Mulcair predicts demise of Northern Gateway pipeline project

[taxslave]

To start with, the seat projections look generous for those other than the NDP
If you look at the vote split it could be a lot different. Voter intentions in a multi
party election, meaning more than two, it could be a huge victory for the NDP.
I do not want the Northern Gateway Pipeline either because I do not want ships
hauling oil to Asia, especially if they are not double hulled ships.
Most BC residents may want the terminal but the majority do not want the ships
on the coast full of oil.
I would not be as opposed if the pipeline went to the port of Vancouver, except
I don't want oil going to Asia.
Mulcair is playing to the growing voices of opposition to pipelines shipping oil
south or to Asia, its a signal that Canadians are becoming much more Canada
first lately.
Call him what you will it the political game.

SO you would rather we continue to blindly continue to be a source of resources just for the US and be at the whim of that somewhat fickle market?
I prefer to have the option of selling anything over our domestic needs to the highest bidder.

 

[mentalfloss]

I think our export business is important, but it shouldn't be handled by a company with such an awful track record.

 

[JLM]

I predict the demise of the NDP as a serious political party.



Slick Dix is NOT the Premier therefore what he says is irrelevant.



NO no no. We MAKE rainbows on the wet coast. This pipeline is to ship them to the middle east where all they got is oil. Pot is easier to ship in bulk carriers from the farm to the store and cut out the middleman in the distribution center.

When people quit nit picking individual improprieties committed by individual MLAs/MPs and decide which party is going to benefit us most over the long haul.

 

[taxslave]

I think our export business is important, but it shouldn't be handled by a company with such an awful track record.

Let them build the pipeline. Fine them right out of existence for screw ups and then put control of the line up for tender. With a substantial bond of course.
This is also my view on companies that are in constant violation of safety rules. Fine them into bankruptcy including the owners so the rest of us can compete.

 

[petros]

I think our export business is important, but it shouldn't be handled by a company with such an awful track record.

What did it say in the article about US regs? Slack! Are we in the US? Did Enbridge abuse US law for 40 some years? Is this a new line built before or after man first went to the moon? Before? Would you go to the moon in the Apollo or woud you prefer to ride to space with todays tech?

 

[beaker]

Let them build the pipeline. Fine them right out of existence for screw ups and then put control of the line up for tender. With a substantial bond of course.
This is also my view on companies that are in constant violation of safety rules. Fine them into bankruptcy including the owners so the rest of us can compete.

Don't let them build the pipeline. Our resources (including the money) would be better used not building a project that will tie us into selling oil sands oil to countries that would also be better off if they get away from dirty fossil fuel. The money, and the time and effort (put into a project that will pollute the air, the ocean, and the right of way, and streams along the pipeline route) if put into solar, wind, geothermal, conservation and efficiency would meet our energy needs, our employment needs, and our ecological needs better and for a longer time frame.

 

[taxslave]

Don't let them build the pipeline. Our resources (including the money) would be better used not building a project that will tie us into selling oil sands oil to countries that would also be better off if they get away from dirty fossil fuel. The money, and the time and effort (put into a project that will pollute the air, the ocean, and the right of way, and streams along the pipeline route) if put into solar, wind, geothermal, conservation and efficiency would meet our energy needs, our employment needs, and our ecological needs better and for a longer time frame.

You need a reality check.. We sell oil and coal. We have very few solar systems or windmills to export.

 

[beaker]

You need a reality check.. We sell oil and coal. We have very few solar systems or windmills to export.

What I was saying though is that our solar equipment, windmills, geothermal and conservation/efficiency technologies and capacities can be developed instead of new coal ports and oil sands pipelines. Then we have those new energies and technologies to export forever. Plus we then have the benefit of using those old fuels as and when we really need them and as we develop sensible ways of using and gathering them.

 

[petros]

What I was saying though is that our solar equipment, windmills, geothermal and conservation/efficiency technologies and capacities can be developed instead of new coal ports and oil sands pipelines

Are we keeping all our other oil and only exporting from oil sands?

 

[JLM]

Don't let them build the pipeline. Our resources (including the money) would be better used not building a project that will tie us into selling oil sands oil to countries that would also be better off if they get away from dirty fossil fuel. The money, and the time and effort (put into a project that will pollute the air, the ocean, and the right of way, and streams along the pipeline route) if put into solar, wind, geothermal, conservation and efficiency would meet our energy needs, our employment needs, and our ecological needs better and for a longer time frame.

While I'm all for solar, wind, wave and nuclear energy, while we have the automobile the use of fossil fuels is a fact for at least another 25 years. If we can turn something that is "dirty" into something that is useful and profitable, that is a bonus. There is no valid reason why we can't send something down a pipe without polluting anything. Sure mistakes have been made through laziness, inattentiteness or plain not giving a sh*t, there is no reason (with proper monitoring and huge fines) this bullsh*t has to continue. Shipping oil should be limited to double hulled ships and sober captains........................no exceptions. Maybe a breathalyser has to be employed at the start of every shift................whatever it takes!

