The Flotilla....IDF Actions Validated!

[Goober]

As I have pointed out, Israel can only legal block arms from entering Gaza. They can stop ships destined for Gaza and search for contraband. Israel's legal arms blockade doesn't extend to looting people's credit cards and then using them to buy beer.

Every time you get slammed with facts you then resort to bogus claims- Link please that the IDF used these funds- cards etc. for beer.
If not a retraction is required due to your constant and deliberate violations of Forum Rules.

So I refer you to Rule number 1 - I bolded & underlined the parts that apply to your post for ease of reading and to lock the door on a possible out as you often resort to. My oh my I am enjoying being a nice guy.

1. Not to post any material that you know, or in our judgment ought to know, is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, hateful, harassing,obscene, profane, threatening, invasive of personal privacy, or in violation of Canadian law;

 

[earth_as_one]

Correct- You are not an expert- You make claims and innuendo. And I am now an apologist- What category would you fall into.

Ships can be boarded in International waters if they are under sanctions from the UN- Or undertaking to break a legal Blockade. And force can be used when required. Again the Law.

Again you should update yourself on the Law.

These civilians have recourse under Israeli Law- The only one that applies for the return of their property.

Please read the below - Inform yourself. Also ask the question - Why did these criminals not pursue thru the Israeli Courts for the return of their possessions- I can hazard a guess- Pure and single hatred for Israel. Recall what the IHH is and has been accused of by different Govt's.
The Israeli Supreme Court is one of the only judiciaries in the world that allows non-citizens to petition against acts of the state and the military. For example, in 2004 the court ruled in favor of Palestinian claimants who argued that a security barrier around North Jerusalem would disrupt the*"fabric of life"for residents of the West Bank.


German court affirms Turkish IHH ban bec... JPost - International

Leipzig’s Federal Administrative Court finds that Frankfurt-based Foundation for Human Rights and Freedoms and Humanitarian Relief donated money to terror group.
BERLIN – A federal court in Germany upheld the Interior Ministry’s ban on the Frankfurt-based Foundation for Human Rights and Freedoms and Humanitarian Relief (IHH) because the Turkish NGO contributed funds to Hamas.

Hamas is recognized by the European Union, Israel and the United States as a “terrorist organization” and Leipzig’s Federal Administrative Court found that the IHH donated money to the group.

The NGO challenged the decision of Germany’s former interior minister Thomas de Maizieres, who outlawed the IHH in July 2010. He said at the time that the IHH “fights against Israel’s right to exist.”

I guess I should just requote the UN report:

The Mission is satisfied that much of the force used by the Israeli soldiers on board the Mavi Marmara and from the helicopters was unnecessary, disproportionate, excessive and inappropriate and resulted in the wholly avoidable killing and maiming of a large number of civilian passengers. On the basis of the forensic and firearm evidence, at least six of the killings can be characterized as extra-legal, arbitrary and summary executions. As such, the conduct of the Israeli forces amounted to violations of the right to life and of the right to physical integrity, as stipulated in articles 6 and 7 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.


Also here is a statement by lawyers representing the activists:

...on behalf of the main organizers of the six-vessel Gaza flotilla carrying approximately 700 human rights activists, journalists, members of parliament and other civilians and crew, the Freedom Flotilla coalition calls on all governments to comply with their duties under article 1 of the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949 and take the following action due to Israel’s theft of the property of those participating in the flotilla. We call on all governments to join us in urgently demanding that Israel:

immediately relinquishes control of all the property seized on 31 May 2010 during its illegal boarding of our ships.

releases the property that constitutes evidence and send all those items of property seized on the six boats on 31 May 2010, to the UN by June 30, 2010, including all cameras, mobile phones, laptops and recording devices which recorded the events aboard the six ships.

releases the remainder of the property (including clothes, credit cards and hard currency) to its rightful owners.

account for every stolen credit card or mobile or satellite telephone usage, which, if true, appears to have turned acts of illegal appropriation of property into straightforward pillage.

