Big Explosion in Oslo

[earth_as_one]

I would agree that good Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, etc... don't butcher innocent people. But every religious sect and political ideology has their share of nutcases even Christians and right wingers. It would be just as wrong to blame every right wing Christian for this nutjob's actions as it it to blame every Muslim for the actions of Islamic nutjobs.

I'd like to make some observations:

I doubt Norwegians will demand that all Christian churches be removed from the proximity of this event's ground zero.

I doubt Norwegians will blame all Christian right wingers for this nutjob's actions or demand that Norway ban Christian immigration.

Many people who claim this nutjob's actions aren't motivated by religion or right wing extremism, have similar if not identical opinions with this nutjob regarding political ideology, Zionism, Islam and immigration. This nutjob's ideology is very close to that of many FoxNews pundits.

If this person was Muslim and his motivations were related to a Islamic extremism rather than a right wing Christian extremist, I'm sure many people who claim this person was not motivated by his ideology would see the connection. I also have no doubt our news would emphasize this connection over and over. Instead of referring to him as a deranged gunman, he'd be branded a Muslim terrorist. People would demand an end to Muslim immigration and block mosques from being built near this event's ground zero.

I'm pointing out these manipulations, because this world has no shortage of Muslim nutjobs and inevitably a Muslim equivalent of this nutjob will commit a similar atrocity. When that happens, I'd like people to think back to this incident and make comparisons regarding the new's terminology and allocation of blame. Our news deliberately manipulates us into having anti-Muslim opinions and to some degree, a source of this man's hate filled ideology.

 

[taxslave]

I would agree that good Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, etc... don't butcher innocent people. But every religious sect and political ideology has their share of nutcases even Christians and right wingers. It would be just as wrong to blame every right wing Christian for this nutjob's actions as it it to blame every Muslim for the actions of Islamic nutjobs.

I'd like to make some observations:

I doubt Norwegians will demand that all Christian churches be removed from the proximity of this event's ground zero.

I doubt Norwegians will blame all Christian right wingers for this nutjob's actions or demand that Norway ban Christian immigration.

Many people who claim this nutjob's actions aren't motivated by religion or right wing extremism, have similar if not identical opinions with this nutjob regarding political ideology, Zionism, Islam and immigration. This nutjob's ideology is very close to that of many FoxNews pundits.

If this person was Muslim and his motivations were related to a Islamic extremism rather than a right wing Christian extremist, I have no doubt our news would be emphasizing it. Instead of calling him a deranged gunman, he'd be called a Muslim terrorist. People would demand an end to Muslim immigration and block mosques from being built near this event's ground zero.

I'm pointing out these manipulations, because inevitably, a Muslim equivalent of this nutjob will inevitably commit a similar atrocity and I'd like people to think back to this incident and see clearly how the news attempts to manipulate us into having anti-Muslim opinions.

It is not hard to form anti muslim opinions when both their spiritual and political leaders are screaming "Death to America " and "Death to Israel" on every news camera they find.

 

[Cliffy]

It is not hard to form anti muslim opinions when both their spiritual and political leaders are screaming "Death to America " and "Death to Israel" on every news camera they find.

That is because they don't show you the moderates who condemn the actions of the radical fundamentalists. Those are not news, only the nut jobs are. EAO is right, the media manipulates public opinion.

 

[mentalfloss]

Once again:

The Shooter is a lone looney without religious or political rational or any rationality.....he was an aberration. It is completely nonsensical to delve the depths of his motives, because they are completely irrational, without reason, without any connection to the world of the sane.....you'd have to be nuts to understand.

British police sent to Norway after Breivik claims ties to far-right group

LONDON — A British police officer was in Norway Monday to liaise with police over weekend attacks which killed at least 93 people after it emerged the mass murderer claimed ties a far-right British group.

Behring Breivik said he was recruited by far-right extremists at a meeting in London in 2002 which was attended by eight people in all, according to the broadsheet.

He boasted that he was one of up to 80 “solo martyr cells” recruited across Western Europe to topple governments tolerant of Islam, it said, adding that Scotland Yard was now trying to establish if he had visited London in recent years.

In the document signed “Andrew Berwick” — an anglicised version of his name — he named former prime ministers Tony Blair and Gordon Brown and Britain’s Prince Charles as “Category A” targets for promoting multiculturalism.

The mass killer also spoke of being in touch with the far-right English Defence League.

British police sent to Norway after Breivik claims ties to far-right group


Christian extremist seeks white European 'jihad'

At more than 1,500 pages and nearly a decade in the making, the manifesto detailing Norwegian mass-killer Anders Behring Breivik's murderous "crusade" gives a chilling picture of a self-confessed "monster."

It was designed to bring about the revolution that the 32-yearold says is needed to end a centuries-long Muslim colonization of Europe.

