What's up with all the strikes lately?

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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If they want something to legislate about Air Canada it's to stop offering those gross California chicken wraps from Quiznos.

I've been to California. Nobody eats **** like that.

Air Canada workers back on the job Friday

Labour Minister Lisa Raitt called the tentative settlement “excellent news.”

“The best deal you can have is the one they did themselves. We’re very, very pleased with how it unfolded,” Raitt said in Ottawa. She said the threat of back-to-work legislation was a “tool that was needed to focus the parties and narrow the issues.”

The CAW’s Bob Chernecki had blasted the swift government intervention, calling it “collusion” between Conservation politicians and the airline. Raitt had insisted that the threat of legislation was meant to turn up the pressure on the two sides to come to an agreement. Few details were available, pending ratification, but the four-year deal that includes wage increases and delays any changes to existing pension benefits until 2013.

However, on the most controversial issue of switching to a defined contribution plan, for new hires only, from a defined benefit plan, the parties agreed to send that to arbitration. “For future Air Canada employees, we regret that we were not able to put in the collective agreement a defined benefit pension,” CAW president Ken Lewenza told reporters at a news conference. “But for us to prolong the strike, it would absolutely make no sense at this time.”

Given that the CAW took such a strong position against moving to a defined contribution plan for new hires, it would have been near-impossible to back down. By agreeing to arbitration, the parties essentially delay a decision, but the CAW probably thought its chances were better than with a retired judge appointed by the government through back to work legislation.


Air Canada workers back on the job Friday - thestar.com
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Anyone else have a bitter taste in their mouth knowing that the government is deliberately holding these peoples' future by the balls?
How long before Air Canada gets screens with check in agents working from India and you get to lose your own baggage carrying it to the trunk of the plane yourself.?
 

TenPenny

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Anyone else have a bitter taste in their mouth knowing that the government is deliberately holding these peoples' future by the balls?

If you listen to the union, they were about to reach this agreement without the legislation, so there is no 'holding these peoples' future by the balls'.
 

Unforgiven

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If they want something to legislate about Air Canada it's to stop offering those gross California chicken wraps from Quiznos.

I've been to California. Nobody eats **** like that.

No the Chickens are from California. A feathered penal colony I suspect due to the tough hide and lack of enthusiasm.
 

captain morgan

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The worker represented by the union is the people. Nice and democractic like.

I'm at a loss as to what that really means.

Ultimately, the consumer pays everyone's wages in this scenario and if any group, union or mgmt, believes that the best way to make a statement is to bite the hand that feeds them then they really ought to expect no support whatsoever.

As mundane as the job may seem to some, flight attendants work their asses off dealing with really sh!tty people all day and it's a really long day if weather is bad and the bars fill with annoyed drunk people waiting.

Digging ditches and oilfield firefighting (blow-out style) is also one helluva way to make a living... The common denominator in all these scenarios is that the employee has a choice.
 

petros

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I'm at a loss as to what that really means.

Ultimately, the consumer pays everyone's wages in this scenario and if any group, union or mgmt, believes that the best way to make a statement is to bite the hand that feeds them then they really ought to expect no support whatsoever.
Are any of these industries hurting for profits? How do they ultimately generate their profits?

As for Air Canada it's not about wages but securing pensions for new hires so they don't get ****ed over because of some management firm blowing their wad on magic beans. This is about ensuring kid hired today will see their pension 30-40 years from now.

As I posted before, how much have Unions invested back into Canada, Canadian jobs and the economy in general over their existance in this fine land?

How many employees have used their union pension to buy failing companies and have kept them thriving and their towns thriving?

Can an individual do that on his own by getting a few co-workers together?
 
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captain morgan

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Are any of these industries hurting for profits? How do they ultimately generate their profits?

Some are hurting and some aren't and while I understand that you are driving at the notion that the profits won't exist without the labor component, the fact of the matter is that the company wouldn't exist to hire a labor force if it weren't for someone or group to put up the risk money... Let's not lose sight of the fact that the workers get paid regardless of the profitability of the company and if you demand that kind of security, then the trade-off is reflected in the upside that you can expect.


As for Air Canada it's not about wages but securing pensions for new hires so they don't get ****ed over because of some management firm blowing their wad on magic beans. This is about ensuring kid hired today will see their pension 30-40 years from now.

.. And the pensions are a huge problem. This group wants a defined pension package that is magically immune to market forces and the economy. I understand that the company is looking to move to a defined contribution plan that does not hold the company liable for hiccups in the economy.

