Tory G8 abortion stance

[JLM]

Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

View Poll Results: Is MorgantalerA Saint?.

A common criminal?

A little of both?

 

[gerryh]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

Nothing common what so ever when it comes to that murderer.

 

[Kreskin]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

He is a Saint. God Bless Henry the Good Guy Saint.

 

[talloola]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

I would like the lifers to explain this.

Lets say you have a new baby and the doctor gives you bad news, that because of a severe digestive problem the baby will only survive on the milk of the mother. This condition will likely fix itself in the next month or two. The babies survival depends on the mother breastfeeding.

If she declines to breastfeed, do you think society has the right to force her to?

I suppose if society and the law can force a parent to
let their child have a blood transfusion, then they must
be able to force a mother to feed the baby her milk.
But, they would have to physically take milk from her, to
feed the baby, is that legal? What a situation, she can't
just let her baby die, when she has the remedy, but they
can't put their hands on her and physically force milk
from her, can they?

I am 'not' a pro lifer.

 

[gerryh]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

I would like the lifers to explain this.

Lets say you have a new baby and the doctor gives you bad news, that because of a severe digestive problem the baby will only survive on the milk of the mother. This condition will likely fix itself in the next month or two. The babies survival depends on the mother breastfeeding.

If she declines to breastfeed, do you think society has the right to force her to?

any human breast milk should do. The baby is removed from the mothers custody (preferably permanently) and either bottle fed using breast milk or a surogate is used for breast feeding.

 

[JLM]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

I suppose if society and the law can force a parent to
let their child have a blood transfusion, then they must
be able to force a mother to feed the baby her milk.
But, they would have to physically take milk from her, to
feed the baby, is that legal? What a situation, she can't
just let her baby die, when she has the remedy, but they
can't put their hands on her and physically force milk
from her, can they?

I am 'not' a pro lifer.

In my mind the answer is fairly simple............Could forcing the mother to provide the milk cause more harm to the mother, than the harm caused to the baby if she doesn't?

 

[gerryh]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

In my mind the answer is fairly simple............Could forcing the mother to provide the milk cause more harm to the mother, than the harm caused to the baby if she doesn't?

of course it'll cause the mother more harm...can you imagine the inconvenience.... not to mention the possible "damage" to the poor womans breasts because of breast feeding.

 

[Cliffy]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

He is a Saint. God Bless Henry the Good Guy Saint.

He saved a lot of women from being butchered like they were back before abortion was legalized. Our personal opinions are irrelevant. Women, like females of many mammalian species, choose to abort. It is their business. If you want to stop them, then you should take responsibility for raising the children. Otherwise it is none of our business.

 

[talloola]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

In my mind the answer is fairly simple............Could forcing the mother to provide the milk cause more harm to the mother, than the harm caused to the baby if she doesn't?

But they would have to 'physically' force milk from her,
can you picture that, maybe in iraq.
People would have to hold her down, while someone attaches a breast pump
to her, and pumps the milk out.
He did say 'the mother's milk', not any mother's milk.

 

[gerryh]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

But they would have to 'physically' force milk from her,
can you picture that, maybe in iraq.
He did say 'the mother's milk', not any mother's milk.

:roll: riiiiight... so we'll make this a complete fairy tale so the murder supporters can justify their support.

 

[talloola]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

:roll: riiiiight... so we'll make this a complete fairy tale so the murder supporters can justify their support.

lets stay to the point, and not make up your own endings
to this story, I'm just trying to figure out what is legal.

Is there an answer Kreskin?

 

[gerryh]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

lets stay to the point, and not make up your own endings
to this story, I'm just trying to figure out what is legal.

the "concept"...."premise"..... is bullsh*t

 

[talloola]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

guess there is no legal answer, we are left hanging, and
only have our own answers.

Yes, she must feed her baby to save it's life, either
on her own, or by having her milk expelled into a bottle
to be fed to her baby.
Can't imagine why any mother would ever refuse to feed
her own baby her own milk, if the child's life was at
risk, without it.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

If saint or criminal are the only options, I'd have to say neither. He's a doctor who provided a medical service a lot of women obviously wanted, a service I'll never need, being male, and beyond that it's like any other elective medical procedure people choose to have: none of my business, it's a private matter between patient and physician.

 

[Kreskin]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

any human breast milk should do. The baby is removed from the mothers custody (preferably permanently) and either bottle fed using breast milk or a surogate is used for breast feeding.

You ducked the issue and those weren't options. The option is to watch the baby die or force the mother to give breast milk. Do you think the law will force her to for this already born baby?

You guys seem to completely miss what the real issue is. It's a legal rights issue that focuses on who has control of the mother's body. Her or someone else. It has nothing to do with a definition of when life begins.

 

[Cliffy]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

If saint or criminal are the only options, I'd have to say neither. He's a doctor who provided a medical service a lot of women obviously wanted, a service I'll never need, being male, and beyond that it's like any other elective medical procedure people choose to have: none of my business, it's a private matter between patient and physician.

Dex, what is the scientific verdict on whether human fat cells are living or not? If they are, could liposuction be considered in the same category as abortion?

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

Dex, what is the scientific verdict on whether human fat cells are living or not? If they are, could liposuction be considered in the same category as abortion?

There can't be much doubt that fat cells are living, if they weren't the body would break them down and flush them out. But left alone to grow naturally they won't turn into another human--though I've met some people whose appearance almost suggests otherwise--so I don't think the comparison is apt.

 

[talloola]

Re: What rights should a fetus have?

then legally, no one has control over her body, except her.

which is the way it should be.

 

[Cliffy]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

There can't be much doubt that fat cells are living, if they weren't the body would break them down and flush them out. But left alone to grow naturally they won't turn into another human--though I've met some people whose appearance almost suggests otherwise--so I don't think the comparison is apt.

It could almost be argued that, particularly in the case of unwanted children, some fetuses do not grow up to be human - ie: Clifford Olsen, Jeffery Dolmer, etc.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Re: Henry Morgantaler- Saint or Common Criminal?

Yeah, I've seen the argument that the drop in the crime rate over the last generation or so is due to abortions being readily and legally available, fewer unwanted children meaning fewer maladjusted adults. I dunno that it's true, but it sounds plausible.