Canada tops, Harper shines?

SirJosephPorter

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Nov 7, 2008
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Not sure but I think that 40 year mortgages went out last year - Rules were changed I believe.

they were scrapped as a result of the meltdown. In the meltdown had not occurred, they would have multiplied and the problems would have been evident a few years down the line. That is why we may be fortunate that the meltdown occurred when it did. A few more years and Canada may have been in as much of a soup as USA.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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Are you saying that for the first 30 years you pay no principal at all? I find that astounding.
I was listening to a finacial advisor when these 40 yr boondoogles came out - I only caught a portion of it - but from what i recall for those 1st 30 years you are paying interest for the most part - Calculate it out - I added a link but did not have time to work the figures. If you have time try it out on 200K
 

SirJosephPorter

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Nov 7, 2008
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I was listening to a finacial advisor when these 40 yr boondoogles came out - I only caught a portion of it - but from what i recall for those 1st 30 years you are paying interest for the most part - Calculate it out - I added a link but did not have time to work the figures. If you have time try it out on 200K

Doesn't matter Goober. The fact is that you will be paying mostly interest for a long time. Overall you will pay much more interest on a 40 year old mortgage than a 30 year or a 25 year mortgage.

It was just as well that they scrapped the 40 year mortgage.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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Doesn't matter Goober. The fact is that you will be paying mostly interest for a long time. Overall you will pay much more interest on a 40 year old mortgage than a 30 year or a 25 year mortgage.

It was just as well that they scrapped the 40 year mortgage.

It was a US way of doing things and we saw how well that worked out.
 

Bar Sinister

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Jan 17, 2010
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you mean the Banking institutions,
And who help these Banking institutions to thrive the most through the years, the Conservatives or the Liberals?
Credit on Canada’s Economy should go to the Party who has helped these Banking institutions stay strong thought the years. We know the answer.........:canada:

I mean all institutions including Canada's strong social infrastructure. But as I said I give no credit to either the Liberals or Conservatives as both parties have displayed a complete inability to institute any sort of long rang planning, preferring to blunder from one economic crisis to the next.
 

JLM

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Nov 27, 2008
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I was listening to a finacial advisor when these 40 yr boondoogles came out - I only caught a portion of it - but from what i recall for those 1st 30 years you are paying interest for the most part - Calculate it out - I added a link but did not have time to work the figures. If you have time try it out on 200K

Of course you are paying down the principal right from the first payment but it could be as little as $1 to start with.
 

Slim Chance

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Nov 26, 2009
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Not sure but I think that 40 year mortgages went out last year - Rules were changed I believe.

I believe that you are correct on that, specifically due to the experience in the States, however, I am unsure if that change applies to any CMHC mortgage, or if it applies to all mortgages.
 

Cliffy

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Nov 19, 2008
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I mean all institutions including Canada's strong social infrastructure. But as I said I give no credit to either the Liberals or Conservatives as both parties have displayed a complete inability to institute any sort of long rang planning, preferring to blunder from one economic crisis to the next.
Our entire economy is based on 5 year plans. That takes a lot of foresight. :-?

We can't expect politicians to think past their masters, now can we?
 

SirJosephPorter

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Nov 7, 2008
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I believe that you are correct on that, specifically due to the experience in the States, however, I am unsure if that change applies to any CMHC mortgage, or if it applies to all mortgages.

It does not apply to all mortgages. If you amortize over ten years, you may be paying 30 or 40% principal from your very first payment.

In general, the longer the amortization period, longer you would go before paying off any serious amount of principle.

So if you have a 40 year mortgage (and zero down payment), for many years you have very little equity in the house. For 15 or 20 years, bank practically owns the house. So if the house prices plunge or you encounter financial hardship, there is no reason to continue with the house, you may as well walk away.
 

SirJosephPorter

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The rules in Canada changed in the last six weeks back or so. Twenty percent down payment, minimum for rental properties. Buyers have to qualify for the five year fixed rate, even if opting for the variable rate. We were considering buying the duplex we live in, until the minimum down payment went to 20%. Can't swing that. Our rent on our side of the duplex (2BR, 3Br on the other) is still more than the mortgage payment would be, but there's no way I can get enough for a 20% down payment. I think the maximum amortization is still 35 years.


