Temporary Foreign Workers put 270 Canadians out of work

Should TFWs be allowed to replace skilled Canadians just to save labour costs?

  • Yes

    Votes: 3 12.5%
  • No

    Votes: 19 79.2%
  • Don't know

    Votes: 2 8.3%
  • Don't care

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    24

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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Edson, AB
Nearly 300 replaced by TFWs at oilsands site | Fort McMurray Today

It was unlike any Labour Day Ryan Louis had experienced.

As hundreds of pipefitters and welders arrived at Husky Energy’s Sunrise project for their weeks-long shifts, a company spokesperson told the crew of approximately 270 this would be their last.

Their replacements?

An equal number of temporary foreign workers brought in by Saipem, a non-union Italian company specializing in oil and gas construction projects.

Over the next 30 days, dozens of temporary foreign workers from Mexico, Ireland, Portugal and Italy were arriving at the site 60 kilometres north of Fort McMurray, waiting for turnover.

By Sept. 27, the original workers —all contractors with Toronto-based Black & MacDonald— were gone.

“Layoffs are pretty standard when there’s no work to be done, but there was plenty of work for us to do out there,” said Louis, a commuter from Napanee, Ont. and an active member of Pipefitters Local 488 in Edmonton. “Plain and simple, a bunch of qualified Canadian citizens who needed work were replaced.”

According to Husky Energy spokesperson Mel Duvall, Saipem Canada is the general contractor for construction of the site’s Central Processing Facility.

Saipem had given Black & MacDonald contracts to complete the project’s first phase, and with construction finishing, Duvall says Black & MacDonald reduced their workforce.

However, several Black & MacDonald contractors dispute these claims. Over a dozen employees that were interviewed all alleged Saipem and Black & MacDonald were involved in payment disputes, and as a result, Black & MacDonald withdrew.

One Black & MacDonald contractor, who could not give his name for seniority reasons, says Saipem let the workers go because unionized labour was too costly.

Both Saipem and Black & MacDonald did not answer repeated calls for comment about the issue, and these claims could not be verified. Duvall did not comment on the use of temporary foreign workers at Sunrise.

Louis says many contractors he worked with at Sunrise have already found work elsewhere in Alberta, Saskatchewan and Newfoundland. However, some are still struggling.

“We were told when I started around April, just after Easter, that we would be good until September or October,” said Reg Fougere, a Nova Scotian pipefitter who was working at the site.

“There was a lot of work there, some of us thought we’d get an extension or new contract there, or they’d at least bring in other Canadians who need work,” he said. “Well thanks to Saipem, we’re Canadians who need some work.”

Fougere also witnessed several foreign workers operate equipment unsafely or wander into restricted areas without protective gear. Fougere says many did not understand the Alberta labour code or basic warning labels on hazardous materials.

When he brought his concerns about the qualifications of the temporary foreign workers to Husky, Fougere says they fell on deaf ears.

“Just to get through the door, we need certificates and licences up the ying-yang like Red Seal certification. It let’s them know that as Canadians, we’re all qualified to the standards,” he says. “These guys coming in, how the hell can they get in without our qualifications? Or how do we know how good their qualifications from other countries are?”

Temporary Foreign Worker program constant ire of Alberta's labour movement

According to Citizenship and Immigration Canada, there were 338,189 temporary foreign workers living in Canada as of Dec. 1, 2012, with nearly 70,000 living in Alberta.

To compare, approximately 257,515 immigrants were welcomed into Canada in 2012 as residents. CIC figures show there were only 101,098 temporary foreign workers in Canada in 2002.

The program's supporters in the federal and provincial government argue the legislation is intended for employers to fill short-term labour or skill gaps. Legislation says they must prove they were unable to find skilled Canadians or permanent residents to do those jobs.

However, groups such as the Alberta Federation of Labour argue the program is being abused and poorly enforced, particularly in the construction industry.


This is just a way to get cheap labour on this project. I think Canada has enough skilled workers or can train/retrain people we have which is a better investment than a welfare or EI check.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
109,295
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So long as there are unemployed Canadians there should be no TFW at all.

When Canadians go to work abroad the locals say the same thing.

Not being given any notice from Black & McDonald has UA pissed off.

Union or non-union, skilled Canadian workers are paid the same in heavy industry.
 

karrie

OogedyBoogedy
Jan 6, 2007
27,780
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This is just a way to get cheap labour on this project. I think Canada has enough skilled workers or can train/retrain people we have which is a better investment than a welfare or EI check.

Well yeah. Cheap labour is the name of the game. It's a balancing act. We've hit the point where we have to go after non-conventional oil. But, when gas prices go up, people lose their minds and demand something be done. People only care about the unions and workers' wages so long as it's not coming out of their pockets. The shopping public's reactions to McD's, Wal-Marts, et al., stand as proof. It sucks royally, but not a single one of those union contractors should be surprised that these companies would pull this.

That being said, I wonder what the other side of the story is, because hubby brings in foreign contractors on a regular basis, and he has to prove need to be able to do so. He has to show that he can't get a local, and that the contractor possesses the skills and training unique to that job.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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Canadian companies that operate abroad do the same thing as what Chinese owned Husky did and no, we don't have enough skilled workers.

