Victim blames Children’s Aid Society for years of abuse by guardian

[captain morgan]

But I am also realistic about the legal roles and responsibilities of the government once they declare a child a ward of the state. And it's not simply about deep pockets, it's about the direct responsibility, who was in charge, who was seeing the files and making the decisions.

There is nothing in this statement that justifies why there should be a difference between the punitive measures applied to CAS and the bio mother.

You want this to be exclusively about the files, knowledge and decision-making process when in fact it is a highly complex scenario.

I don't think that you're fool-hardy enough to believe that CAS would knowingly place a child with a convicted felon with a documented drug habit.

When you have a child in your care, and their file includes....

Drug abuse.

Criminal back ground.

Criminal activity occurring in the home.

Abuse allegations.

Neglect allegations.

.... it is NOT hindsight, to know that they should be placed in a different foster home.

I really wonder how close this might be to the description of the mother.

 

[karrie]

I don't think that you're fool-hardy enough to believe that CAS would knowingly place a child with a convicted felon with a documented drug habit..

Did you not read the article? Hookers, drugs, and a known criminal record.

There is nothing in this statement that justifies why there should be a difference between the punitive measures applied to CAS and the bio mother.

You want this to be exclusively about the files, knowledge and decision-making process when in fact it is a highly complex scenario.

I really wonder how close this might be to the description of the mother.

Yes I want it to be about the files, because one was making direct decisions about these kids, and one wasn't.

The mother had no control over those kids, CAS did. They were legal wards of the crown, under the direct care and control of CAS.

CAS kept her and her half-brother in his care despite Hassan’s drug use, criminal record and neighbours’ reports of neglect and abuse.

"He was a single man with a criminal record who had no connection to me. Why would he want to parent me?”

CAS granted Hassan custody of the girl because he already had custody of her half-brother despite the fact that Hassan already had five criminal convictions.
“I read the CAS reports when I was 17 years old, I was one of nine children born to a drug-addicted mother and all nine were seized. My older sister was adopted, yet I was given to him,” the victim said. “My CAS reports, a police file, showed a babysitter noticed I had soreness and redness in my genital area when I was eight years old.
“There were reports that we were malnourished and grossly underweight while we were living in Regent Park (until 1999) — we barely had enough to eat.”
When the girl was seven years old, reports of drug use and prostitutes frequenting Hassan’s Regent Park apartment forced the CAS to apprehend the two children.
Once Hassan completed drug rehab, both children — who cannot be identified due to a publication ban — were returned to his care and the family moved to another neighbourhood in the GTA.

Just a quick review of the original post.

 

[Sal]

Did you not read the article? Hookers, drugs, and a known criminal record.




Yes I want it to be about the files, because one was making direct decisions about these kids, and one wasn't.

The mother had no control over those kids, CAS did. They were legal wards of the crown, under the direct care and control of CAS.

not to mention that zero would be served by hunting down some ill, drug addicted woman...there is no purpose in it other than spending more time and money and resources which should be poured into an already over burdened system.

No one rescued mum that's for sure when she just kept pushing out more babies. Now let's punish her further.

This thread has blown my mind.

 

[captain morgan]

Did you not read the article? Hookers, drugs, and a known criminal record.

I sure did. And IF CAS placed these kids with the abuser with full knowledge in advance of convictions and proven/documented drug abuse (not allegations), then they should be tried and face the consequences.

I will heartily support that once buddy established a criminal record that the children should have been removed immediately, but you're coming across as if they knew all this info in advance and set the kids there... There is nothing in the article that suggests otherwise.

And perhaps we should examine the policies and practices of CAS to determine if that agency supports placing kids with drug addled convicts.. If not, maybe there's the option of suing the placement agents (that ignored the rules/regs), but then again, they don't have the deep pockets of gvt, so no lawyer will get on board.

Interestingly enough, all the article has to say about mom is this: "I was one of nine children born to a drug-addicted mother and all nine were seized"

Kinda makes you wonder about the details of mom, doesn't it?.. But, we'll never know how much abuse, neglect and impact it had as the article portrays her as a pseudo victim as well.

Lastly, Hassan is also alleging that the accusation is fallacious.... Unlikely, but he does get due process.

Yes I want it to be about the files, because one was making direct decisions about these kids, and one wasn't.

