Drunken Breast Feeding
- Thread starter Cannuck
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What I see is some people making the assumption that the breastfeeding and the breastfeeding alone is what got her arrested, not being drunk off her ass and causing a domestic disturbance. Hell, I have relatives who've been hauled in, held, and put on probation for being drunken morons in their own home WITHOUT kids around. Add a kid to the mix, let alone a six week old baby, and police have a pretty low tolerance for drunken idiocy.
My parents drank, my grandparents drank, yadda yadda yadda.... but they were responsible enough in how they did it that no one had to be called to make sure no one was being beaten to death.
As for the breastfeeding itself. I've had a beer or two while nursing. It was one of the sure fire ways to get a cranky child to finally have a much needed diaper filling moment. And I'm sure it was just as safe for their system in that dose as any medicine I could have used to intervene and give them some relief. But more than a beer... that's getting to the realm of making your kid flat out drunk. And while it might mean a nice quiet night for mom while babe sleeps, drugging kids is irresponsible. But, like anything that goes on with babies, the only time you're going to get busted for it is if someone notices or it becomes a problem.
My parents drank, my grandparents drank, yadda yadda yadda.... but they were responsible enough in how they did it that no one had to be called to make sure no one was being beaten to death.
As for the breastfeeding itself. I've had a beer or two while nursing. It was one of the sure fire ways to get a cranky child to finally have a much needed diaper filling moment. And I'm sure it was just as safe for their system in that dose as any medicine I could have used to intervene and give them some relief. But more than a beer... that's getting to the realm of making your kid flat out drunk. And while it might mean a nice quiet night for mom while babe sleeps, drugging kids is irresponsible. But, like anything that goes on with babies, the only time you're going to get busted for it is if someone notices or it becomes a problem.
That's why I asked what the legal limit for being drunk at home is.
Who knows what really happened?
There is no legal limit. There is a behavioural limit. If the police are called in for a domestic disturbance, you've breached that limit.
As for 'who knows what happened', I think the police who are saying it was about much more than breastfeeding, and the mother who pleaded guilty to neglect, might have a clue as to what all was going on.
How long ago was it that people clicked in and realized "gripe water" was booze?
At one time breast feeding wasn't advised due to pollutuion in mother's milk causing birth defects and cancers. Therer are still many regions where it isn't advised.
Where does the silliness end?
At one time breast feeding wasn't advised due to pollutuion in mother's milk causing birth defects and cancers. Therer are still many regions where it isn't advised.
Where does the silliness end?
I think most moms always knew if it had alcohol in it. When it still had booze in it was around the same time that people would dip soothers in whiskey for baby's sore gums. Gripe water here now has all the active ingredients it did before, minus the alcohol. My kids used it.
Many moms pour gravol, baby tylenol, and a host of other chemicals into their kids on a regular basis. A bit of alcohol in gripe water, or a drink in breastmilk isn't a huge issue.
The silliness is people buying into the media hype that claims that breastfeeding is all that's at issue in this case. They want to rile people up, sell the story, make it as sensational and infuriating as possible.
Where does it say "she was drunk off her ass"?
It's unclear how much Anavarina had to drink. Police never conducted a blood-alcohol test. Investigators believed she was drunk, and her arrest on a charge of child abuse and neglect did not require a test.
Nor does it say anything about her causing a domestic dispute. It says she claimed she was assaulted by her boy friend. She had signs of trauma as well. It doesn't say anything about the boy friend other than he wasn't there when police turned up and wasn't charged. Was it even investigated?
I know drunken idiocy but I've never been hauled in for anything like that. I didn't see anything reported about drunken idiocy. Just that she was breast feeding right in front of the police while they were trying to do their investigating. According to Grand Forks Police Lt. Rahn Farder, women don't breast feed children in front of them period.
Bit of a jump from breast feeding to beating someone to death in a drunken rage isn't it Kerrie?
There is nothing wrong with that if it's at an appropriate time. But as in the story here, the police didn't bother with any testing. They can tell when people are drunk. This is of course bull****. Other wise no one would need a breathalizer to be convicted in court of drunk driving. Simply the officer's say so would be the end of it.
I remember the doctor giving me a sip of whiskey to clear the phlem out of my throat and sinus when I was a little squirt.
Not illegal though. You can knock a kid right out when they are sick with over the counter drugs and no cop is going to bust in, arrest you and threaten to take the kiddies away.
This smells of some buddies on the force helping a buddy out with a cranky, problematic baby mama.
Karrie. You don't see the link between breastfeeding advisories, pollution and the massive onslaught of breast cancer?
If women really want the pink ribbons to do some good. Start stuffing them into the gears of industry.
An incident like this is just a social agency using obscure reasoning to exert more control and have the bleeding hearts with no clue endorse it.
If women really want the pink ribbons to do some good. Start stuffing them into the gears of industry.
An incident like this is just a social agency using obscure reasoning to exert more control and have the bleeding hearts with no clue endorse it.
When this story first broke months ago Unf it said that she called on a domestic disturbance, but when the police showed up was attempting to breast feed and was so drunk she couldn't even get the baby to her chest properly. The police told her to stop since it's bad for the baby and bottle feed it instead, but she kept trying. They called the hospital to find out if it was safe and what to do, and the hospital asked that the baby be brought in.
I can't find that original article under the swamp of op-ed pieces about it.
I can't find that original article under the swamp of op-ed pieces about it.
Sorry petros, but I simply ignored the sideline discussion. If you want to talk about why it's important for women to nurse, and to stick it to the powdered chemical industry that tries to tell women they know better than nature, by all means, have at it. It's just not pertinent to the discussion at hand.
