Palestinian hero kidnapped israeli soldier
- Thread starter aeon
- Start date
aeon said:
No, I consider reading newspapers being aware of the world around me (remember that thread about JTF2?). If you don't read newspapers, you won't know what is happening in the world. You can't simply rely on your conspiracy theory websites to adequetly provide you with the information a person requires to form an informed opinion about world issues.
Besides, if you only have one perspective to draw from, you may find your opinion a little skewed. Just like the people who refuse to read newspapers that have a different bias than there's, a bit of a skewed perspective.
aeon said:
Of course Israel cares about things. They care about keeping their citizens safe from suicide attacks. They care about keeping their soldiers safe from wanton kidnappings. They care about maintaining their sovereignty. They care about all the things that the rest of us around the world care about.
LittleRunningGag said:
News isnt about only JFT2 , yes i read news papers on a daily basis from many point of view, i even read stupid news papers like the "Globe and mail", mostly to get a laugh at, still nothing in the news convince me that JFT2 were only in iraq to rescue peoples.
LittleRunningGag said:
Well , why then have they attacked just like they did? that was just a provocation,they know what the palestinians militant will do to their soldier, they will kill him, that is a fact, and then israel will turn around and say look how bad they are, and the cycle of violence will just continues.
aeon said:
Well obviously you don't. If you truely did read newspapers, you would have already known about those events. If you paid attention to anything around you, you would have known about them. It was on the news, and on the front pages for a week.
Because they can't pander to the demands of terrorists. If they do that they are inviting more activities like this. If this one soldier dies, that would be bad. But if this one soldier is only a prelude to more people being kidnapped and killed, that would be worse.
Over the last year, before the election of Hamas, the Israelis and Palestinians were making great strides in the effort towards peace. The election of Hamas has destroyed all that work. Israel has put forth the olive branch and seen it swatted away. They tried.
LittleRunningGag said:
No it wasnt in front page of the news.I live in montreal.
That goes also for you, if you would have paid attention in the last 5 years , regardings palestinians-israelis conflict, you would have seen that israel has constantly agressed palestinians, that was in front page of the news for the latst 5 years, at the least.
Today in "" le devoir"" the front page says, "" israel takes extremes steps ,by again violating human rights""
LittleRunningGag said:
Israelis werent making great strides in the effort towards peace, total bullstrawberry crap,sharon is the responsible for this whole infitada,that is a fact, they always has a right to attack , whatever the reason is.
Re: RE: Palestinian hero kidnapped israeli soldier
Oh, I SEE.
You were yapping on about the Geneva Conventions, not me. Do you think the requirements for decent treatment do not apply because the war is on-going?
Meanwhile, as this poor Israeli kid is tortured and murdered while in Palestinian custody, Palestinian kids purposely break the law in front of Israeli soldiers so they will have the ENJOYMENT of a stay in an Israeli prison with books, TV, soccer, ping-pong.
WHO is behaving indecently?
Come on Aeon, live up to our agreement.
aeon said:Colpy said:Aeon said
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA You've GOT to be kidding!:lol: 8O
Edited to say:
Tell you what, Aeon, IF this unfortunate kid turns up alive without escaping or being rescued by Israeli troops, I will offer you a public and heartfelt apology.
If he appears under any circumstances alive and NOT mistreated, I will not only apologize, but will refrain from criticizing any of your posts for 30 days, and will publically declare you to have a superior intellect.
In return, if this kid turns up dead or tortured, you will do a post (just one) critical of the Palestinians, and praising the Israelis. Makes it a bet of dollars against doughnuts.
Agreed?
Apperently our deal doesnt work anymore, since israel just did a recent devastated attacks.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1808768,00.html
Well since israel is cutting all supplies of food and fuel, that gives green light to palestinians militant to do what they want with the kidnapped soldier.
Oh, I SEE.
You were yapping on about the Geneva Conventions, not me. Do you think the requirements for decent treatment do not apply because the war is on-going?
Meanwhile, as this poor Israeli kid is tortured and murdered while in Palestinian custody, Palestinian kids purposely break the law in front of Israeli soldiers so they will have the ENJOYMENT of a stay in an Israeli prison with books, TV, soccer, ping-pong.
WHO is behaving indecently?
Come on Aeon, live up to our agreement.
