Quantum Entanglement

Cliffy

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Nov 19, 2008
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That, is woo. Reality is reality, beliefs are beliefs.
Yup, just what I expect from a skeptic. Do you not think that I know how far that my beliefs are from the status quo? I think the status quo is woo and those that cling to it are nutters. A crazy friend of mine says she loves being insane because she can get away with anything. I agree. There is a tremendous amount of freedom in being insane (which by definition is not believing in status quo reality) as long as you don't act crazy enough for the boys with the white coats to come and take you away (ha ha ho ho hee hee!)
 

Tonington

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Yup, just what I expect from a skeptic. Do you not think that I know how far that my beliefs are from the status quo?

This has nothing to do with status quo. Can you believe away a tumor growing on a thoracic disc? Can you believe away lead poisoning?
 

Cliffy

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This has nothing to do with status quo. Can you believe away a tumor growing on a thoracic disc? Can you believe away lead poisoning?
Yes. 15 years ago I was given 1 month to live after I had two heart attacks and refused triple bi-pass surgery. Three and half years ago I was given another death sentence due to congestive heart failure which the doctor said was because I refused the bi-pass. Today, I am healthier than I was before my heart attacks because I refused to believe them and chose to believe in me.
 

JLM

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This has nothing to do with status quo. Can you believe away a tumor growing on a thoracic disc? Can you believe away lead poisoning?

Actually, Tonington, there are documented cases of just that very thing. When your frame of mind is improved such as when you are optimistic, your immune system works better.
 

Tonington

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No. I asked specific questions. I fully admit that there are a great amount of unknowns in medical science. Maybe you had a wakeup call and changed your lifestyle, and that was enough to allow your body to repair the damage. I have no idea. Plenty of other people have done as you did, and didn't survive. I think it would be dubious to doubt their convictions to survive.
 

JLM

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Yes. 15 years ago I was given 1 month to live after I had two heart attacks and refused triple bi-pass surgery. Three and half years ago I was given another death sentence due to congestive heart failure which the doctor said was because I refused the bi-pass. Today, I am healthier than I was before my heart attacks because I refused to believe them and chose to believe in me.

There you go Ton, a classic example even closer at hand than I would have imagined. :smile:

No. I asked specific questions. I fully admit that there are a great amount of unknowns in medical science. Maybe you had a wakeup call and changed your lifestyle, and that was enough to allow your body to repair the damage. I have no idea. Plenty of other people have done as you did, and didn't survive. I think it would be dubious to doubt their convictions to survive.

Some just give up.
 

Cliffy

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No. I asked specific questions. I fully admit that there are a great amount of unknowns in medical science. Maybe you had a wakeup call and changed your lifestyle, and that was enough to allow your body to repair the damage. I have no idea. Plenty of other people have done as you did, and didn't survive. I think it would be dubious to doubt their convictions to survive.
It would be difficult to explain the mechanisms that I put into play to accomplish what I did, especially in this forum format. But, I have absolute faith that I could cure any medical or physiological ailment I could encounter. Let us just say that if we are basically made of energy, then energy can be manipulated to rectify any ailment. But there are many factors that come into play in the healing process that include (but are not restricted to) physical, emotional, mental and spiritual elements. And it takes more than a will to live to overcome problems that we take years to create.
 

Dexter Sinister

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Well reality is a subjective commodity not an objective one, in my reality.
Too solipsistic for me. As I've said before, people who think we create our own reality are invited to jump off the roof of my house into the rock garden 5 meters below and try to change the reality of what happens to them. There is an objective reality out there that exists regardless of our thoughts about it, it was here long before we showed up to think about it, and it'll be here long after we're gone. Had we not had at least a reasonable approximation of that reality in our perceptions, on a scale appropriate to our size and environment, over those thousands of generations, evolution would have made short work of us. Science teaches us how limited those perceptions are, but it doesn't invalidate them, it extends them.

I'm also of the opinion that if telepathy existed it would have had tremendous survival value and would have been strongly selected for. Thus the fact that we're not routinely telepathic suggests to me that there's no such thing and we have to seek other explanations for what appear to be instances of it. They are to be found in the many known shortcomings of our perception, reasoning, and memory, and the methods of science are the only means we've ever discovered for reliably removing their effects. Evolution has strongly biased our minds in favour of making certain kinds of perceptual errors on the "better safe than sorry" principle. Is that movement in the tall grass a sabre-toothed tiger or the wind? Safer to decide it's the predator, even if it's not, that error--a false positive or type I error, a statistician would say--has very low cost. The other kind of error, the false negative or type II error, deciding it's not the tiger when it is, has a very high cost. We make false positive errors all the time, supported by our great skill at finding patterns even where there really aren't any, and false negative errors relatively infrequently. That one little fact about human perception accounts for the continuing existence of all kinds of mystic nonsense.
 

