Omnibus Russia Ukraine crisis

Serryah

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Ahem Biden lifted restriction was for defense only and only along the border, if I recall properly only within 50km into Russia





So... will you say "sorry, my bad, I stand corrected" now? Or ignore it as usual and look for another excuse?
 
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Twin_Moose

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So... will you say "sorry, my bad, I stand corrected" now? Or ignore it as usual and look for another excuse?
There were limitations on what Ukraine can use the munitions on and no US equipment can enter Russia. If you look back in the thread I already posted the use and limitations of the extent of US munitions, Trump just removed all the restrictions
 

Twin_Moose

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One more excellent reason to ban nuke plants. That was a warning. The next one may be on a functioning plant.
Sorry Taxslave but that was one of the first plants built in the USSR and had no safety protocols built in and when the core melted down there was no shields in place to protect the public because the Marxist's didn't care
 

Taxslave2

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Sorry Taxslave but that was one of the first plants built in the USSR and had no safety protocols built in and when the core melted down there was no shields in place to protect the public because the Marxist's didn't care
WHich is why nuke plants need to be banned.
 

Ron in Regina

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Even before his so-called peace negotiations have begun, Trump appears to have conceded to Stalin’s successor in Moscow just about everything Russia could have hoped for.

Insofar as it’s possible to discern the sketchy outlines of the concordat that Trump struck with Russian President Vladimir Putin during a lengthy telephone conversation on Thursday — bits of it have been variously downplayed or walked back or amplified by unnamed White House officials — the Russians will be permitted to keep most, if not all, of the Ukrainian territory they’ve already conquered.

And Putin will face no consequences nor bear any costs for his scorched-earth war on Ukraine’s civilian population. The U.S. will no longer provide arms to Ukraine unless Kyiv pays for them up front, but the White House will consider backing Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s bid to acquire the roughly $300 billion in frozen Russian assets, held mostly in European banks, if Ukraine spends the money on American military hardware.

Overlooked in the news media’s efforts to figure out exactly what the American position is: the Biden administration was not the primary financial contributor to Ukraine’s resistance. Europe has contributed 132.3-billion euros (C$197 billion) over the past three years, and has pledged an open-ended commitment for as long as it takes. The American contribution amounted to 114.2-billion euros, and the majority of that money stayed in the U.S., as purchases from American arms manufacturers.

Trump reports that his conversation with Putin was pleasant, and they hope to meet soon, either in the U.S. or Russia. “We each talked about the strengths of our respective nations,” Trump said, “and the great benefit that we will someday have in working together.”

Trump added that Russia should be invited to rejoin the G7 countries, reconstituting the G8. “I’d love to have them back. I think it was a mistake to throw them out,” he said. “They should be sitting at the table. I think Putin would love to be back.”

Russia was ejected in 2014 after Putin invaded and seized Crimea, where so many Russian apparatchiks maintain their holiday palaces.

Other elements of Putin-Trump concordat: Trump concurs with Putin that Ukrainians should never have been allowed to imagine that their country would be permitted membership in NATO. The war was Ukraine’s fault, and the fault of Trump’s predecessor, Joe Biden, who offended Russia’s anti-NATO “red line” sensibilities about Ukraine, which Russia insists is not now, and never was, a proper country.

Meanwhile, Ukrainians wait in hope and agony to learn just how many more concessions Trump will offer the Russian terror state in order to claim the mantle of ending the war, which has been levelling Ukrainian cities for almost three full years now. At least 57,000 Ukrainian soldiers and civilians have been killed, and over 250,000 have been injured.
The latest atrocity: In the early hours of Friday morning, a Russian drone fitted with a high-explosive warhead smashed into the mothballed Chernobyl nuclear power plant, damaging the reactor’s protective shelter. Chernobyl’s Soviet-era meltdown and fire was the worst nuclear accident in history. The protective seals around the plant were intended to last for generations. So far, Ukrainian authorities say, there’s no evidence of heightened levels of radioactivity around the site.