Buying has many hidden costs, and may not always be profitable. You say rent is more than the mortgage payment would be, did you take into account property taxes? Any reasonable house would have 3000 or 4000 $ in property taxes. So add 250 or 300 $ per month to your mortgage payment. Is it sill lower than the rent you are paying?

Then there is the insurance. With owning, you must insure the entire house, with renting; you insure only the house contents. Also, house usually has much higher utility bills compared to an apartment. Then there are repairs to the house. If it is an old house, something usually goes wrong with it, and every year you may have to spend so much fixing the place.

My son recently bought his house for 165,000$. He was also looking to renting a two bedroom apartment (the house is about the same size, plus the basement). I did some rough, back of the envelope calculations. If he can sell the house for 190,000 $ (six percent of which goes to the real estate agent right away) in five years’ time (he will complete his residency, and almost certainly will sell in five years), he will just about break even, when compared to renting.

We bought our first house when we were both 33 years old (in England). Until then we were renting, I didn’t see much point in buying. The money we had, I was able to invest to get substantial rate of return.

So it all depends, buying is not always the more profitable thing to do.
 

TenPenny

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Jun 9, 2004
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Let's take a 40 year mortgage, at 5%, for $100,000.00.
In the first year, you will pay off $815.22 toward the prinicpal.
In the first 3 years together, you'll pay $2,571.58 toward the principal.

With a monthly payment of $478,80 ($5,745.60 per year). It takes until year 26 when you start paying as much against the principal as you do in interest.
 
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Tonington

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Oct 27, 2006
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So it all depends, buying is not always the more profitable thing to do.

Believe me we talked about that. In the end it's not so much to me what I profit, I don't really think about it as profit, but that I'm building equity.
 

Tonington

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Does your province allow assumable mortgages?

I don't know, I hadn't even heard of that until just now. The owner of this duplex was born and raised in the building. I don't think he has a mortgage on this property.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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I don't know, I hadn't even heard of that until just now. The owner of this duplex was born and raised in the building. I don't think he has a mortgage on this property.
With the market settling - prices to go down - he might be willing to hold a 2nd motrgage. Never know till you have some figures and ask -
 

SirJosephPorter

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With the market settling - prices to go down - he might be willing to hold a 2nd motrgage. Never know till you have some figures and ask -

It is not clear that prices will go down, Goober. In big cities like Toronto, maybe. But outside big cities, price increases have been fairly modest.

My son told me that the house he bought was on the market one year ago, priced at 190,000, It was not sold, so the owner pulled it off the market. This year he listed it for 169,000 and my son got it for 165,000.

At least in London there is no housing bubble.
 

pegger

Electoral Member
Dec 4, 2008
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I 'm kinda sorry that the whole 40/0 thing has hi-jacked the thread. My point was, the Conservatives were introducing very economically damaging rules and regulations - and I think crediting with with "saving our bacon" so to speak on the economic front is a bit much - if they had more time, we would have been in a worse of situation.

As it is - I think their plan to increase EI rates is possibly the worst economic decision ever made in recent history - yet partisans will praise the genius of Harper to the end.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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I 'm kinda sorry that the whole 40/0 thing has hi-jacked the thread. My point was, the Conservatives were introducing very economically damaging rules and regulations - and I think crediting with with "saving our bacon" so to speak on the economic front is a bit much - if they had more time, we would have been in a worse of situation.

As it is - I think their plan to increase EI rates is possibly the worst economic decision ever made in recent history - yet partisans will praise the genius of Harper to the end.

Just love that near Hitler salute
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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It is not clear that prices will go down, Goober. In big cities like Toronto, maybe. But outside big cities, price increases have been fairly modest.

My son told me that the house he bought was on the market one year ago, priced at 190,000, It was not sold, so the owner pulled it off the market. This year he listed it for 169,000 and my son got it for 165,000.

At least in London there is no housing bubble.

Tightening of the Morg market will slow down prices - Edmonton is still calssed as affordable for housing - so price will slow but not drop - on the otehr side of the coin many people are caught in condos they ordered on spec - A larrge numbe I know of ordered 5 - 10 or more - hoping to turn a profit - Condos will drop in this area -
Then I will look at buying one if the prices drop enought.

lastly - In AB they have the worst laws & regs governing condos so if anyone buys one out here ensure you have a lawyer who knows the market - forget Real estate agents - Lawyers know what is and is not a good building to buy into.