A two-state solution for Canada?
- Thread starter Machjo
- Start date
Neither were mine, mine were having a swell time in Europe in 1776! Probably thought the Yanks were crazy for fighting the world's superpower but other than that were probably enjoying life to its potential.
Fleeing the revolution; I believe, could constitute the founding cultural myth of Southern Ontario but otherwise it does not hold ground for anywhere else in Canada, most Canadians then were living in Europe or their provinces were not admitted into Confederation until a century later.
The Irish have the oppression of the British, the Australians have their convicts, the Kiwi have well uhh not so sure, and us Western Canadians can envoke images of the NWMP (North West Mounted Police until renamed RCMP), Lumberjacks and Cowboys (and farmers)!
At least it can give us something we can laugh about, us from the west coast can refer ourselves to mountainmen and those on the Prairies as unsophisicated grain farmers
There's no laughing; however, about losing a war or a civil war (as per Ontario's case).
's-lone There's no reason for it to be chaotic and hateful. We are civilized people.' I would like to be able to believe this, but from what I've read and heard in the past from Quebecois. I am doubtful. ( and maybe even from some of the 'rest of Canada'.)
It is,
I don't remember the last time there was a separatist terrorist cell being arrested in Western Canada. We are often too busy paying for the equalization payments so Quebecers can build bombs to target Anglophones in Montreal!
Quebec is still dealing with the immense humiliation which followed the Battle of the Plains of Abraham, which saw Quebec annexed to Canada. The British wanted to assimilate the French but unfortunately; while the Americans had no problem doing so (see New Orleans), but failed in Canada and today we are left with the burden of having to deal with an occupied people who resent us and will probably want revenge to some degree.
*edit
To follow up:
We are not talking about Lithuania, Latvia or Estonia, or Uzbekistan (comparable to our Nunavut in terms of importance), and Belarussia and Ukraine never counted (see Kievan Rus; brothers do not fight civil wars over secession and cultural conflict. Much like we would never fight the British or Australians!)
but rather a province in Canada which has a quarter of our GDP and compromises a significant portion of our armed forces and doesn't have any commonly shared founding myth. In fact, their history consists of fighting us and being annexed by us, doesn't sound like a working relationship!
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I would be more concerned about Canada's soveriegnty than Quebec's.
Right now from the things I have been reading , this soveriegnty movement is just a smoke screen for bleeding money from the Government. The federalist are also involved ....
What I don't understand is the Seperatist keep saying that there would be more money left if it didn't go to Ottawa...... Why are the federalist not correcting that statement? Take a poll , and most Quebecers believe there is more money going to Ottawa than is returned.
To the original question .....Quebec right now has all it needs...If the politicians didn't have anything to continually demand then they would be stuck running the finaces of this province responsably........which they can't , no matter who is in power .
Right now from the things I have been reading , this soveriegnty movement is just a smoke screen for bleeding money from the Government. The federalist are also involved ....
What I don't understand is the Seperatist keep saying that there would be more money left if it didn't go to Ottawa...... Why are the federalist not correcting that statement? Take a poll , and most Quebecers believe there is more money going to Ottawa than is returned.
To the original question .....Quebec right now has all it needs...If the politicians didn't have anything to continually demand then they would be stuck running the finaces of this province responsably........which they can't , no matter who is in power .
I agree if you dont want to be in Canada, take a plane out of the country and **** off. The situation the quebecious have in our country is already good.
You people who advocate seperation of our provinces from the country are something else. Oh yea you can seperate and we can share a common citizenship so i can work in quebec when you guys seperate. I CAN ALREADY WORK IN QUEBEC RIGHT NOW AND SOMEONE FROM QUEBEC CAN WORK IN ONTARIO. Why the **** would i go to quebec after they seperate.