ADC Press Release:
Palestinian Prisoners on Hunger Strike
Washington, D.C.,Anguished by the current conditions in Israeli prisons in which they are kept, approximately 1,500 Palestinian prisoners went on a hunger strike this past Sunday. They have been joined by other prisoners bringing the number of those on the hunger strike to approximately 2,264. Prisoner's rights groups and families of those serving in the facilities also participated in sit down protests. According to the Palestinian Prisoner's Affairs Minster, Hisham Abdelrazaq, "this hunger strike is not a political strike," instead he added, "it's a strike about basic fundamental rights."
The protest calls on Israeli officials to address a wide range of issues concerning the inhumane treatment of prisoners by guards, as well as the overall harsh and deplorable conditions of the prisons themselves. The prisoners are requesting the cessation of humiliating and unnecessary strip searches, more frequent family visits, improving sanitary conditions, installing public telephones, providing better medical care, allowing prisoners to pursue their education by registering at Palestinian and foreign universities, reducing prison crowding, and "ending the policy of beating detainees en route to courts."
In response to these demonstrations, Israeli officials have declared psychological warfare and imposed even further restrictions on those participating in the hunger strike by confiscating radios and temporarily terminating all visits. Moreover, Israeli prison officials have stated that they plan to hold barbecues and eat near the Palestinian prisoners' cells. Security Minister Tzahi Hanegbi commented, "As far as I'm concerned they can strike for a day, a month, until death. We will ward off this strike and it will be as if it never happened."
In 2003, the International Federation of Human Rights, in cooperation with several Israeli and Palestinian human rights groups, released a report on Israel's treatment of Palestinian detainees and prisoners. The report concluded that there were "flagrant violations" of human rights. Amnesty International has also released a report on the conditions of Palestinian prisoners in Israeli jails. To read Amnesty's report see:
http://web.amnesty.org/library/index/engmde150742002
Additionally, in the mid 1990's, B'tselem, the Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, issued a report entitled "Neither Law Nor Justice" in which they describe the Israeli methods of torture. Female prisoners also gave testimonies about sexual abuse and flagrant abuse of private parts of their body. For more information, see:
http://www.btselem.org
The American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC) is deeply troubled by the conditions which the Palestinian prisoners are forced to endure and by the Israeli government's reaction. ADC President Mary Rose Oakar stated "This kind of treatment of prisoners bears similarities to the Abu Ghraib prison torture scandal. We call on the Administration, Congress, as well as Human Rights organizations to take action and express their deep concern against these human rights violations."
link
Palestinian Prisoners on Hunger Strike
Washington, D.C.,Anguished by the current conditions in Israeli prisons in which they are kept, approximately 1,500 Palestinian prisoners went on a hunger strike this past Sunday. They have been joined by other prisoners bringing the number of those on the hunger strike to approximately 2,264. Prisoner's rights groups and families of those serving in the facilities also participated in sit down protests. According to the Palestinian Prisoner's Affairs Minster, Hisham Abdelrazaq, "this hunger strike is not a political strike," instead he added, "it's a strike about basic fundamental rights."
The protest calls on Israeli officials to address a wide range of issues concerning the inhumane treatment of prisoners by guards, as well as the overall harsh and deplorable conditions of the prisons themselves. The prisoners are requesting the cessation of humiliating and unnecessary strip searches, more frequent family visits, improving sanitary conditions, installing public telephones, providing better medical care, allowing prisoners to pursue their education by registering at Palestinian and foreign universities, reducing prison crowding, and "ending the policy of beating detainees en route to courts."
In response to these demonstrations, Israeli officials have declared psychological warfare and imposed even further restrictions on those participating in the hunger strike by confiscating radios and temporarily terminating all visits. Moreover, Israeli prison officials have stated that they plan to hold barbecues and eat near the Palestinian prisoners' cells. Security Minister Tzahi Hanegbi commented, "As far as I'm concerned they can strike for a day, a month, until death. We will ward off this strike and it will be as if it never happened."
