Why Do Many Reasonable People Doubt Science?

[Cannuck]

But it didn't take long for it to morph into mindless clutter on the airwaves, not to mention killing motorists. Then there came all the other crap to the point where we have an entire generation glued to the F**king gadget 24/7 and missing out on other more healthy aspects of life.

Fear of technology is understandable when one feels overwhelmed by it. I'm sure there were lots of folks that had reservations about flight. Fortunately, people ignored them for the most part.

You probably aren't aware but there is a difference between science and technology....and your entertainment value isn't irrelevant btw. It's priceless.

 

[Sal]

The key word being manipulated. (Good morning, Sal)

morning hon

when I worked for a non profit l learned quickly how to manipulate stats because the stats determined our funding

 

[JLM]

morning hon

when I worked for a non profit l learned quickly how to manipulate stats because the stats determined our funding

Your knowledge and understanding of stats is commendable, now if you could convey your wisdom and sagacity to Cannuck, it might preclude a lot of ignorance.

 

[Sal]

Your knowledge and understanding of stats is commendable, now if you could convey your wisdom and sagacity to Cannuck, it might preclude a lot of ignorance.

nah I am no stats or math wiz...one does what one has to

I was kinda shocked though that it could be done...I'd never even considered it before

 

[Ron in Regina]

WOW

Must read!!!!


Why Do Many Reasonable People Doubt Science?

We live in an age when all manner of scientific knowledge—from climate change to vaccinations—faces furious opposition.
Some even have doubts about the moon landing.....

Hate to admit it, but I fall into this camp at times. Science I don't doubt,
but motives I do. What are the motives of those pushing an agenda and
using science as a club in a "nothing to see anywhere else and no
questioning my authority" sort'a thing.

 

[damngrumpy]

First I am not afraid of technology itself I am confounded by it but not fear
more frustration. Yes manipulation is a key word and some of the worst
groups denouncing science are the one manipulating it. Funding is the
key here.
Something else is going on though. Scientists are not as respected as they
were, police and politicians those who repair your car and even Doctors are
suspect in many cases. It was said not long ago firefighters and farmers
have risen to the top where police and church ministers were once in the
spotlight. There is a veil of mistrust of Each Other and that is more serious
than doubting science but that's another subject.
I think the televangelist scientists such as David Suzuki have done a lot of
damage. Science is one thing public acceptance of the findings another.
We hear water need protection and the first thing that happens? Water meters
regulations, and rising bills.
Same with power and natural gas and the list goes on. Soon science = more
profit and political justification for ensuring business gets what it wants.
That may or may not be true but it is public acceptance of that point of view.
The HST fight in BC is a prime example of this illistration

 

[waldo]

Perhaps if you'd reword that question it might save you some embaressment. Science is the method best able to prove or disprove a theory. Fer instance if science did not prove the metalurgical strength of steel half of the bag of nails you bought would bend like plastic and the other half would shatter like glass. Science ,the method, certainly aims for proof, you might be confident buying a bag of provisional spikes or tentative bolts. The tentative provisonal position does not build working machines, only proof will provide tangible utility. Your claim of my expressed confusion is provisional and tentative while your own words prove you to be a deck of more or less than fifty two.

science does not deal in absolute theory proof - no theory is ever proven. A basic principle in science is that any law, theory, or otherwise can be disproven, as I said, in the face of new facts or evidence that challenges the prevailing theory:

Prevailing is exactly that - tentative, provisional and reflecting on evidence... but not final... but subject to change in the presence of a 'better theory or new/updated evidence' to challenge the prevailing science/theory.

the embarrassment you speak of... is yours!

 

[Ron in Regina]

Unless it is "settled" science like 'the Earth is flat' and 'you'll fall off the
edge if you sail too far in one direction' where once the "settled" science
of their times by those with an agenda, and those that questioned where
belittled and ridiculed at best, and persecuted at worse.

science does not deal in absolute theory proof - no theory is ever proven. A basic principle in science is that any law, theory, or otherwise can be disproven, as I said, in the face of new facts or evidence that challenges the prevailing theory....

Yes. Exactly.

 

[damngrumpy]

The problem is people convene their own opinions into their own understanding
of what they want science to say. We agree that all food must be organic and that
is that. We all want to have people conform to our rules on the environment as we
believe or we don't care what is happening all science is nonsense
Polarization is the problem and less and less people really look at science objectively
News has become entertainment
Science has become a tool to enforce ones point of view to hell with objectivity
That is because the messenger is no longer trusted.

 

[Cannuck]

Your knowledge and understanding of stats is commendable, now if you could convey your wisdom and sagacity to Cannuck, it might preclude a lot of ignorance.

No need Sparky. I'm well aware that people can certainly try to manipulate stats for their own agenda. For example, some of the seniors on this forum will try to twist the stats regarding senior wealth to try and suggest they aren't the wealthiest generation in the history of our great country. This is obviously to support their agenda which is to keep the gravy train rolling at the expense of their children. This in no way, shape or form negates the statistical data that clearly shows that seniors are, in fact, the wealthiest generation in the history of this great nation. You see, the science clearly shows one thing and manipulating doesn't change a thing. It only convinces people that don't understand how the data is compiled. This is why people believe elevators are safer because we have elevator inspectors or driving is safer because we have anti-texting legislation. If you look at the data without an agenda then it really doesn't lie. That's why many of the folks here have a problem with science. It doesn't support their agenda. They (you) need to get over it.

 

[talloola]

reasonable people will and should ask questions about anything they need to know more about, sounds

reasonable to me, scientists Ask questions about their own findings, over and over, till they are

satisfied with the proof they were looking for.

