Voters go to the polls in the UK General Election

coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
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Chillliwack, BC
It's funny that you say the DUP is nationalist. I mean, you're not wrong. They are British nationalists, but they are a Northern Irish Unionist party. Calling a unionist party in Northern Ireland nationalist is hilarious. Just proves how idiotic nationalism is.

There will always be a debate as to what constituent parts of political confederation comprise a 'nation'. I prefer to side with existing constitutional demarcations. And nationalism is the only alternative to the economic, moral and social dissolution being cast upon us by globalism.. which hands all power to supranational agencies, banks and corporations.. which are utterly self serving and amoral.
 
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Corduroy

Senate Member
Feb 9, 2011
6,670
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Vancouver, BC
There will always be a debate as to what constituent parts of political confederation comprise a 'nation'. I prefer to side with existing constitutional demarcations.

LOL wut?

Are you working on a definition of "nation" that means whatever boundaries a particular state happens to have?
 

coldstream

on dbl secret probation
Oct 19, 2005
5,160
27
48
Chillliwack, BC
LOL wut?

Are you working on a definition of "nation" that means whatever boundaries a particular state happens to have?


Sure if they were deliberatively constituted by historical, political and cultural forces.. and if they are systematically confirmed through democratic processes.. like the UK.. like Canada. The alternative is to have ever more narrowly defined constituencies claiming 'nationhood'.. many imposed by ideological or cultural definitions by an intellectual elite over the best interests and viability of a community.
 
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Corduroy

Senate Member
Feb 9, 2011
6,670
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Vancouver, BC
Funny, you said you were working with a definition that means the boundaries a particular state happens to have, then you go on to use other metrics. I think what you really mean is that borders should have anything to do with it. Occasionally borders reflect historical and cultural forces, but if borders go against that, then seems like you shouldn't rely on borders.
 

Tecumsehsbones

Hall of Fame Member
Mar 18, 2013
60,475
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I can't figure out what possessed Teresa May to call this election in the first place.
She thought she could win a bigger Tory majority.

Pretty much everybody has said this. Heck, May herself has admitted it. Your failure to understand is. . . perplexing.

Let me put it to you in terms your alleged mind may actually be able to grasp: she wanted a bigger, stronger majority. She thought she could get one by calling the election when she did. She was wrong.

Hope that helps.
 

Murphy

Executive Branch Member
Apr 12, 2013
8,181
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Ontario
The chickens have come home to roost.

Sinn Fein has 7 seats, but they won't show up for the Parliamentary hijinx. That won't help stabilize a minority govt. EU negotiations will be messed up. With Labour the big winner, BL may want to end it all. Jump from a bridge, or leap in front of a train. Tickets for the event will be available in the lobby.

And, of course, this thread is deserving of the dancing baby, because, they're Brits after all. With few, if any, redeeming qualities. Let the games begin! Caesar gives the UK a 'usque pollices'.



[youtube]-5x5OXfe9KY[/youtube]
 

justlooking

Council Member
May 19, 2017
1,312
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I can't figure out what possessed Teresa May to call this election in the first place.

The only good thing about this is the minority partner is going to be the Democratic Unionists who are true social conservatives, anti EU, and nationalists. Hopefully they'll keep May honest. But i suspect a Brexit 'Light' will start to dominate the agenda with some lip service to sovereignty and capitulation to Brussels on trade and immigration.

One of the Conservative wags on the BBC ....


1. May was constantly interfered with by people like Gina Miller and her daily lawsuits, but more importantly the House of Lords;
some Lords were whining about especially May not having a mandate for Brexit, and thus they could interfere with the legislative process in the Commons.

Tories were 20 points ahead in the polls, Jeremy Corbyn was fighting a full blown civil war in the Labour Party, and 4 million
UKIP voters could be wooed to vote for the Tories if they took the bull by the horns with Brexit.

There was never going to be a better time to call an election. And then she pulled a Hillary and completely self destructed.+


2. We'll see about the DUP. Their desire to keep an open border in Ireland, with some staying in the single market,
and Brexit would be effectively cancelled. Too bad for the Brits, and the rest of Europe.

3. Please don't think Anna Soubry counts for anything in the Tory Party.
 

Corduroy

Senate Member
Feb 9, 2011
6,670
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Vancouver, BC
1. May was constantly interfered with by people like Gina Miller and her daily lawsuits, but more importantly the House of Lords;
some Lords were whining about especially May not having a mandate for Brexit, and thus they could interfere with the legislative process in the Commons.

Tories were 20 points ahead in the polls, Jeremy Corbyn was fighting a full blown civil war in the Labour Party, and 4 million
UKIP voters could be wooed to vote for the Tories if they took the bull by the horns with Brexit.