In 2003, the International Federation of Human Rights, in cooperation with several Israeli and Palestinian human rights groups, released a report on Israel's treatment of Palestinian detainees and prisoners. The report concluded that there were "flagrant violations" of human rights. Amnesty International has also released a report on the conditions of Palestinian prisoners in Israeli jails. To read Amnesty's report see:
http://web.amnesty.org/library/index/engmde150742002
Additionally, in the mid 1990's, B'tselem, the Israeli Information Center for Human Rights in the Occupied Territories, issued a report entitled "Neither Law Nor Justice" in which they describe the Israeli methods of torture. Female prisoners also gave testimonies about sexual abuse and flagrant abuse of private parts of their body. For more information, see:
http://www.btselem.org
The American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (ADC) is deeply troubled by the conditions which the Palestinian prisoners are forced to endure and by the Israeli government's reaction. ADC President Mary Rose Oakar stated "This kind of treatment of prisoners bears similarities to the Abu Ghraib prison torture scandal. We call on the Administration, Congress, as well as Human Rights organizations to take action and express their deep concern against these human rights violations."
link
aeon, have you read the Hamas Charter? A couple of brief excerpts for you:
And most importantly:
What say you about the intent of the Palestinian Peoples? In electing Hamas, they elected a group of murderers who's sole purpose is the destruction of Israel and all "unbelievers" who are in the "promised land."
Israel had pulled out of Palestinian territory as per the agreements made between Sharon and the Palestinians. The Israeli army has warned (through leaflets) Palestinian citizens before attacking. Which group looks worse in this situation?
And most importantly:
What say you about the intent of the Palestinian Peoples? In electing Hamas, they elected a group of murderers who's sole purpose is the destruction of Israel and all "unbelievers" who are in the "promised land."
Israel had pulled out of Palestinian territory as per the agreements made between Sharon and the Palestinians. The Israeli army has warned (through leaflets) Palestinian citizens before attacking. Which group looks worse in this situation?
aeon said:
Do you watch the news? Do you watch the CBC? It was on the CBC, I saw it. Any news organization that didn't show it isn't worth paying attention to. I find it rather hard to believe that the entirety of the Montreal news media completely ignored the capture and rescue of the vollenteers.
Not to mention that you said earlier that you read the G&M. It was in the G&M as well. Quite a bit, in fact.
LittleRunningGag said:
Sorry i don't watch tv, cbc though is a very good network, i downloaded a lot of report from this network,they are not perfect but they did a pretty good job in the last 5 years,still with everything they say on jft2 from everything i read in the news papers, i am still not convinced that they are there for the good reasons.
RE: Palestinian hero kidn
Hehehe your responses are getting shorter, I smell victory:
I'm a fascist? You can divine this without knowing the person I am? You've never spoken to me outside of a control internet environment, yet you have the gaul to pass judgement on me? I can assure you that I am most certainly NOT a fascist (then again, you deem everyone who doesn't agree with you as a fascist). The definition of Fascism:
That isn't me at all aeon. Then again, how could you know that when you don't even know ME?
Ok whoa here Captain backpeddle. In a previous post, you deemed that Israel doesn't want peace with Palestine:
Then later on in this thread you did an utter flipflop and deemed that if Israel wanted to, they could destroy Palestine. So which is it? Do the Israeli's want peace or not? There is no grey area on this aeon, it's black and white. I've been pointing out all along that Israel has been holding back for decades, there has been nothing stopping them from blowing away Palestine, nothing except their desire to stop the fighting and live in peace. Just when things are calm and getting close, some idiots blow themselves up, or as in this case, abduct a soldier for shock value. Palestinians keep perpetuating the violence. Now look at where that's gotten them? IDF tanks in Gaza. Cause and effect aeon.
Your first sentance makes absolutely NO sense what so ever. I've read it 5 times over and I can't make any sense out of it. Can someone please translate loser-speak to English for me?
As for the 2nd sentance, there has been PLENTY of evidence aeon, you've just chosen not to read/listen to it. Hell, Mr. Bin Laden himself appeared on international television and told the West to go f.uck itself and claimed that Al-qaeda had carried out the attacks. People on these forums have been telling you this since I first started posting here. Yet you don't want to believe it, and that's your hang-up not mine buddy. My arguments make perfect sense. If the elected body, tells me something, i'm inclined to believe them, given the position they're in to make such calls. You, on the other hand, don't believe anything unless you can google it. Who's stance is more ridiculous aeon?
I'm still not sure as to what your point is, especially regarding 100,000 "close friends" of yours whom you can personally vouch for. Care to explain yourself in full on this one, as your mish-mash of frenglish has utterly confused me.
Once again, how can you vouch for 100,000 you don't know? How do you know that every single one of them is a perfect human being? How do you know that one isn't a rapist? Or a murderer? Or a thief? To reiterate, you cannot vouch for 100,000 people you've never met aeon. That's intellecually bankrupt, and i'm sure everyone on these forums will agree with me.