Trump has been clear that he expects European troops to police American “security guarantees” in Ukraine, which Zelenskyy is expected to earn by presenting the Americans with what Trump has called “the equivalent of like $500 billion worth of rare earths.” Huh…ok?

Back in Munich, Vance offered no further clarity, although he did tell the Wall Street Journal that the U.S. would be prepared to hit Russia with sanctions and even send American soldiers to Ukraine if Moscow interferes with Zelenskyy’s arrangements with the United States.

In Munich, Vance was content to harangue the Europeans about the misguided fears they harbour about Russia and China?

“What I worry about is the threat from within — the retreat of Europe from some of its most fundamental values, values shared with the United States of America,” he said.

Vance’s remarks were widely understood to be in reference to immigration levels, echoing the rhetoric of the far-right, pro-Russian Alternative for Germany party, which Trump’s lieutenant, Elon Musk, has gone out of his way to boost.

Given Trump’s apparent determination to apply “economic force” on Canada to pressure the country to become the 51st state — a threat that could justify the invocation of Article 4 of the North Atlantic Treaty, requiring the 32-member alliance to convene for consultations — it’s not at all clear why the United States shouldn’t join Russia as a former G7 member.

The G7 meets in Kananaskis, Alta., in June. There’s no good reason why Trump should be admitted to Canada to attend?
 

Taxslave2

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So the way I read that, is if Europe wants to stop the Russian invasion, they will have to pay for it themselves. The US will not finance someone else's war. Until they decide it is in their bests interests to intervene. Like when their oil supply gets cut off.
 

Ron in Regina

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So the way I read that, is if Europe wants to stop the Russian invasion, they will have to pay for it themselves. The US will not finance someone else's war. Until they decide it is in their bests interests to intervene. Like when their oil supply gets cut off.
Fair enough, and the demand by the US of 500 Billion of Ukraines rare earth metals, is balance against the…
…The American contribution amounted to 114.2-billion euros, and the majority of that money stayed in the U.S., as purchases from American arms manufacturers.
Which was mighty generous of them…&…
…Europe has contributed 132.3-billion euros (C$197 billion) over the past three years, and has pledged an open-ended commitment for as long as it takes…
…Without demanding ransom/tribute from a nation that’s been fighting Russia since shortly after Trudeau was freezing bank accounts of Canadians over the Ottawa parking kerfuffle (in the Canadian national best interests, without even having to prorogue parliament)…to the best of my knowledge at this point…&…
..the White House will consider backing Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s bid to acquire the roughly $300 billion in frozen Russian assets, held mostly in European banks, if Ukraine spends the money on American military hardware…
…and…
Trump has been clear that he expects European troops to police American “security guarantees” in Ukraine, which Zelenskyy is expected to earn by presenting the Americans with what Trump has called “the equivalent of like $500 billion worth of rare earths.” Huh…ok?
…and…
Europe won't have a seat at the table for Ukraine peace talks, Donald Trump's Ukraine envoy said on Saturday, after Washington sent a questionnaire to European capitals to ask what they could contribute to security guarantees for Kyiv.

Trump shocked European allies this week by calling Russian President Vladimir Putin without consulting them or Kyiv beforehand and declaring an immediate start to peace talks.

Trump administration officials have also made clear in recent days that they expect European allies in NATO to take primary responsibility for the region as the U.S. now has other priorities, such as border security and countering China.

The U.S. moves have stoked fears that Europeans may be cut out of a peace deal that would also impact their own security, particularly if it is seen as too favourable to Russia.

Kellogg told a global security conference in Munich that the U.S. would act as an intermediary in the talks, with Ukraine and Russia as the two protagonists.

Asked about the prospects of the Europeans being at the table, Kellogg said: "I'm (from) a school of realism. I think that's not gonna happen."
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…&/or…
"Why is the Trump administration giving Putin gifts - Ukrainian land and no NATO membership for Ukraine - before negotiations even begin?" Did Ukraine get a say in any of this?

