Unclear wording of CERB eligibility means some recipients asked to pay everything back

[petros]

Some CERB recipients set to get notices they must repay portion of aid money
Author of the article:Canadian Press
Canadian Press
Publishing date:Nov 25, 2021 • 5 hours ago • 1 minute read • 9 Comments
CERB cheques are pictured in this file photo.
CERB cheques are pictured in this file photo. PHOTO BY FILE PHOTO /Postmedia Network
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OTTAWA — Some Canadians who received a pandemic jobless benefit are set to receive notices that they have to repay some of the aid they received last year.

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The Canada Emergency Response Benefit was rolled out at the onset of the pandemic during a historic drop in the labour market — three million jobs lost and two million people with hours cut. The government sent $2,000 payments to some recipients who applied through Service Canada as an advance on the first four weeks to help households who saw sudden loss of earnings.


The idea was to reconcile the payment at some point during the time CERB was available, which is why many who got the advance saw a break in benefits during the summer of 2020.

The government now says there are still recipients who owe some or all of the $2,000, specifically those who were not entitled to the aid or didn’t collect CERB for at least 20 weeks.


Employment Minister Carla Qualtrough says anyone who needs it will get a flexible repayment schedule and there will be no penalties or interest charged on the overpayment.

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“Canadians will not be put into financial hardship by having to repay emergency benefits they received,” Qualtrough says in a statement.

Those who owe money will get a notice from Service Canada outlining how much they owe, the process to repay, and how they can appeal the decision.

Some CERB recipients set to get notices they must repay portion of aid money

Some Canadians who received a pandemic jobless benefit are set to receive notices that they have to repay some of the aid.

torontosun.com

Good luck with that.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

Good luck with that.

I don't think any government in history ever mastered the law of diminishing returns. . .

Chocolate factories did.

 

[harrylee]

In March 2020 I was semi-retired, worked part time making about $1200 a month. I was laid of due to Covid closures for 4 months.

When I applied and got my 4 months of CERB, I stuck it in my savings and it's still there. I met all the conditions they asked for but was still concerned that they would find a way to screw it up, which they did. I have received no notice that I now do not qualify, paid tax on it, so I figure it's mine.
Like a government official said years ago....."I am entitled to my entitlement"

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

In March 2020 I was semi-retired, worked part time making about $1200 a month. I was laid of due to Covid closures for 4 months.

When I applied and got my 4 months of CERB, I stuck it in my savings and it's still there. I met all the conditions they asked for but was still concerned that they would find a way to screw it up, which they did. I have received no notice that I now do not qualify, paid tax on it, so I figure it's mine.
Like a government official said years ago....."I am entitled to my entitlement"

Friend of mine got $10,000 from the Air Force (misplaced decimal point on his pay). He banked it in a separate account, and when they came after him three years later, he wrote them a cheque for the $10K, kept the 1200 dollars in interest he'd made, and everybody was happy.

 

[harrylee]

Friend of mine got $10,000 from the Air Force (misplaced decimal point on his pay). He banked it in a separate account, and when they came after him three years later, he wrote them a cheque for the $10K, kept the 1200 dollars in interest he'd made, and everybody was happy.

That is my thought also, but at todays interest rates, I may be able to buy a coffee and donut at Timmies with the interest.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

That is my thought also, but at todays interest rates, I may be able to buy a coffee and donut at Timmies with the interest.

No kidding. Right now in the U.S., money market accounts (a type of savings account) pays less than CDs. Which just shows how weird it gets when the government lends money for free.

 

[Dixie Cup]

Fact is many people thought they could latch on to some free taxpayer money. The "penalties" they are facing are no different that those of us that retired last year. OAP is based on the previous year's income, so most people are not going to receive the full benefit the first year of retirement. Anyone already col;ecting a pension should not have even applied for CERB.

I agree. I retired in Oct '20 and never even thought about applying for anything because I knew I wasn't entitled to receive. All one had to do is look it up on-line. We did, surprisingly receive $300 each back in May/June '20 (??) - but nothing else. We'll likely have to pay tax on it but fortunately, it wasn't much so I doubt we will have a tax bill this year.

It still surprises me, even after working with taxes for 18 years, that people think that the money they receive will have no tax consequences. I even had someone ask why they have to pay tax on CPP as they thought it was tax free. No, it isn't because you deduct your CPP (and EI) contributions on your tax return (from your pay cheque) so that amount is not taxable which is why you pay tax when you actually collect - Not unlike your RRSP! Sigh.... Having said that, most people don't do their own taxes so they likely don't even realize that.

 

[taxslave]

I agree. I retired in Oct '20 and never even thought about applying for anything because I knew I wasn't entitled to receive. All one had to do is look it up on-line. We did, surprisingly receive $300 each back in May/June '20 (??) - but nothing else. We'll likely have to pay tax on it but fortunately, it wasn't much so I doubt we will have a tax bill this year.