You're missing the point (as per usual) aeon. I'm not discussing their political affiliation, or their adherance to their religion. I'm talking about moderation. The Saudi's have a long-standing tradition of good rapport with the West. They've cooperated on numerous occasions with us, hell they even helped defeat Iraq in 90-91. That's my point. That and a direct corelation between backwards Islamic States and Prosperous Islamic States. If you look it aeon, there is a direct corelation between the level of Islamic Fanaticism and the Social Standing of the State in question. E.g.:
United Arab Emirates vs Palestine
Regardless, that's what i'm talking about aeon, moderation in their dealings with non-islamic nations.
As for your links:
1. Doesn't work
2. Did you actually READ the article? Or were there too many big words for you? The whole point to the article is to highlight that you cannot sue an organization that doesn't fall under your legal system. The Saudi High Commission isn't subject to U.S. Federal Law aeon.
Hehehe your responses are getting shorter, I smell victory:
I'm a fascist? You can divine this without knowing the person I am? You've never spoken to me outside of a control internet environment, yet you have the gaul to pass judgement on me? I can assure you that I am most certainly NOT a fascist (then again, you deem everyone who doesn't agree with you as a fascist). The definition of Fascism:
That isn't me at all aeon. Then again, how could you know that when you don't even know ME?
Ok whoa here Captain backpeddle. In a previous post, you deemed that Israel doesn't want peace with Palestine:
Then later on in this thread you did an utter flipflop and deemed that if Israel wanted to, they could destroy Palestine. So which is it? Do the Israeli's want peace or not? There is no grey area on this aeon, it's black and white. I've been pointing out all along that Israel has been holding back for decades, there has been nothing stopping them from blowing away Palestine, nothing except their desire to stop the fighting and live in peace. Just when things are calm and getting close, some idiots blow themselves up, or as in this case, abduct a soldier for shock value. Palestinians keep perpetuating the violence. Now look at where that's gotten them? IDF tanks in Gaza. Cause and effect aeon.
Your first sentance makes absolutely NO sense what so ever. I've read it 5 times over and I can't make any sense out of it. Can someone please translate loser-speak to English for me?
As for the 2nd sentance, there has been PLENTY of evidence aeon, you've just chosen not to read/listen to it. Hell, Mr. Bin Laden himself appeared on international television and told the West to go f.uck itself and claimed that Al-qaeda had carried out the attacks. People on these forums have been telling you this since I first started posting here. Yet you don't want to believe it, and that's your hang-up not mine buddy. My arguments make perfect sense. If the elected body, tells me something, i'm inclined to believe them, given the position they're in to make such calls. You, on the other hand, don't believe anything unless you can google it. Who's stance is more ridiculous aeon?
I'm still not sure as to what your point is, especially regarding 100,000 "close friends" of yours whom you can personally vouch for. Care to explain yourself in full on this one, as your mish-mash of frenglish has utterly confused me.
Once again, how can you vouch for 100,000 you don't know? How do you know that every single one of them is a perfect human being? How do you know that one isn't a rapist? Or a murderer? Or a thief? To reiterate, you cannot vouch for 100,000 people you've never met aeon. That's intellecually bankrupt, and i'm sure everyone on these forums will agree with me.
You're missing the point (as per usual) aeon. I'm not discussing their political affiliation, or their adherance to their religion. I'm talking about moderation. The Saudi's have a long-standing tradition of good rapport with the West. They've cooperated on numerous occasions with us, hell they even helped defeat Iraq in 90-91. That's my point. That and a direct corelation between backwards Islamic States and Prosperous Islamic States. If you look it aeon, there is a direct corelation between the level of Islamic Fanaticism and the Social Standing of the State in question. E.g.:
United Arab Emirates vs Palestine
Regardless, that's what i'm talking about aeon, moderation in their dealings with non-islamic nations.
As for your links:
1. Doesn't work
2. Did you actually READ the article? Or were there too many big words for you? The whole point to the article is to highlight that you cannot sue an organization that doesn't fall under your legal system. The Saudi High Commission isn't subject to U.S. Federal Law aeon.