We also call on all governments to urgently demand from Israel that:

It will preserve all evidence in its possession in its original form (i.e. computer disks, hard-drives, SIM cards, memory cards, as well as any other physical evidence which could be considered relevant to any investigations) for handing over to the independent, impartial investigation ordered by the Security Council and/or UN Fact Finding Mission ordered by the Human Rights Council and in anticipation of the opening of criminal investigations.
It confirms that none of the film and photographic evidence seized on 31 May 2010 has in fact been destroyed and that it will not do so and to account for every single destroyed or disappeared item...
Freegaza - Flotilla Passengers to Israeli Government:

Also, as far as I know, not a single activist or reporter in the Freedom Flotilla was ever charged with a crime related to this incident. Attempting to label the Freedom Flotilla activists and reporters accompanying them as criminals is therefore erroneous. Calling them terrorists would require that they participated in something related to terrorism... Since the Freedom Flotilla's cargo was only food, medicine and other humanitarian supplies (items that Israel cannot legally block according to the UN report), while the reporters were only armed with video recording equipment ... they aren't terrorists either.

The main difference between us is that I won't defend attacks against civilians by anyone, while you will defend any crime committed by an Israeli, including using stolen credit cards to buy beer. I support universal human rights, freedom and justice. I oppose the criminals on both sides. You support any form of oppression or injustice committed by criminals on the Israeli side. That's why I believe you are an Israeli apologist. Personally I think its sad that you've been reduced to defending people who looted people of their money, jewelry and credit cards at gun point and then used those credit cards to buy beer.

BTW, Unlike you, the Israeli military has stated that they would consider it to be a serious crime if its proven that a member of the IDF used a stolen credit card to buy beer.

Manolo Luppichini of the Italian TV station RAI 3 said his credit card was used to make purchases after it was confiscated by the Israeli army. "They took two cameras, microphones, a stand and other equipment from me and my photographer," he said. "They took one of the cameras as I was taking photographs. Afterwards they took my wallet, passport, bag and all personal effects on the boat."

After he was deported, he discovered that purchases had been made with his confiscated credit card, both while he was being held in the Beer Sheva detention centre and after his return to Italy.

"One purchase was from a vending machine in Tel Aviv for about 10 shekels on 2 June," he said. Another purchase, for 240 shekels, was made in Gedera when Luppichini was back in the Italian city of Bologna. "The sums were not large," he said. "But in principle it is theft, for all intents and purposes."

Luppichini has written to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, President Shimon Peres, the foreign and defence ministers and to Israel's ambassador in Italy asking how his credit card came to be used in this manner and requesting the immediate return of all of his equipment.

The Israel Defence Forces spokesman issued a statement saying that, with the exception of "magnetic media," which was retained for security reasons, the personal belongings of all the people aboard the flotilla were put on the Turkish planes in which they were deported. The IDF was considering whether the "magnetic media" would be returned, he added.

As regards Luppichini's credit card, he said the foreign ministry and police were investigating. If it was established that it was stolen, "the matter will be dealt with severely," he said.
UNHCR | Refworld | Journalists on intercepted flotilla still awaiting return of confiscated equipment

That last bolded statement proves that at least some members of the IDF will recognize that using a stolen credit card to buy beer is a crime... even if the thief is a member of the IDF. Therefore I wouldn't label the IDF spokesperson who made that statement an "Israeli apologist". The IDF spokesperson who made that statement knows a crime is defined by the action, rather than the person who committed it...

As far as I can determine, no crime exists which is too outrageous that you can't ignore, provided it was committed by an Israeli. That's why you are an Israeli apologist.

 

[Goober]

I guess I should just requote the UN report:

The Mission is satisfied that much of the force used by the Israeli soldiers on board the Mavi Marmara and from the helicopters was unnecessary, disproportionate, excessive and inappropriate and resulted in the wholly avoidable killing and maiming of a large number of civilian passengers. On the basis of the forensic and firearm evidence, at least six of the killings can be characterized as extra-legal, arbitrary and summary executions. As such, the conduct of the Israeli forces amounted to violations of the right to life and of the right to physical integrity, as stipulated in articles 6 and 7 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.


