Should Canadian tax payers be funding abortion?
- Thread starter mikemac
- Start date
Cute. Back to the exaggerations.
Every kind of life has a purpose. Ants serve a larger portion of life in general on the planet than people do. So far people have only shown ourselves to be destroyers of things and other forms of life and human life isn't worth shyte without the rest of the life on Earth.
Who says? I'm sure that if they could speak, cows would say they're the most important form of life. Or your ants.
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So within the last year or so there were some 21,000 unwanted pregnancies and 89% of them were medically unnecessary. And you come up with 2 examples where there was a crime? That's hardly a rate to hinge your argument upon.
Why bother to go that far? The contraceptives are for preventing unwanted pregnancies. Adoption is for after the pregnancy.
I know they are tough concepts to understand.
And what thought are you giving to thousands of couples who can't have children of their own and are just longing to have a child to love and nurture and have so much love to give?
"No matter what scientific evidence you think you have, and regardless if a human fetus is considered "Life"... it's still a Human Fetus, not a Human Being, and you don't become a human being until you're born.... and before you're a human fetus, you're a human zygote."
Who cares about all the friggin' semantics- makes about as much sense as burning your pay cheque- after all it's not money yet..........until you take it to the bank.
Who cares about all the friggin' semantics- makes about as much sense as burning your pay cheque- after all it's not money yet..........until you take it to the bank.
Medicare funded abortions
Medicare was set up to provide medically necessary procedures and treatment, but when we make exceptions and allow for the payment of procedures, that are not medically necessary. Abortion is one of these procedures that in the vast majority of cases is done as a convenience for the woman. Because we are paying for procedures that are not medically necessary to preserve someones health, we are running the risk that Medicare will and is becoming unsustainable. In fact at some point we will all lose what coverage we do have when money is spent for political reasons and to appease women's rights groups.
I have no problem funding abortions in the case of the woman life being in danger, or in the case of incest or rape, but certainly not abortion on demand just because a woman was careless and failed to practice diligent family planning. Henry Morgentaler say he is concerned about women's health but it seems to me he is more interested in getting rich though billing Medicare to fund his abortion clinics across Canada. We would likely be shocked at how much he is syphoning off the top as a salary.:angryfire:
Medicare was set up to provide medically necessary procedures and treatment, but when we make exceptions and allow for the payment of procedures, that are not medically necessary. Abortion is one of these procedures that in the vast majority of cases is done as a convenience for the woman. Because we are paying for procedures that are not medically necessary to preserve someones health, we are running the risk that Medicare will and is becoming unsustainable. In fact at some point we will all lose what coverage we do have when money is spent for political reasons and to appease women's rights groups.
I have no problem funding abortions in the case of the woman life being in danger, or in the case of incest or rape, but certainly not abortion on demand just because a woman was careless and failed to practice diligent family planning. Henry Morgentaler say he is concerned about women's health but it seems to me he is more interested in getting rich though billing Medicare to fund his abortion clinics across Canada. We would likely be shocked at how much he is syphoning off the top as a salary.:angryfire:
That's one of my points. As our health care will start eating up budgets, we'll be cutting back further and further on unnecessary procedures anyway and insurance will cover less and less. Why not save a bunch and mitigate the problem early?
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Abortion is an elective procedure. But Canada Health Act covers many elective procedures. Indeed, most of the operations done in hospitals during normal working hours are elective procedures, sometimes booked weeks in advance. Hip replacement, carpel tunnel etc.
[FONT="][/FONT] The procedures carried out in after hours are mostly emergency procedures such as appendix, emergency Caesarian etc. It is unfair to defund only abortion and fund all the other elective procedures. If most of the elective procedures are defunded, if public health system is reduced to a fraction of its current size, then there may be some merit in defunding abortion. But defunding abortion only on its own simply shows ideological bias, nothing more.
You have some misunderstanding of how a doctor works. Dr. Morgantaler is not siphoning off anything. A Doctor’s office is a business, like any other business. Doctor provides a service, is responsible for all the expenses. Whatever is left after expenses are gone, that is his income. He gets what is left at the bottom, rather than siphoning off anything from the top.
Quite so, a woman is always blamed for the pregnancy. That is why when it comes to abortion, it should be only up to the woman and her doctor, nobody else's business.
No more escapist then much of the dodging you've been doing towards my responses.
And considering we're talking about hypotheticals and what-if's, the answer is truly irrelevant.
:roll:
Try and keep up will you?
You said: "And how many incidents are like that these days now that abortion is legal?"
Which you seemed to be leading/implying towards that if it doesn't remove all of a problem, then there's no point in doing it, even if it reduces the size of said problem.
That was the point.
Oh and I never said anything about the Gun Registry, I was talking about Gun Control in general, which has existed in this country long before the Gun Registry was a brain fart.
Once again, please keep up.
Once again: :roll:
As already argued since like page #1 of this thread, Those two options do not always apply to everyone.
Contraceptives do not always work and due to medical reasons, some can not use certain types. As mentioned before, contraceptives do reduce many of the problems, but sometimes they don't work and the pregnancy was still not intentional..... it is not an absolute solution and some people do need an abortion because your "Solution" didn't work in the first place.
Adoption after birth does not apply to every situation either, and those reasons are already explained.
Because none of these options are absolute answers, all of these options should be available and the women involved should have every freedom and right to decide for themselves which options to choose, especially when they already tried some of these options and they didn't work, resulting in the situation they're in now.
