Is Welfare The Government’s Fault?

[Liberalman]

fair enough...i will address each piece.

i can leave 50 resumes or job apps everywhere

.

if you left that many resumes you would get calls

if my skill set does not match the job skills needed it is a waste of time for the company

you have some skill sets and the exposure will let the compony consider you for future jobs

in theory it would in practice it won't.

it works in practice

nothing would be gained

.

everything will be gained

just because someone is able bodied does not mean they have the mental health to hold down a daily job there are a myriad of reasons as to why people are on welfare..

they would be in the can't work group

it can not take a zillion government agents to enforce the checking-up-on-receivers

there is not a zillion on the welfare role

it will be come more expensive to police the system than it does to spend the welfare.

there would be more savings if monitered properly than not doing anything
[/quote]

 

[petros]

If the government were to identify able-bodied welfare recipients should they pick up their welfare cheques after they show a signed form from at least one place the welfare recipient left a resume or job application? This would cut down on welfare fraud and get the welfare recipient searching for a job on a daily bases.

What do you think?

In SK you have to turn in a job search form where you list at least 10 places where when and the name and phone number of of the person you spoke to or gave a CV.

And they do check up to ensure you didn't just crack open the phonebook to fill the quota.

 

[JLM]

I consider all government jobs as high paid welfare.

I wouldn't go quite that far, there has to be a few watch dogs as not all the employers in the private sector are squeaky clean. In the Okanagan lately there have been a couple of instances of senior neglect in private seniors' residences. Would you like to fly on private airlines without D.O.T. keeping an eye on things? I think integrity lies within the person more than who employs them.

 

[petros]

[As far as I'm concerned there is always something that needs doing in a community- like litter to be picked up or improvements to landscaping like pulling weeds, thinning, pruning etc. which able bodied welfare recipients should be doing, hence saving the taxpayer from having to hire some to do it.

You can't force somebody to work.

In SK the types of things you listed are done by Fine Option where you can work off traffic and court fines if you can't afford to pay them and through community associations to get the speds into the workforce.

 

[JLM]

You can't force somebody to work.


[/FONT][/FONT]

They might do it voluntarily if they got hungry!

 

[petros]

They might do it voluntarily if they got hungry!

True, that is why the Community Assoc in my neighbourhood allows you to work when you want if you fall short which is easy to do when all welfare here pays is $700 a month.

You can't find anywhere to rent for $700 let alone trying to feed yourself and pay utilities with the $700.

I have no idea why some people think welfare is the life of Riley.

 

[lone wolf]

You can't force somebody to work.

You can try ... but it's pretty much guaranteed you won't get quality workmanship

 

[JLM]

You can try ... but it's pretty much guaranteed you won't get quality workmanship

That is why you might have them picking up garbage rather than say tuning pianos or violins.

 

[lone wolf]

That is why you might have them picking up garbage rather than say tuning pianos or violins.

I'm sure we all know people who can screw up picking up garbage too.

 

[Nuggler]

True, that is why the Community Assoc in my neighbourhood allows you to work when you want if you fall short which is easy to do when all welfare here pays is $700 a month.

You can't find anywhere to rent for $700 let alone trying to feed yourself and pay utilities with the $700.

I have no idea why some people think welfare is the life of Riley.

It's a myth propagated by the well fed and employed who own a large streak of nasty.

good luck fighting the unions on that one... they would say you are putting workers out of work

Which would be true.

 

[china]

It's not as black-and-white as your tarred brush thinks. Too often Welfare is the waiting area for bureacracy to shuffle its feet before filing someone into long-term disability support.

Service Canada
Services for People with Disabilities

canada.gc.ca
BreadcrumbHome >People with Disabilities
Starting a Business - For People with Disabilities

Opportunities Fund for Persons with Disabilities
The Opportunities Fund for Persons with Disabilities provides funding for national, regional and local projects that assist people with disabilities in preparing for and finding employment or self-employment, as well as acquiring the skills necessary to maintain that new employment.
Disability Vocational Rehabilitation Program
The Disability Vocational Rehabilitation Program offers vocational counselling, financial support for training, and job search services to recipients of Canada Pension Plan (CPP) Disability Benefits to help return to work.
Entrepreneurs with Disabilities Program
The Entrepreneurs with Disabilities Program provides services to entrepreneurs with disabilities who live in western Canadian communities and who are seeking to start up or expand a small or medium-sized business.
Other programs and services:

