Striking teachers get pay docked!

[PoliticalNick]

The teachers are doing exactly what they are paid to do. Why would the government have right to dock their pay when they are doing their job.

We already went over this bribe thing though. Paying someone for their services is not a bribe.



It is also the government's choice to do this. Everyone in this thread seems 100% against the teachers when this is all about an action that the government has taken.

If you had any idea how many time the BCTF had held the parents of BC hostage for more money in the last 2 decades you would understand why most of us would be just as happy to see their contract include being boiled in oil.

Teachers work about 8 months a year and continually seem to want to do less teaching and more babysitting for their salary. I say they are an essential service and should not be allowed to strike. Personally I think they should go to every district that engages in these rotating strikes and hand every teacher notice for the end of June. F*ck em all, fire their a$$es and let them reapply for September when they can start at the bottom.

 

[captain morgan]

If you had any idea how many time the BCTF had held the parents of BC hostage for more money in the last 2 decades you would understand why most of us would be just as happy to see their contract include being boiled in oil.

Teachers work about 8 months a year and continually seem to want to do less teaching and more babysitting for their salary. I say they are an essential service and should not be allowed to strike. Personally I think they should go to every district that engages in these rotating strikes and hand every teacher notice for the end of June. F*ck em all, fire their a$$es and let them reapply for September when they can start at the bottom.

Take a page from Ralph Klein and each time the teachers strike; offer up a number of licenses for Charter/Private schools - all with the 'per student funding allocation'.

Shuts 'em up real quick especially in that the teachers that move from the Union to the private sector really scale back the Union numbers

 

[PoliticalNick]

Take a page from Ralph Klein and each time the teachers strike; offer up a number of licenses for Charter/Private schools - all with the 'per student funding allocation'.

Shuts 'em up real quick especially in that the teachers that move from the Union to the private sector really scale back the Union numbers

Yep. I started raving about this to my girlfriend and she couldn't understand my anger. Then I found out she had never experienced a teacher's strike here in AB and her oldest graduated yesterday. Once I explained I had put my boys in private school because of 3 strikes in 5 years she saw my point a bit better.

 

[MHz]

Government employees expecting to be paid for not working is nothing new.

I'm pretty sure if kids started school when they were 12 that they would be just as smart at the end of grade 12 as they are today. That cuts out 6 years of 'useless spending' and you could still use the same number of teachers with smaller classes or whatever of just save the money and the kids will sort out who goes where as far as careers go.

 

[JLM]

I'm pretty sure if kids started school when they were 12 that they would be just as smart at the end of grade 12 as they are today. That cuts out 6 years of 'useless spending' and you could still use the same number of teachers with smaller classes or whatever of just save the money and the kids will sort out who goes where as far as careers go.

I hear you, but I have just one question. Some of the kids will no doubt be self-starters and will likely get cracking doing something constructive, but I'm guessing for about 75% what you'd have is 6 wasted years between the age of 6 and 12, not to mention some bad habits get deeply ingrained. What do you propose to deal with those developments?

 

[BornRuff]

Well, you obviously have the issues confused. I think most people want to see teachers get paid appropriately for what they do, but that doesn't include succumbing to bribes. When you have a job building widgets I would think your pay would be based on the number and quality of the widgets you build! Why complicate the issue?

Structure of the deal doesn't change the overall amount that it costs you. If they can save money by offering a one time bonus instead of an ongoing benefit, as a taxpayer I always want them to save money.

If you had any idea how many time the BCTF had held the parents of BC hostage for more money in the last 2 decades you would understand why most of us would be just as happy to see their contract include being boiled in oil.

Teachers work about 8 months a year and continually seem to want to do less teaching and more babysitting for their salary. I say they are an essential service and should not be allowed to strike. Personally I think they should go to every district that engages in these rotating strikes and hand every teacher notice for the end of June. F*ck em all, fire their a$$es and let them reapply for September when they can start at the bottom.

I'm sure they would love to be declared an essential service. That would mean that their contracts would automatically go to binding arbitration which almost always ends in better deals for the union.

In the end, it takes two to tango. The BC government has been really bad at managing their relationship with teachers. It is really exemplified by things such as just stripping parts of contracts unilaterally.

 

[JLM]

Structure of the deal doesn't change the overall amount that it costs you. If they can save money by offering a one time bonus instead of an ongoing benefit, as a taxpayer I always want them to save money.

That's where you and I differ. I want to see what my money is actually going for. If it's being spent to educate children I'd rather spend a few $s more, that is well spent. I don't want to see my money spent on bribes to get teachers to sign contracts. I want them to sign the contract because they are happy with the pay for what they are paid to do.

 

[BornRuff]

I'm pretty sure if kids started school when they were 12 that they would be just as smart at the end of grade 12 as they are today. That cuts out 6 years of 'useless spending' and you could still use the same number of teachers with smaller classes or whatever of just save the money and the kids will sort out who goes where as far as careers go.

Kids learn the most important stuff in those early years. Basic literacy and numeracy is essential for any later learning, and it is very clear that most kids simply don't learn this stuff without high quality education.

That's where you and I differ. I want to see what my money is actually going for. If it's being spent to educate children I'd rather spend a few $s more, that is well spent. I don't want to see my money spent on bribes to get teachers to sign contracts. I want them to sign the contract because they are happy with the pay for what they are paid to do.

This is stupid. If you are paying the same people the same amount of money to do the same job, what difference does it make?

You would seriously want to pay more money just to prove your misguided point about "bribes"?