Tonington

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But, I have absolute faith that I could cure any medical or physiological ailment I could encounter.
So then, you have the key to immortality. Colour me skeptical, again. I make a distinction between choosing to live well, and believing something away. That's not the same thing at all.
 

JLM

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It would be difficult to explain the mechanisms that I put into play to accomplish what I did, especially in this forum format. But, I have absolute faith that I could cure any medical or physiological ailment I could encounter. Let us just say that if we are basically made of energy, then energy can be manipulated to rectify any ailment. But there are many factors that come into play in the healing process that include (but are not restricted to) physical, emotional, mental and spiritual elements. And it takes more than a will to live to overcome problems that we take years to create.

I have a dear cousin in her 70s who has been recently diagnosed with A.L.S. (Lou Gehrigs disease) and from what I can gather she has been going downhill pretty fast. I've tried to give her encouragement but really don't know what other advice to offer. What would you do in her boots, Cliff?
 

JLM

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So then, you have the key to immortality. Colour me skeptical, again. I make a distinction between choosing to live well, and believing something away. That's not the same thing at all.

That probably wouldn't happen. When you find you are 50 years older than anyone else on the planet and them young whippersnappers just arent' listening, in defense of your sanity you will probably decide to "call it a day".

Let us know when you pass the age of 200.

Sounds like you have a fairly high expectation. :lol:

A classic example of conflation.


Dubious.

All you've given us is your "take" on the situation which are just other opinions. :smile:
 

Cliffy

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Let us know when you pass the age of 200.
Who would want to? I haven't figured out how to arrest the aging process, although I think it is just a shortcoming of the knowledge base. But that doesn't mean if I did knew the secret of longevity that I would use it. I don't fear death, just suffering. So when my time comes to let go of this body, I will not hesitate. I would like to step through the veil before I go this time though. I have lived many different lives in this body and I choose to live at least one more before I move on.

I have a dear cousin in her 70s who has been recently diagnosed with A.L.S. (Lou Gehrigs disease) and from what I can gather she has been going downhill pretty fast. I've tried to give her encouragement but really don't know what other advice to offer. What would you do in her boots, Cliff?
I would have to do some research on the subject to familiarize myself with all the knowns and alternatives. I would have to talk to her extensively to try to find out the root causes, what has been going on in her life that would influence her to contract such a debilitating disease.
 

JLM

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Who would want to? I haven't figured out how to arrest the aging process, although I think it is just a shortcoming of the knowledge base. But that doesn't mean if I did knew the secret of longevity that I would use it. I don't fear death, just suffering. So when my time comes to let go of this body, I will not hesitate. I would like to step through the veil before I go this time though. I have lived many different lives in this body and I choose to live at least one more before I move on.


I would have to do some research on the subject to familiarize myself with all the knowns and alternatives. I would have to talk to her extensively to try to find out the root causes, what has been going on in her life that would influence her to contract such a debilitating disease.

Thanks, Cliff- About 20 years ago she lost a son in motor cycle accident, which she's never gotten over and when that happens I think your guard goes down against any type of invasion.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
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RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
There are many questions which science can never answer, there are an infinite number of questions that human science will never think to ask. Discounting the powers of the mind especially those widely experienced for uncounted thousands of years is irrational. So those who know what they know and do with it what science cannot explain have the distinct advantage over the common screwdriver that science actually is. Most science if not all science is itself the product of creative minds open to the universal conscience. First something enters the mind, an idea, a dream, a thought and only then is science applied. Science will always follow and never will it lead. That isn't to say that science isn't great it's just to say that science cannot create. So until science can explain the formation of an idea it will have to shut the hell up. Imagine the arrogance to tell someone that they cannot use the power of the mind to heal and that they cannot be connected over distances to another mind when there are literally millions who have done and can do just that. They take way to much license in their madness these white coated clipboarded buffoons.
 

JLM

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Tonington Dubious.[/QUOTE said:
Ton, I see a lot of people every day who are still fairly healthy and young who have given up on life for such simple reasons as lack of direction or their thinking isn't organized, or they've been put down so often they just don't have the heart to get up, so I would imagine there are scads like that who have a debillitating disease.
 

Dexter Sinister

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So until science can explain the formation of an idea it will have to shut the hell up.
Sure beave, just because there's something it can't currently explain it shouldn't try to explain anything. That'll take us a long way. You're suffering a surfeit of egregious type I errors.