Business Development Program
The Business Development Program provides unsecured and interest-free loans to small and medium-sized businesses in Atlantic Canada to help them carry out start-up and expansion activities.
Community Futures Loan Program
Throughout Western Canada the locally run, non-profit, Community Futures organizations have achieved outstanding success by integrating the social and economic needs of their communities. A wide range of services and financing opportunities are available to small businesses and entrepreneurs at the local Community Futures offices.
Financing for starting a business
Business Development Bank of Canada's helps entrepreneurs start up new businesses by providing them with long-term loans as well as consulting services and advice.
Francophone Economic Development Organizations
Francophone Economic Development Organizations provide services to francophone entrepreneurs who are seeking to start up or expand small and medium-sized businesses in western Canada.
Seed Capital Initiative
The Seed Capital Initiative provides repayable, unsecured loans to start, expand or improve a small business.
Training and Employment Initiatives
Human Resources and Skills Development Canada provides individuals who are eligible for Employment Insurance with income and entrepreneurial support while they develop and implement their business plan.
Women's Enterprise Initiative
The Women’s Enterprise Initiative provide services to women entrepreneurs who are seeking to start up or expand small and medium-sized businesses in Western Canada.
Women in Business Initiative
The Women in Business Initiative provides financial support, information and advice to women entrepreneurs in Atlantic Canada to help them develop their businesses and increase their competitiveness.

 

[lone wolf]

So what? What they say is seldom what they do. You'd have to experience it to know it.

Sure there are, officially, programs. There are also huge obstacles (read: bureaucrats) between person in need and said program.

 

[china]

S]

There are also huge obstacles (read: bureaucrats) between person in need and said program.

Oh yeah....? who got them (the obstacles) there ? the Russians , Polish maybe the Chinese , oh no ,it's the f...en American's fault ,right .If you want something , anything ,really badly , for a good cause , the nature its self will remove all the obstacles or give you the means to eliminate them .....and that ain't no magic....that is life . Live ,don't fukn vegetate !

 

[lone wolf]

S]


Oh yeah....? who got them (the obstacles) there ? the Russians , Polish maybe the Chinese , oh no ,it's the f...en American's fault ,right .If you want something , anything ,really badly , for a good cause , the nature its self will remove all the obstacles or give you the means to eliminate them .....and that ain't no magic....that is life . Live ,don't fukn vegetate !

If you're not up for intelligent discourse, be abusive - right? Seems you're still bitter because someone in Canada's government said NO to your brand of fertilizer. Get over it and you can live too....

 

[Liberalman]

well, isn't that special..... let's penalize those that have fallen on hard times or have made a mistake in the past by giving more to someone that may have just been lucky.



Is welfare the governments fault? Sure, to those that are unwilling to take responsibility for the REASON that welfare is needed. Societal mores are the reason that welfare is needed. The fact is that societal members turn a blind eye to those less fortunate or in need. They EXPECT "government" to "do something".

we, as a society, are responsible for each and every member of that society, and untill we actually take on that responsibility, we will continue to have the disenfranchised and down trodden. We will continue to hear the whining of the cost from those that don't understand the TRUE cost of allowing there to be members of our society going without.




What it is, is another example of jlm thinking of only himself.

by gerryh
Is welfare the governments fault? Sure, to those that are unwilling to take responsibility for the REASON that welfare is needed. Societal mores are the reason that welfare is needed. The fact is that societal members turn a blind eye to those less fortunate or in need. They EXPECT "government" to "do something".

we, as a society, are responsible for each and every member of that society, and untill we actually take on that responsibility, we will continue to have the disenfranchised and down trodden. We will continue to hear the whining of the cost from those that don't understand the TRUE cost of allowing there to be members of our society going without.

