!!..Banks and insurance companies..Not so sure they even know that there are people behind the fudged numbers!

They will ..If they don't clean up their act..!..We do need to try to keep our positioning in the global areana but not at the expense of the hard working honest slavedrones..Give them a break!..It's always the good people who seem to suffer at the hands of the selfish!

I feel this is changing thanks to open honest media and web sites like this!!

Long live the internet and "REAL TIME" media!
 
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