Also here is a statement by lawyers representing the activists:

...on behalf of the main organizers of the six-vessel Gaza flotilla carrying approximately 700 human rights activists, journalists, members of parliament and other civilians and crew, the Freedom Flotilla coalition calls on all governments to comply with their duties under article 1 of the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949 and take the following action due to Israel’s theft of the property of those participating in the flotilla. We call on all governments to join us in urgently demanding that Israel:

immediately relinquishes control of all the property seized on 31 May 2010 during its illegal boarding of our ships.

releases the property that constitutes evidence and send all those items of property seized on the six boats on 31 May 2010, to the UN by June 30, 2010, including all cameras, mobile phones, laptops and recording devices which recorded the events aboard the six ships.

releases the remainder of the property (including clothes, credit cards and hard currency) to its rightful owners.

account for every stolen credit card or mobile or satellite telephone usage, which, if true, appears to have turned acts of illegal appropriation of property into straightforward pillage.

We also call on all governments to urgently demand from Israel that:

It will preserve all evidence in its possession in its original form (i.e. computer disks, hard-drives, SIM cards, memory cards, as well as any other physical evidence which could be considered relevant to any investigations) for handing over to the independent, impartial investigation ordered by the Security Council and/or UN Fact Finding Mission ordered by the Human Rights Council and in anticipation of the opening of criminal investigations.
It confirms that none of the film and photographic evidence seized on 31 May 2010 has in fact been destroyed and that it will not do so and to account for every single destroyed or disappeared item...
Freegaza - Flotilla Passengers to Israeli Government:

Also, as far as I know, not a single activist or reporter in the Freedom Flotilla was ever charged with a crime related to this incident. Attempting to label the Freedom Flotilla activists and reporters accompanying them as criminals is therefore erroneous. Calling them terrorists would require that they participated in something related to terrorism... Since the Freedom Flotilla's cargo was only food, medicine and other humanitarian supplies (items that Israel cannot legally block according to the UN report), while the reporters were only armed with video recording equipment ... they aren't terrorists either.

The main difference between us is that I won't defend attacks against civilians by anyone, while you will defend any crime committed by an Israeli, including using stolen credit cards to buy beer. I support universal human rights, freedom and justice. I oppose the criminals on both sides. You support any form of oppression or injustice committed by criminals on the Israeli side. That's why I believe you are an Israeli apologist. Personally I think its sad that you've been reduced to defending people who looted people of their money, jewelry and credit cards at gun point and then used those credit cards to buy beer.

BTW, Unlike you, the Israeli military has stated that they would consider it to be a serious crime if its proven that a member of the IDF used a stolen credit card to buy beer.

Manolo Luppichini of the Italian TV station RAI 3 said his credit card was used to make purchases after it was confiscated by the Israeli army. "They took two cameras, microphones, a stand and other equipment from me and my photographer," he said. "They took one of the cameras as I was taking photographs. Afterwards they took my wallet, passport, bag and all personal effects on the boat."

After he was deported, he discovered that purchases had been made with his confiscated credit card, both while he was being held in the Beer Sheva detention centre and after his return to Italy.

"One purchase was from a vending machine in Tel Aviv for about 10 shekels on 2 June," he said. Another purchase, for 240 shekels, was made in Gedera when Luppichini was back in the Italian city of Bologna. "The sums were not large," he said. "But in principle it is theft, for all intents and purposes."

Luppichini has written to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, President Shimon Peres, the foreign and defence ministers and to Israel's ambassador in Italy asking how his credit card came to be used in this manner and requesting the immediate return of all of his equipment.

The Israel Defence Forces spokesman issued a statement saying that, with the exception of "magnetic media," which was retained for security reasons, the personal belongings of all the people aboard the flotilla were put on the Turkish planes in which they were deported. The IDF was considering whether the "magnetic media" would be returned, he added.