The final entry comes scant hours before Friday's Oslo carnage. He emailed the 1,518page document to his friends just hours before he carried out Norway's worst terrorist attack. In it, he urged others to follow his example by killing anyone - particularly political leaders - who tolerates Islam.

"I will be labelled as the biggest (Nazi-) monster ever witnessed since WW2," says the "Marxist Hunter" in what is at times a rambling, at times bewilderingly detailed thesis.

He calls for adherents to spawn large families of white European "jihadists."

"If you are not willing to sacrifice your own life, then I would strongly advise you to make babies and ensure that they will be willing to sacrifice theirs when the time is right."
​

​

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The text outlines his transformation as he strives to return Europe to an almost medieval racial and religious makeup. It ranges from denunciations of political correctness to how to cover up the real reasons for purchasing chemicals from China for use in weaponry.

Friday's sickening scenes trigger the start of a "pre-emptive war" he says.

It is "waged in order to repel, defeat or weaken an ongoing Islamic invasion/colonization, to gain a strategic advantage in an unavoidable war before that threat materializes." He adds: "We cannot afford to wait around and re-act when it is too late."

He launched his movement in London in 2002, he says, "one of several leaders of the national and pan-European Patriotic Resistance Movement."

Concrete planning for Operation Martyr, as he baptized the events in and around Oslo, began in earnest in the autumn of 2009, with the setting up of "front" companies including a mining company and a farm to cover his acquisition of materials for military use, such as fertilizer for his bomb.

Christian extremist seeks white European 'jihad'
​

 

[DaSleeper]

I tend to have a bit more "consideration" (for lack of a better word) for the nut who blows himself up while killing others, than for a coward who parks a truck and walks away then kills defenseless children...... all without provocation.
I am sure though that with the laws in Europe he will not receive the same punishement as McVeigh....pity

 

[mentalfloss]

I tend to have a bit more "consideration" (for lack of a better word) for the nut who blows himself up while killing others, than for a coward who parks a truck and walks away then kills defenseless children...... all without provocation.
I am sure though that with the laws in Europe he will not receive the same punishement as McVeigh....pity

A pity for the extreme right who will suffer a huge blow to their cult because of the ongoing investigation.

No, it's not a pity.

People like these must be kept alive in prison, so that we properly investigate the nature of their crimes and further prevent them.


Norway's shooter: Delusional loner or far-right conspirator?

As they investigate Norway's worst mass murder since the Second World War, the country's police and security experts are trying to determine whether the man they have in custody is a delusional loner or a member of Scandinavia's growing band of far-right extremists.

"We are not sure whether he was alone or had help," a police official, Roger Andresen, said at a televised news conference on Saturday, after police had laid charges against Anders Behring Breivik for both the bombing and the shooting rampage at a youth camp in which 76 people were killed. "What we know is that he is right-wing and a Christian fundamentalist."

Norway's shooter: Delusional loner or far-right conspirator? - World - CBC News

 

[DaSleeper]

People like these must be kept alive in prison, so that we properly investigate the nature of their crimes and further prevent them.

Spoken like a true P.C. Left Winger....:roll:

 

[mentalfloss]

Spoken like a true P.C. Left Winger....:roll:

Norway Attacks Expose U.S. Media’s Double Standard on "Terrorism"

Numerous news outlets and commentators initially blamed the attacks in Norway on Islamic militants. Rupert Murdoch’s British newspaper, The Sun, ran a front-page headline that read, "'Al-Qaeda' Massacre: Norway’s 9/11." In the United States, Murdoch’s Wall Street Journal also initially blamed "jihadists," reporting that "Norway is targeted for being true to Western norms."

Meanwhile, on the Washington Post’s website, Jennifer Rubin wrote, "This is a sobering reminder for those who think it’s too expensive to wage a war against jihadists."

To discuss the media coverage of the attacks, we’re joined by Glenn Greenwald, constitutional law attorney and political and legal blogger who has written about the media coverage of the attacks in Norway for Salon.com. “When it became apparent that Muslims were not involved and that, in reality, it was a right-wing nationalist with extremely anti-Muslim, strident anti-Muslim bigotry as part of his worldview, the word 'terrorism' almost completely disappeared from establishment media discourse. Instead, he began to be referred to as a 'madman' or an 'extremist,'" says Greenwald. “It really underscores, for me, the fact that this word 'terrorism,' that plays such a central role in our political discourse and our law, really has no objective meaning. It’s come to mean nothing more than Muslims who engage in violence."