Re: RE: Palestinian hero kidn
Well the fact that the majority of jews immigrated mainly from europe in the begining of 1900 to israel/palestine means yes the land belongs to mainly palestinians, of course there is the natives jews who were about 5 % of the total population, the land belong to them too and so as the other native ethni.
Champloo said:
Well the fact that the majority of jews immigrated mainly from europe in the begining of 1900 to israel/palestine means yes the land belongs to mainly palestinians, of course there is the natives jews who were about 5 % of the total population, the land belong to them too and so as the other native ethni.
aeon said:
The current attacks against Palestinian territory are in response to kidnappings and rocket attacks. If someone is trying to hurt you, the best option is to hit them back ten times harder. Its called a deterant.
I don't know, you'd have to ask Hamas. Its in their charter.
Up until they did that they were acheiving great strides on the road to peace. The election of Hamas stopped that. How does the election of Hamas help?
Thats prisoner abuse, a completely different issue. Besides,at least the people in Israeli detainment are alive. I don't see anyone there getting killed like that poor Jewish settler that was kidnapped the other day.
Up until they were expelled by Muslims, around the time of the collaps of the Roman Empire, the Jews were mostly settled in the area of Israel. No one really has a solid, "We were here first," claim on the region.
Re: RE: Palestinian hero kidn
This is the description of a fascist system,here is the definition of a fascist person.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism
That is pretty close to you
Well when you look at the damage israel has done to palestinians, it is clear they don't want peace, the damage they did to palestinians is something we have never seen since the great wars.
Do you realize how many damage israel has done so far?? if you call that they want peace, then you are ""enough said""
cause and effect?? 2 palestinian dig a tunnel, killed soldiers , kidnapped another one, result? israel are ready to kill them all.
You call them idiot by blowing themselves, which i agree, but you are in the army, ready to go in afganisthan, where from the begining there is no evidence that they are behind 9-11, so to summerize, you are ready to kill people for something based on a lie, you know what, that is not better than them.
I dont believe it, because it was brought by us officials, not aljeezeerah by the way.
Here is what bin laden said right after 9-11
Why don't you believe this one?? first it wasnt brought by us officials, which means a lot, and not shown to the american public.
Also according to fbi, oussama bin laden is left handed, on the video, he is suddenly right handed.
Since palestinians lives normal life in here, then no need to commit terrorist act.
I am not missing any point, dealing with the west isnt a sign of moderation, where the hell did you get that crap?
As for the links, here they are...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...ode=&contentId=A22088-2002Aug15¬Found=true
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1127811912376
and they work very well.
I did read the article, and yes it is ridicoulus, cause they are suspected to fund alquada, but they have a free pass, i don't think those in guantamobay would have had the same threatment, if they were only suspected to fund terrorist, completly ridicoulus when i think about it, and guys like you doesnt even see anything wrong with this.
Mogz said:
This is the description of a fascist system,here is the definition of a fascist person.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism
That is pretty close to you
Mogz said:
Well when you look at the damage israel has done to palestinians, it is clear they don't want peace, the damage they did to palestinians is something we have never seen since the great wars.
Mogz said:
Do you realize how many damage israel has done so far?? if you call that they want peace, then you are ""enough said""
cause and effect?? 2 palestinian dig a tunnel, killed soldiers , kidnapped another one, result? israel are ready to kill them all.
You call them idiot by blowing themselves, which i agree, but you are in the army, ready to go in afganisthan, where from the begining there is no evidence that they are behind 9-11, so to summerize, you are ready to kill people for something based on a lie, you know what, that is not better than them.
Mogz said:
I dont believe it, because it was brought by us officials, not aljeezeerah by the way.
Here is what bin laden said right after 9-11
Why don't you believe this one?? first it wasnt brought by us officials, which means a lot, and not shown to the american public.
Also according to fbi, oussama bin laden is left handed, on the video, he is suddenly right handed.
Mogz said:
Since palestinians lives normal life in here, then no need to commit terrorist act.
Mogz said:
I am not missing any point, dealing with the west isnt a sign of moderation, where the hell did you get that crap?
As for the links, here they are...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...ode=&contentId=A22088-2002Aug15¬Found=true
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1127811912376
and they work very well.
I did read the article, and yes it is ridicoulus, cause they are suspected to fund alquada, but they have a free pass, i don't think those in guantamobay would have had the same threatment, if they were only suspected to fund terrorist, completly ridicoulus when i think about it, and guys like you doesnt even see anything wrong with this.