Agreed Zzarchov. One man can't move a boulder, two can, three can build a pyramid, four can move a mountain. And so it goes.
Writers union unhappy Leno wrote jokes for show
- Thread starter Praxius
- Start date
I can't figure out why anyone's watching Leno or Letterman for that matter, the greatest comedy skit ever seen by humankind is based on Pennsylvania Avenue. Complete with disappearing video tapes of CIA torture techniques, "outing" of CIA agents by the head commedian and his cadre, trillions funnelled to Carlyle and "Friends of the Administration", electoral processes fixed and Constitutions and Conventions disappearing before your eyes!
It's not just "comedy" its magic and "illusion" AKA Chris what's his name....
It's not just "comedy" its magic and "illusion" AKA Chris what's his name....
Remember those inspirational words of the Pharoes:
"There is nothing under the sun that cannot be accomplished when you have an inexhaustable supply of cheap labour."
Pangloss
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Leno inspires in me, the need to punch him the mouth, his brand of humour as I recall is the standard disin of banana republics and the poor. To me it embodys the imperial rot, he's not funny in my opinion, just an ignorant cruel big mouth. I'v only seen him acouple of times and that was enough, maybe that's not fair but to bad. I can't realy discuss the American entertainment scene because I don't follow it, I have a perfectly good picture window overlooking the bushes, I think that's better.
Interesting thing about those inexhaustable slaves, I read where there was never enough arible land to feed a crew of the proposed size for the known length of time to complete construction.
The conclusion was that some real good engineering had been forgotten, and that the builders were not slaves but professional Egyptian builders who worked permanently on state infrastructure projects. It was suggested that hydraulics were the main source of motive power and not masses of slaves, there was some discussion of canals from the nile to the construction sites.
So because they are not in your union, your union will give them a more difficult time looking for a job? That sounds real fair, considdering that person could be equal or better trained then those running the union.
And I am not in a union and yet I have a medical / dental plan, I have money going into my pension, and where I live, safety rules are required for everybody, and if the company is found negligent, then we know where that story goes. I have all my health and safety training and companies I work for have to to regular safety checks, tests and renew their certificates. I don't see any use for unions personally, as the above I currently have without. But then again, every industry and location on the planet is different.
Everybody get's screwed over in a job eventually in their lives.... that how you learn to look out for those crap jobs and know if someone's going to screw you over. I just call it experience, and I don't feel I need other's to tell me what's best for me.
But to each their own.
I can't remember where I saw this link, could have been posted here on this site before. It's showing how one man could move large blocks of stone like those of Stonehenge.
That's the problem right there, thinking you can get ahead of the company you work for.... quite the oxymoron. I personally look for a level of comfort in life that I require and nothing more. I don't try and milk a company for all it is worth and in turn they don't jerk me around. If I wanted to make it ahead of a company I worked for, I'd start my own.
So like the ancestors of black slaves, I owe unions something today?
Oh wait that's right too... US / Can differences. Shows how often I look at where someone is from.
And that's why I continually preached about revolution in the previous forum I went to. Ah... but nobody has the gusto to do that anymore these days. As you said, nobody thinks there's anything really wrong. Sure life isn't perfect one would say, but at least they're not in a 3rd world country.
But that doesn't mean you still have to put up with how you're living today. France goes on riots when a couple of kids get smacked up against a squad car while driving off on a bike.... I think the US is more then beyond warrented for a revolution.
But at the same time one has to be careful just how far they go with the powers of a union. Push too far and you begin to loose democracy and nudge a bit towards socialism. But is that a bad or good thing? Individuals decide I suppose.
Yeah but when the rich elite go out to the public and say something or do something really stupid... why not treat it with the "Let them Eat Cake" mentality, and have a bunch of executions and behead the dumb bastards? That's what we're missing these days.... the rich and the kings are no longer scared of their pesants, that was the whole point of the last 200 years people.... to scare the crap out of them by numbers.
Oh, Praxius, are you trolling?
Take some time to understand what I've written. What union will let a scab in? None.
What happens in our industry if you are not unionized? Employers screw you. Not the union.
Try reading my post again.
Pangloss
I know plenty about the industrial revolution and when unions came into play here in Canada, not the US.... trying to imply I know nothing about how and why they were created is just blaitenly ignorant on your part.
But just because I know the same things as you do, doesn't mean I'll come to the same conclusions as you have. Individuals are permitted to focus on other aspects on something.
And I never said Unions are a complete waste of time or never done any good.... I was arguing some of the things that they do. Please read more carefully next time.
You are right Praxius, you owe nobody anything. Not your parents who created and raised you, nor the state, who protected and educated you (I know, I know, the state is a big bad monster - see some of my posts on other threads), and certainly not the labour movement, who are to thank for things like an eight hour day, a five day work week, health and safety regulations, being paid in legal tender rather than company script, actually being paid at all.
I could continue, but why bother? All the blessings of your life are due to you and you alone.
Man, you must be one awesome guy.
Pangloss
I could continue, but why bother? All the blessings of your life are due to you and you alone.
Man, you must be one awesome guy.
