Who's right to choose, a womans right to choose.

[tracy]

BTW, I've seen the wear 2 condoms idea a couple of times on this thread, and if anyone was being serious, don't. 2 condoms increases the chances of a tear occuring because of the increased friction so that actually makes them less effective. One is best.

 

[Kreskin]

So its better that the child grow up in a hostile environment knowing "Daddy" is only around because the courts forced him to be? I hope "Mommy" has a good physiologist on hand. Should a child be broughtup in a loving and wanted place? I mean what are you really talking about? Custody? no. Child support? Keep it! if a man is only sticking around because some judge ordered it what does it do to that child your so concerned about?

The courts decide things based on the needs of the child, not the parents, and they only act under civil law when the issue is brought before them. They certainly don't force people to live under the same roof.

 

[selfactivated]

Plan Parenthood in texas suggested 2 condums. I called before I gave the kids the talk.

 

[selfactivated]

The courts decide things based on the needs of the child, not the parents, and they only act under civil law when the issue is brought before them. They certainly don't force people to live under the same roof.

Again how would a child FEEL knowing "Daddy" is only in his life because "mommy" took him to court for money? You asked about the childs feelings so Im trying to get you to see how a child would feel without telling ANOTHER story from MY life.

 

[Kreskin]

Again how would a child FEEL knowing "Daddy" is only in his life because "mommy" took him to court for money? You asked about the childs feelings so Im trying to get you to see how a child would feel without telling ANOTHER story from MY life.

They would grow up feeling better knowing Daddy skipped town and refused to help because the child could've been aborted or given away? Interesting.

 

[selfactivated]

Id rather grow up Loved by a stranger than by someone who kept me out of obligation.

Ok I warned you.

Critter was a total whoops but when I told his dad I was pregnant he took me for a ride on a 750 honda at 90 miles an hour going down the I 5. He tried to toss me off the back! When he could do it he stopped the bike and ditched me. A cop came by picked me up took me home and the next week I packed my stupid arse up and got outta dodge! 7 1/2 months later I had my sweet Angel. No "daddy" to damper our family. Later his "dad" hunted ME down! and he was awarded visitation rights......grrrrrrrrr........I wont tell you what that sperm doner did to all three of my children. Lets just say he spent time in jail after the police beat the daylights outta him. So. Was "Daddy" worth having around? Nope.

Im NOT saying EVERY situation is as extreme as mine BUT you keep saying "what about the child?" I say the same thing, "What about the child?" Each situation is different. Hell theres no REAL answers just hopes that us stupid humans dont kill our young trying to do the "right" thing by them.

 

[tracy]

Plan Parenthood in texas suggested 2 condums. I called before I gave the kids the talk.

Then they are giving outdated info and you might want to refresh that with your daughters! 2 condums is a BIG no no. I love Planned Parenthood though, I have their t shirt that says "parenthood should always be a choice".

http://www.plannedparenthood.org/birth-control-pregnancy/birth-control/condom.htm

From one of their FAQ sites:
http://www.ppsp.org/askbeth.asp?show_section=display_a_month&startDate=2/1/2003
Extra Protection?I'm very scared that i might be pregnant. I mean i didn't take birth control but he did use 2 condoms and that was the first time i have ever had sex.
.....
Ashley

Dear Ashley,
Definitely take a pregnancy test! You seem really worried and a pregnancy test will tell you what is going on.

You did the right thing by using condoms to protect yourself. However, using two condoms at once can be dangerous. The condoms rub against each other and that can cause tears in the condoms. If their are tears then semen could leak out. Next time only use one condom- male or female.

 

[selfactivated]

Thank you Love I will update them on our next phone call. They live in Texas. I support Plan Parenthood every time I have an extra fiver. They're a great organization.

 

[tracy]

Glad to hear I'm not the only one who likes them There are a lot of planned parenthood haters out there, but I really like them. When I'm ready for a 9-5 job, they are definitely on the top of my list. I get my exams and birth control from them and they are always great. I'm going in next week... I really like my marine, but don't want a baby yet

 

[selfactivated]

Smart girly Kids are the best but best planned for. Being a Mom sure teaches you about how the world got so screwed up lol. Enjoy your marine Im looking fore a 6' 4" Viking that loves Witches LOL Im at that age were I dont worry about being pregnant so I just enjoy

 

[Zzarchov]

Im reminded about how other cultures traditionally delt with these issues.

Male Dominated cultures..we'll, we know that song and dance, women are property. Im glad we've moved away from that.

Female Dominated or Gender Neutral cultures, in the vast majority Fathers aren't concidered related to their children, its none of their business. The woman chose to have sex, its her kid.

I could definately see the later working, if a woman chooses to have unsafe sex..thats her perogative and her kid.

But asking women to share equal responsibility to men would never fly.


I always liked the option where either parent could put their half of parental rights and responsibilities up for adoption without the consent of the other. If you didn't want to be a father you could offer some childless man the rights (and responsibilities) of being the childs father, and the biological mother could deal with it since the babies right to a proper father who can support it outweighs her choice to have unsafe sex.