As regards Luppichini's credit card, he said the foreign ministry and police were investigating. If it was established that it was stolen, "the matter will be dealt with severely," he said.
UNHCR | Refworld | Journalists on intercepted flotilla still awaiting return of confiscated equipment

That last bolded statement proves that at least some members of the IDF will recognize that using a stolen credit card to buy beer is a crime... even if the thief is a member of the IDF. Therefore I wouldn't label the IDF spokesperson who made that statement an "Israeli apologist". The IDF spokesperson who made that statement knows a crime is defined by the action, rather than the person who committed it...

As far as I can determine, no crime exists which is too outrageous that you can't ignore, provided it was committed by an Israeli. That's why you are an Israeli apologist.

Every time you get slammed with facts you then resort to bogus claims- Link please that the IDF used these funds- cards etc. for beer.
If not a retraction is required due to your constant and deliberate violations of Forum Rules.

So I refer you to Rule number 1 - I bolded & underlined the parts that apply to your post for ease of reading and to lock the door on a possible out as you often resort to. My oh my I am enjoying being a nice guy.

Now you are slandering me. I suggest you retract the portion in large font post. No proof- Then you are in violation of Forum Rules-

1. Not to post any material that you know, or in our judgment ought to know, is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, hateful, harassing,obscene, profane, threatening, invasive of personal privacy, or in violation of Canadian law;
[/SIZE][/U][/B]

 

[earth_as_one]

Every time you get slammed with facts you then resort to bogus claims- Link please that the IDF used these funds- cards etc. for beer.
If not a retraction is required due to your constant and deliberate violations of Forum Rules.

So I refer you to Rule number 1 - I bolded & underlined the parts that apply to your post for ease of reading and to lock the door on a possible out as you often resort to. My oh my I am enjoying being a nice guy.

1. Not to post any material that you know, or in our judgment ought to know, is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, hateful, harassing,obscene, profane, threatening, invasive of personal privacy, or in violation of Canadian law;

Read it and weep:
Gaza convoy activists claim Israeli soldiers using debit cards stolen in raid | World news | The Guardian

A spokeswoman for the Israeli embassy in London advised Musaji to register a formal complaint.
"We regard any misconduct as described in Mr Musaji's allegations to be utterly unacceptable and intolerable, and suggest waiting until this subject matter is clarified," she said. "As had happened previously, an Israeli soldier was found guilty of illegal use of a credit card for which he was indicted and sentenced to seven months' imprisonment."

Check out 1 minute and 50 seconds into this video and you can see a bank statement showing fraudulent use of an IDF confiscated credit card.

In this case I agree with the spokeswoman from the Israeli Embassy in London. Neither she nor I will defend an IDF soldier using a stolen credit card to buy beer...

As far as I can determine, no crime exists which is too outrageous that you can't ignore, provided it was committed by an Israeli. That's why you are an Israeli apologist.

 

[Goober]

I guess I should just requote the UN report:

The Mission is satisfied that much of the force used by the Israeli soldiers on board the Mavi Marmara and from the helicopters was unnecessary, disproportionate, excessive and inappropriate and resulted in the wholly avoidable killing and maiming of a large number of civilian passengers. On the basis of the forensic and firearm evidence, at least six of the killings can be characterized as extra-legal, arbitrary and summary executions. As such, the conduct of the Israeli forces amounted to violations of the right to life and of the right to physical integrity, as stipulated in articles 6 and 7 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.