... So, here's the $64,000 question... Why doesn't the union take on the responsibility of guaranteeing the pensions of it's workers? Hell, the CAW/UAW had over a billion in cash to 'invest' in GM, why the hell don't they take-on some of the pension issues for their group seeing all that cash was contributed by their members?

Answer that and you'll understand the impracticality of the corporate body doing the same.

As I posted before, how much have Unions invested back into Canada, Canadian jobs and the economy in general over their existance in this fine land?

Fair enough, but there are many groups that invest/reinvest back into Canada. The unions do not have any exclusivity in this.

How many employees have used their union pension to buy failing companies and have kept them thriving and their towns thriving?

See above
 

petros

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So, here's the $64,000 question... Why doesn't the union take on the
responsibility of guaranteeing the pensions of it's workers? Hell, the CAW/UAW
had over a billion in cash to 'invest' in GM, why the hell don't they take-on
some of the pension issues for their group seeing all that cash was contributed
by their members?
They aren't the employers. Depending on the contract and the union, pensions may fall in the hands of the employer as to how or who it is invested with.

Why shouldn't pension investment protected for all Canadians and not just union members? A CDIC type insurance that covers the whole nut would be wise idea especially after derivatives and deregulating fiascos of late.

I'd have no issues as an employer in kicking in an extra $10 a head for something like that.
 

Corduroy

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Last night they were breaking the shop windows in bourgeois downtown Vancouver, flipping over the vehicles of the Fascist Police and throwing Molotov cocktails. With all these strikes it only makes sense to conclude that the revolution is at hand! Get to your soviets, comrades! National daycare and dental plans for all!
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
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captain morgan

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They aren't the employers. Depending on the contract and the union, pensions may fall in the hands of the employer as to how or who it is invested with.

Why shouldn't pension investment protected for all Canadians and not just union members? A CDIC type insurance that covers the whole nut would be wise idea especially after derivatives and deregulating fiascos of late.

I'd have no issues as an employer in kicking in an extra $10 a head for something like that.

Who says that the union can't take control of the pension? The corporate contribution is not mandated, it is a perk. The union doesn't want that responsibility because no one does and by in large, that duty gets outsourced to a third party that works to invest the funds so the pension grows.

If an employee demands a defined pension plan then it cannot happen without risking that cash and taking a chance on publicly traded securities including derivatives and deregulated markets.. You can't have it both ways.

In terms of CDIC, sure that is no problem, but the pension fund will grow at a pathetically low interest rate and in the end, the employers now are moving towards not being responsible for a defined pension plan for the same reason that the unions refuse to take on that responsibility.... There is no way that a defined plan can be achieved without a significant exposure to risk and the result is that all of the contributions end up in a savings-style account that can not possibly ever deliver a defined lifestyle indexed to inflation.
 

JLM

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Last night they were breaking the shop windows in bourgeois downtown Vancouver, flipping over the vehicles of the Fascist Police and throwing Molotov cocktails. With all these strikes it only makes sense to conclude that the revolution is at hand! Get to your soviets, comrades! National daycare and dental plans for all!

I'm on a "dental plan", they are not what they are cracked up to be. Actually they don't save you any money- cost you more if anything in exchange for have the payments evened out a bit. I pay $80 EVERY MONTH plus 25% of any treatment. Of course only a fool would think someone else is going to pay for your dental.
 

JLM

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It's insurance...you probably don't get all your money back on car or home insurance either.

That's true, I was just trying to dispel the myth that dental insurance makes dental work cheaper, whereas the likely scenario is it costs half less and half more.
 

Tonington

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It really depends on what services you use, and how many people on your plan. If you need surgery then it's well worth it. If you're going in for regular check-ups, maybe not. If I had 8 kids, $50 a month for the family plan I purchased would be a steal.
 

mentalfloss

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Jun 28, 2010
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If you listen to the union, they were about to reach this agreement without the legislation, so there is no 'holding these peoples' future by the balls'.

There is strong sentiment that the union delayed any negotiations on pensions to go to arbitration in 2013 because they were afraid of the possible back-to-work legislation the government would have put forth. The fact that they gave into arb is bad enough, but now the government is peddling the legislative threat as a "tool" that pushed things forward.

That's pretty draconian.

Last night they were breaking the shop windows in bourgeois downtown Vancouver, flipping over the vehicles of the Fascist Police and throwing Molotov cocktails. With all these strikes it only makes sense to conclude that the revolution is at hand! Get to your soviets, comrades! National daycare and dental plans for all!

lol

It is interesting that all of these strikes are happening en masse, just after the election.

Coincidence? I guess we'll never know..