1170 Inmates freed from Kandahar Prison

[L Gilbert]

I'll echo Mikey here.
I'll also add that although there may be a few Afghans who detest interference in "normal" Afghan affairs, there are an awful lot of stories I have seen and heard where kids are happ to be able to learn in schools instead of slaving for tyrants, women are also happy to be be able to learn, they are happy to be able to get some sun instead of being shrouded in layers of clothing (see Mr. Google about Vitamin D deficiency. It is a miserable state), and some are immensely impressed at the generosity of other people of the world.
Although I think that Canada should get its priorities straight and take care of business at home before beetling about the rest of the planet being Dudley Doright, I think an awful lot of good has come from Canada being in Afghanistan.

 

[talloola]

If I may answer? We don't have a spine as the poodle we have become!!!

delete

 

[talloola]

If I may answer? We don't have a spine as the poodle we have become!!!

I have rephrased my original answer, check it out.

 

[earth_as_one]

Related and back on track:

The Taliban prison attack probably caused coalition forces to pull back to Kandahar city which the Taliban probably used to capture eight villages on the outlying districts near Kandahar.

Taliban seize Afghan villages

Taliban fighters have taken control of eight villages in Arghandab district in Afghanistan, and have said they plan to march towards Kandahar city.

About 500 fighters are said to be involved in the ongoing Taliban offensive, which got under way on Monday, Al Jazeera has learnt.

Arghandab district lies 30km north of Kandahar city...

...The violence came after Hamid Karzai, the Afghan president, sparked a major row with neighbouring Pakistan by threatening to launch attacks on fighters allegedly hiding in Pakistani territory.

The unrest follows the escape of more than 1,000 Taliban and other prisoners in a suicide attack on the main jail in the southern city of Kandahar on Friday night, which also left many prison guards dead...

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/0AB43678-9AF6-40F1-A279-2FB612E28518.htm

I'd say the fight is on...

 

[Stretch]

[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]Report: U.S. Gave Green Light For Taliban Prison Attack [/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]'Reports out of the Middle East indicate that U.S. forces gave the green light for the Taliban to attack a government prison in Kandahar this past Friday and stood idly by while Taliban fighters violently freed more than 1000 inmates. [/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]"Experts in regional affairs believe that Taliban militants attacked the Kandahar prison with the green light from US forces," reports Press TV. "They say it is questionable - how could the militants dare attack the prison with US-led troops stationed just northeast of the jail?" [/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]"The sources also noted that although clashes between Afghan security forces and the militants lasted for several hours, US-led troops did not intervene."'[/FONT]
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2008/061608_green_light.htm​

 

[annabattler]

Let's see....the Taliban were good guys when they sided with the Americans to oust the Russians from Afghanistan. Then,the Taliban exerted some power of their own(using weapons supplied by the Americans) and decided they would be the ruling force in Afghanistan.
Along comes Osama Bin Laden and 9/11..and the world search is on for Bin Laden...and Afghanistan is targetted as having been one of his hiding/training places.Some American trrops are deployed to Afghanistan for the "hunt",but many more are needed for the invasion of Iraq.
NATO gets involved. Canada will not commit to the invasion of Iraq...instead.as a sop to the Americans,accedes to NATO's request for troops for Afghanistan.
War is not a game of checkers,with acknowledged rules of engagement.
I think we're in over our heads.Our Canadian troops may be well trained, and well-intentioned....but our mentality is miles apart from the Taliban mentality.
The porous borders of Afghanistan will never allow for this push for an Afghani demoscracy.There are too many other powers at play behind the scenes,and far too much history there for us to ever understand,or defeat the "designated" enemy.

 

[jimmoyer]

Withdrawing from conflict assumes you can.

Sure, we can leave.

But as a failed state festers and becomes safe haven to an unchallenged and unthreatened base camp (the meaning of al qaeda) the conflict does not remain "over there".

The definition of success is not resolution.

The definition of success is to stay in the conflict here.

The definition of success is continuing to fight another point of view.

This isn't like Vietnam or Algeria where you can leave and the war is over.

 

[Colpy]

Withdrawing from conflict assumes you can.

Sure, we can leave.

But as a failed state festers and becomes safe haven to an unchallenged and unthreatened base camp (the meaning of al qaeda) the conflict does not remain "over there".

