NATO aghast at U.S. criticism of Afghan allies
- Thread starter #juan
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Exactly. They LOVE to hear critisism about the US. Thrive on it. Roll in it.
But can they take it when they are critisized... well see above posts!
One thing I can assure of as a past Commissioned Officer in the US military service. The US is never a Team Player period. If it isn't the US way then it is the highway. Arrogance is customary too. In my opinion the Australian, British and Canadian forces attitudes are far superior and easy to work with. I call it the ABC story of repeated successes. The US has no history in that field (nor do they care) at all. If you want to witness effective Team Work just look at the British Commonwealth militray groups.
Yeah now. Perhaps he should have choosen his words a little more carefully. Then again, Someone else we know seems like he enjoys shooting his mouth off about "World War Three" and "Holy Crusades"
It doesn't honestly suprise me something like the above came from the US. I think they need to work on their forign relations skills a bit more next time before they run their mouths.
When I'm responsible for representing my country and I'm paid to do so, I'll watch what I say. Until then, I'll remain spouting off loads of BS mixed with some truths to mess with people's heads.
Does Mr Gates recall some little guys called "Viet Cong"? Fighting shadows and ghosts hasn't got any easier.
Woof!
I'll take this one:
When I was growing up back in the 80's, I hated the US because of their "We so Great" attitude. But... I wasn't overly bothered by it, because you guys ligitamatly had reason to be proud of yourselves.
But now you're country is a joke, a sham, and since you know who got into power, the entire country has crumbled into a shell of your former self, all the while you guys continue to spout "We so Great" when clearly you guys are not.
Your country used to be great.... it's not anymore. Look in the mirror for once.
Now as it goes towards critisism of Canada and our troops? I can take plenty.... when it's actually true.
Tell me something?
You guys invaded Afghanistan a while back, and then invaded Iraq.... neither are resolved, NATO had to come through and clean up your guys' damn mess.... YET AGAIN.
And the fact that you guys didn't finish the job that you started to begin with, and for you guys to turn around and bad mouth your allies for actually helping you in your stupid unjust invasions of sovrign countries not related to 9/11.... you guys sure have a lot of friggin ignorant nerve. Seems a bit hypocritical to point the fingers at your allies for not getting the job done, when you guys never got it done either.... besides the fact your country never bothered to plan a method of pull out of either war. Bravo..... bow to the experts.
Must have something to do with that failing education system you have down there.
Well I see how it has been ingrained in generation after generation. In other words you are telling me you have been brainwashed.
We still are a great country no matter how many of you try to tell us we are not.
If you call the invasion of Afghanistan unjust then you clearly are not able to think rationally and follow world events outside of CC and Information Clearing House.
NATO had to clean up our mess? Have they? Is it over? :lol: It's a war. NATO came in because it is in the treaty. A treaty for a Cold War that we burdened under as you sat cozily. During NATO's illegal invasion of Yugoslavia it was American airpower that had to come in and clean that mess.
Ah yes... the ol' "If you don't agree with what we tell you, you're brainwashed." the great answer to all.
Tell me, who exactly brainwashed me? My country? The evil-doers? Scientology? Psssh.
Now who's the brainwashed one? Perhaps you don't follow much of what's been going on inside your country to notice. Quite honestly, I don't have the time to list two pages of how your country went into the drains in the last 8+ years. If I know more about what's going on in your country then you do, then once again.... that great education system at play again you guys have. Case in point would be Michigan where only 25% of the students actually end up graduating. How about your housing crisis the middle class is currently in? How about that Recession you're basically in at the moment?
Yes, that must be so clear that's what's wrong with me. Following world events would have given your fearless and brainless leader some intelligence that Osama wasn't even in Afghanistan at the time of invasion. The only two main reasons why you guys invaded was #1 - You blamed the Taliban for the attack. The Taliban did not approve of Osama's attack and he got in some crap for it, but the main organization was in Afghanistan, so you guys decided to pick on them. And #2 - The Taliban who were in power at the time, did not approve of a natural gas pipline the US wanted to build and get money from. Put 2 and 2 together.
For some reason, messes made by the US tend to take a while to clean up, due to massive F'ups. And NATO should have been disolved long ago. Canada, Australia, the UK and other commonwealth nations should just stick together and leave you guys to your cowboy mentality.
Alright, let's put EagleSmack and Praxius into the ring, or is it rink?, and fight it out!!
I, too read just now about the back-pedaling of Mr. Gates. Did he say he was sorry? That I must have missed.
So, we kind-hearted, fun-loving and generous Canadians will forgive him a second-last time!!!!;-)
I, too read just now about the back-pedaling of Mr. Gates. Did he say he was sorry? That I must have missed.