That's the point.
And who are you to say nobody's using them, let alone doubling up on them? That's a table based on individual tests of each with no information on combinations of either.
All one can do is provide the education and the options to choose.... it is up to each individual to decide for themselves what they're going to do, regardless of what you like or don't.
Simply imposing restrictions or bans on abortions because you don't like how a % of the population abuses the system, will only harm those that the programs are genuinely there for in the first place.
Educate, provide options, otherwise tough diddims, the rest isn't up to you.
There is only one solution I have been saying all along.... education, provide options/services.... allow the individual to decide.
Keep in mind that the majority of the individuals who may have to face these decisions and consequences are adults who are fully capable of making decisions for their own lives and future.
And before you respond with the typical "Well what right do they have to decide on the life of another being?" ~ I've already answered this too.
If I worried and cared for every single form of life on this planet and elsewhere in the universe, I'd end up a blithering ball of snot, incapable of living my own life because I'd be worried about every ramification of my own existence against every other living being's life on this planet.
Things Die..... that's existence.... Some things you can save, other things you have no control over. You're going to die some day soon, and so am I.... and so is every other living thing around you that you know. Some will die quickly, some slowly, peacefully, painfully, some will live a long life and others won't even start.
Death and suffering is all around you in every shape and form.... what do you plan on doing about it?
I don't just think it, I know it:
AnnaG - "Again, I think abortion should be illegal, but people need to be educated more about the alternatives and gov't is not helping much."
I kinda figured you made a typo when I responded to this, but since you didn't catch onto my response before, I figured maybe that's what you actually meant.
For the record, Something that is against the law is "Legal" with an "I" in the front.... ie: Illegal.
Can you say "Illegal?"
Sure.... I knew you could.
^ Then you should double check what you plan to post before posting, because you contradict yourself a lot.
And obviously there are better and cheaper ways to avoid abortion, I never once disputed that issue.... the issue is that it doesn't always work and those women stat'd as having an abortion because they weren't ready doesn't clarify if they used contraceptives or didn't in the process.... and it seems some in here just want to jump to the conclusion that they all never used contraceptives and were 100% completely irresponsible.
..... Speaking of "Spin" :roll:
Why? This country was built on Immigration, we need jobs and we need workers..... get more immigrants.
It's not pitiful, you just don't like it because it doesn't suit your position.
Hardly an exaggeration at all.
That's not what I was referring toward.
I wasn't suggesting we all go out and kill ants because they're useless.... My reference was towards how many of us will kill insects and rodents that come into our homes, out territory (much like many other animals kill other animals that enter their territory) ~ Otherwise if you want to Snow White the whole planet with Nature Love and sing little songs to your ants coming into your home..... expect to have your home infested with insects, into your food, rodents chewing through your walls.... and so on.
Then your house is condemned and you're tossed out on your arse to live with those same insects and rodents that just destroyed your home.
Or I suppose you could spend the rest of your life continually trapping them all and setting them all back out into the wild alive, only to do it again the next day.
Things are killed on this planet for a lot less then just inconvenience and it's not just us humans that can or will kill without a second thought.
That's life, this is the world you live in..... enjoy.
It doesn't matter what the hell that cow thinks.... Certainly Greenpeace, PETA and the Sea Sheppards don't give a damn, they're too concerned with the cute widdle seals.
Once again, the point being was towards "HUMAN RIGHTS" not every other type of "Rights" out there one can think of.
Human Rights apply to Human Beings, not Ants, Cows, Monkeys or Hippos.... or human fetusesezezez.
You don't have sex, or have sex very often do you?
We all know all of this, you certainly repeated it dozens of times already at the very least.
What you don't seem to understand is that there's a lot of people living in this country.... there are a lot of people having sex around this country, every minute of every day, in all sorts of positions, with all sorts of partners...... contraceptives are not a 100% sure fire thing against pregnancy.... you even linked to a chart, so you should know this.
There is a real good chance every minute, of every day, during each of these billions of incidences of sex across this vast country of ours, that contraceptives will fail and a pregnancy will occur..... and these people involved are still not going to be ready to go through with it.
It's got nothing to do with all the them not caring what happens... chances are they did care, which is why they use contraceptives in the first place. But just because a statistic showed such and such amount of women got abortions because they weren't ready for the responsibility, doesn't mean they never used contraceptives.
My sister and her boyfriend were using condoms and birth control, and she ended up having triplets. Now me knowing what they used is based on hearsay, because, thank Jebus, I didn't witness this unfold personally... but they said they were being careful and they used protection. The trips were not planned or intended, she was going to university at the time too.... but she chose to have them.
What you don't seem to understand is that your wonderful "Solutions" are not solutions to the overall problem.... there is no one or two solutions to this problem and contraceptives do not always ensure total protection.
I second the motion.
It's funny how some in here think Pregnancy and Giving birth is just a cake walk.
Oh... you're pregnant but don't want the child or your body to go under drastic and serious changes that can and does affect health, job and direction of your entire life?
Too bad, carry it full term, lose your job and pay for a few months, spit it out, that shouldn't be too hard, and then just plop it on the door step of an orphanage.... it works like that in cartoons afterall, piece of cake. :-?
How about some of the guys in here try and picture carrying a softball in their scrotum for 9 months and simply spitting that out through your pee hole with no probs.
I don't think so, by the same token why couldn't a fetus be considered a human being?