Norway Attacks Expose U.S. Media's Double Standard on "Terrorism"

 

[DaSleeper]

Wipe the saliva dripping on your keyboard....it could be shocking later on..:smile:
The media was wrong at first...but now that they say what you want to hear...what they say is the gospel truth??..
How liberal of you:roll::lol:

 

[mentalfloss]

Wipe the saliva dripping on your keyboard....it could be shocking later on..:smile:
The media was wrong at first...but now that they say what you want to hear...what they say is the gospel truth??..
How liberal of you:roll::lol:

False equivocation and now we're getting into stupid smilie territory.

It's all downhill from here.

 

[earth_as_one]

I agree, with you MF. This horrific crime (and Rupert Murdoch's phone hacking) should be be major blows against the few who control the many.

Regarding the role of religion in this atrocity.

You will find individuals who will say and do pretty much anything from every religion. What ends up on Fox News is highly selective and deliberately manipulative. All religions are inherently peaceful. Violence has been justified in the name of all religions. We would have less war if more people followed their religion's true intent.

Manipulation of the masses to justify violence is the problem. Powerful people like Rupert Murdoch control the media and as a result control what we know. These people use religion, nationalism, fear, greed.... to control the message and relative importance. They control who wins elections and as a result government policies which affect them. The de-emphasis of religion and ideology in this case serves their interests.

It is not hard to form anti muslim opinions when both their spiritual and political leaders are screaming "Death to America " and "Death to Israel" on every news camera they find.

My point exactly.

Reality regarding Islam:

Islam - The Religion Of Peace​

1. Introduction.

Today, many non-Muslims regard Islam as a religion that promotes violence, terrorism and war. Unfortunately, they rely in their view of Islam on the general media, which is not always accurate in reporting the news. Many media outlets, such as TV, radio, newspapers and magazines, are influenced by their investors or owners who have certain agendas and who want to promote certain values and points of view. Other media outlets are simply after the "big story", in order to make more money and more profits. Others are simply "followers", who only gather news from other sources, re-package it and try to sell it again purely as a business.

In all these cases, the news reporting is not accurate, but is driven by ulterior motives or simply by profits. Only very few media organizations are committed to providing accurate and true information, regardless of financial gain. Therefore, people today should be very careful in what they take from the media.

Before blindly accepting what the TV, radio or newspaper is reporting, one should think critically about what is being reported. Is this being reported accurately, or is it being exaggerated or even completely fabricated? Who are these people reporting the news, and do they have vested interests to report the story in a certain way, or are they completely objective and fair? Critical thinking is very important in all aspects of life, especially when it comes to accepting the media reports about important and controversial issues.
Islam is in fact a religion that promotes peace and understanding among people of all faiths, and it strongly prohibits all forms of violence and aggression against all people regardless of their faith or race.

pg2...
Islam - Religion of Peace. Islam stands for peace and justice, and prohibits violence and aggression

 

[AbtFet]

Wow!

Now this woman is dead on.....

Fanaticism, mass murder and the left | Melanie Phillips



The guy is a screaming looney.

He has no accomplishes, no connections, no ideology.....he is simply nuts.

The aspects of what motivated him emerged from a twisted, deviant, sick and yes, evil mind...........one incapable of logic, empathy or reason.

Therefore to try to understand or to lay blame for his acts by way of analysis of his thought preocesses is, in itself, insanity.

His inspiration is irrelevant, except to show his insanity.

Isn't that obvious?

...But when a Muslim commits these crimes he's perfectly sane and was told by his book to commit these crimes.
Forget the fact that Muslims have been oppressed by America with their support for Israel and dictatorships in Muslim countries for decades, that doesn't cause them to snap, no it's the Qur'an! LOL!
Muslim immigration to Europe and USA is just the by-product of their foreign policy towards Muslim countries which includes supporting brutal dictators that completely obliterate human rights and high standards of living. What do you think the 'Arab Spring' is about? Muslim immigration isn't some conspiracy to try and eradicate us and our culture. This believe is not only baseless and it's downright dangerous as the massacre in Norway has shown us.

 

[mentalfloss]

North American administrations could take some pointers from Norway's response to this terrorist attack. Combat violence with democracy and open discussion.


Norway PM gives little thought to suspect

Norwegian Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg said he doesn't spend much time thinking about the suspect in the two deadly attacks, instead focusing his attention on the victims of the violence. "I'm actually not thinking about the man. I'm thinking about the results of the acts he committed," Stoltenberg told reporters during a news conference on Wednesday

He described the acts as "horrifying" and said he's been able to "create some distance to that man."

Stoltenberg said he will focus on those who have lost loved ones and help those who are still in hospital, recovering from injuries. Asked whether the attack means some laws may need tightening up, he said he would welcome a debate on that after the investigation is complete.

Stoltenberg repeated what he said in an interview Tuesday with CBC News — that Norwegians are adamant that their country must remain an open and democratic society and that any new security measures will need to be balanced against that need. "We have to be very clear to distinguish between extreme views, opinions — that [are] completely legal, legitimate to have. What is not legitimate is to try to implement those extreme views by using violence," he said.