Sorry to be the one to tell you, but there are many moving parts to this and focusing on one or two preferred elements on which to base a position is simply not an option.

The mother had no control over those kids, CAS did. They were legal wards of the crown, under the direct care and control of CAS.

Care to admit that the Mom neglected the kids that lead to CAS getting involved?

You are bending over backwards to sweep this fact under the rug.

 

[petros]

Her case against CAS has to do with more than that one instance.

Drug abuse.

Criminal back ground.

Criminal activity occurring in the home.

Abuse allegations.

Neglect allegations.

That's enough that they should have been placed elsewhere.

It's the combined file, and the CAS's choice to keep her in that home, that she has every right to take them to court over..

What kind of drugs? Pot? How come they haven't taken away your kids for smoking up?

What were his crimes? 3 bad cheques and a couple DUIs? Obviously minor summary convictions that didn't involve doing jail time. If he did time he wouldn't have been approved to begin with.

Is an escort illegal activity? I have a friend who is a madame. 20+ plus years of paying a buttload of taxes has kept the cops away while on duty but not off duty.

Allegations without indictable evidence is just that. An allegation.

Interestingly enough, all the article has to say about mom is this: "I was one of nine children born to a drug-addicted mother and all nine were seized"

Kinda makes you wonder about the details of mom, doesn't it?.. But, we'll never know how much abuse, neglect and impact it had as the article portrays her as a pseudo victim as well.

Lastly, Hassan is also alleging that the accusation is fallacious.... Unlikely, but he does get due process..

To lose all her kids she either refused rehab or kept having dirty piss tests which are once a week for two years.

 

[karrie]

Care to admit that the Mom neglected the kids that lead to CAS getting involved?

You are bending over backwards to sweep this fact under the rug.

How am I trying to sweep that under the rug?

The government found her so negligent that they removed her parental rights.

What kind of drugs? Pot? How come they haven't taken away your kids for smoking up?

What were his crimes? 3 bad cheques and a couple DUIs? Obviously minor summary convictions that didn't involve doing jail time. If he did time he wouldn't have been approved to begin with.

Is an escort illegal activity? I have a friend who is a madame. 20+ plus years of paying a buttload of taxes has kept the cops away while on duty but not off duty..

I have no idea on any of that, thus my assertion that she's not wrong to take them to court. She has every right.

 

[petros]

No idea? You acting like you're judge Judy and executioner. How can you not know and pass judgement? How the hell was CAS supposed know what was going on if the cops initally cleared him? Magic ball or fortune cookie?

 

[karrie]

No idea? You acting like you're judge Judy and executioner. How can you not know and pass judgement? How the hell was CAS supposed know what was going on if the cops initally cleared him? Magic ball or fortune cookie?

You're the one who's found them innocent, how is that any different?

She has every right to take them to court. She has every right to demand answers and justice. And to not have someone try to pass the buck to her or her bio-mother.

 

[petros]

She doesn't have a right. She'll have one helluva time even getting an inquiry going.

CAS operates under a Provincial protocol, if protocol says there is no evidence of wrong doing, the kids stay put.

There are foster kids who will BS and try to get foster parents in **** to get moved if foster parents have and enforce rules or have to do housekeeping chores or wing nut Christian.

 

[karrie]

I know foster parents, social workers, and group home workers, and parents. I'm more than aware of the manipulations children are capable of (children, not just foster children, btw).

That doesn't mean this girl is making stuff up (talk about judge and jury huh?), nor does it mean CAS wasn't negligent.

She wouldn't be 'crazy' to blame them or seek answers. She'd be human. Normal.

 

[SLM]

I honestly cannot understand what all the fuss is about. She absolutely has a right to explanations from CAS for her file given what she went through. And if she has to sue them to get that explanations, then that's what she has to do.

He was convicted, therefore there was enough evidence to prove that he committed those acts against her. That has moved from supposition into fact. What they knew, how they knew and why they didn't put it together and intervene is definitely within her rights to pursuit. They are supposed to monitor foster parents, they pay foster parents. They are responsible for what goes on in a foster home. Period, end of story.

Everybody is talking about the birth mother. How does anyone know she didn't face charges for neglect or cruelty at the time the children were taken away? Should she face them? Maybe, but without knowing more than she was an addict it's hard to say specifically. And anyway, that is a completely different topic. The agency was in charge and responsible for seeing to this girl's welfare for the period when she was growing up. They are the ones that owe her an explanation for why she was left in the home that she was in.