It still surprises me, even after working with taxes for 18 years, that people think that the money they receive will have no tax consequences. I even had someone ask why they have to pay tax on CPP as they thought it was tax free. No, it isn't because you deduct your CPP (and EI) contributions on your tax return (from your pay cheque) so that amount is not taxable which is why you pay tax when you actually collect - Not unlike your RRSP! Sigh.... Having said that, most people don't do their own taxes so they likely don't even realize that.

There is still no reason why CPP should be taxable. Just theft by government.

 

[Dixie Cup]

There is still no reason why CPP should be taxable. Just theft by government.

Since it's considered income and is not taxed when you contribute, it's taxed at a much lower rate when you retire as your income isn't as high. At least, that's the reasoning. I also contributed to an RRSP and now that I'm drawing down on it on a monthly basis, I'm taxed on it as well. But, as I also said earlier, I deducted my contributions at tax time thus I will be taxed on the funds at a lower rate because my only income is CPP, OAS & the RRSP. My income has dropped considerably so that I pay little to no tax. Most people simply have CPP and OAS; however, the supplement from OAS one can receive (if eligible) isn't taxable FYI.

 

[taxslave]

I know what the government's reasoning is. I still consider it theft. Also CPP is much lower than it should be considering the amount of money both workers and their employers contribute every year. Many of us contribute more than required, as do our employers. We get our overpayment back, but the employer's portion is just kept in the pot. I don't consider $1100/month very good return on 50 years worth of forced investing.

 

[Mowich]

I agree. I retired in Oct '20 and never even thought about applying for anything because I knew I wasn't entitled to receive. All one had to do is look it up on-line. We did, surprisingly receive $300 each back in May/June '20 (??) - but nothing else. We'll likely have to pay tax on it but fortunately, it wasn't much so I doubt we will have a tax bill this year.

It still surprises me, even after working with taxes for 18 years, that people think that the money they receive will have no tax consequences. I even had someone ask why they have to pay tax on CPP as they thought it was tax free. No, it isn't because you deduct your CPP (and EI) contributions on your tax return (from your pay cheque) so that amount is not taxable which is why you pay tax when you actually collect - Not unlike your RRSP! Sigh.... Having said that, most people don't do their own taxes so they likely don't even realize that.

I looked into CERB too Dixie. It was made perfectly clear that it was taxable. Wasn't at all interested in applying but the taxable part made sure I would not apply. Like the saying goes, nothing in this world is free.

 

[TheShadow]

I am shocked at how many people applied and thought it was free.

In fact, now that it's tax time again they are shocked they have to pay it back.

It's just sad really as it's messing with many low and fixed income people.

 

[spaminator]

High schoolers reportedly claimed $636 million in federal relief cheques
Author of the article:Kevin Connor
Publishing date:Jul 14, 2022 • 16 hours ago • 1 minute read • 6 Comments

Statistics Canada says hundreds of thousands of teenaged students received payments of up to $5,000, which was money intended for COVID relief aid for jobless taxpayers facing eviction or foreclosure, according to Blacklock’s Reporter.


Access to Information documents show in 2021 a total $636 million was paid to high schoolers.

“Pandemic related benefits included new programs like the Canada Emergency Response Benefit,” said André Bernard, StatsCan chief of income statistics.

The payments were based on the Census.

“The Census is uniquely positioned to assess the impacts of the pandemic on incomes of Canadians … tell us what happened in 2020,” Bernard said.

Data shows Canadians aged 15 to 19 — a total 25% of girls and 22% of boys — claimed federal relief cheques.

“Many received payments from government income support programs,” said Bernard.

In March 25, 2020, Parliament enacted the Canada Emergency Response Benefit Act to issue $2,000-a month cheques to jobless taxpayers.


The act allowed payments to teenagers as young as 15 but they needed to provide a tax return the previous year.

Blacklocks say records showed federal authorities gave payments without confirming applicants were tax filers.

Payments included $81.3 million in pandemic relief cheques to children aged 15, a total $185.6 million to children aged 16 and $369.2 million to children aged 17.

“If the government had not done that back then what would have been the outcome?” Liberal MP Kevin Lamoureux, parliamentary secretary to the Government House Leader, told the Commons on Jan. 25, 2021.

“We would have had more people borrowing money because of their loss of income. We would have had people not being able to pay for basic needs such as their groceries, their rent, their mortgages.”

Critics said the payments to high school students was misdirected.

“God love the 15-year old who got a $2,000-a month CERB cheque courtesy of taxpayers but I think that money would be better spent on First Nations suffering,” said Conservative MP Kelly McCauley.