Pangloss
Yes I read it well thank you..... reminds me of something a mobster would say. "Oh you need our protection from people smashing your store up"
AKA: "Oh you need to join our union or companies will screw you over.... oh and we'll make sure you don't get a job."
I'm not trolling by any sorts, you just pretty much proved my point.
Oh and if you didn't catch it, my point was that Unions are not all smiles and sunshine and I personally have issues with a couple of things that they do that I feel are unessicary..... I am not proclaiming we need to abolish them.
Stop trying to start an argument out of something that doesn't exist.
Uh huh... yes I'm such an ungreatful arsepucker arn't I? Because I question a couple of things in a specific situation, I'm totally against the system man.... Look out.... I'm such a rebbel. Where's my mom, I feel like smacking her around now all of a sudden.
If you're trying to get a rise out of me by fishing for things I never said, knock yourself out, I've been down this path once too often to bite. I stated my opinion, get over it. And no, I'm not Satan incarnate just yet... I still need to find a nice new born lamb to sacrafice.
You must also be blessed with trying to put words into people's mouths.
I do know how to entertain my party guests from time to time, if you are interested to know. I do a great Stewie Griffon.
I can't exactly see how one could misreprent you telling me I'm ungreatful for my parents raising and taking care of me.... kinda ignorant if you ask me, but meh, whatever you say
... is exactly what you say.
PS: I live in a Provence, not a State, same thing I know, but I like nit picking
... is exactly what you say.
PS: I live in a Provence, not a State, same thing I know, but I like nit picking
Well Praxius,
1.) The labour movement owes you nothing, anything they did they did in their own self-interest.
2.) If you bosses haven't carefully calculated how little they can pay you and at what point its cheaper to replace you, and don't intend to honour that, then they are stupid and will soon fall to a company who can do basic bookwork.
If you believe your company is not milking you, you better work for a sole proprietorship or a partnership. If you work for a corporation and they are being lax and corrupt, paying you more than they need to then they can be said to be breaching their fiduciary obligation.
If I buy stock in a company I won't settle for them letting low level corruption hurt my investment by paying you more than they need to.
If you're company isn't trying to get you to work for as little as possible then they are stupid at best and thieves at worst.
In that vein, you should be getting your full market value for your time. Work isn't a charity (and shouldn't be) for either side. Its not being evil for one person to try and get more from the other, that is the basis of our economic system. We aren't communists.
If your boss can replace you for cheaper, you shouldn't be trying to charge so much for your time and should expect to be fired. Likewise if you can get more compensation elsewhere, you should, you work for your boss you don't donate volunteer hours.
If you don't feel like getting the most compensation from your job, fine. But don't act all shocked and appalled when your boss jerks you around, that is his job that he gets paid for.
1.) The labour movement owes you nothing, anything they did they did in their own self-interest.
2.) If you bosses haven't carefully calculated how little they can pay you and at what point its cheaper to replace you, and don't intend to honour that, then they are stupid and will soon fall to a company who can do basic bookwork.
If you believe your company is not milking you, you better work for a sole proprietorship or a partnership. If you work for a corporation and they are being lax and corrupt, paying you more than they need to then they can be said to be breaching their fiduciary obligation.
If I buy stock in a company I won't settle for them letting low level corruption hurt my investment by paying you more than they need to.
If you're company isn't trying to get you to work for as little as possible then they are stupid at best and thieves at worst.
In that vein, you should be getting your full market value for your time. Work isn't a charity (and shouldn't be) for either side. Its not being evil for one person to try and get more from the other, that is the basis of our economic system. We aren't communists.
If your boss can replace you for cheaper, you shouldn't be trying to charge so much for your time and should expect to be fired. Likewise if you can get more compensation elsewhere, you should, you work for your boss you don't donate volunteer hours.
If you don't feel like getting the most compensation from your job, fine. But don't act all shocked and appalled when your boss jerks you around, that is his job that he gets paid for.
Understandable and all of which I agree to, and all of which is what I went through straight out of college... I then learned what to look out for, and I keep my job, my job. I have no issues leaving a company I feel I am being screwed around in, but every job thus far has been a step up from the last.... all I'm saying is I personally did not require a union to do any of this for me.
Quite honestly if I have any issues with my job and I feel my company isn't treating me fairly, then there's always the Labour Board whom I've called once or twice in my day which have helped set things straight. And the companies I worked for don't like them showing up, and they can't fire you because you reported them either.... lots of compensation comes from that if it happened.
But once again, before I get thrown into another misunderstood argument, My situation is not everybody's, and I imagine certain jobs may require unions.
I just think, back on topic a bit, that if Jay can do the job himself and is willing to do so, then why can't he? I mean, sure he signed a contract within the union, so legally he's screwed I guess. But what happens when there's a deal made, they all stop the strike, go back to work, and then Jay and the rest of the show decide they don't need writters anyways and fire/lay them all off as a shift in company management?
Couldn't they just do that now during the strike and be done with it? Or is there something in the contract which states a company can not do this? (Ligit questions as I don't know exactly)
Quite honestly if I have any issues with my job and I feel my company isn't treating me fairly, then there's always the Labour Board whom I've called once or twice in my day which have helped set things straight. And the companies I worked for don't like them showing up, and they can't fire you because you reported them either.... lots of compensation comes from that if it happened.