 

[Cannuck]

Unless it is "settled" science like 'the Earth is flat' and 'you'll fall off the
edge if you sail too far in one direction' where once the "settled" science
of their times by those with an agenda, and those that questioned where
belittled and ridiculed at best, and persecuted at worse.



Yes. Exactly.

But if somebody came up with realisitic evidence that the earth was indeed flat, science would look at that evidence objectively. Just like science doesn't say there isn't a gawd. It's just that nobody has come up with credible evidence.

 

[waldo]

That is because the messenger is no longer trusted.

yes; a key point as applies to many. Mainstream media has failed to properly convey understanding/findings... at the same time, scientists have also failed in properly bringing research findings to the mainstream for layperson review. Much of the fail behind the mainstream is due to straight economics; few mainstream media outlets staff dedicated science writers with the knowledge to interact with scientists to properly convey technical level understanding to the public layperson. Many media outlets simply rely upon news aggregators and the same piece appears 'everywhere', right or wrong. In this latter regard, there is a big push by agenda-driven parties, most of it politicized, to attempt to get "anything" up into the mainstream for mass distribution..... and a tangential play on this is purposeful misinformation put forward by so-called tabloid newspapers (many/most of British origin)... purposeful misinformation intended solely to sell papers/views!

on some levels, the mainstream is improving... embarrassment drives degrees of change/improvement! Scientists have also begun to recognize their own failures in proper public dissemination and are more actively working to ensure news/understanding is brought to the public at a layperson's understanding level. But the past is the past and yes, as you say, the public has been confused and degrees of trust has been lost.

 

[darkbeaver]

science does not deal in absolute theory proof - no theory is ever proven. A basic principle in science is that any law, theory, or otherwise can be disproven, as I said, in the face of new facts or evidence that challenges the prevailing theory:the embarrassment you speak of... is yours!

So the science behind steel spikes has not been proven? How about spears and clubs? I am of the opinion that spikes have left the theoreticle realm and entered the land of proven utility precisely because of applied science.

 

[JLM]

No need Sparky. I'm well aware that people can certainly try to manipulate stats for their own agenda. For example, some of the seniors on this forum will try to twist the stats regarding senior wealth to try and suggest they aren't the wealthiest generation in the history of our great country. This is obviously to support their agenda which is to keep the gravy train rolling at the expense of their children.

Which just goes to show how shallow your knowledge and character really is. Yep when you count the $ signs we are without a doubt the wealthiest generation in history, but a person with any depth of character, would evaluate the true value of our $1/2 million dollar houses today and $100,000 vehicles. A lot of our so called wealth like in my case is the result of starting to save $10 a month when we were 20 and let time and interest rates do their thing. But anyway if you want to continue to wallow in ignorance, that's your decision. Being stupid is one thing, being deliberately stupid is something else!

 

[waldo]

So the science behind steel spikes has not been proven? How about spears and clubs? I am of the opinion that spikes have left the theoreticle realm and entered the land of proven utility precisely because of applied science.

beav, beav... is there a steel spike theory... I'm not aware of it. Is there an active body of work/research working to challenge/usurp that "steel spike theory"?

 

[GreenFish66]

There is good and bad science...and like anything, some is debatable, indisputable, and some is subject to change depending on input, variables... etc...If it is good science backed by proven experimentation and solid evidence, scientists and reasonable people will agree with it. If not, other scientists and reasonable people will call it B.S, and prove it.

It's fringe science - pseudo science, bordering on science fiction that draws the greatest criticism and debate(my favorite kinda science). But the most controversial kinda science, is Pure B.S. science promoted mostly by Politicians and Biz. That's the so-called Science that pisses off both scientists and reasonable people alike.

------------------------

Google moon...Show me the foot prints, the flag and lunar rover, and I will undoubtedly believe that a man placed his foot on the moon, more than once.

_______________________


Takes truth and proof to prove the truth. Believe what you will. You are entitled to/by your opinion.

_____________________

Now off to Mars and Europa!

 

[Cannuck]

Yep when you count the $ signs we are without a doubt the wealthiest generation in history..... But anyway if you want to continue to wallow in ignorance, that's your decision. Being stupid is one thing, being deliberately stupid is something else!

Bwahahahahaha!!! Is it any wonder why I get such a kick out of you. First, you agree with me then call me ignorant and stupid. At least you've finally agreed that seniors are the wealthiest generation in history and all it took was me clubbing you over the head repeatedly with the facts. Hey, I guess science (aka statistical evidence) works after all. Next we'll work on all the social programs geared towards seniors. It would now appear that once a club you over the head enough with those facts, you'll eventually come around. Then it should be pretty easy to draw the correlation between seniors and selfishness. Even if you don't get it, it's still fun mocking you.

 

[taxslave]

stalker! Why do/would you care? Surely you're not claiming a person's expressed opinion is a reflection of/on their job/employment. :mrgreen:

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which one(s)? Is there a particular label you're having difficulty with/concern over?



please elaborate. What's a right kind of thinking... what's a wrong kind of thinking? Is your right/wrong LABELING an avenue for you to introduce morality into this discussion? :mrgreen: Is there right and/or wrong in, "otherwise reasonable people doubting science"?



standard taxi deflection routine to being challenged to support your "less than reasonable person doubt of science"! Same ole, same ole taxi! Forever doubting science but never, ever in a willing position to substantiate that cast doubt.

Wrong again. I don't doubt science. I just doubt agenda driven scientists.

 

[GreenFish66]

https://www.sciencenews.org/article/odds-are-its-wrong - "Science fails to face the shortcomings of statistics"