So, we kind-hearted, fun-loving and generous Canadians will forgive him a second-last time!!!!;-)
The cold war was not conducted against the USSR which was never a primary target. The cold war was cover used for market exspansion throughout the third world. The real targets were always developeing nations who in succession had thier democraticly elected governments replaced by American backed dictators at great cost in human life and property destruction, the winners were big bussiness as usual, the loosers, innocent men women and children
Recent historical scholarship rufutes strongly any invasion threat by Soviets aimed at Europe. It has been understood that the overwhelming evidence supports the theroy of maintenance of A/ military industrial sales and developement B/ the boggyman of Soviet influance in the developing world. In other words the entire cold war was a diversion while Uncle Sam raped pillaged and destroyed socialism in on every continent on earth, and continues to do so with the new boggyman of Islamic Terrorism a threat that does not exist except in the minds of those to lazy to read about it's history. Counter insurgency or counter terrorism is and has been the main work of American forces for over forty years, this matter is heavily documented by literally tons of documented evidence. Every campainge fought in over fifty years was aimed at civilian infrastructure and governments for the purpose of American corporate expansion, no threat ever existed to America, only to American and western corporations. It was all done for money and nothing else. Todays situation is different only in scale and scope of operation. Gates said exactly what he thought, they are desperate that Nato Allies engage more fully in the conquest, fearing the inevitable defeat. European citizens will not allow fuller ingagement of thier forces. Europeans have been reluctant participants thus far this accounts for the poor turnout and lead feet. There is no practicle way for the coalition forces in Afghanistan or Iraq to extract victory, they are bogged down in protracted guierilla warfare which they cannot win unless they sweep the area clean with chemical and biological agents, you will recall that nothing is off the table. What has been removed and for a long time is the chance for total victory by the coalition, something they knew if they didn't acheive early would never come. Neither the people of Iraq nor the Afghans will ever be defeated without the employment of WMDs in addition to the napalm, phosphor bombs, cluster bombs, depleted urainium and other illegle weapons. Canada, if we don't get out will be involved in the breakup of Pakistan, for no good reason other than the service to our imperial masters.
About the "America is so great concept".
Is America sliding? Or is the world just moving faster than it?
Either way, its not as great (in comparison) as it once was. America 1945 was hands and feet above the rest of the world in almost every way.
In the 80's it was better than most of the world in most ways.
In the 90's it was a pretty great place, but not really that much different than most of the western world, it had its strengths and few weaknesses.
Now, its on par with the western world, but there are nations who are better in most ways (though not all). I mean, seriously, less self congratulating and more working on self-improvement.
It should tell you something that the Canadian dollar's been hovering around par, and was at one point 10 cents over in the last year, we used to be a 2 for 1 sale.
This is with canada TRYING to drive down the price of our dollar too. America has not always been the greatest, nor will it always be, unless it not only tries hard, but other nations don't try hard.
Is America sliding? Or is the world just moving faster than it?
Either way, its not as great (in comparison) as it once was. America 1945 was hands and feet above the rest of the world in almost every way.
In the 80's it was better than most of the world in most ways.
In the 90's it was a pretty great place, but not really that much different than most of the western world, it had its strengths and few weaknesses.
Now, its on par with the western world, but there are nations who are better in most ways (though not all). I mean, seriously, less self congratulating and more working on self-improvement.
It should tell you something that the Canadian dollar's been hovering around par, and was at one point 10 cents over in the last year, we used to be a 2 for 1 sale.
This is with canada TRYING to drive down the price of our dollar too. America has not always been the greatest, nor will it always be, unless it not only tries hard, but other nations don't try hard.
A pat on the back and..."keep going, Canada,... fight the torrorists!!"
http://tinyurl.com/28cgkp
Blair was in Toronto today delivering a rallying speech to fight global terrorism, and watch out for rising China!
At least some brave protesters showed up and complained about his involvement in the wars, which were started under false pretenses.
I don't think protests are accomplishing anything. They are ineffective in the States as well as here.
http://tinyurl.com/28cgkp
Blair was in Toronto today delivering a rallying speech to fight global terrorism, and watch out for rising China!
At least some brave protesters showed up and complained about his involvement in the wars, which were started under false pretenses.
I don't think protests are accomplishing anything. They are ineffective in the States as well as here.