(Russia occupies around a fifth of Ukraine and has demanded Kyiv cede territory and become permanently neutral under any peace deal. Ukraine demands Russia withdraw from captured land and wants NATO membership or equivalent security guarantees to prevent Moscow from attacking again…so I’m assuming Ukraine hasn’t had a say in Trumps negotiations with Putin so far then?)
The memoranda, signed in Patria Hall at the Budapest Convention Center with U.S. Ambassador Donald M. Blinken amongst others in attendance, prohibited Russia (😉), the United States and the United Kingdom from threatening or using military force (🤫) or economic coercion against Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan, "except in self-defence or otherwise in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations." As a result of other agreements and the memorandum, between 1993 and 1996, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons.

February 20th, 2014, Russia invaded Crimea.
 

Jinentonix

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"Trump has been clear that he expects European troops to police American “security guarantees” in Ukraine, which Zelenskyy is expected to earn by presenting the Americans with what Trump has called “the equivalent of like $500 billion worth of rare earths.”

This is going to be a problem for the US in the near and medium future at the least. Or at least part of their problem. Trump reneging on deals and agreements the US made with other countries over the years (and decades) will make America look like a country that doesn't live up to the commitments and guarantees it offered. If we look at both Ukraine and Canada neither country went to the US hat in hand begging for a guarantee. The US approached BOTH countries, for different reasons, and said "Hey, if you do this thing we're asking you, we'll protect/defend you from aggressors".

Crap like Trump is pulling has the potential to push more countries closer to BRICS. Not exactly a good scenario when the two biggest idiots in BRICS are Russia and China.

Trump's playing the isolationist game is also a gamble. The last two times the US tried to do the isolationist thing they got dragged into 2 world wars in just 23 years. I think Trump is also upset with Europe because they aren't buying enough US military equipment. And if that is the case there's a pretty good reason why, the Europeans build some pretty fucking decent kit themselves.
 

Ron in Regina

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So, Trump & Putin are negotiating with each other regarding peace in Ukraine.

Putin gets to Keep all the land Russia occupies in Ukraine, America gets $500,000,000.00 in rare earth minerals from Ukraine, Ukraine gets to not join NATO, & maybe Ukraine gets to keep some or all of the $300 billion in seized Russian Oligarchs assets in European banks…as long as it’s used to purchase Americans military equipment. Glad Putin & Trump could agree on how to divide up Ukraine’s assets so amicably between them.
Who attacked Ukraine again? The war has caused widespread damage across Ukraine and Russia now controls around a fifth of its territory. The bulk of Ukraine’s coal deposits, which powered its steel industry before the war, are concentrated in the east and have been lost.

About 40% of Ukraine's metal resources are now under Russian occupation, according to estimates by Ukrainian think-tanks We Build Ukraine and the National Institute of Strategic Studies, citing data up to the first half of 2024. They provided no detailed breakdown.

Since then, Russian troops have continued to advance steadily in the eastern Donetsk region. In January, Ukraine closed its only coking coal mine outside the city of Pokrovsk, which Moscow's forces are trying to capture.

Russia has occupied at least two Ukrainian lithium deposits during the war - one in Donetsk and another in the Zaporizhzhia region in the southeast. Kyiv still controls lithium deposits in the central Kyrovohrad region.

Then, with what’s left, that’s still under Ukraine control, U.S. President Donald Trump on Tuesday said Ukraine had “essentially agreed” to a rare earth minerals deal with the US.
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"I told them that I want the equivalent of like $500 billion worth of rare earths, and they’ve ‘essentially agreed’ to do that.”

vs

MUNICH — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky rejected a Trump administration request this week that Kyiv hand over 50 percent of its rare-earth mineral resources — an extraordinary demand that could significantly overshadow the value of aid that has been sent to Ukraine.

