A guide for guidance: how to choose your doctrine

talloola

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 14, 2006
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Me either. For some reason or other, he seems to prefer to repel people from Islam, not attract people to it.

Anyway, I "know" there are no gods in the same way I "know" there are no tooth faeries, Santa Clauses, and rabbits that lay Easter eggs.

That's right, all of the above were invented by 'man' for
the human to enjoy himself and feel good, just like god,
a crutch and a security blanket to make one feel good.
 

eanassir

Time Out
Jul 26, 2007
3,099
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That is why the disbelievers among the Children of Israel were cursed by the tongue of David and Jesus son of Mary, according to their disobedience and transgression; as follows:

((Cursed were the unbelievers of the Children of Israel by the tongue of David, and Jesus, Mary’s son; that was because they rebelled and used to transgress [on the prophets of God.] ))

The above between brackets is the explanation of the aya 5:78
لُعِنَ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُواْ مِن بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ عَلَى لِسَانِ دَاوُودَ وَعِيسَى ابْنِ مَرْيَمَ ذَلِكَ بِمَا عَصَوا وَّكَانُواْ يَعْتَدُونَ
 

talloola

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 14, 2006
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There is no such thing as a curse, unless one is gullible,
easily intimidated and ignorant, then they themselves can
talk themselves into believing they have such a thing put
onto them, when in reality there is no such thing, it is
no different than some circus act trying to trick you.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
44,850
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Nakusp, BC
That's right. You have to believe that you are cursed in order for it to mean anything. That is how voodoo works, and it happens when a doctor tells you you only have a certain amount of time to live. Many people who do not have to die, do so because a doctor gives them a death sentence. They die because they don't try to do anything to get better. Religion relies on that gullibility to scare their adherents into obeying the "word".
 

AnnaG

Hall of Fame Member
Jul 5, 2009
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That is why the disbelievers among the Children of Israel were cursed by the tongue of David and Jesus son of Mary, according to their disobedience and transgression; as follows:

((Cursed were the unbelievers of the Children of Israel by the tongue of David, and Jesus, Mary’s son; that was because they rebelled and used to transgress [on the prophets of God.] ))

The above between brackets is the explanation of the aya 5:78
لُعِنَ الَّذِينَ كَفَرُواْ مِن بَنِي إِسْرَائِيلَ عَلَى لِسَانِ دَاوُودَ وَعِيسَى ابْنِ مَرْيَمَ ذَلِكَ بِمَا عَصَوا وَّكَانُواْ يَعْتَدُونَ
Curses are superstitious nonsense. Blessings are, too, for that matter. Might as well make voodoo, at least it's more entertaining.
 

AnnaG

Hall of Fame Member
Jul 5, 2009
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That's right. You have to believe that you are cursed in order for it to mean anything. That is how voodoo works, and it happens when a doctor tells you you only have a certain amount of time to live. Many people who do not have to die, do so because a doctor gives them a death sentence. They die because they don't try to do anything to get better. Religion relies on that gullibility to scare their adherents into obeying the "word".
Beat me to it. But you are right.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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There is no such thing as a curse, unless one is gullible,
easily intimidated and ignorant, then they themselves can
talk themselves into believing they have such a thing put
onto them, when in reality there is no such thing, it is
no different than some circus act trying to trick you.

I think you are 99% correct BUT there are exceptions to every rule. Years ago in Ireland a man was hanged for a crime he alleges he was not guilty of and as he walked up to gallows he said that grass would not grow on his grave and lo and behold it never did. I don't know if that's a curse or not but it's not a normal phenominum.
 

AnnaG

Hall of Fame Member
Jul 5, 2009
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I think you are 99% correct BUT there are exceptions to every rule. Years ago in Ireland a man was hanged for a crime he alleges he was not guilty of and as he walked up to gallows he said that grass would not grow on his grave and lo and behold it never did. I don't know if that's a curse or not but it's not a normal phenominum.
Sounds like an Irish wives' tale to me. We all know how unsuperstitious the Irish are, right? lmao Ireland's loaded with leprachauns, ghosts, banshees, goblins, etc.

Anyway, if it isn't a wives' tale, a little diesel fuel does wonders for the greenery.
 

countryboy

Traditionally Progressive
Nov 30, 2009
3,686
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BC
I think you are 99% correct BUT there are exceptions to every rule. Years ago in Ireland a man was hanged for a crime he alleges he was not guilty of and as he walked up to gallows he said that grass would not grow on his grave and lo and behold it never did. I don't know if that's a curse or not but it's not a normal phenominum.