The people is the government

Service Canada
Services for People with Disabilities

canada.gc.ca
BreadcrumbHome >People with Disabilities
Starting a Business - For People with Disabilities

Opportunities Fund for Persons with Disabilities
The Opportunities Fund for Persons with Disabilities provides funding for national, regional and local projects that assist people with disabilities in preparing for and finding employment or self-employment, as well as acquiring the skills necessary to maintain that new employment.
Disability Vocational Rehabilitation Program
The Disability Vocational Rehabilitation Program offers vocational counselling, financial support for training, and job search services to recipients of Canada Pension Plan (CPP) Disability Benefits to help return to work.
Entrepreneurs with Disabilities Program
The Entrepreneurs with Disabilities Program provides services to entrepreneurs with disabilities who live in western Canadian communities and who are seeking to start up or expand a small or medium-sized business.
Other programs and services:

Business Development Program
The Business Development Program provides unsecured and interest-free loans to small and medium-sized businesses in Atlantic Canada to help them carry out start-up and expansion activities.
Community Futures Loan Program
Throughout Western Canada the locally run, non-profit, Community Futures organizations have achieved outstanding success by integrating the social and economic needs of their communities. A wide range of services and financing opportunities are available to small businesses and entrepreneurs at the local Community Futures offices.
Financing for starting a business
Business Development Bank of Canada's helps entrepreneurs start up new businesses by providing them with long-term loans as well as consulting services and advice.
Francophone Economic Development Organizations
Francophone Economic Development Organizations provide services to francophone entrepreneurs who are seeking to start up or expand small and medium-sized businesses in western Canada.
Seed Capital Initiative
The Seed Capital Initiative provides repayable, unsecured loans to start, expand or improve a small business.
Training and Employment Initiatives
Human Resources and Skills Development Canada provides individuals who are eligible for Employment Insurance with income and entrepreneurial support while they develop and implement their business plan.
Women's Enterprise Initiative
The Women’s Enterprise Initiative provide services to women entrepreneurs who are seeking to start up or expand small and medium-sized businesses in Western Canada.
Women in Business Initiative
The Women in Business Initiative provides financial support, information and advice to women entrepreneurs in Atlantic Canada to help them develop their businesses and increase their competitiveness.

lots of programs and hard to get unless know someone

 

[Sal]

if you left that many resumes you would get calls

I used to be in the job placement industry. It simply isn't true in Ontario so perhaps where you live it is true. I also hired for years and years so perhaps you could expound on why you believe your statement to be true because from my personal experience, it is not but I am open to the possibility if you can show me how this would be successful.

you have some skill sets and the exposure will let the compony consider you for future jobs

Really? I don't think you have an understanding of how an HR works in a corporate environment.

it works in practice

Okay, where and how?

there is not a zillion on the welfare role

there would be more savings if monitered properly than not doing anything

Fair enough, but you should know it is currently monitered so if you say it works, where is it already implemented and working?

 

[china]

If you're not up for intelligent discourse, be abusive - right? Seems you're still bitter because someone in Canada's government said NO to your brand of fertilizer. Get over it and you can live too....

Hhahahahahaahahha , What do you smoke LW ,it's probably "Made in China ".hahahaahhAHAH

 

[L Gilbert]

Just a response to Gerry's contention- " let's penalize those that have fallen on hard times or have made a mistake in the past by giving more to someone that may have just been lucky."

Yeah, I got that, I just didn't understand the reply you gave him; which is why I said I didn't understand that one comment.

Some poor SOB that gets hurt on the job qualifies as "unlucky" in my definition, yet you would deny the poor bugger the $1K cash at retirement. Or the dude that collects a couple weeks of UI just because he got laid-off because of mismanagement on the part of the company (or whatever reason) and had to get another job.
IOW, your solution isn't very well thought out.

 

[lone wolf]

Hhahahahahaahahha , What do you smoke LW ,it's probably "Made in China ".hahahaahhAHAH

What's it to you? You wouldn't be invited to partake of my reserve brand anyhow.

Careful ... there are archives where your whine can be found....

Hhahahahahaahahha

 

[JLM]

Yeah, I got that, I just didn't understand the reply you gave him; which is why I said I didn't understand that one comment.

Some poor SOB that gets hurt on the job qualifies as "unlucky" in my definition, yet you would deny the poor bugger the $1K cash at retirement. Or the dude that collects a couple weeks of UI just because he got laid-off because of mismanagement on the part of the company (or whatever reason) and had to get another job.
IOW, your solution isn't very well thought out.

Hey, Gil I hear you, what I suggested is the "rough draft", I don't expect the finished product to turn out just as I suggested. I drew the line at the extreme.