 

[JLM]

Kids learn the most important stuff in those early years. Basic literacy and numeracy is essential for any later learning, and it is very clear that most kids simply don't learn this stuff without high quality education.



This is stupid. If you are paying the same people the same amount of money to do the same job, what difference does it make?

You would seriously want to pay more money just to prove your misguided point about "bribes"?

It's guys like you who already "feed" a corrupt system! Like I've already said the system needs an overhaul from stem to gudgeon. Maybe a good place to start would be to fire the worst 10% of the teachers and give the other 90% a 10% raise. That makes more sense to me than bribing them.

 

[gopher]

no work
no pay

 

[JLM]

If you had any idea how many time the BCTF had held the parents of BC hostage for more money in the last 2 decades you would understand why most of us would be just as happy to see their contract include being boiled in oil.

Teachers work about 8 months a year and continually seem to want to do less teaching and more babysitting for their salary. I say they are an essential service and should not be allowed to strike. Personally I think they should go to every district that engages in these rotating strikes and hand every teacher notice for the end of June. F*ck em all, fire their a$$es and let them reapply for September when they can start at the bottom.

Hey Nick watch you don't get into a "pissing contest" with B.R. We've already had an ongoing battle over the number of hours the teachers teach. He's hung up on what "the standard" is, I'm more interested in what's actually happening. We have two grand daughters who live with us and go to school, so we have a pretty good idea about what goes on in one school at least and I'M NOT SAYING IT'S BAD.

 

[BornRuff]

It's guys like you who already "feed" a corrupt system! Like I've already said the system needs an overhaul from stem to gudgeon. Maybe a good place to start would be to fire the worst 10% of the teachers and give the other 90% a 10% raise. That makes more sense to me than bribing them.

What exactly would you do to replace the thousands of fewer teachers?

Your ideas make no sense. You would rather pay 10% more forever for fewer teachers than pay a one time signing bonus of ~1.5% of one years salary?

In what possible way can you spin that as a reasonable deal for taxpayers?

Hey Nick watch you don't get into a "pissing contest" with B.R. We've already had an ongoing battle over the number of hours the teachers teach. He's hung up on what "the standard" is, I'm more interested in what's actually happening. We have two grand daughters who live with us and go to school, so we have a pretty good idea about what goes on in one school at least and I'M NOT SAYING IT'S BAD.

Lol, you are making claims about what is happening, eg, the number of hours of teaching. If you are not hung up on that, why do you continually bicker about it?

no work
no pay

They are still doing the same amount of work. The government is "locking them out" without changing the actual number of hours they are supposed to teach. It is just a naked punitive cash grab.

 

[taxslave]

In the end, it takes two to tango. The BC government has been really bad at managing their relationship with teachers. It is really exemplified by things such as just stripping parts of contracts unilaterally.

Not quite true. Back when we were cursed with a socialist government the teachers won the lottery. Not only did they get good settlements the government of the day wrote up what they called accords and added even more money to the teachers already generous pay.
Also it is the teachers union that has always had a militant lean and most of them are way left of reality.

 

[JLM]

What exactly would you do to replace the thousands of fewer teachers?

.

That's the easiest question you've asked yet. The 10% that would be fired are likely contributing about 2% of the productivity so you are not really losing a hell of a lot, actually probably gaining and the 90% getting the raise might be thrilled to put forth a little more effort- like 1 or 2% would be enough. I'm not in favour of paying drones and parasites!

 

[BornRuff]

That's the easiest question you've asked yet. The 10% that would be fired are likely contributing about 2% of the productivity so you are not really losing a hell of a lot, actually probably gaining and the 90% getting the raise might be thrilled to put forth a little more effort- like 1 or 2% would be enough. I'm not in favour of paying drones and parasites!

You better hope they put in more effort since they will now have significantly larger class sizes. How many do you think will put in enough effort just to make up for the larger class size, much less actually improve quality?

Again, how is paying 10% more for teachers forever a better deal than paying a 1.5% one time payment? Why do you put your own misunderstanding of what a "bribe" is over basic dollars and cents?

 

[JLM]

You better hope they put in more effort since they will now have significantly larger class sizes. How many do you think will put in enough effort just to make up for the larger class size, much less actually improve quality?

Again, how is paying 10% more for teachers forever a better deal than paying a 1.5% one time payment? Why do you put your own misunderstanding of what a "bribe" is over basic dollars and cents?

Sorry Bucko, I don't misunderstand what a bribe is in the least.

 

[BornRuff]

Sorry Bucko, I don't misunderstand what a bribe is in the least.

Why are you ignoring the numbers I have asked you about repeatedly?

Larger class sizes. 10% more forever vs 1.5% one time payment.

Not quite true. Back when we were cursed with a socialist government the teachers won the lottery. Not only did they get good settlements the government of the day wrote up what they called accords and added even more money to the teachers already generous pay.
Also it is the teachers union that has always had a militant lean and most of them are way left of reality.

What do you think of the government unilaterally changing provisions in the old contracts relating to class sizes and composition?

 

[JLM]

Why are you ignoring the numbers I have asked you about repeatedly?

Larger class sizes. 10% more forever vs 1.5% one time payment.



What do you think of the government unilaterally changing provisions in the old contracts relating to class sizes and composition?

I like Gov't.s that change with the times. -

 

[BornRuff]

I like Gov't.s that change with the times. -

Still ignoring the numbers eh?

 

[JLM]

Still ignoring the numbers eh?

What do you want to know about them that I haven't already told you?