Norway’s ‘We’re Sorry’ Monument to 91 Dead Witches

Cliffy

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Nov 19, 2008
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Ergot is a rye mold, not wheat and it is more referenced to Europe and the Dark Ages where there were records of people just going mad and going on killing sprees. In Salem, I heard if a man dreamed of a woman and she was not his wife, she was accused of witchcraft for invading his dreams. Some say it was also used to get even with women who refused to have sex with a man (married or not) just to get even.
 

EagleSmack

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In Salem, I heard if a man dreamed of a woman and she was not his wife, she was accused of witchcraft for invading his dreams. Some say it was also used to get even with women who refused to have sex with a man (married or not) just to get even.


Got a link?
 

SLM

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Mar 5, 2011
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I've read MANY books about the Salem Hysteria aka The Salem Witch Trials and "ergot" was only a possible theory to the hysteria in the girls.


Everything else points to religion, superstition, and politics. Politics meaning Salem Village politics.


As soon as the governor of Massachusetts said "spectral visions" can no longer be used as evidence the hysteria stopped.




The instigation was the girls actually dabbling in what could be considered witchcraft at that time.


I go to Salem a few times a year as I've always been fascinated by the people of those times and the Salem Hysteria. Now Salem is indeed a mecca for Wicca and all things supernatural. Salem in October is the best. I spoke to a Wiccan up there once and I said that it is interesting how this place (Salem) has become the place for Wicca and the women (and few men) that were killed during the hysteria were not witches at all. She agreed and said... "It was all Bull Sh*t."


No doubt something like that can easily start with a lie, a complete fabrication or embellishment.....just look at the hysteria in the 80's over daycare sex-abuse. And that's from a so-called reasoned, enlightened public.

Still I always thought the one thing that dabbling or superstition didn't explain was the violent seizures experienced by the girls, and ergot seems a reasonable enough explanation. Certainly the seizures were enough of a catalyst to move it forward/along, if not the outright instigation of it all.
 

Sal

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Sep 29, 2007
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Maybe. . .


omg, I could have a couple of those for breakfast no problem

they look pretty magical.

Got a link?

In the late 1600s, the Puritan settlement of Salem in Massachusetts toppled into chaos when accusations of witchcraft began to appear. Two young girls, aged nine and eleven, were said to have fallen victim to fits "beyond the power of Epileptic Fits or natural disease," including screams, strange contortions, and throwing objects. The village doctor, unable to explain the symptoms, suggested that witchcraft may be afoot in Salem. Others in the settlement began to exhibit similar inexplicable behavior, and shortly the accusations began to fly.
The infamous trials that followed left nineteen people hanged to death, and scores of others imprisoned under suspicion of supernatural wrongdoing. Today, few would suggest that those punished were actually guilty of witchcraft, but the true cause of the errant behavior in Salem's citizens is still a mystery. One theory-- perhaps the most intriguing yet offered-- suggests that the community's rye crop may have been partially to blame. Moreover, such maladjusted rye may have played a role in many of history's mysterious events.



Bad Rye and the Salem Witches ? Damn Interesting


an interesting read
 

Tecumsehsbones

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The NPS calls it the Salem Hysteria. I thought it rather tame myself and kind of grinned when I went to the NPS Salem Visitors Center and asked about the Salem Witch Trials and he kept calling it "The Hysteria".
It's some of that "political correctness" righties like to rant and rave about, except when it's used to whitewash the violence and insanity of groups of white Christians.
 

EagleSmack

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No doubt something like that can easily start with a lie, a complete fabrication or embellishment.....just look at the hysteria in the 80's over daycare sex-abuse. And that's from a so-called reasoned, enlightened public.

Still I always thought the one thing that dabbling or superstition didn't explain was the violent seizures experienced by the girls, and ergot seems a reasonable enough explanation. Certainly the seizures were enough of a catalyst to move it forward/along, if not the outright instigation of it all.


I think the seizures were staged... hysteria.


The seizures stopped when it was ruled that spectral visions could no longer be used as evidence in trial. The attention was off the group of girls and that was the end of it.

It's some of that "political correctness" righties like to rant and rave about, except when it's used to whitewash the violence and insanity of groups of white Christians.


Oh please. Cry me a river.