UA won't have any problems dispatching their members to other jobs.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Nearly 300 replaced by TFWs at oilsands site | Fort McMurray Today

It was unlike any Labour Day Ryan Louis had experienced.

As hundreds of pipefitters and welders arrived at Husky Energy’s Sunrise project for their weeks-long shifts, a company spokesperson told the crew of approximately 270 this would be their last.

Their replacements?

An equal number of temporary foreign workers brought in by Saipem, a non-union Italian company specializing in oil and gas construction projects.

Over the next 30 days, dozens of temporary foreign workers from Mexico, Ireland, Portugal and Italy were arriving at the site 60 kilometres north of Fort McMurray, waiting for turnover.

By Sept. 27, the original workers —all contractors with Toronto-based Black & MacDonald— were gone.

“Layoffs are pretty standard when there’s no work to be done, but there was plenty of work for us to do out there,” said Louis, a commuter from Napanee, Ont. and an active member of Pipefitters Local 488 in Edmonton. “Plain and simple, a bunch of qualified Canadian citizens who needed work were replaced.”

According to Husky Energy spokesperson Mel Duvall, Saipem Canada is the general contractor for construction of the site’s Central Processing Facility.

Saipem had given Black & MacDonald contracts to complete the project’s first phase, and with construction finishing, Duvall says Black & MacDonald reduced their workforce.

However, several Black & MacDonald contractors dispute these claims. Over a dozen employees that were interviewed all alleged Saipem and Black & MacDonald were involved in payment disputes, and as a result, Black & MacDonald withdrew.

One Black & MacDonald contractor, who could not give his name for seniority reasons, says Saipem let the workers go because unionized labour was too costly.

Both Saipem and Black & MacDonald did not answer repeated calls for comment about the issue, and these claims could not be verified. Duvall did not comment on the use of temporary foreign workers at Sunrise.

Louis says many contractors he worked with at Sunrise have already found work elsewhere in Alberta, Saskatchewan and Newfoundland. However, some are still struggling.

“We were told when I started around April, just after Easter, that we would be good until September or October,” said Reg Fougere, a Nova Scotian pipefitter who was working at the site.

“There was a lot of work there, some of us thought we’d get an extension or new contract there, or they’d at least bring in other Canadians who need work,” he said. “Well thanks to Saipem, we’re Canadians who need some work.”

Fougere also witnessed several foreign workers operate equipment unsafely or wander into restricted areas without protective gear. Fougere says many did not understand the Alberta labour code or basic warning labels on hazardous materials.

When he brought his concerns about the qualifications of the temporary foreign workers to Husky, Fougere says they fell on deaf ears.

“Just to get through the door, we need certificates and licences up the ying-yang like Red Seal certification. It let’s them know that as Canadians, we’re all qualified to the standards,” he says. “These guys coming in, how the hell can they get in without our qualifications? Or how do we know how good their qualifications from other countries are?”

Temporary Foreign Worker program constant ire of Alberta's labour movement

According to Citizenship and Immigration Canada, there were 338,189 temporary foreign workers living in Canada as of Dec. 1, 2012, with nearly 70,000 living in Alberta.

To compare, approximately 257,515 immigrants were welcomed into Canada in 2012 as residents. CIC figures show there were only 101,098 temporary foreign workers in Canada in 2002.

The program's supporters in the federal and provincial government argue the legislation is intended for employers to fill short-term labour or skill gaps. Legislation says they must prove they were unable to find skilled Canadians or permanent residents to do those jobs.

However, groups such as the Alberta Federation of Labour argue the program is being abused and poorly enforced, particularly in the construction industry.


This is just a way to get cheap labour on this project. I think Canada has enough skilled workers or can train/retrain people we have which is a better investment than a welfare or EI check.

To play "Devil's advocate" here, Is there any chance the replacement workers have a better work ethic perhaps?
 

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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To play "Devil's advocate" here, Is there any chance the replacement workers have a better work ethic perhaps?
Who cares? Canadians first is my opinion. We need to look after our citizens and not worry about the corporations.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Who cares? Canadians first is my opinion. We need to look after our citizens and not worry about the corporations.

I think you may have just hit on something there, Nick, ................. the root cause of many labour problems, not to mention a wide spread feeling among consumers these days that we are being ripped off. A year or so ago, I called a plumber to fix a leak. He spent less than 5 minutes here and charged me $85 and within a few months it was leaking again. (For less than $10 I now have the same wrench he used). I would amend "Canadians first" to "Canadians first as long the value obtained is equal to other competitors". I remember a time when we took pride in our work.
 

B00Mer

Keep Calm and Carry On
Sep 6, 2008
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You know in Kelowna, they wanted to bring in temporary workers to pick apples and other fruit, but someone came up with the great idea to cut off welfare recipients if they didn't go pick..

They need to do that right across the country..

Also, I'm with PoliticalNick, Canadian Jobs for Canadian's first.. :canada:

 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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You know in Kelowna, they wanted to bring in temporary workers to pick apples and other fruit, but someone came up with the great idea to cut off welfare recipients if they didn't go pick..