Also here is a statement by lawyers representing the activists:

...on behalf of the main organizers of the six-vessel Gaza flotilla carrying approximately 700 human rights activists, journalists, members of parliament and other civilians and crew, the Freedom Flotilla coalition calls on all governments to comply with their duties under article 1 of the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949 and take the following action due to Israel’s theft of the property of those participating in the flotilla. We call on all governments to join us in urgently demanding that Israel:

immediately relinquishes control of all the property seized on 31 May 2010 during its illegal boarding of our ships.

releases the property that constitutes evidence and send all those items of property seized on the six boats on 31 May 2010, to the UN by June 30, 2010, including all cameras, mobile phones, laptops and recording devices which recorded the events aboard the six ships.

releases the remainder of the property (including clothes, credit cards and hard currency) to its rightful owners.

account for every stolen credit card or mobile or satellite telephone usage, which, if true, appears to have turned acts of illegal appropriation of property into straightforward pillage.

We also call on all governments to urgently demand from Israel that:

It will preserve all evidence in its possession in its original form (i.e. computer disks, hard-drives, SIM cards, memory cards, as well as any other physical evidence which could be considered relevant to any investigations) for handing over to the independent, impartial investigation ordered by the Security Council and/or UN Fact Finding Mission ordered by the Human Rights Council and in anticipation of the opening of criminal investigations.
It confirms that none of the film and photographic evidence seized on 31 May 2010 has in fact been destroyed and that it will not do so and to account for every single destroyed or disappeared item...
Freegaza - Flotilla Passengers to Israeli Government:

Also, as far as I know, not a single activist or reporter in the Freedom Flotilla was ever charged with a crime related to this incident. Attempting to label the Freedom Flotilla activists and reporters accompanying them as criminals is therefore erroneous. Calling them terrorists would require that they participated in something related to terrorism... Since the Freedom Flotilla's cargo was only food, medicine and other humanitarian supplies (items that Israel cannot legally block according to the UN report), while the reporters were only armed with video recording equipment ... they aren't terrorists either.

The main difference between us is that I won't defend attacks against civilians by anyone, while you will defend any crime committed by an Israeli, including using stolen credit cards to buy beer. I support universal human rights, freedom and justice. I oppose the criminals on both sides. You support any form of oppression or injustice committed by criminals on the Israeli side. That's why I believe you are an Israeli apologist. Personally I think its sad that you've been reduced to defending people who looted people of their money, jewelry and credit cards at gun point and then used those credit cards to buy beer.

BTW, Unlike you, the Israeli military has stated that they would consider it to be a serious crime if its proven that a member of the IDF used a stolen credit card to buy beer.

Manolo Luppichini of the Italian TV station RAI 3 said his credit card was used to make purchases after it was confiscated by the Israeli army. "They took two cameras, microphones, a stand and other equipment from me and my photographer," he said. "They took one of the cameras as I was taking photographs. Afterwards they took my wallet, passport, bag and all personal effects on the boat."

After he was deported, he discovered that purchases had been made with his confiscated credit card, both while he was being held in the Beer Sheva detention centre and after his return to Italy.

"One purchase was from a vending machine in Tel Aviv for about 10 shekels on 2 June," he said. Another purchase, for 240 shekels, was made in Gedera when Luppichini was back in the Italian city of Bologna. "The sums were not large," he said. "But in principle it is theft, for all intents and purposes."

Luppichini has written to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, President Shimon Peres, the foreign and defence ministers and to Israel's ambassador in Italy asking how his credit card came to be used in this manner and requesting the immediate return of all of his equipment.

The Israel Defence Forces spokesman issued a statement saying that, with the exception of "magnetic media," which was retained for security reasons, the personal belongings of all the people aboard the flotilla were put on the Turkish planes in which they were deported. The IDF was considering whether the "magnetic media" would be returned, he added.

As regards Luppichini's credit card, he said the foreign ministry and police were investigating. If it was established that it was stolen, "the matter will be dealt with severely," he said.
UNHCR | Refworld | Journalists on intercepted flotilla still awaiting return of confiscated equipment

That last bolded statement proves that at least some members of the IDF will recognize that using a stolen credit card to buy beer is a crime... even if the thief is a member of the IDF. Therefore I wouldn't label the IDF spokesperson who made that statement an "Israeli apologist". The IDF spokesperson who made that statement knows a crime is defined by the action, rather than the person who committed it...