The prime minister said he felt the assaults were an attack on "the Norwegian model, the Norwegian democracy, our political system." Stoltenberg's office building was the target of Friday's bomb blast in Oslo, and it was his Labour Party's youth wing that came under attack in the shooting rampage that claimed dozens of lives.

Earlier, Norway's domestic intelligence chief told CBC News that it's "highly unlikely"' that the suspect has cells in the country, adding that she doesn't think he's insane. Janne Kristiansen said that after four days, they don't have any evidence of other cells in Norway. Kristiansen said while it's possible, she thought it's highly unlikely. She said she believes Breivik wants to keep the focus on himself and be in the limelight.

Breivik's lawyer, Geir Lippestad, said his client claims to be part of an organization with several cells in western countries. Lippestad said Breivik talked about "two cells in Norway but several cells abroad."

Kristiansen also rejected claims by Breivik's lawyer who said he believes his client is probably insane. "I have been a defence lawyer before and in my opinion this is clearly a sane person because he has been too focused for too long and he has been doing things so correctly," she told the BBC. "In my experience of having had these sorts of clients before, they are normally quite normal but they are quite twisted in their minds, and this person in addition is total evil."

Breivik has confessed to last Friday's bombing and the mass shootings at the island retreat that killed 76 people, but on Monday he pleaded not guilty to terrorism charges, alleging he was just trying to save Europe from "Muslim colonization." Norwegian news agency NTB said police detonated explosives at Breivik's farm about 160 kilometres north of Oslo on Tuesday. Breivik said in his manifesto that he had rented the farm and created a fake business there as cover for ordering six tonnes of fertilizer — an integral component of the Oslo bomb.

Meanwhile, Norwegian Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg says his country must remain committed to an open and democratic society following last week's deadly attacks in downtown Oslo and at an island youth camp.

The prime minister said he felt the assaults were an attack on "the Norwegian model, the Norwegian democracy, our political system." Stoltenberg's office building was the target of Friday's bomb blast in Oslo, and it was his Labour Party's youth wing that came under attack in the shooting rampage that claimed dozens of lives.

Still, the prime minister said Norwegians are adamant that their country must remain an open society and that any new security measures will need to be balanced against that need.


Norway PM gives little thought to suspect - World - CBC News

 

[DaSleeper]

False equivocation and now we're getting into stupid smilie territory.

It's all downhill from here.

And you came ito this thread when???
Post 387...when you thought you were backing a winner .....so predictable.

As for the "Religion of Peace"
Try the first hit on Bing....

religion of peace - Bing

Or google

Google

 

[earth_as_one]

Thank you for making my point dS.

Your first hit is a load of crap:
Islam: Making a True Difference in the World - One Body at a Time

If you can't see how that crap is selective and deliberately manipulative and believe it... then you follow the same path as that nutjob in Oslo.

 

[TenPenny]

Too bad he didn't watch Fox News

 

[DaSleeper]

How about pointing out some of the list of islamic attack that aren't true....

Instead of the thumbs down:smile:

You can even quote al-jazeera

 

[mentalfloss]

How about pointing out some of the list of islamic attack that aren't true....

Instead of the thumbs down:smile:

You can even quote al-jazeera

 

[DaSleeper]

‪donald rumsfled known unknowns‬‏ - YouTube

False equivocation and now we're getting into stupid smilie territory.

It's all downhill from here.

Right on.....
Hypocrite

 

[earth_as_one]

Too bad he didn't watch Fox News...

Yeah, FoxNews would have straightened this guy out. Very funny.

You might like this short interview on Fox which twists this into a story about Islamic terrorism.
‪Fox News guest: Norway first non-Islamic terror since 1995‬‏ - YouTube

The comments were pretty good:
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way to go fox .. the upcoming event : non-Islamic earthquake
Federerized 4 hours ago
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Disgusting television and worthless journalism!
videoroyal 5 hours ago
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**** you Fox News! A Christian Fundamentalist kills children and you accuse us of not having "muslim protection" around our government? What kind of a horror-propaganda-show are you? // Angry Swede.
Haruame 5 hours ago
Reply

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I live in Sweden where people view Fox News as a joke and nothing more than right wing propaganda. This isn't the first time they use Scandinavia to push their agenda.
BudmaudeY 6 hours ago

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I am Norwegian too, this made me extremly angry!! Who is this person who obviusly has no idea what he is talking about! He should get his facts straight!
gk700 7 hours ago
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@hebbazz Hope you all don't think Fox represents all of us Americans. Many Americans, including me, think that Foxnews is a disgrace and a huge embarrassment for our country. Best wishes from Maryland.