 

[petros]

Worse things than oil should be shipped how? Through all ports and down every rail line and highway like it is now?

 

[JLM]

Worse things than oil should be shipped how? Through all ports and down every rail line and highway like it is now?

Very f*****g carefully. :lol:

 

[petros]

Very f*****g carefully. :lol:

Carefully? have you check the track record for rail and truck recently? It would be nice if dangerous products had their own way to move around safely OFF the roads, rail lines wouldn't it?

 

[beaker]

While I'm all for solar, wind, wave and nuclear energy, while we have the automobile the use of fossil fuels is a fact for at least another 25 years. If we can turn something that is "dirty" into something that is useful and profitable, that is a bonus. There is no valid reason why we can't send something down a pipe without polluting anything. Sure mistakes have been made through laziness, inattentiteness or plain not giving a sh*t, there is no reason (with proper monitoring and huge fines) this bullsh*t has to continue. Shipping oil should be limited to double hulled ships and sober captains........................no exceptions. Maybe a breathalyser has to be employed at the start of every shift................whatever it takes!

Human error, it is going to happen because we are human. Maybe that is what makes us human. All the safety considerations, all the good intentions can get screwed up by someone having a bad day. The larger the structural components the larger the mistakes results. Fewer accidents, just more costly ones.

 

[JLM]

Human error, it is going to happen because we are human. Maybe that is what makes us human. All the safety considerations, all the good intentions can get screwed up by someone having a bad day. The larger the structural components the larger the mistakes results. Fewer accidents, just more costly ones.

Part of setting up "quality control", is to have checks in place so that nothing is vulnerable to weaknesses of any one person. Sure you are NEVER going to eliminate accidents entirely but you can get it down to a level we can live with.

 

[Kakato]

Part of setting up "quality control", is to have checks in place so that nothing is vulnerable to weaknesses of any one person. Sure you are NEVER going to eliminate accidents entirely but you can get it down to a level we can live with.

I like to think of them as incidents and preventable,I see no reason why we cant build a leak proof pipeline.Human error and poor inspection is what leads to most failures,a simple scratch on a pipe will almost guarantee a failure long before the pipe is to be abandoned.
That's why inspections are so important,the guy should be standing right there and walking the line all the time when that pipes being handled.

 

[taxslave]

What I was saying though is that our solar equipment, windmills, geothermal and conservation/efficiency technologies and capacities can be developed instead of new coal ports and oil sands pipelines. Then we have those new energies and technologies to export forever. Plus we then have the benefit of using those old fuels as and when we really need them and as we develop sensible ways of using and gathering them.

That is working on the not very solid assumption that
A) we make the equipment in sufficient quantity to export
B) Other countries want to buy our equipment instead of manufacturing their own
C) We can manufacture this at a competitive price
Whereas we have an overabundance of both oil and coal that others do not and are willing to pay cash to get.

 

[JLM]

I like to think of them as incidents and preventable,I see no reason why we cant build a leak proof pipeline.Human error and poor inspection is what leads to most failures,a simple scratch on a pipe will almost guarantee a failure long before the pipe is to be abandoned.
That's why inspections are so important,the guy should be standing right there and walking the line all the time when that pipes being handled.

Absolutely agree, but sooner or later just when an inspector sneezes or blinks, is going to be right when a woodpecker takes a peck at it. :smile:

 

[damngrumpy]

I don't care one way or another taxslave as long as all product is produced and refined
in this country before we make any decision. We should no longer export raw material
of any nature without being refined or processed wood etc. If we can't get maximum
value don't sell it period.
I do not think the government should own all thre resources but they should regulate
like hell on what we have. enbridge is a prime example of what happens when no one
is keeping an eye on them.
I would also suggest that the BC Liberal Party is in free fall, and will not form the next
government. What is really telling is the number of cabinet ministers and MLA's that
are calling it a day. If they announce before the writ is dropped their pension is higher.

The BC Tories are a fringe movement, even the Federal Conservatives are backing the
BC Liberals because it is the old Socred Coalition under a different name and it is dead
once again. As for the federal NDP going away, that has been said for more than sixty
years. The fact is the Federal NDP, the Federal Liberals and the Federal Conservatives
are all going to be around for a very long time and we need a variety of opinions and the
debate and ideas that come out of that.
Gateway is in serious trouble, the company who is building it is now discredited and the
people of BC are still not on board. Energy needs to be developed but we should not do
it just for the sake of doing it.

 

[JLM]

I don't care one way or another taxslave as long as all product is produced and refined
in this country before we make any decision. We should no longer export raw material
of any nature without being refined or processed wood etc. If we can't get maximum
value don't sell it period.

You can't suck and blow at the same time, DG.:smile: If we really expect someone to buy our products we have to produce them just as cheap or cheaper than they can. Do you buy products from someone for a higher price than you can make it yourself?