{Europe has contributed 132.3-billion euros (C$197 billion) over the past three years, and has pledged an open-ended commitment for as long as it takes. The American contribution amounted to 114.2-billion euros, and the majority of that money stayed in the U.S., as purchases from American arms manufacturers}

Ukrainian officials are working on a counterproposal that would still offer Washington more access to the country’s natural resources but would bolster U.S. security guarantees for Ukraine, four people familiar with the discussions said.

Zelensky told reporters Saturday that he had not agreed to the Trump administration’s proposal “because it’s not ready yet.”

He said that security guarantees were not part of the U.S. proposal, and that Ukraine needed that in any agreement with the United States.

The offer and Ukraine’s consideration of it rippled through European diplomatic circles not only for its audacity but also because the war-ravaged country appeared to be seriously considering how to reach a deal in the hope of a commitment from the United States to help defend against Russia’s aggression.
Ukraine’s rare-earth mineral resources could be worth trillions of U.S. dollars, etc…
 

spaminator

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Zelenskyy says time has come for creation of ’armed forces of Europe’
Author of the article:Associated Press
Associated Press
Philipp Jenne
Published Feb 15, 2025 • Last updated 1 day ago • 6 minute read

MUNICH — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said Saturday that the time has come for the creation of an “armed forces of Europe,” because the U.S. may no longer be counted on to support the continent.


Meanwhile, German Chancellor Olaf Scholz hit back at Americans for meddling in his country’s election after U.S. Vice President JD Vance scolded European leaders over their approach to democracy and met with the leader of a German far-right party.

Forceful speeches from Zelenskyy and Scholz on Day 2 of the Munich Security Conference underlined the impact of a blizzard of decisions by U.S. President Donald Trump that show a rapidly growing chasm in trans-Atlantic ties.

European leaders are reeling after Trump’s decision to upend years of U.S. policy by holding talks with Russian President Vladimir Putin in hopes of ending the Russia-Ukraine war. Trump’s special envoy for Ukraine and Russia on Saturday all but ruled out that Europeans would be included in any Ukraine peace talks.


Ramping up his desire for a more muscular and mighty Europe, Zelenskyy said that Ukraine’s nearly three-year fight against Russia’s full-scale invasion has proved that a foundation exists for the creation of a European army — an idea long discussed among some leaders on the continent.

“I really believe that time has come,” he said. “The armed forces of Europe must be created.”

Zelenskyy also told The Associated Press on Saturday in Munich that he “didn’t let” his ministers sign an agreement with the U.S. on the extraction of minerals in the country, because “it is not ready to protect us, our interest.”


Ukraine is hoping to offer rare earth elements essential for many kinds of technology in exchange for continued military aid.


Earlier, Zelenskyy alluded to a phone conversation between Trump and Putin this week, after which Trump said that he and Putin would likely meet soon to negotiate a peace deal over Ukraine _ breaking with the Biden administration’s harder line against Moscow over Russia’s all-out assault on Ukraine, which began on Feb. 24, 2022.

Russia’s Foreign Ministry said Saturday that Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov spoke by phone with U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio on the initiative of the U.S. side.

Russia is under sweeping Western sanctions related to the war in Ukraine. Russia’s Foreign Ministry said that Rubio and Lavrov discussed Ukraine, the Middle East and developing economic and trade relations, including “removing unilateral barriers to mutually beneficial trade, economic and investment cooperation.” They agreed to be in “regular contact,” including to prepare for an upcoming summit.


U.S. State Department spokesperson Tammy Bruce confirmed the call between Rubio and Lavrov, saying it was a follow-up to the conversation between Trump and Putin on Wednesday.

Rubio reaffirmed Trump’s “commitment to finding an end to the conflict in Ukraine. In addition, they discussed the opportunity to potentially work together on a number of other bilateral issues,” Bruce said.

Trump previously assured Zelenskyy that he would have a seat at the table to end the war, and the Ukrainian leader insisted that Europe should also have one.

“Ukraine will never accept deals made behind our backs without our involvement, and the same rule should apply to all of Europe,” Zelenskyy said, adding that “not once did (Trump) mention that America needs Europe at the table.”