The definition of success is not resolution.

The definition of success is to stay in the conflict here.

The definition of success is continuing to fight another point of view.

This isn't like Vietnam or Algeria where you can leave and the war is over.

Exactly. Exactly.

Thank you.

Improving the lot of the Afghan people and creating a free democratic state in Afghanistan is a wonderful secondary goal.

But to achieve either would be close to miraculous.

It should be kept in mind they are secondary goals.

The primary goal is to deny the enemy territory for training camps, and political protection and support for the planning and execution of attacks on the west......including Canada.

 

[jimmoyer]

Thanks Colpy !!

I might add another point, of vaguer philosophical repercussions and dangers of even greater importance.

This conflict is absolutely necessary.

Both sides (our side and theirs) think they know the truth. By battling each other we will push our point of view into each other's faces. We will be forced to confront who we are.

They look at Allah and pray and want sharia. They look at our decadent consumerist ways.
Let us find out who we are in this war.

We will both find out our own evils.

May this humble both sides.

For practical considerations, my earlier post supercedes this messianic one.

 

[darkbeaver]

Tick tick tick tick the clock is running out for the failed empire. The bankers don't care about schools or fat happy children. It is characterized as a battle of ideologys and it is but not religious, that's sop for the simpleminded. Scocialism or death make your choice the world is weary of capitalism and war its main bizz. The present war in Afghanistan was planned bankrolled and launched by the coalition, lock stock and barrel.

 

[jimmoyer]

Oh Darkbeaver who rules the night...

LOL !!!

You don't think war is part of the socialist cause ?
War is not the exclusive franchise of capitalism.
War has been utilized by every manner of belief and philosophy.

 

[Stretch]

"It is the Oil, Stupid!"

by Joseph Clifford
​

The Russians got into their Vietnam right after we got out of ours? Isn't that strange?

We supported Bin Laden and the Taliban for years, and viewed them as freedom fighters against the Russians? Isn't that strange?

As late as 1998 the US was paying the salary of every single Taliban official in Afghanistan? Isn't that strange?

There is more oil and gas in the Caspian Sea area than in Saudi Arabia, but you need a pipeline through Afghanistan to get the oil out. Isn't that strange?

UNOCAL, a giant American Oil conglomerate, wanted to build a 1000 mile long pipeline from the Caspian Sea through Afghanistan to the Arabian Sea. Isn't that strange?

UNOCAL spent $10,000,000,000 on geological surveys for pipeline construction, and very nicely courted the Taliban for their support in allowing the construction to begin. Isn't that strange?

All of the leading Taliban officials were in Texas negotiating with UNOCAL in 1998. Isn't that strange?

1998-1999 the Taliban changed its mind and threw UNOCAL out of the country and awarded the pipeline project to a company from Argentina. Isn't that strange?

John Maresca VP of UNOCAL testified before Congress and said no pipeline until the Taliban was gone and a more friendly government was established. Isn't that strange?

1999-2000 The Taliban became the most evil people in the world. Isn't that strange?

Niaz Naik, a former Pakistani Foreign Secretary, was told by senior American officials in mid-July that military action against Afghanistan would go ahead by the middle of October. Isn't that strange?

9/11 WTC disaster.
Bush goes to war against Afghanistan even though none of the hijackers came from Afghanistan. Isn't that strange?

Bush blamed Bin Laden but has never offered any proof saying it’s a "secret". Isn't that strange?

Taliban offered to negotiate to turn over Bin Laden if we showed them some proof. We refused; we bombed. Isn't that strange?

Bush said: "This is not about nation building. It's about getting the terrorists." Isn't that strange?

We have a new government in Afghanistan. Isn't that strange?

The leader of that government formerly worked for UNOCAL. Isn't that strange?

Bush appoints a special envoy to represent the US to deal with that new government, who formerly was the "chief consultant to UNOCAL". Isn't that strange?

The Bush family acquired their wealth through oil? Isn't that strange?

Bush's Secretary of Interior was the President of an oil company before going to Washington. Isn't that strange?

George Bush Sr. now works with the "Carlysle Group" specializing in huge oil investments around the world. Isn't that strange?

Condoleezza Rice worked for Chevron before gong to Washington. Isn't that strange?