As far as I can determine, no crime exists which is too outrageous that you can't ignore, provided it was committed by an Israeli. That's why you are an Israeli apologist.

So he filed a claim- wrong country - did it happen where he resides - possible- Now a copy of the Police report and what they did. Were charges filed. Then your link is nothing.

Now accusing me of accepting any crimes committed by Israel includes Genocide. A retraction is in order. Either retract or prove it.

Read it and weep:
Gaza convoy activists claim Israeli soldiers using debit cards stolen in raid | World news | The Guardian

A spokeswoman for the Israeli embassy in London advised Musaji to register a formal complaint.
"We regard any misconduct as described in Mr Musaji's allegations to be utterly unacceptable and intolerable, and suggest waiting until this subject matter is clarified," she said. "As had happened previously, an Israeli soldier was found guilty of illegal use of a credit card for which he was indicted and sentenced to seven months' imprisonment."

Check out 1 minute and 50 seconds into this video and you can see a bank statement showing fraudulent use of an IDF confiscated credit card.
Israelis Looted Flotilla Equipment,Cash,Used Activist Credit Card To Buy Beer - YouTube

In this case I agree with the spokeswoman from the Israeli Embassy in London. Neither she nor I will defend an IDF soldier using a stolen credit card to buy beer...

As far as I can determine, no crime exists which is too outrageous that you can't ignore, provided it was committed by an Israeli. That's why you are an Israeli apologist.

Either retract your statement with and apology, prove it or I will pursue this.

 

[earth_as_one]

So he filed a claim- wrong country - did it happen where he resides - possible- Now a copy of the Police report and what they did. Were charges filed. Then your link is nothing.

Now accusing me of accepting any crimes committed by Israel includes Genocide. A retraction is in order. Either retract or prove it.



Either retract your statement with and apology, prove it or I will pursue this.

All I claim is that some reporters and activists were unnecessarily roughed up and possible that a few were executed.

I have no doubt that they lost most of their personal belongings including money, jewelry and credit cards. Some IDF soldiers are thieves. The IDF has no trouble condemning IDF soldiers who steal... but you apparently need a Police report before the evidence becomes shifted slightly toward the possibility that some IDF soldiers aren't saints. I consider taking money and jewelry at gunpoint to be armed robbery.

Israeli apologist is a deliberate propaganda term though. So I admit you got me on that. I apologize...

 

[CDNBear]

Also to cut off the old fall back of Israeli apologists I have nothing against Israel or the IDF.

Ummm...

While Palestinians have neither, this area will remain a war zone. Eventually cruelty, injustice and oppression will lead to Israel's ruin.

Ya...

As a matter of fact the UN report states that most of the IDF actions that day were illegal.

Allegedly.

The only legal acts were related Israel's enforcement of their legal arms blockade...

And boarding boats that refused to heave to and be legally boarded.

... which in the case of the Freedom Flotilla, didn't apply, as they weren't moving any arms to Gaza.

Irrelevant, there are legal channels that still have to be followed to move materials of any kind through a legal blockade.

Trying to run a legal military blockade, is actionable by military strike.

The Freedom Flotilla's cargo was 100% humanitarian aid in the form of food and medical supplies. Not a single gun, rocket or arm of any kind.

Irrelevant. The law is clear.

The fact is that in international waters, international law applies. I agree with the UN. Israel has a legal right to block arms from entering Gaza. I agree that Israel has a legal right to search any ships with a Gaza destination for arms. I disagree with you that money, jewelry and credit cards are contraband.

You disagree with what?

Can you show me...

1, Where he said they were contraband?
2, Where it's been proven this took place?

I'm no expert...

That's obvious.

But tell you what... Please argue your case that forcing people to hand over their money, credit cards and jewelry at gun point is connected Israel's legitimate defense and not piracy.

First you have to show that it actually happened.