In the late 1600s, the Puritan settlement of Salem in Massachusetts toppled into chaos when accusations of witchcraft began to appear. Two young girls, aged nine and eleven, were said to have fallen victim to fits "beyond the power of Epileptic Fits or natural disease," including screams, strange contortions, and throwing objects. The village doctor, unable to explain the symptoms, suggested that witchcraft may be afoot in Salem. Others in the settlement began to exhibit similar inexplicable behavior, and shortly the accusations began to fly.
The infamous trials that followed left nineteen people hanged to death, and scores of others imprisoned under suspicion of supernatural wrongdoing. Today, few would suggest that those punished were actually guilty of witchcraft, but the true cause of the errant behavior in Salem's citizens is still a mystery. One theory-- perhaps the most intriguing yet offered-- suggests that the community's rye crop may have been partially to blame. Moreover, such maladjusted rye may have played a role in many of history's mysterious events.



Bad Rye and the Salem Witches ? Damn Interesting


an interesting read


That was one of the theories of course. I was asking Cliffy if he had a link to back up his claim.
 

SLM

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Mar 5, 2011
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I think the seizures were staged... hysteria.
The seizures stopped when it was ruled that spectral visions could no longer be used as evidence in trial. The attention was off the group of girls and that was the end of it.

I think they were staged later on, but think in the beginning it was real (the seizures), so caused by something. The reason I personally think this is I don't see young girls of that era being sophisticated enough to concoct it purely on their own, but certainly capable of latching onto the idea once it presented itself. Just my opinion.
 

EagleSmack

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I think they were staged later on, but think in the beginning it was real (the seizures), so caused by something. The reason I personally think this is I don't see young girls of that era being sophisticated enough to concoct it purely on their own, but certainly capable of latching onto the idea once it presented itself. Just my opinion.


I certainly see young girls of that era carrying on like any other era. During the height of the events they had the accusers in the back of the wagon driving through other villages pointing out "witches" and houses where witches lived.They were actually more malicious it would seem because people were getting hanged for it and they did not stop until their phony antics were no longer admissible. JMO
 

SLM

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Mar 5, 2011
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I certainly see young girls of that era carrying on like any other era. During the height of the events they had the accusers in the back of the wagon driving through other villages pointing out "witches" and houses where witches lived.They were actually more malicious it would seem because people were getting hanged for it and they did not stop until their phony antics were no longer admissible. JMO

Oh it was incredibly malicious! No two ways about it. I just meant at the very, very beginning when it all started with those two (or three?) girls. The one they blamed on the maid/slave. Everything they did can be explained by them feeding off the adult's reactions, except for the seizures. Unless it was super common knowledge that possession induces seizures and very young girls were able to expertly pass off a fake seizure they'd probably never witnessed before....but I doubt it. That's what I meant by sophisticated. I wasn't trying to imply that they were innocent parties, far from it.
 

EagleSmack

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Oh it was incredibly malicious! No two ways about it. I just meant at the very, very beginning when it all started with those two (or three?) girls. The one they blamed on the maid/slave. Everything they did can be explained by them feeding off the adult's reactions, except for the seizures. Unless it was super common knowledge that possession induces seizures and very young girls were able to expertly pass off a fake seizure they'd probably never witnessed before....but I doubt it. That's what I meant by sophisticated. I wasn't trying to imply that they were innocent parties, far from it.


Yes the maid/slave that they were actually doing what was considered then as witchcraft and got busted doing it. THEN the seizures started and spread to other girls and women of the same clique.


One frustrating part was that one of the accusers accused one of the judges of being a witch during one of the trials and he said.


"We will have none of that. You will Stick to the evidence."


And according to the source the girl grinned and continued her accusation of the accused on trial.


So pathetic.
 

Sal

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I think the seizures were staged... hysteria.


The seizures stopped when it was ruled that spectral visions could no longer be used as evidence in trial. The attention was off the group of girls and that was the end of it.

That was one of the theories of course. I was asking Cliffy if he had a link to back up his claim.
ah okay

the seizures could have stopped once the rye was no longer infected
 

Blackleaf

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Oct 9, 2004
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It's a shame we can't tie the Loose Women to a large stake, pile kindling around them, and ignite it. Unfortunately, that'll probably be illegal.
 

Locutus

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Jun 18, 2007
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It's a shame we can't tie the Loose Women to a large stake, pile kindling around them, and ignite it. Unfortunately, that'll probably be illegal.






There appears to be plenty of Milfy and Gilfy goodness on that program man. Unlike the American view spin-off (which nobody should watch anyway). Go with the fantasy but please, stop watching it if it bothers you. Kinda like that oprah thing over here.

I recommend gilfs.

protip: they're not skittish and they know how to bake.

Unless of course, you're not into women at all. Can't help you there bud.