Chevron named one of its newest "supertankers" after Condoleezza. Isn't that strange?

Dick Cheney worked for the giant oil conglomerate Haliburton before becoming VP. Isn't that strange?

Haliburton gave Cheney $34 Million dollars as a farewell gift when he left Haliburton. Isn't that strange?

Haliburton is in the pipeline construction business. Isn't that strange?

There is $6 Trillion dollars worth of oil in the Caspian Sea area. Isn't that strange?

The US government quietly announces Jan 31, 2002 we will support the construction of the Trans-Afghanistan pipeline. Isn't that strange?

President Musharref (Pakistan), and Karrzai, (Afghanistan -Unocal) announce agreement to build proposed gas pipeline from Central Asia to Pakistan via Afghanistan. (Irish Times 02/10/02) Isn't that strange?

"It’s the Oil, Stupid!"
http://www.mediamonitors.net/josephclifford2.html​

 

[dancing-loon]

No, Stretch, ... it's the Crude, Dude!!;-);-)

Linda McQuaig is a leading Canadian journalist who connects the dots in It's the Crude, Dude: Greed, Gas, War and the American Way.

She points out that for decades Washington has been intensely focused on gaining control of the oil reserves of the Middle East. That focus took on new urgency under the Bush administration, with its close ties to Big Oil, including a vice-president who's gotten rich going back and forth between Big Oil and the top echelons of the U.S. government. The urgency was driven by the fact that the vast oil reserves of Iraq – the last unharvested oil bonanza left on earth – were in the process of being parceled off to foreign competitors.

Iraq represented the alluring prospect of future energy security for the United States, even as America's own oil reserves were dwindling. And, with potential profits in the range of $100 billion a year, Iraq also represented the future of the oil industry. In the words of Wall Street oil analyst Fadel Gheit, Iraq "is the big dance. Everyone wants to be there."
But the U.S. oil giants hadn't been invited to the big dance. Instead, Saddam Hussein had been busy making deals with oil companies from other nations, including America's arch-rivals: China, Russia and France.

http://www.lindamcquaig.com/ItsTheCrudeDude/index.cfm

 

[Colpy]

So, where is this pipeline through Afghanistan?

The USA, since they conquered the nation and destroyed the terrorist's bases of operation, have practically ignored the place, relatively speaking.............which simply puts the lie to the entire fabrication that this whole 9-11 thing was to get a pipeline through Afghanistan.

Simply ridiculous.

It's been 7 years, guys.

Where is it?

 

[dancing-loon]

Bush Will Seek to Drop a Drilling Ban

Published: June 18, 2008
WASHINGTON — President Bush, reversing a longstanding position, will call on Congress on Wednesday to end a federal ban on offshore oil drilling, according to White House officials who say Mr. Bush now wants to work with states to determine where drilling should occur.
The move underscores how $4-a-gallon gas has become a major issue in the 2008 presidential campaign, and it comes as a growing number of Republicans are lining up in opposition to the federal ban.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/washington/18drill.html?hp
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I don't understand this! Just now I read there is plenty of oil in Iraq on which they surely have first dips! Why must they now start drilling in environmentally sensitive areas?
Well, he is still thinking for the moment about it. His father actually put that ban in place years ago.

 

[dancing-loon]

So, where is this pipeline through Afghanistan?

The USA, since they conquered the nation and destroyed the terrorist's bases of operation, have practically ignored the place, relatively speaking.............which simply puts the lie to the entire fabrication that this whole 9-11 thing was to get a pipeline through Afghanistan.

Simply ridiculous.

It's been 7 years, guys.

Where is it?

Have patience, my Dear! First Afghanistan has to be conquered and secured. The Taliban would otherwise wreck it right away.

Ten years ago Mr. John Maresca, who was/is the Vice President of International Relations at UNOCAL Corporation talked to the US Congress on Feb. 12th, 1998. Here is a short passage from his speech:

The second option is to build a pipeline south from Central Asia to the Indian Ocean. One obvious route south would cross Iran, but this is foreclosed for American companies because of U.S. sanctions legislation. The only other possible route is across Afghanistan, which has of course its own unique challenges. The country has been involved in bitter warfare for almost two decades, and is still divided by civil war. From the outset, we have made it clear that construction of the pipeline we have proposed across Afghanistan could not begin until a recognized government is in place that has the confidence of governments, lenders, and our company.