Yeah, but did they send out a scientific team to show why the grass didn't grow? I'm sure they would have been able to disprove any notion of curses, etc. with tons of facts and data. I'm sure they could have proven that the lack of grass was a perfectly normal occurence, and likely caused by a lack of nutrients in the soil, a localized temperature inversion, or some other explainable (in their terms) thing. :-|

Actually, any of those mysterious happenings (and there have been many alleged ones) are dismissed as being bullsh!t by those who have their minds made up in advance about such things. I think there is a tendency for some educated folks to cling to, and defend their definition of reality as it was taught to them in the hallowed halls of higher learning.

Of course, I'm not looking for a fight here - just making an observation that perhaps we don't know everything there is to know about everything. Some follow their faith, some follow their textbooks, and some just have an open mind. Ain't life interesting?
 

SirJosephPorter

Time Out
Nov 7, 2008
11,956
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Yeah, but did they send out a scientific team to show why the grass didn't grow? I'm sure they would have been able to disprove any notion of curses, etc. with tons of facts and data. I'm sure they could have proven that the lack of grass was a perfectly normal occurence, and likely caused by a lack of nutrients in the soil, a localized temperature inversion, or some other explainable (in their terms) thing. :-|

Actually, any of those mysterious happenings (and there have been many alleged ones) are dismissed as being bullsh!t by those who have their minds made up in advance about such things. I think there is a tendency for some educated folks to cling to, and defend their definition of reality as it was taught to them in the hallowed halls of higher learning.

Quite right, countryboy, it will be dismissed as nonsense by science. No doubt scientists could have gone to the place, analyzed the soil and come up with an explanation as to why grass didn’t grow there. But why should they bother? Much easier to dismiss it as an anecdote and therefore, unreliable.

Science above all relies on reproducibility of results. If somebody says, utter such and such a curse in such and such manner, under such and such conditions, and you make the soil infertile, nothing will grow there. Then scientists will look at it seriously. Then anybody can perform the experiment and determine the validity of it.

But a claim like this, that somebody uttered a curse and as a result grass doesn’t grow at some place, means nothing, science will ignore it and rightly so.
 

countryboy

Traditionally Progressive
Nov 30, 2009
3,686
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Quite right, countryboy, it will be dismissed as nonsense by science. No doubt scientists could have gone to the place, analyzed the soil and come up with an explanation as to why grass didn’t grow there. But why should they bother? Much easier to dismiss it as an anecdote and therefore, unreliable.

Science above all relies on reproducibility of results. If somebody says, utter such and such a curse in such and such manner, under such and such conditions, and you make the soil infertile, nothing will grow there. Then scientists will look at it seriously. Then anybody can perform the experiment and determine the validity of it.

But a claim like this, that somebody uttered a curse and as a result grass doesn’t grow at some place, means nothing, science will ignore it and rightly so.

But that's not to say that all "scientists" agree on everything all the time, is it? I recall a few disagreements among scientists on "mysterious" things and what they're all about. Just asking...
 

SirJosephPorter

Time Out
Nov 7, 2008
11,956
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Ontario
But that's not to say that all "scientists" agree on everything all the time, is it? I recall a few disagreements among scientists on "mysterious" things and what they're all about. Just asking...

Scientists rarely agree on anything, countryboy. Whenever any scientist puts forth a hypothesis, it is savagely attacked, to find the flaws in it, to see if it can withstand intense scrutiny. When experimental evidence is found strongly supporting the hypothesis, it then is promoted to being a theory. As more and more evidence is found in its support, it gains more and more adherents. Even then skeptics always remain.

Thus, there are scientists (admittedly a small minority) who do not agree with the Big Bang Theory, they think it is false. There are scientists (even a smaller minority) who think that the Theory of Relativity is wrong.

It is all part of the healthy debate that continuously goes on in science. Science is not a monolith, there are always differing viewpoints in science. That is what facilitates the advancement of science.

However, no scientist will give any credence to anything supernatural or paranormal.
 

AnnaG

Hall of Fame Member
Jul 5, 2009
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And awaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay goes another topic.