According to this video (which provides supporting evidence in the form of bank statements) show that after the IDF soldier killed the activists, some of them celebrated the massacre by using stolen credit cards to buy beer:
ISRAELI PIRATES STEAL $3 MILLION FROM GAZA FLOTILLA AND USED CREDIT CARDS TO BUY ALCOHOL - YouTube

Interesting, you are sure Israel is guilty of piracy, but made no mention of the fact that Israel has stated that most of the goods and cash have been sent back to the IHH, or sent to check points, waiting to be transfered into Gaza.

Why is it the only part of that video, and the only claims bandied about, that you believe, are the ones that demonize Israel?

The video also says that a few laptops and cell phones were returned. So I retract my former retractions. The IDF kept 99.9% of the personal property they illegally confiscated, not 100%.

Is it common practice to return property seized from criminals, in the act of committing a crime, be returned, before the end of the investigation?

I can assure you, even in a simple case of a charge of "Weapons Dangerous" here in Canada, involving one person. It can take up to three years to get your personal property back, upon acquittal.

The wheels of justice do not move at light speed.

I support universal freedom and justice.

Your posts would indicate that the latter is a lie.

 

[Goober]

All I claim is that some reporters and activists were unnecessarily roughed up and possible that a few were executed.

I have no doubt that they lost most of their personal belongings including money, jewelry and credit cards. Some IDF soldiers are thieves. The IDF has no trouble condemning IDF soldiers who steal... but you apparently need a Police report before the evidence becomes shifted slightly toward the possibility that some IDF soldiers aren't saints. I consider taking money and jewelry at gunpoint to be armed robbery.

Israeli apologist is a deliberate propaganda term though. So I admit you got me on that. I apologize...

As far as I can determine, no crime exists which is too outrageous that you can't ignore, provided it was committed by an Israeli. That's why you are an Israeli apologist.

This is what I requested.

Now accusing me of accepting any crimes committed by Israel includes Genocide. A retraction is in order. Either retract or prove it.

Your post dances around the issue.

So I expect a retraction and an apology - Adding in reasons for this, that and whatever, detract from what I requested.

Apologies and retractions are unequivocal. Simple, concise, clear and stating that you will not be accusing me of such inhumanity in future posts. Those are the components of an apology.

I do give you some credit for your post but it does not satisfy what I requested.

Thank you

 

[earth_as_one]

Sure I'll retract what I said and offer an apology. I admit that I crossed a line and you are right to call me on it.

 

[Goober]

Sure I'll retract what I said and offer an apology. I admit that I crossed a line and you are right to call me on it.

Thank you I appreciate that.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

Boy this flotilla thread sure has got some legs eh.

 

[Goober]

Boy this flotilla thread sure has got some legs eh.

It is still sailing.

 

[earth_as_one]

This thread proves that most Canadians only know the Israeli version of events. Most Canadians remain unaware of the UN report which made these determinations:

IDF culpability:
-some lethal wounds suffered by activists on the Mavi Marmara were consistent with execution style killings
-the IDF acted recklessly with live fire and needlessly endangered people's lives.
-many activists on the Mavi Marmara and other vessels in the flotilla were unnecessarily abused and beaten including those who acted non-violently.
-the IDF illegally confiscated millions of dollars in personal property, including jewelry, credit cards and money
-the IDF illegally interfered with the right of reporters to report the news by confiscating their video/photographic equipment and media.

Activist culpability
-Activists on the Mavi Marmara deliberately created a situation where the IDF's use of lethal force was justified.... up until the activists were subdued...
-Activists on other vessels in the flotilla acted in ways that recklessly endangered the lives of the IDF soldiers.

Reference UN Report:
A/HRC/15/21 of 27 September 2010

Most Canadians remain unaware that the Freedom Flotilla did not transport anything which could be legally blocked by Israel. The Flotilla did have humanitarian food and medical aid which Israel illegally blocks. I agree that the Israel has the right to inspect all cargo entering Gaza for contraband (arms). I do not agree that Israel can interfere with the delivery of food, medicine and other humanitarian aid.