There was never going to be a better time to call an election. And then she pulled a Hillary and completely self destructed.+

She also pulled a Hillary Clinton by underestimating a populist message.

2. We'll see about the DUP. Their desire to keep an open border in Ireland, with some staying in the single market,
and Brexit would be effectively cancelled. Too bad for the Brits, and the rest of Europe.

I read the DUP was pro-Brexit. Was I mistaken?
 

Curious Cdn

Hall of Fame Member
Feb 22, 2015
37,070
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This just in:

In the most audacious attack yet, yesterday in Britain millions of ISIS terrorists armed with ballot papers blew up the Tory majority. Numbers of dead and wounded are not known, but the one confirmed death is the UK Independence Party.

British Prime Monster Theresa May recovered from perhaps the most epic political failure since. . . well. . . the last Tory PM, by immediately contacting the Orange Order in Belfast and securing their agreement to coalition. "I'm not sure what they asked for, because who can understand those Paddy thugs?" said Mrs. May, "But I am sure that the political sons of Ian Paisley will never cause trouble or betray me. I'm sure if we let them murder a few more Taigs, they'll be content."

Mrs. May has promised to ramp up the fight against radical Muslim terrorism by cutting more police from the rolls and further alienating Continental allies.

Yeah. May sold her soul to the Orangemen. As a matter of fact, she spent the entire day trying to make orange juice out of mouldy lemons.
 

Murphy

Executive Branch Member
Apr 12, 2013
8,181
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Ontario
That is a minority position. I hope you are a minority.

The pundits will have a field day with her. And deservedly so.


Gerry Adams

"I don't know how Theresa May can survive this. It is putting a big focus on Brexit because she went out to get a vote for a hard Brexit.

"The people here in this state voted to remain. It's been ignored by the DUP, the UUP and Theresa May."

[youtube]Zdjl521oUdY[/youtube]
 
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Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
49,948
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Wow, just wow. What a mess. Pollsters all wrong again. UK swirling around the bowl. Pound dumped 2%.
The Brussels gang must be rubbing their hands will glee.
Not sure if May will survive the day.

In 2015 we were predicting a Hung Parliament (which we got in 2010 for the first time since 1974) and talking about what sort of Coalition Government we were going to set up and instead got a Tory victory.

In 2017 we were predicting a Tory victory and instead got a Hung Parliament and are talking about what sort of Coalition Government we are going to set up.

As the leader of the party which got most votes and most seats, the now lame-duck Theresa May is first to be given the opportunity to try and form a government. Her party won 318 seats, which is eight short of the 326 needed for victory, so May is now in talks with Northern Ireland's right-wing (anti-abortion, anti-gay rights, anti-EU) Democratic Unionist Party (DUP), led by former Northern Ireland First Minister Arlene Foster, to try and form a Coalition Government with them or, if not a formal Coalition, what is known as a "confidence and supply" arrangement with them. The DUP won 10 seats in this election, so that means a Tory deal with them would set up a government with 328 seats, just giving May a majority.

DUP Leader Arlene Foster Giving A Statement On Forming Government With Tories


What I like about UK elections is just how many parties there are. It may seem like the country is more divided, and I guess it is, but it also demonstrates more democratic participation.

Here are the final results

Conservatives - 318
Labour - 261
Scottish National - 35
Liberal Democrat -12
Democratic Unionist - 10
Sinn Fein - 7
Plaid Cymru - 4
Green - 1

The previous parliament had 3 more parties. The Conservatives lost 12 seats, Labour gained 29 and SNP lost 21.

What does it all mean? It's obvious that despite still being the biggest party the Conservatives gambled and lost. Jeremy Corbyn was laughed at for having 30 year old social policies. Before the election his poll numbers were historically low for a Labour leader, which is part of the reason why Theresa May called an election. How did they turn it around? Can we chalk it up to Labour policies actually resonating with voters? Maybe voters were annoyed with an obviously cynical and politically motivated snap election? I've heard it suggested that the Conservative campaign just wasn't organized or maybe complacency and polling kept Conservative voters at home and brought out younger voters.

Labour finished on 262 seats. There was one last seat which took a while to declare because it was very tight between the Tories and Labour, so it was recounted once or twice to make sure. It went to Labour.