 

[Ariadne]

Ariadne

Those were pretty generalized statements condemning all males to this child role you paint. I hope you know there are some very responsible young men out there who would love to find a girl to marry and start a family with.

Let's not put all men into one category ... and your contributions to this thread are wonderful.... I am only surprised you wrote that last one in such sweeping condemnation....

I think that was my early morning absolute lack of patience with people that whine because they can't have their way after getting a girl pregnant. I know that not all men are irresponsible and I certainly meant no offense to the rednecks either. I have children and know that many men are most eager to step up to the plate and take responsibility for their children, even after divorce.

 

[Curiosity]

Ariadne

Well said - I thought you might be tiring of the circular motion the topic was taking too....it just didn't fit into your great earlier thoughts - rednecks bashing included hahaha...

I think we are on parallel track thoughts regarding one's sense of responsibility to self and consequences of poorly thought out actions...

 

[Ariadne]

There's alot of things in life that aren't fair. Men's 'rights' regarding pregnancy may not be fair, but given how our biology works, it's impossible to fairly place the burden on both partners shoulders. It is the woman who is pregnant, not the man. Period. ....

I completely agree that, as parents, we have a responsibility to educate our children to celebrate the differences between men and women, not bemoan the fact that we don't have equality. Both sexes have pluses and minuses when it comes to pregnancy but the best way to protect everyone's rights is to secure that little document that says Certificate of Marriage. It makes everything easier in terms of rights and responsibilities in the event that parents want to part ways. Children "Hollywood style" (without marriage) are great for people that can hire nannys, house keepers, lawn keepers and private jets, but regular people need legal documents to protect their rights. Accidental pregnancy leaves the woman in a very precarious situation and unless the man steps up to the plate and solidifies the relationship, he's basically telling the woman (even without words) that he's not interested in the child.

 

[selfactivated]

I completely agree that, as parents, we have a responsibility to educate our children to celebrate the differences between men and women, not bemoan the fact that we don't have equality. Both sexes have pluses and minuses when it comes to pregnancy but the best way to protect everyone's rights is to secure that little document that says Certificate of Marriage. It makes everything easier in terms of rights and responsibilities in the event that parents want to part ways. Children "Hollywood style" (without marriage) are great for people that can hire nannys, house keepers, lawn keepers and private jets, but regular people need legal documents to protect their rights. Accidental pregnancy leaves the woman in a very precarious situation and unless the man steps up to the plate and solidifies the relationship, he's basically telling the woman (even without words) that he's not interested in the child.

Im sorry but I totally disagree. I was a better single parent than a couple. My kids were happier and better adjusted. As for the redneck commit? I will have to agree but thats another thread lol And marrage doesnt mean good parenting. been there done that dont need another ride

 

[CDNBear]

[/color]
So forcing a women to go through with an unwanted pregnancy is ok? That doesn’t infringe on her rights? Are you kidding me? Until you can take that child and put it inside the man that so desperately wants the little brat its all my decision if you don’t like it. Don’t have sex with women who don’t want them.

Actually I was referring to infringing on the mans rights not be a Father.

 

[CDNBear]

A woman cannot force a man to be a father, the most she can expect is that he provide financially and even that is a struggle for many women in Canada today - it's not exactly something men step up and volunteer for.

This is the meat of my point. EXPECT FINANCIAL SUPPORT.

Why should she expect it?

Who is she to dictate to another free sentiant being what they may or may not do, if no one can tell her what to do?

 

[CDNBear]

It seems to me that we're approaching this from the point of blaming the woman for something that is within her rights. The real issues are that a man wants a child, but knocking up a woman doesn't satisfy his needs OR a man doesn't want a child, but he consented to that actions that would result in a child. Seems to me the man needs psychological help.

Is that realy constructive or called for?

I understand your position, but bashing men is not the answer.

If you have the right to spread'em and have some fun to, but oops, something goes wrong, you can abort or carry it out. The man does not have an option here. That is unfair period.

Just because two concenting adults have sex, does not give a woman the right to pick the pocket of someone for the next 18 to 26 years.

The woman should be accountable for her particapation in the act, and if she choses to go it, then she should bear the burden, alone.

 

[CDNBear]

I responded to your "options" comment. I couldn't give a rats butt if a woman has an option that a guy doesn't. I'm concerned with the welfare of a child. If he doesn't want to opt in he shouldn't opt in in the first place.

So abstenance is your personal choice for contraception?

How unrealistic is that in this country. In so many rural areas, all there is to do, is F**K and watch the grass grow.

Lets stay real here.

 

[CDNBear]

So she should just be F'd for the rest of her life, as well as the kid. Or she should have the abortion or ship it off to another family? Get real.

YES

Now your gettin it.

If she has all the options, she can deal with there ramifications. What gives her the right to screw over a man for the rest of his life?

I'm not talking about a couple here, that chose to have a kid and then split, we're talkin casual sex and mishap.