But once again, before I get thrown into another misunderstood argument, My situation is not everybody's, and I imagine certain jobs may require unions.
I just think, back on topic a bit, that if Jay can do the job himself and is willing to do so, then why can't he? I mean, sure he signed a contract within the union, so legally he's screwed I guess. But what happens when there's a deal made, they all stop the strike, go back to work, and then Jay and the rest of the show decide they don't need writters anyways and fire/lay them all off as a shift in company management?
Couldn't they just do that now during the strike and be done with it? Or is there something in the contract which states a company can not do this? (Ligit questions as I don't know exactly)
The union contract with the employer is a business contract, it's binding on both parties, no superstar, sports celebrity or professional of any kind would even consider entering into a business arangement without the protection of business agents or union representation, but we hear from those at or near the top that a union contract is no longer necessary because of advancements of workers rights under law, nothing could be furthur from the truth.
The dismemberment of the union movement began in ernest with Ronald Reagan at the onset of the neo-liberal revolution which in fact was a counterrevolution conducted by the capitalists, it was sucessful and it has cost the working class untold harm. The rollback of the rights of workers has continued unabated since that time, it is near complete, there's virtually nothing but the hollow shell left. Pensions and benefits of all description have been eviserated in the name of corporate efficiency sold under the misnomer of individual criticle thought and personal responsibility. When I joined the work force we had protections and laws that todays newbee to the work force can only dream about. Today wages and working conditions continue to race to the bottom, the capitalists want us working under third world conditions as thier bible commands.
No one would expect Sydney Crosbey or a construction company to conduct thier business without argreement under contract but when a mechanic or a supermarket clerk wants the same thing they are branded as lazy good for nothing malcontents intent on nothing more than solidifying thier shiftless laziness into law. It's always been that way, the men and women of the labour movement are responsible for raising the standard of living of the working class that enabled most of the prosperity we have enjoyed over the last century and a half, if not for them life as we know it would be a decidedly different and empty thing.
When you go to work you are selling your skills which you have paid to develope, if you sell yourself without union or business agent protection of the legal contract you can bet you're getting shafted in 95 of 100 cases. That, far from being radical thought, is in fact only common sense of the most rudimentry order.
The dismemberment of the union movement began in ernest with Ronald Reagan at the onset of the neo-liberal revolution which in fact was a counterrevolution conducted by the capitalists, it was sucessful and it has cost the working class untold harm. The rollback of the rights of workers has continued unabated since that time, it is near complete, there's virtually nothing but the hollow shell left. Pensions and benefits of all description have been eviserated in the name of corporate efficiency sold under the misnomer of individual criticle thought and personal responsibility. When I joined the work force we had protections and laws that todays newbee to the work force can only dream about. Today wages and working conditions continue to race to the bottom, the capitalists want us working under third world conditions as thier bible commands.
No one would expect Sydney Crosbey or a construction company to conduct thier business without argreement under contract but when a mechanic or a supermarket clerk wants the same thing they are branded as lazy good for nothing malcontents intent on nothing more than solidifying thier shiftless laziness into law. It's always been that way, the men and women of the labour movement are responsible for raising the standard of living of the working class that enabled most of the prosperity we have enjoyed over the last century and a half, if not for them life as we know it would be a decidedly different and empty thing.
When you go to work you are selling your skills which you have paid to develope, if you sell yourself without union or business agent protection of the legal contract you can bet you're getting shafted in 95 of 100 cases. That, far from being radical thought, is in fact only common sense of the most rudimentry order.
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In those cases I'd have to say they earned it darkbeaver. If they got those concessions it means they bargained better and convinced more people to be anti-union.
An considering the point of unions is to boost the price of the commodity sold (for all types of unions, not just labour unions), that means unions have gotten such a bad reputation that higher wages and more security isn't enough to secure peoples interests.
Alot of that I can say first hand is bad on the unions part, there has been alot of corruption and a lot of poor decisions made on unions parts.
Often these could be corrected with serious effort, but alot of unions haven't done any ernest and well planned moves to correct this.
Ie, Often as you are, I've heard union activists blaming changes started by Reagan. When a guy wins 49 states and is venerated almost as a living saint, true or not, blaming the guy for anything probably won't help your cause. Which is what im talking about. If anyone wants to seriously change a unions PR they should probably hire a PR firm.
An considering the point of unions is to boost the price of the commodity sold (for all types of unions, not just labour unions), that means unions have gotten such a bad reputation that higher wages and more security isn't enough to secure peoples interests.
Alot of that I can say first hand is bad on the unions part, there has been alot of corruption and a lot of poor decisions made on unions parts.
Often these could be corrected with serious effort, but alot of unions haven't done any ernest and well planned moves to correct this.
Ie, Often as you are, I've heard union activists blaming changes started by Reagan. When a guy wins 49 states and is venerated almost as a living saint, true or not, blaming the guy for anything probably won't help your cause. Which is what im talking about. If anyone wants to seriously change a unions PR they should probably hire a PR firm.