They need to do that right across the country..

Also, I'm with PoliticalNick, Canadian Jobs for Canadian's first.. :canada:


Even if the product is sub standard?
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
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Who cares? Canadians first is my opinion. We need to look after our citizens and not worry about the corporations.

When YOU are the guy doing the hiring and paying the bill, do you not search out the person who can provide the "biggest bang for the buck"?
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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Who cares? Canadians first is my opinion. We need to look after our citizens and not worry about the corporations.

Not necessarily. Many of our unionized workforce have this idea they are entitled to getting paid for doing nothing. Usually the worst offenders are the ones that complain the most about nonunion companies getting the jobs. In the project I am currently working on there is not a single person that has not made over $100G since March yet they complain about the company ripping them off. THen there is the featherbedding which drives up costs for no reason. Sometimes I am embarrassed to say that I belong to the same group.

You know in Kelowna, they wanted to bring in temporary workers to pick apples and other fruit, but someone came up with the great idea to cut off welfare recipients if they didn't go pick..

They need to do that right across the country..

Also, I'm with PoliticalNick, Canadian Jobs for Canadian's first.. :canada:


How exactly do you propose to get Canadians to do the jobs that need to be done?
 

JLM

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Nov 27, 2008
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New Criteria for hiring employees for Canadian Industry

1. They must be Canadian.
2. They must be able to do the work.
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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New Criteria for hiring employees for Canadian Industry

1. They must be Canadian.
2. They must be able to do the work.

Add they must be willing to work.

Most people here have at least heard of the HD Mining problems. They don't seem to have unions yet but two Canadian miners I know are now working there for a contractor that is providing management and safety supervision. Pay is over $45/hr.
 

B00Mer

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When YOU are the guy doing the hiring and paying the bill, do you not search out the person who can provide the "biggest bang for the buck"?

LOL I just quit a job that they hire Mexicans because the break the law... constantly..

They treated me like sh!t because I would not drive my truck illegally..

Fella was bragging he did 10 Calgary to Edmonton runs in 5 days and took 10 5 hours to stay awake. So he is driving 18 to 20 hour days on the road with 4 to 6 hours of rest..

Hey, but he is definitely more productive than I, and when he has a accident and kills someone.. ??

I've come down to where I think in Canada all trucks need to have eLogs, disk air brakes and a dash cam, and I know of a few companies that are going that way.. safety of your fleet and drivers, and most important the others on the road are more important that profit..



How exactly do you propose to get Canadians to do the jobs that need to be done?

I think I already stated that.. match welfare recipients to workers willing to hire.. obviously if the welfare recipient refuses the job, he's cut off from further aid in that province..

Obviously there are cases where the welfare recipient may not be able to do the job at hand, you have to review each case. But where there is a single male, unemployed, there is no reason why that lazy fukk is milking the system.
 

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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When YOU are the guy doing the hiring and paying the bill, do you not search out the person who can provide the "biggest bang for the buck"?

Sure, as long as they are Canadian. Unless there are no Canadians available.

Not necessarily. Many of our unionized workforce have this idea they are entitled to getting paid for doing nothing. Usually the worst offenders are the ones that complain the most about nonunion companies getting the jobs. In the project I am currently working on there is not a single person that has not made over $100G since March yet they complain about the company ripping them off. THen there is the featherbedding which drives up costs for no reason. Sometimes I am embarrassed to say that I belong to the same group.



How exactly do you propose to get Canadians to do the jobs that need to be done?

Those are issues to be sorted out between the company, the union and the govt. What you don't do is put 300 citizens on EI or welfare while bringing in foreigners to save a few bucks. If you want to do business in Canada there is a cost and that is hiring Canadians to do the job.
 

B00Mer

Keep Calm and Carry On
Sep 6, 2008
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Those are issues to be sorted out between the company, the union and the govt. What you don't do is put 300 citizens on EI or welfare while bringing in foreigners to save a few bucks. If you want to do business in Canada there is a cost and that is hiring Canadians to do the job.

Yeah but some bleeding heart Liberals "on this forum" believe in distribution of wealth..

These people are scabs and the 300 laid off should do a blockade of the business..

Husky Oil is not the only Big Corporation to screw over Canadians.. The Royal Bank too



https://www.facebook.com/OutsourceTheWest
 
Last edited:

karrie

OogedyBoogedy
Jan 6, 2007
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New Criteria for hiring employees for Canadian Industry

1. They must be Canadian.
2. They must be able to do the work.

That sounds fair. IF, you stop allowing Canadians to work abroad.

It is senseless to write one set of rules for our industry, while we take advantage of other countries' industry.

I personally know more than 10 guys who work overseas. Why is that allowed?
 

PoliticalNick

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Mar 8, 2011
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That sounds fair. IF, you stop allowing Canadians to work abroad.

It is senseless to write one set of rules for our industry, while we take advantage of other countries' industry.

I personally know more than 10 guys who work overseas. Why is that allowed?

I don't have a problem bring in skilled people if there are no Canadians available but it should be Canadians first in line. This practice of putting Canadians out of work and bringing in cheap foreign labour to replace them is just wrong and it needs to stop.