According to my research, activists can prove that some of their illegally confiscated credit cards were stolen and used illegally. Most likely some IDF soldiers used them to buy beer and other personal items. The Israeli government and the IDF authorities have stated that the activists are free to pursue their claims and if proven true will take action.

 

[darkbeaver]

Of course when zionists instruct, educate, inform ,entertain, activate and politically serve the Canadian mass what other general understanding can there be. Israel is now and always has been at war with the normal world.

 

[TenPenny]

According to my research, activists can prove that some of their illegally confiscated credit cards were stolen and used illegally. Most likely some IDF soldiers used them to buy beer and other personal items. The Israeli government and the IDF authorities have stated that the activists are free to pursue their claims and if proven true will take action.
.

Why would they need to steal credit cards, I thought they controlled all of the world's banks?

 

[earth_as_one]

IDF soldiers control all of the world's banks?
Link please...

 

[TenPenny]

You mean they're NOT part of the vast Zionist conspiracy that controls the banks as well as the media worldwide?

 

[Goober]

This thread proves that most Canadians only know the Israeli version of events. Most Canadians remain unaware of the UN report which made these determinations:

IDF culpability:
-some lethal wounds suffered by activists on the Mavi Marmara were consistent with execution style killings
-the IDF acted recklessly with live fire and needlessly endangered people's lives.
-many activists on the Mavi Marmara and other vessels in the flotilla were unnecessarily abused and beaten including those who acted non-violently.
-the IDF illegally confiscated millions of dollars in personal property, including jewelry, credit cards and money
-the IDF illegally interfered with the right of reporters to report the news by confiscating their video/photographic equipment and media.

Activist culpability
-Activists on the Mavi Marmara deliberately created a situation where the IDF's use of lethal force was justified.... up until the activists were subdued...
-Activists on other vessels in the flotilla acted in ways that recklessly endangered the lives of the IDF soldiers.

Reference UN Report:
A/HRC/15/21 of 27 September 2010

Most Canadians remain unaware that the Freedom Flotilla did not transport anything which could be legally blocked by Israel. The Flotilla did have humanitarian food and medical aid which Israel illegally blocks. I agree that the Israel has the right to inspect all cargo entering Gaza for contraband (arms). I do not agree that Israel can interfere with the delivery of food, medicine and other humanitarian aid.

According to my research, activists can prove that some of their illegally confiscated credit cards were stolen and used illegally. Most likely some IDF soldiers used them to buy beer and other personal items. The Israeli government and the IDF authorities have stated that the activists are free to pursue their claims and if proven true will take action.

Everything on board as cargo was legal shall we say- except they did not go thru Israeli ports- Thus breaking International Law. So you keep on defending those criminals.

 

[earth_as_one]

You mean they're NOT part of the vast Zionist conspiracy that controls the banks as well as the media worldwide?

I don't believe this and I've never claimed such nonsense. If you believe this I suggest you post a link backing up your viewpoint, so I can tear it to shreds.

The fact is the MSM in the US (UK, Australia and Canada) has a provable pro-Israel bias.
Analysis of Coverage of Israel/Palestine in Media

If you want to see it in action, watch this video:
Galloway shatters Israeli propaganda - YouTube
(Hilarious if you like watching someone get their ass wiped in a debate)

If you want to know how our media has become so slanted in favor of Israel, I suggest you watch this video:
Peace, Propaganda & The Promised Land {Part 1} - YouTube
and
Peace, Propaganda & The Promised Land { Part 2 } - YouTube

 

[Goober]

I don't believe this and I've never claimed such nonsense. If you believe this I suggest you post a link backing up your viewpoint, so I can tear it to shreds.

The fact is the MSM in the US (UK, Australia and Canada) has a provable pro-Israel bias.
Analysis of Coverage of Israel/Palestine in Media

So a provable bias -You should provide facts not just innuendo, claims or video links. Patiently waiting for a number of independent links- not just one or 4 - and independent is critical to proving your claim.