Honestly I never knew there were so many fans of CAS out there!

 

[petros]

“Children’s Aid ruined my life because I could have been adopted as a baby,” she said angrily. “Instead, they thought it was in my best interest ... to be placed into this man’s care. He was a single man with a criminal record who had no connection to me. Why would he want to parent me?”

Maybe, just maybe CAS could have done something if she didn't keep it a secret for 8 years? Her brother didn't even know. If there was "no connection" why did they stay? Don't they have cop sponsored safety talks for young kids in GTA where they are told to report things like this to the school who call the cops?

 

[gerryh]

Maybe, just maybe CAS could have done something if she didn't keep it a secret for 8 years? Her brother didn't even know. If there was "no connection" why did they stay? Don't they have cop sponsored safety talks for young kids in GTA where they are told to report things like this to the school who call the cops?

wow... just wow.... you just can't seem to keep from blaming her, can you.

 

[SLM]

Maybe, just maybe CAS could have done something if she didn't keep it a secret for 8 years? Her brother didn't even know. If there was "no connection" why did they stay? Don't they have cop sponsored safety talks for young kids in GTA where they are told to report things like this to the school who call the cops?

Did you swallow a misogyny pill today? Seem to have a real hard on hatred for someone who was sexual abused as a child.

 

[L Gilbert]

"But the now 20-year-old woman is seething with outrage at both Hassan and the Toronto Children’s Aid Society because it granted him custody of her when she was two years old. And the CAS kept her and her half-brother in his care despite Hassan’s drug use, criminal record and neighbours’ reports of neglect and abuse." "Reports of being malnourished". That's inexcusable. How many reports does there have to be before the authorities act?
"CAS granted Hassan custody of the girl because he already had custody of her half-brother despite the fact that Hassan already had five criminal convictions." Pretty weak grounds for granting custody.
"CAS reports, a police file, showed a babysitter noticed I had soreness and redness in my genital area when I was eight years old." She should have been removed from Hassan's custody and he should have been investigated ..... again.
"reports of drug use and prostitutes frequenting Hassan’s Regent Park apartment forced the CAS to apprehend the two children." Nice environment for kids to grow up in.
"In general, the CAS tries to keep siblings together 'when it’s safe to do so,' explained Fleming, the CAS’s intake co-ordinator." I really would like to know his definition of safe. Apparently, the definition allows for use of drugs, prostitutes, malnourishment, sexual abuse, etc.
"'Our goal is to keep children with families where it’s safe and practical,' Fleming said. '(But) the child’s safety comes first.'" Oh, obviously.

Glad most kids aren't treated to that kind of safety.

 

[WLDB]

Yup. Drug use but no 'warning signs" of sexual abuse.

Drug use is enough. Take the kid from one junkie and give them to another? Makes no sense.

 

[petros]

There are millions of stable, working, sane drug users, it's 4% of those millions who are a complete loss. She's a 4%er.

 

[L Gilbert]

There are millions of stable, working, sane drug users, it's 4% of those millions who are a complete loss. She's a 4%er.

As opposed to the craphead that CAS stuck the girl with?

 

[petros]

Did they follow the guidlelines the Province of ON set? If yes then it's the Provincial guidelines that should be attacked if CAS didn't meet those guidleline then look at them.

 

[Sal]

Functions of agency

9 The functions of an agency are to
(a) protect children from harm;
(b) work with other community and social services to prevent, alleviate and remedy the personal, social and economic conditions that might place children and families at risk;
(c) provide guidance, counselling and other services to families for the prevention of circumstances that might require intervention by an agency;
(d) investigate allegations or evidence that children may be in need of protective services;
(e) develop and provide services to families to promote the integrity of families, before and after intervention pursuant to this Act;
(f) supervise children assigned to its supervision pursuant to this Act;
(g) provide care for children in its care or care and custody pursuant to this Act;
(h) provide adoption services and place children for adoption pursuant to this Act;
(i) provide services that respect and preserve the cultural, racial and linguistic heritage of children and their families;
(j) take reasonable measures to make known in the community the services the agency provides; and
(k) perform any other duties given to the agency by this Act or the regulations. 1990, c. 5, s. 9.