I breastfed for 2 1/2 years straight. I never quit between pregnancies. I avoided formula like the plague. But, I also planned my partying so that
1) I was not drunk and responsible for trying to hold a fragile 6 week old baby.
2) I had pumped and stored so the baby could be fed 'clean' breast milk by someone who wasn't drunk.
3) I could pump and dump the booze laden milk.
There are safe ways to handle drinking and partying around your kids. And there are unsafe ways.
How many people on here have read the articles about the death of two girls on the Yellow Quill reserve, and wished that someone would have known that the only person in charge of them was drunk? If these officers had left, and she had fallen asleep on the baby (as mothers are often warned can happen even with cold medicines, etc), or worse, it had died of alcohol poisoning like the baby in Russia, (Baby dies after breastfeeding on drunk mother’s milk / MosNews.com) (yes, it's an extreme, outside, and rare case, but you get my point)... then what would the public outcry be?
How close of attention did you pay to sugar or caffeine intake during that time?
What is more dangerous to an infant? A drunk woman's milk or one who just ate a cake?
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Friends... As a social activist from way back- and there are more than a few of us here, we have to recognize we are all now, living that dream we never pondered.
Since the 60's-70's and thereafter social workers have been streaming from the universities in an effort to see that the children were always safe- and perpetrators were kept away. The government agencies since have swelled with to the enth degree with graduates of good intent.
Now we are griping at all our peers. -See! These once, 'former' Angels of Mercy are NOW outreaching their authority- now that the consequences effect Us and Ours. We Still demand our personal freedom over the health concerns of our children.
Many of These That Argue for their 'Freedom' have never even had a child, notice that?
Personal freedom DEMANDS personal responsibility.
As one of them and many of my friends... we of those 60's-70's movements... We, never got a large handle on that idea- responsibility.
Not until much later. Some never did, many today haven't a clue. Yes. Many many kids who were raised by us with these values of personal freedom- they have bought in- even if not, they've not had them demonstrated for them.
Gripe water, home recipes, or often "shared but parsed" drug use, are remnant solutions to the age old problem today.
Let the doctors give the advice and the social agencies do their thing, for they are tools for OUR society- we built.
If you can't stop parse-ing your own alcohol use- or drug use- while you have the responsiblity of a newborn or infant child or Older Child... get honest. Take a look at it, hey, let your family or fostercare raise it while you get your life together/or don't.
Don't be... -'Living'- like that young mother facing charges in Florida. ...Freedom? ...Responsibilty?
Brothers and Sisters, it is NOT an either/or anymore! :fish:
Well then allow me.
Mother Faces BWI Charge - April 28, 2009
Mother Faces BWI Charge - April 28, 2009
It's not even stated in the police report who called the police.
Nothing at all about having a problem getting the baby to the breast.
According to the police report, they thought she was drunk and though there isn't any clinical evidence to go on, they called the local hospital, talked to someone who works the graveyard shift who said after the police also told them about her prescription medication, to transport the baby to the hospital. No word on how the baby is.
They then charged her with criminal neglect for nothing other than breast feeding while she was what they considered drunk.
As for pleading guilty, the police over looked the knee to the chin and the smack in the face that the boy friend did and went whole hog on busting her for breast feeding her newborn at 4 in the morning. Nice that they managed to get her to plead to a lesser charge and not get listed as a danger to children.
It doesn't matter what oped pieces say, it's what in the police report that counts. And there is nothing in there showing her blood alcohol level was normal or not.
I submit that if she had a lawyer handy and the money to pay for it, she would have been out of jail before lunch time.
Nope I smell a rat here and I bet it's a pal on the police dept.
Come on. Someone drinking half a liter of pure alcohol isn't even in the same ball park as this. If you tried to drink the equivalent of that you would be on the floor. Hell, I would be on the floor.
Let's not take some extreme example to try and make this case bigger than it worth.
This lady needed someone to tell her to lay off the booze while taking care of her kids. I bet no one taught her a damn thing about drinking. Ten to one when she turned 21 it was open season on booze. Mix that with what was obviously an abusive relationship and lack of a support system and you get what amounts to dumb **** happening.
This young lady needs a mentor not a criminal record.
It seems odd that alcohol use is subject to discussion on where we place the bar of acceptable standards of consumption by infants. I don't really know what to say to you on that Unf, if you think there's wiggle room there, then I've gotta wonder just where YOU would place the bar.
I was generalizing in my comment - I don't know the specifics of the case, I'm simply observing that it seems pretty obvious that this is an avoidable type of harm - and the benefit to risk ratio doesn't quite pan out in favour of the child imo, so therefore it should be avoided.
As for no one being a perfect parent, you're right. It's impossible - that doesn't mean we shouldn't do the best job we can. When it comes to alcohol abuse with children, we know a hell of a lot more about the harmful effects than we did 20 years ago - so what's the point of acquiring knowledge about what's harmful for us and what isn't if we aren't going to apply that knowledge?
That's a far cry from swathing a kid in bubble wrap and shielding them from all types of harm that can occur in the course of everyday life. Making the leap into the realm of the ridiculous for the sake of argument seems like an illogical direction to take here...
Now this, you might be right about. I don't think my original comment in any way advocated for this mother to lose custody of her children, nor acquire a record. I simply felt that the comment that feeding a baby booze is different than assault doesn't make sense. Harm is harm. How that harm is delivered still seems like a strange distinction to make.
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