To be honest i suppourt a one world government
Here is a website to book yourself a one way ticket if you feel that Canada isnt for you.
http://www.onetravel.com/travel/one..._Way_Flights&gclid=CLqd-bjy3KYCFY64KgodSB5e1Q
You people who advocate seperation of our provinces from the country are something else. Oh yea you can seperate and we can share a common citizenship so i can work in quebec when you guys seperate. I CAN ALREADY WORK IN QUEBEC RIGHT NOW AND SOMEONE FROM QUEBEC CAN WORK IN ONTARIO. Why the **** would i go to quebec after they seperate.
To be honest i suppourt a one world government
Here is a website to book yourself a one way ticket if you feel that Canada isnt for you.
http://www.onetravel.com/travel/one..._Way_Flights&gclid=CLqd-bjy3KYCFY64KgodSB5e1Q
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Living with mommy will always be more confortable and that's called dependence.
I agree that too many separatists are putting their heads in the sand, thinking Quebec's problems would suddenly disappear if we had our country. But here's the thing, nationalists dream about independence, not dependence. So the argument that there will be less money left just doesn't work that much. It's just an argument used by federalists who want to stay in Canada no matter what. Not very convincing from an indépendantiste point of view.
How about a one way ticket to the library? You can use it to check out words like democracy and confederation.
I just wonder, if the voting Québécois realises that when separating they have to take their share of the national debt with them???
Does that particular ethnic group realize anything? (At the risk of being politically incorrect)
I think it's pretty obvious that yes we would take our share of the national debt.
And a whole lot less territory than is now Quebec.
Everybody thinks this stuff is easy, straightforward.....
If Canada is divisible, so is Quebec, starting with (but not limited to) the district called Ungava......which was NOT part of Quebec until 1912. It is largely native in population, and it is doubtful it would want to go.
Things are getting complicated, eh?
And here's a prediction for you.....any attempt at unilateral independence for Quebec (as planned by that moron Parizeau had he won the referendum) will lead to civil war.
It is the elephant in the room no one wants to discuss.
I know that it's obvious to an enlightened individual such as yourself, but I remember at the last referundum, it was never mentioned by the politicos pushing it.....
If you go back through my post history, you'll quickly see that I fully acknowledge this problem. In fact, I consider this issue to be THE biggest problem with separatism. The national debt thing is a no brainer. But territorial issues... now that's complicated!
I've already made myself clear as to what I think of the original OP and quebecois separatists. Have I not used enough expletives in my naration?
Quebec population 7,948,208
Canadian national debt...Canada's National Debt Clock : The Canadian Taxpayers Federation
Canadian national debt...Canada's National Debt Clock : The Canadian Taxpayers Federation
On the territorial thing, the Feds don't really have a voice here, they've given it away to First Nations. There are agreements in place between Quebec & the Cree re Ungava natural resource development (La Grande/Eastmain) & compensation has been given. The real question is what do the Inuit want from Quebec to play ball.
Just a correction here. I've lived in both Quebec (and not just Montreal, but deep inside central Quebec) and English Canada, and can testify that the majority (even if only a small majority) of Quebecers are simply not functional in English, while in Montreal and Ottawa, I've met plenty of native English-speakers who were quite functiona in French). While what you say may be true for the most part, you're way oversimplifying things here. Looking at it that way, English-Canada could certainly benefit from Quebec know-how especially in promoting English-Canadian products into the international French-language market, just as Quebec could benefit from English-Canadian know-how. Not to mention that both Quebec and Ontario especially have many industries that could benefit one another. There's no point hurting ourselves just 'to teach them a lesson'.
The two-state solution proposed in the OP however would likely put an end to the equalization payments on the one hand, but also allow Quebec to bild closer ties with the Francophonie for instance without being held back from English Canada on the other. It would also allow English Canada to build closer ties with the Commonwealth for instance, and again likely put an end to equalization payments, any collaboration btween English-Canada and Quebec having to be mutually beneficial to both.
but it doesn't work that way.
you don't get to separate but then have all this free help and rules and amendments.
if you separate, you separate completely.. there's no partial or separation with clauses.