He further explains...

Last October, the Central Asia Gas Pipeline Consortium, called CentGas, in which Unocal holds an interest, was formed to develop a gas pipeline which will link Turkmenistan's vast Dauletabad gas field with markets in Pakistan and possibly India. The proposed 790-mile pipeline will open up new markets for this gas, traveling from Turkmenistan through Afghanistan to Multan in Pakistan. The proposed extension would move gas on to New Delhi, where it would connect with an existing pipeline. As with the proposed Central Asia oil pipeline, CentGas can not begin construction until an internationally recognized Afghanistan Government is in place.

In the meantime ten years have passed. The Taliban, who were paid millions already, had provided some stability to Afghanistan, but then changed their minds and rejected the proposal offered by Exxon.
There is lots more to read, I only picked out the sections pertaining to the pipeline via Afghanistan.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/oil.html
--------------------------------------------------------------
It is pretty clear that the American Government listened to the oil executives, since many of them are sitting directly at the highest level of the government, and they simply resorted to solving the problem by going to war against the Taliban regime. They established a western-style government in Afghanistan with an executive from Unocal as President... Mr. Hamid Karzai!! BUT... after seven years of fighting, even getting NATO involved, the Taliban are still not defeated!!! That is ridiculous, Colpy!

 

[Colpy]

I am sorry, DL, I just don't believe the USA first killed 2600 of its own people on 9-11, smashed its own military HQ, doing hundreds of millions, if not billions of dollars worth of property damage, doing extensive damage to its own economic system, then spent billions of dollars and many of it's soldiers' lives invading Afghanistan, so that an oil company could builda pipeline to provide NG to India......which still hasn't been started seven years later.....

For 1% of the money already spent, they could stand soldiers shoulder to shoulder along the entire route of the pipeline to protect it.

They could certainly have done extensive construction in the north, which is basically secured.....

It simply doesn't wash.

In fact, the entire idea is just silly.

Think about this..........

 

[dancing-loon]

I am sorry, DL, I just don't believe the USA first killed 2600 of its own people on 9-11, smashed its own military HQ,

I, too, think that is crazy! But so many plausible reports are out there, one cannot help, but believe it.

doing hundreds of millions, if not billions of dollars worth of property damage,

That is all paid by the insurance companies!

doing extensive damage to its own economic system,

No problem! It was actually good for the economy!

then spent billions of dollars and many of it's soldiers' lives invading Afghanistan,

The leaders don't think and operate that way. They have the tax payers and the bankers to finance their fancies, and the young civilans to gladly do the job!

so that an oil company could build a pipeline to provide NG to India

Business is business, no matter where or what, even prostitution is a business!!!

.....which still hasn't been started seven years later.....

The war is still raging in Afghanistan!!!

For 1% of the money already spent, they could stand soldiers shoulder to shoulder along the entire route of the pipeline to protect it.

:lol: They could do a number of things that would benefit the world instead of destroying it!!!Their thinking is only for themselves!

They could certainly have done extensive construction in the north, which is basically secured.....

Look it up... they already did.

It simply doesn't wash. In fact, the entire idea is just silly.

Maybe it is... who can say for sure? But since they are known liars, one has to be skeptical!

Think about this..........

I did!;-);-)

 

[Colpy]

Well, DL, it seems I owe you a bit of an apology.....the pipeline is on. The allies have just agreed on a route through Afghanistan...........the route backed by the USA.

Construction to begin in 2010. That is nine years after the invasion.

In my own defense I have to point out that Taliban activity is NOT affecting the plans for construction , as the line will be built straight through territory now awash in Taliban activity, i.e. Khandahar Province.

I am far, far from convinced this war was fought for this pipeline.......
In fact, I'm on the other side of the planet from convinced......

BTW, construction will do wonders for the Afghan economy, it will be very good for the Afghan people......

 

[MikeyDB]

Colpy

You once suggested that I and several other people here at CC are naive when it comes to how the world works.... and in particualar the United States of Unlimited Greed.....

You're a nice fellow I'm willing to bet, but you're backing the wrong horse and have backed the wrong horse for years. These people lie to you and everyone else. Always have and always will.