Hi Beaver...
you use strong language! I cannot agree with everything you say, nor anticipate the same horrific predictions. You know already, but I will tell you again, that I value your opinions and the unflowered way you present them. Every so often, when reading your posts, I just about roll under the computer desk laughing! You are so refreshing, and gawd knows... so well informed! Take it as a compliment, but don't let it get to your head!;-)
So, let me take your posting apart! ;-)
On the other hand, the Western Forces used Germany as a bullwark against the spread of communism from Russia. West-Germany actually has to thank the Russians for their communistic threat, because that way the allies pampered and nursed W-Germany to a strong nation again, without a military force, of course.
http://www.johndclare.net/Basics_ColdWar.htm
The Americans had the so called Marshall-Plan, which helped to get Western Europe on its feet again. Check out this link with map which states "...was the primary plan of the United States for rebuilding and creating a stronger foundation for the allied countries of Europe, and repelling communism after World War II."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan
Naturally, the Americans benefitted from that generosity as well, because it was a wise business investment at the same time, AND all those aided European countries are to this day still American allies. Smart thinking in Washington. I see nothing wrong with that.
That the entire Cold War was just a diversion I cannot see.
They destroyed socialism on every continent? Hmm... you mean perhaps some South American states like Chile, Nicaragua and Panama?
Angola in Africa? Any others?
It is always the CIA first, then comes the military, if necessary. Often the CIA alone is able to achieve their goal by instigation, bribing, and pitting one against the other.
Money is the greatest motivator in the western capitalist world. Exploitation of cheap labor in Third World countries.
Yes, forinstance there is a strong resistance amongst the German people, but their Chancellor is very much pro American. Then you have to consider they are all rather small countries.
But hold it!! There is a slim chance Obama might win and do a 180 degree turn, reconciling America with the Muslim World. I think that's all that is needed to achieve peace. The "terrorists" are just as battle weary as the Americans and would be happy to live in peace, following their own traditional ways.
Thank you Beaver!
you use strong language! I cannot agree with everything you say, nor anticipate the same horrific predictions. You know already, but I will tell you again, that I value your opinions and the unflowered way you present them. Every so often, when reading your posts, I just about roll under the computer desk laughing! You are so refreshing, and gawd knows... so well informed! Take it as a compliment, but don't let it get to your head!;-)
So, let me take your posting apart! ;-)
Are you able to verify that statement with some references? To me that is a totally new thought. I happen to come from Germany and know, that Russia would have taken over West-Germany as well, given the opportunity. The West-Germans were glad the allies were there to prevent that from happening. They feared the Russians far more than the Brits and Americans.
On the other hand, the Western Forces used Germany as a bullwark against the spread of communism from Russia. West-Germany actually has to thank the Russians for their communistic threat, because that way the allies pampered and nursed W-Germany to a strong nation again, without a military force, of course.
http://www.johndclare.net/Basics_ColdWar.htm
The Americans had the so called Marshall-Plan, which helped to get Western Europe on its feet again. Check out this link with map which states "...was the primary plan of the United States for rebuilding and creating a stronger foundation for the allied countries of Europe, and repelling communism after World War II."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_Plan
Naturally, the Americans benefitted from that generosity as well, because it was a wise business investment at the same time, AND all those aided European countries are to this day still American allies. Smart thinking in Washington. I see nothing wrong with that.
Islamic terrorism was created by the Americans. That I can see easily and also find enough written about it. Boogeyman's purpose is pretty clear, as is llustrated in Iraq and Afghanistan. It is always countries with rich resources and/or strategic locations. Russia forinstance is getting worried about being soon totally surrounded by American military bases! :roll:
That the entire Cold War was just a diversion I cannot see.
They destroyed socialism on every continent? Hmm... you mean perhaps some South American states like Chile, Nicaragua and Panama?
Angola in Africa? Any others?
Not just money, also power and control, but actually those two come with money.
It is always the CIA first, then comes the military, if necessary. Often the CIA alone is able to achieve their goal by instigation, bribing, and pitting one against the other.
Money is the greatest motivator in the western capitalist world. Exploitation of cheap labor in Third World countries.
Yes, it has spread and that's why we have an American Empire now... a big monster! Perhaps it is not so bad to have Harper as PM!:smile:
Exactly! It's draining their strength. Besides, most Americans don't support that war anymore.
Yes, forinstance there is a strong resistance amongst the German people, but their Chancellor is very much pro American. Then you have to consider they are all rather small countries.
Do you think they would do that? I don't! China, Russia, North Korea and Hugo Chavez personally would come down on them!!
Well, in that case... Cheers, Beaver:lol:
But hold it!! There is a slim chance Obama might win and do a 180 degree turn, reconciling America with the Muslim World. I think that's all that is needed to achieve peace. The "terrorists" are just as battle weary as the Americans and would be happy to live in peace, following their own traditional ways.
Thank you Beaver!