“That says a lot,” he said. “The old days are over when America supported Europe just because it always had.”

“Now, as we fight this war and lay the groundwork for peace and security, we must build the armed forces of Europe,” Zelenskyy said.

Zelenskyy said that his idea wasn’t about replacing NATO.

“This is about making Europe’s contribution to our partnership equal to America’s,” he said.

It’s unclear whether the idea will catch on with European leaders. Zelenskyy has sought greater military and economic support from the European Union for years and repeatedly warned that other parts of Europe could be vulnerable to Russia’s expansionist ambitions too.

While the bloc — along with the United States — has been one of Kyiv’s strongest backers, pockets of political disagreement in EU over its approach to Moscow and economic realities, including national debt levels that have crimped defense spending, have stood in the way of greater support.


Europeans likely excluded from Ukraine peace talks

European leaders have been trying to make sense of a tough new line from Washington on issues including democracy and Ukraine’s future, as the Trump administration continues to upend trans-Atlantic conventions that have been in place since after World War II.

Gen. Keith Kellogg, Trump’s special envoy for Ukraine and Russia, all but cut out Europeans from any Ukraine-Russia talks, despite Zelenskyy’s call for Europe to take part.

“You can have the Ukrainians, the Russians, and clearly the Americans at the table talking,” Kellogg said at an event hosted by a Ukrainian tycoon. Pressed on whether that meant Europeans won’t be included, he said: “I’m a school of realism. I think that’s not going to happen.”


“We need to ensure Ukrainian sovereignty,” he said, before adding: The “European alliance … are going to be critical to this.”

Asked what he would tell Trump if he were at the conference, Polish Foreign Minister Radosław Sikorski said that he would remind Trump that the U.S. had pledged to stand with Ukraine for as long as it takes.

“The credibility of the United States depends on how this war ends — not just the Trump administration (but) the United States itself,” Sikorski said.

Annalena Baerbock, Germany’s foreign minister, described the new U.S. stance as a “moment of truth” that requires European leaders to overcome their differences and unite for a meaningful peace in Ukraine.

“This is an existential moment. It’s a moment where Europe has to stand up,” she said. “There won’t be any lasting peace, if it’s not a European-agreed peace.”


Iceland’s prime minister, Kristrun Frostadottir, lamented a lack of clarity from Washington.

“People are still not sure what the U.S. wants to do. And I think it would be good if we came out of this conference if they had a clear picture of it,” she said.

German chancellor hits back at Vance

Earlier, Scholz said that he was “pleased” at what he called a shared commitment with the United States to “preserving the sovereign independence of Ukraine,” and agreed with Trump that the Russia-Ukraine war must end.

But Scholz also condemned the new political tack from Washington, affirming his strong stance against the far-right and said his country won’t accept people who “intervene in our democracy.”

A day earlier, Vance chastised Europe’s leaders at the conference and suggested that free speech is “in retreat” across the continent. He said that many Americans saw in Europe “entrenched interests hiding behind ugly Soviet-era words like misinformation and disinformation.”


Vance said that no democracy could survive telling millions of voters that their concerns “are invalid or unworthy of even being considered.” He also met with the co-leader of the far-right Alternative for Germany, or AfD, party, which is polling second ahead of Scholz’s own Social Democrats before the Feb. 23 election in Germany.

Alluding to Germany’s Nazi past, Scholz said that the longstanding commitment to “Never Again” — a return to the extreme right — wasn’t reconcilable with support for AfD.

“We will not accept that people who look at Germany from the outside intervene in our democracy and our elections and in the democratic opinion-forming process in the interest of this party,” he said. “That’s just not done, certainly not amongst friends and allies. We resolutely reject this.”

“Where our democracy goes from here is for us to decide,” Scholz added.

Not all responses from European leaders were negative.

President Karin Keller-Sutter of Switzerland, which isn’t an EU member, was quoted by Swiss daily Le Temps as saying she had “spoken about values to defend and that we share like freedom and the possibility for people to express themselves.”