High schoolers reportedly claimed $636 million in federal relief cheques

Statistics Canada says hundreds of thousands of teenaged students received payments of up to $5,000.

torontosun.com

 

[Ron in Regina]

High schoolers reportedly claimed $636 million in federal relief cheques
Author of the article:Kevin Connor
Publishing date:Jul 14, 2022 • 16 hours ago • 1 minute read • 6 Comments

Statistics Canada says hundreds of thousands of teenaged students received payments of up to $5,000, which was money intended for COVID relief aid for jobless taxpayers facing eviction or foreclosure, according to Blacklock’s Reporter.

…& that’s two years ago, to the day almost, and we still don’t know the final total I’m sure…

Access to Information documents show in 2021 a total $636 million was paid to high schoolers.

Any word whether welfare double dippers, prisoners, treaty payees, etc. were asked to repay the ineligible payments?

I seem to remember something from a couple years ago about investigating this being an undue burden on the investigators at Revenue Canada, & that was before it came out that a bunch of people at Revenue Canada where involved in defrauding….Revenue Canada.

How could one collect CERB if they are on welfare. Or maybe a better question would be why would anyone collect welfare when they can get CERB?

There in lies the question, because they certainly did receive CERB, even reports of persons in jail receiving CERB.

Access-to-information files said the Canada Revenue Agency had “no records” of who mismanaged the Canada Emergency Response Benefit program, according to Blacklock’s Reporter.

“We have no records pertaining to this request,” wrote the agency’s access-to-information office.

Blacklock’s had sought the names of those responsible for mismanaging the CERB program that paid out Billions of dollars in fradulent claims.

Revenue commissioner Bob Hamilton testified it was a “decision by the government,” but would not name names.

“We determined there was an increase in fraud because there were greater incentives to defraud,” said Hamilton, testifying on Feb. 2, 2023, before the House of Commons public accounts committee.

“We implemented a number of fraud detection measures. It is, nevertheless, true the number of instances of fraud increased.”

Official estimates had ineligible claimants get $7.96 billion in relief cheques with audits scheduled to continue into 2025.

“It’s very difficult to know what will be left at the end of the day,” said Hamilton.

In the early days of the pandemic on March 25, 2020, Parliament passed the CERB Act to pay $2,000 a month to jobless tax filers facing eviction or foreclosure. While the program was originally budgeted for $24 billion, its final costs were $81.6 billion.

CRA was assigned processing claims, including verification that applicants were tax filers, but no upfront verification occurred. Access-to-information records showed payments of $636 million were claimed by children as young as 15.

Hamilton said “an unidentified government official” told CRA to process claims with no questions asked.

Feds mum on who's to blame for $8B in fraudulent CERB payments: Report — Toronto Sun

CRA had 'no records' of who mismanaged CERB program during pandemic, Blacklock's Reporter says

apple.news

 

[Dixie Cup]

…& that’s two years ago, to the day almost, and we still don’t know the final total I’m sure…


I seem to remember something from a couple years ago about investigating this being an undue burden on the investigators at Revenue Canada, & that was before it came out that a bunch of people at Revenue Canada where involved in defrauding….Revenue Canada.


Access-to-information files said the Canada Revenue Agency had “no records” of who mismanaged the Canada Emergency Response Benefit program, according to Blacklock’s Reporter.

“We have no records pertaining to this request,” wrote the agency’s access-to-information office.

Blacklock’s had sought the names of those responsible for mismanaging the CERB program that paid out Billions of dollars in fradulent claims.

Revenue commissioner Bob Hamilton testified it was a “decision by the government,” but would not name names.

“We determined there was an increase in fraud because there were greater incentives to defraud,” said Hamilton, testifying on Feb. 2, 2023, before the House of Commons public accounts committee.

“We implemented a number of fraud detection measures. It is, nevertheless, true the number of instances of fraud increased.”

Official estimates had ineligible claimants get $7.96 billion in relief cheques with audits scheduled to continue into 2025.

“It’s very difficult to know what will be left at the end of the day,” said Hamilton.

In the early days of the pandemic on March 25, 2020, Parliament passed the CERB Act to pay $2,000 a month to jobless tax filers facing eviction or foreclosure. While the program was originally budgeted for $24 billion, its final costs were $81.6 billion.

CRA was assigned processing claims, including verification that applicants were tax filers, but no upfront verification occurred. Access-to-information records showed payments of $636 million were claimed by children as young as 15.

Hamilton said “an unidentified government official” told CRA to process claims with no questions asked.

Feds mum on who's to blame for $8B in fraudulent CERB payments: Report — Toronto Sun

CRA had 'no records' of who mismanaged CERB program during pandemic, Blacklock's Reporter says

apple.news

That's what happens when you hire based on everything EXCEPT merit & qualifications!