Anyway, I think it's kind of funny that people can go through life sticking to superstition as a guide.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Vernon, B.C.
Yeah, but did they send out a scientific team to show why the grass didn't grow? I'm sure they would have been able to disprove any notion of curses, etc. with tons of facts and data. I'm sure they could have proven that the lack of grass was a perfectly normal occurence, and likely caused by a lack of nutrients in the soil, a localized temperature inversion, or some other explainable (in their terms) thing. :-|

Actually, any of those mysterious happenings (and there have been many alleged ones) are dismissed as being bullsh!t by those who have their minds made up in advance about such things. I think there is a tendency for some educated folks to cling to, and defend their definition of reality as it was taught to them in the hallowed halls of higher learning.

Of course, I'm not looking for a fight here - just making an observation that perhaps we don't know everything there is to know about everything. Some follow their faith, some follow their textbooks, and some just have an open mind. Ain't life interesting?


Absolutely - who would have thunk 200 years ago that you could flick switch and a dark room would light up instantly. We've probably only penetrated about 1% of what there is to know. It's a good think too or some peoples heads would explode and you'd be picking up fragments for 1/2 a mile.
 

talloola

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 14, 2006
19,576
113
63
Vancouver Island
Quite right, countryboy, it will be dismissed as nonsense by science. No doubt scientists could have gone to the place, analyzed the soil and come up with an explanation as to why grass didn’t grow there. But why should they bother? Much easier to dismiss it as an anecdote and therefore, unreliable.

Science above all relies on reproducibility of results. If somebody says, utter such and such a curse in such and such manner, under such and such conditions, and you make the soil infertile, nothing will grow there. Then scientists will look at it seriously. Then anybody can perform the experiment and determine the validity of it.

But a claim like this, that somebody uttered a curse and as a result grass doesn’t grow at some place, means nothing, science will ignore it and rightly so.

wrong post
 

talloola

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 14, 2006
19,576
113
63
Vancouver Island
Absolutely - who would have thunk 200 years ago that you could flick switch and a dark room would light up instantly. We've probably only penetrated about 1% of what there is to know. It's a good think too or some peoples heads would explode and you'd be picking up fragments for 1/2 a mile.

you guys are actually saying that there is a possibility
that the grass didn't grow because of 'what' he said?
amazing. I can't even begin to put any kind of question
mark on that comment 'the man' made, then when the grass
didn't grow, think that perhaps it 'is' because of his
statement.
He probably paid someone to spray the area before they
filled it in, so that no grass would grow for some time.

Anyway it would be boring if we all thought the same.

lol
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
31,759
11,530
113
Regina, Saskatchewan
Scientists rarely agree on anything, countryboy. Whenever any scientist puts forth a hypothesis, it is savagely attacked, to find the flaws in it, to see if it can withstand intense scrutiny. When experimental evidence is found strongly supporting the hypothesis, it then is promoted to being a theory. As more and more evidence is found in its support, it gains more and more adherents. Even then skeptics always remain.

Thus, there are scientists (admittedly a small minority) who do not agree with the Big Bang Theory, they think it is false. There are scientists (even a smaller minority) who think that the Theory of Relativity is wrong.

It is all part of the healthy debate that continuously goes on in science. Science is not a monolith, there are always differing viewpoints in science. That is what facilitates the advancement of science.

However, no scientist will give any credence to anything supernatural or paranormal.


Can you tie this into the Thread itself, the opening post and the
direction that eanassir pointed the Thread with his opening post?

I'm assuming this was the direction you where going and just haven't
gotten there yet.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
you guys are actually saying that there is a possibility
that the grass didn't grow because of 'what' he said?
amazing. I can't even begin to put any kind of question
mark on that comment 'the man' made, then when the grass
didn't grow, think that perhaps it 'is' because of his
statement.
He probably paid someone to spray the area before they
filled it in, so that no grass would grow for some time.

Anyway it would be boring if we all thought the same.

lol

The thing is we just don't know, when strange things happen that people just don't understand, the easiest route is denial. If 200 years ago someone had said we're going to fly like the birds, he have landed in the loony bin. Stuff happens that we just don't understand.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
Can you tie this into the Thread itself, the opening post and the
direction that eanassir pointed the Thread with his opening post?

I'm assuming this was the direction you where going and just haven't
gotten there yet.

Hey Ron - some people are more interested in arguing than in going in any particular direction...............................:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: