The "Bible Belts" in Canuckville

[JLM]

I agree. The question is, how are you going to force Canadians to eat right and exercise? There are temptations all around us, there is cheap and delicious (if nutritionally disastrous) food available at McDonald’s and other places. You can’t ban McDonald’s in a free enterprise. For that matter, there are salads and other healthy foods available at McDonald’s, but how many people stick to burgers and French Fries (the French must feel insulted that Americans call that disgusting product French)?

If you cannot force people to eat right and exercise, the next best thing is to look after their health as best as we can. And that means taxation.

Now, part of health care expenses are being used to teach people to exercise and eat right. But you can’t force people to do these things.

Good morning, S.J. - I don't think it's so much a matter of forcing people to change their ways than to get them to want to. As I've said before I'm dead against raising taxes, but I think your suggestion is a good one in one respect, taxing people where they have a choice and that is to tax the hell out of salt, sugar, trans fats and saturated fats. That should kill two birds with one stone. McDonalds and their ilk will find it is probably just too expensive to cook with this crap (especially if they try to pass the price on to the consumer and the consumer quits buy it. There's French fries nad then there's French Fries. They don't have to be boiled in 3 gallons of grease. I make a damn fine French fry using a tablespoon or so of Olive oil and just baking on a pan in the oven., so I guess they could be change to "French baked" It's not just McDonald's there are other worse culprits, like Nalleys who are in the salt bagging business and throw in a couple of potato chips, or cheesies. Now the Gov''t can use half those taxes realized to pay down health costs and use the other half to set up organized physical fitness activities. I'm not sure if there is the technology to do it yet but I think it would be possible to give tax breaks to people who do regular strenuous exercise, but it would have to be fool proof as it would attract thousands of cheaters. Another thing Gov't could do is give tax breaks to restaurants that only serve healthy food or at least have a "health food section".

 

[countryboy]

There's something amusing about the child of such a 'tolerant' 'liberal' person, who doesn't want to go somewhere because there might be scary people there, and who gets upset when the weather strands him for two days in the friendliest, most welcoming, wonderful party city in the country.

I laughed until I stopped, as they say.

There is the added benefit of learning a whole bunch of new words in the bars too. A great opportunity to actually learn more about the country and its people, as opposed to reading about it on Wikipedia.

 

[countryboy]

Indeed, that is what my son was worried about when he was applying for residencies. In addition to several places in Ontario, he also went to Winnipeg, Saskatoon, Calgary for interviews. He was worried that he may be matched to one of those places and he may end up living in a high crime area.

When they do resident matching, they don’t give you any choice. You interview with the medical programs and rank them (and of course, medical programs rank you). Then the matching program finds the best match and gives it to you. You either take it or leave it, there is no other choice. So if he had been matched somewhere in the West, he would have to take it, he would have no choice in the matter.

He was relieved when he was assigned to London, Ontario (at Western).

Incidentally, he also went to St. John’s (Memorial University) for interview. He was stuck there for two days due to a snow storm, at a time when Ontario was bone dry. He was quite pi**ed off about it, he told me that he ranked Memorial University the last.

It sounds as if he made the right decision. Wasn't it north of London that the OPP officer was gunned down a couple of days ago? He should be OK though, if he stays to the inner part of London.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

I think you've missed his point. Or perhaps I've missed yours. While there are numerous hutterite colonies and a fair number of mennonites in southern Alberta, they are rather insular communities, not proselytizing at all and really don't interact much with outsiders. Other than some peculiarities of dress and appearance they are not very notable. I have no knowledge of the amish so won't speak to that.

I don't think communities in Ontario are any different. They keep pretty much to themselves.

Having spent the last three winters in southeast Texas, I can tell you unequivocably that that is not the case there. It never failed to amaze me how so many people "wore their heart on their sleeve" so to speak. It was quite common to be asked what church I went to "up there", to be asked what my personal relationship with Jesus was, to be invited to attend church services - and to be looked at askance when I declined or answered in the negative. Very aggressive, almost recruiting. Numerous radio and TV stations devoted to the cause, again, very aggressive. Baptists and Methodists are the denominations that come to mind, but I'm sure there were others. Coming from what you term Canada's bible belt, I'd never seen anything like it. Most Albertans I know would be considered dangerously agnostic or atheistic by south Texas standards.

Btw, have you ever been here? Just asking.

I have a friend in South Carolina, he tells me the same thing about South Carolina. And do you mean have I been to Taxes? The answer is no, I haven't been to southern USA at all, except Florida, and I don't think that counts as Bible Belt.

If you mean have I been to Alberta, I visited Alberta for ten days (and enjoyed my trip thoroughly). We visited Calgary, Banff, Lake Louise, Columbian Ice Field, Jasper etc.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

There's something amusing about the child of such a 'tolerant' 'liberal' person, who doesn't want to go somewhere because there might be scary people there, and who gets upset when the weather strands him for two days in the friendliest, most welcoming, wonderful party city in the country.

I laughed until I stopped, as they say.

The last laugh will be with London and surrounding areas, TenPenny. They will get a damn good Internist in 4 or 5 years. I assume having spend 8 or 9 years in London, he will settle somewhere in that area.

 

[countryboy]

I have a friend in South Carolina, he tells me the same thing about South Carolina. And do you mean have I been to Taxes? The answer is no, I haven't been to southern USA at all, except Florida, and I don't think that counts as Bible Belt.

Oh-oh. I just spotted another liberal Freudian slip up there, and it's a dandy. We can all tell what's on your mind, SirJP - the answer to all problems, right?

 

[SirJosephPorter]

"Force?" OK, Adolf.

Taking a more moderate, tolerant, and humane approach, how about educating, encouraging, and supporting the move toward better nutrition? Of course, you'd have to detach yourself for a minute from your totalitarian approach to all things human, but you might be surprised what can get done by individuals - even just the lowly "normal and common people" - when you show them better alternatives and help them achieve them.

Your comment, "If you cannot force people to eat right and exercise, the next best thing is to look after their health as best as we can. And that means taxation" is about what I'd expect...as usual, short-sightedness combined with the old "let's throw some money at it" approach to a problem.

You still haven't answered my question, countryboy. How do you force people to live right? Or if you don't like the word force, how do you persuade them to live right? There is already educational efforts as to which foods are best for you, the benefits of exercise etc. Apparently it doesn't have much effect.

Or do you wait until people learn their lesson, not provide health care in the meantime? Yes, that will be a sensible solution.

The fact is, some people are never going to eat right and exercise. The next best thing is provide health care for them.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Good morning, S.J. - I don't think it's so much a matter of forcing people to change their ways than to get them to want to. As I've said before I'm dead against raising taxes, but I think your suggestion is a good one in one respect, taxing people where they have a choice and that is to tax the hell out of salt, sugar, trans fats and saturated fats. That should kill two birds with one stone. McDonalds and their ilk will find it is probably just too expensive to cook with this crap (especially if they try to pass the price on to the consumer and the consumer quits buy it. There's French fries nad then there's French Fries. They don't have to be boiled in 3 gallons of grease. I make a damn fine French fry using a tablespoon or so of Olive oil and just baking on a pan in the oven., so I guess they could be change to "French baked" It's not just McDonald's there are other worse culprits, like Nalleys who are in the salt bagging business and throw in a couple of potato chips, or cheesies. Now the Gov''t can use half those taxes realized to pay down health costs and use the other half to set up organized physical fitness activities. I'm not sure if there is the technology to do it yet but I think it would be possible to give tax breaks to people who do regular strenuous exercise, but it would have to be fool proof as it would attract thousands of cheaters. Another thing Gov't could do is give tax breaks to restaurants that only serve healthy food or at least have a "health food section".

Tax incentives and extra taxation for the offenders may well be a solution. But here political influence, political lobbying come into force. The side which has the most political influence gets to call the shots. Still, I think some of the more liberal jurisdictions n USA, like California are working along those lines.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

There is the added benefit of learning a whole bunch of new words in the bars too. A great opportunity to actually learn more about the country and its people, as opposed to reading about it on Wikipedia.

You mean learn new words in the bars in the west? Sorry, my son doesn't visit bars (neither do I), he doesn't even drink alcohol. At the Thanksgiving meal I always offer him a glass of wine, he always refuses, with a faint undertone of righteousness.

You may consider him even more of a snob than you think I am.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

It sounds as if he made the right decision. Wasn't it north of London that the OPP officer was gunned down a couple of days ago? He should be OK though, if he stays to the inner part of London.

There are parts of London which are rough, as in any other city. However, overall crime rate in London and other Ontario cities is much lower than most of the cities in the West (as is shown in one of my previous posts). He was quite happy with the matching he got.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

It sounds as if he made the right decision. Wasn't it north of London that the OPP officer was gunned down a couple of days ago? He should be OK though, if he stays to the inner part of London.

He did not make the right decision. As I mentioned in my previous post, the matching program assigns you to a residency spot, you don’t have a choice in the matter. You either take it or leave it, and leaving it is not really an option.

So he would have gone anywhere he was assigned. Saskatoon, Winnipeg, even to Memorial University (his last choice). So you could say that the matching program made the right decision.

 

[JLM]

There are parts of London which are rough, as in any other city. However, overall crime rate in London and other Ontario cities is much lower than most of the cities in the West (as is shown in one of my previous posts). He was quite happy with the matching he got.

Crime could be a lucrative supplier of "work" for those in the medical profession- patching up old shot up gun slingers..................:lol:

 

[countryboy]

You mean learn new words in the bars in the west? Sorry, my son doesn't visit bars (neither do I), he doesn't even drink alcohol. At the Thanksgiving meal I always offer him a glass of wine, he always refuses, with a faint undertone of righteousness.

You may consider him even more of a snob than you think I am.

Well, it might surprise you to know that my drinking is limited to about 3 beers a year, and maybe a couple of glasses of wine. But I used to love going to bars to listen to the music, meet people, and have some fun. Most of the time, I drank iced tea but still had a good time. My "drinking buddies" loved it, 'cause they always had a driver.

That's not to say I never drank generously...I just lost my taste for it around the age of 20, as I had done my share of boozing from about the age of 15. Shocking, I know, but it's just another benefit of being from the country and learning about real life at an early age. That's what makes us "hillbillies" so wise. And conservative, too!

 

[countryboy]

You mean learn new words in the bars in the west?

Sorry, I wasn't clear. I was referring to St. John's, where the language is known to be a little bit "different." Especially in bars.

 

[JLM]

Well, it might surprise you to know that my drinking is limited to about 3 beers a year, and maybe a couple of glasses of wine. But I used to love going to bars to listen to the music, meet people, and have some fun. Most of the time, I drank iced tea but still had a good time. My "drinking buddies" loved it, 'cause they always had a driver.

That's not to say I never drank generously...I just lost my taste for it around the age of 20, as I had done my share of boozing from about the age of 15. Shocking, I know, but it's just another benefit of being from the country and learning about real life at an early age. That's what makes us "hillbillies" so wise. And conservative, too!

CB- It took me until about 45 to gain the wisdom you had gained by age 20, but like you good times were had gaining the wisdom, now I drink about the same amount you do, have found I can have fun just drinking coffee and enjoy others company until they get p*ssed to the point, where I feel like just quietly exiting............:lol::lol::lol::lol:

 

[countryboy]

You still haven't answered my question, countryboy. How do you force people to live right?

You can't, unless you drift so far to the left that you end up looking like the Soviet Union, complete with secret food police. I know that must sound tempting, but I'm not in favour of it.

Or if you don't like the word force, how do you persuade them to live right? There is already educational efforts as to which foods are best for you, the benefits of exercise etc. Apparently it doesn't have much effect.

Perhaps the "educational efforts" need to be reviewed. I haven't seen much evidence of them. Is there a course in schools called "Eating Right for your Health?" I think not. But there should be, and that's just one example. There is a long way to go on those efforts.

Or do you wait until people learn their lesson, not provide health care in the meantime? Yes, that will be a sensible solution.

You're kidding!? You sound like Paul Martin. Cut the health care and damn the consequences. And we all know what a fine mess that created. No, I have to disagree with you here. NOT providing health care is way too extreme, in my opinion. You're sounding like a neo-con this morning, but slightly meaner.

The fact is, some people are never going to eat right and exercise. The next best thing is provide health care for them.

Never say never. You give up way too easily. Have you never heard the expression..."If at first you don't succeed, try, try again."??? Of course, I think a few adjustments after the first try or two might be in order, but nonetheless, changing something as deeply entrenched as the North American Eating Culture is a big job and requires a lot of thought, attention, and work. It's not something you can simply throw money at, or seek an instant solution for, on Wikipedia. Nope, this one requires some real smarts and tenacity.

It's breaking new ground in a way. Something like building the first railroad across Canada. An unprecedented feat. Requiring the same level of unprecedented dedication. Do you think it's worth it? I do.

 

[Cliffy]

What the heck does any of this have to do with Bible Belts? Do thumpers eat less healthy, drink and exercise more or less, speak funnier than your regular bar fly? Who derailed this thread again?

By the way, the bible belt runs through every community. It is not geographically specific. They're Everywhere! Check under your bed at night before you go to sleep. They like to plant subliminal messages in your ears while you are unconscious and cannot defend yourself from their insidious natterings.

 

[JLM]

You can't, unless you drift so far to the left that you end up looking like the Soviet Union, complete with secret food police. I know that must sound tempting, but I'm not in favour of it.



Perhaps the "educational efforts" need to be reviewed. I haven't seen much evidence of them. Is there a course in schools called "Eating Right for your Health?" I think not. But there should be, and that's just one example. There is a long way to go on those efforts.


You're kidding!? You sound like Paul Martin. Cut the health care and damn the consequences. And we all know what a fine mess that created. No, I have to disagree with you here. NOT providing health care is way too extreme, in my opinion. You're sounding like a neo-con this morning, but slightly meaner.



Never say never. You give up way too easily. Have you never heard the expression..."If at first you don't succeed, try, try again."??? Of course, I think a few adjustments after the first try or two might be in order, but nonetheless, changing something as deeply entrenched as the North American Eating Culture is a big job and requires a lot of thought, attention, and work. It's not something you can simply throw money at, or seek an instant solution for, on Wikipedia. Nope, this one requires some real smarts and tenacity.

It's breaking new ground in a way. Something like building the first railroad across Canada. An unprecedented feat. Requiring the same level of unprecedented dedication. Do you think it's worth it? I do.

Just been waiting here with baited breath for an epistle from Ron to steer back from health to Bible thumping. Maybe we should change the title of this thread unless you are not done with Bible thumping/bashing. Meantime the way you two fellas are going is leading right back to User fees for health care- the sensible solution in the first place.

 

[JLM]

What the heck does any of this have to do with Bible Belts? Do thumpers eat less healthy, drink and exercise more or less, speak funnier than your regular bar fly? Who derailed this thread again?

By the way, the bible belt runs through every community. It is not geographically specific. They're Everywhere! Check under your bed at night before you go to sleep. They like to plant subliminal messages in your ears while you are unconscious and cannot defend yourself from their insidious natterings.

Great minds think alike, Cliff, you just read mine......:smile:

 

[countryboy]

What the heck does any of this have to do with Bible Belts? Do thumpers eat less healthy, drink and exercise more or less, speak funnier than your regular bar fly? Who derailed this thread again?

By the way, the bible belt runs through every community. It is not geographically specific. They're Everywhere! Check under your bed at night before you go to sleep. They like to plant subliminal messages in your ears while you are unconscious and cannot defend yourself from their insidious natterings.

Yeah, and the hotels are in on the conspiracy too. They're in thick with the Gideons...but the evidence is in the night table, not under the bed. :lol:

Hey Cliff...what diversion? The Bible Belts I know of (southern Manitoba, for example) are located in farming areas, for the most part. Farm areas produce food, and thus the discussion of food and its impact on our wellbeing is pertinent to the subject. I mean, if we start eating better, we'll do a better job of supporting our Bible Belt brothers, and they'll begat each other and go forth and multiply, etc. See? I made the connection! ;-)