Jeremy Corbyn was unpopular amongst much of the Labour Party, thinking that his relationship with the IRA and 1970s-style socialist, Marxist, Far-Left beliefs would lead his party to electoral oblivion. Instead he performed much better during the election campaign than many people thought he would. He went out and met the voters, always has a smile on his face and seemed positive. He also engaged with younger people, amongst whom he's popular with, and he got them to come out and vote, which led to a far higher turnout this time around. He took part in the TV leaders' debates. By contrast, May seemed to be always dour, emotionless and wooden. She even refused to take part in some TV debates. Another mistake of hers was introducing a deeply unpopular policy on social care in the Conservative manifesto which, which she launched in Halifax. That policy proved unpopular amongst voters. That's why we now have the strange situation where May won the election (albeit with no majority) but feels as though she lost it, and Corbyn lost the election but now feels as though he won it.

As for May, I think she now has just months left in her job. She'll stay as PM for now and when the Brexit negotiations get underway on 19th June, but it'll not be long until she's replaced as Tory leader and PM. Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson, the leader of the victorious Leave campaign, is the bookies' favourite. The Home Secretary Amber Rudd is another one tipped to be the new PM, as is Anna Soubry. Another one who might run to be the new PM is Adam Afriyie, the MP for Windsor, who has been tipped to be "Britain's Obama." The Chancellor of the Exchequer Philip Hammond and the Brexit Secretary David Davis are also hotly tipped.

There is even a chance that we might have yet another General Election, this time in the autumn, to try and get rid of the Hung Parliament. That could very well sweep Corbyn into No10 or, if they have a new leader by then, see the Tories re-establish a majority.

Next PM?



Boris Johnson, the bookies' favourite


Anna Soubry


Amber Rudd


Philip Hammond


David Davis



Adam Afriyie

That is a minority position. I hope you are a minority.

The pundits will have a field day with her. And deservedly so.


Gerry Adams

"I don't know how Theresa May can survive this. It is putting a big focus on Brexit because she went out to get a vote for a hard Brexit.

"The people here in this state voted to remain. It's been ignored by the DUP, the UUP and Theresa May."

[youtube]Zdjl521oUdY[/youtube]

People should explains to that terrorist that the people of the United Kingdom voted Leave.

Therefore the whole of the United Kingdom - Northern Ireland, Scotland, England and Wales - is leaving the European Union. That's democracy.

The only good thing about this is the minority partner is going to be the Democratic Unionists who are true social conservatives, anti EU, and nationalists. Hopefully they'll keep May honest. But i suspect a Brexit 'Light' will start to dominate the agenda with some lip service to sovereignty and capitulation to Brussels on trade and immigration.

Labour's Shadow Brexit Secretary Sir Keir Starmer said that he wants to end free movement of people. So even if there's another election soon and Labour wins it - and now there's a good chance they might - it seems we shouldn't have to worry about the UK still having to accept free movement of people.

Also, Corbyn is a Eurosceptic and there are rumours he voted Leave in the referendum, unlike May who was a member of the Remain camp. Corbyn has been a fierce critic of the EU for decades.

Another thing about this election result is the collapse of the Scottish nationalists - the people who held a Scottish independence referendum in 2015 and lost. In the 2015 election they won a whopping 56 seats - out of the 59 Scottish seats in the Commons - and vowed to hold another independence referendum soon. But in this election they have ended up with just 35 seats, a loss of 21, with a lot of those seats going to the Tories in a land which, for the last 60 years, has been relatively Tory-free (that was the only good thing for the Tories in this election). In fact, the traditionally anti-Tory Scotland now has more Tories than it has had since the 1955 election. So that huge collapse for the nationalists in Scotland now must mean that Scottish independence is off the cards. The Scots have shown that they don't want it.

The final results in detail

Results of the 2017 General Election - BBC News

The new make-up of the Commons:

Conservatives: 318 seats (-13 seats) (13,667,213 votes)
Labour: 262 (+30) (12,874,985)
Scottish National Party (SNP): 35 (-21) (977,569)
Liberal Democrats: 12 (+4) (
2,371,772)
Democratic Unionist Party (DUP): 10 (+2) (292,316)
Sinn Fein: 7 (+3) (238,915)
Plaid Cymru: 4 (+1) (164,466)
Green Party: 1 (0) (525,371)

Turnout: 68.7%
Electorate: 46,843,896
 
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mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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Blackleaf three days ago: 'Theresa May is the next Margaret Thatcher.'

Today: 'Everything's just fine and she'll be replaced in a few months.'
 

Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
49,948
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Blackleaf three days ago: 'Theresa May is the next Margaret Thatcher.'

Today: 'Everything's just fine and she'll be replaced in a few months.'

Just like the Tory press.

A few days ago, The Sun and Daily Mail were hailing her as a Thatcherite-Churchillesque saviour. Now they want rid of her.
 

tay

Hall of Fame Member
May 20, 2012
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I want Boris to be PM. Then we can watch him and Trump discuss hair styles......