Nice American Article: US vs. Canada

[Paranoid Dot Calm]

Yuh Know ....

Unless ordinary folks storm the Parliament of Canada and begin to demand social justice ...... nothing will change. Quit dreamin' .

Governments are looking for any reason to walk away from all the commitments they made within our lifetimes.

The government well knows the anger, disillusion and disappointment within our communities across Canada.

And .... They know that "We're" comin' .

Their worst enemy right now is the internet.

I can easily see the governments using "pornography" as the beginning point of "controlling" internet access.
They will soon only allow "approved" sites to be listed through Google-Search. If your not reputable or have not got a "licence", you will not be listed on any Search Engine.

Presently; the police are bragging about catching perverts and chatroom molesters.
No doubt, soon they will be talking about the internet being a "tool" for terrorists.

They are gonna shut the internet down!

The last thing they need is for ordinary Canadians to share views and opinions with each other.
That would be "terrorism".

Anyone who gets sick and needs medical attention should just go out and slap a policeman (not hard or in anger).
In jail you have more "rights" to medical care than ordinary Canadians.
In jail, they even have an ombudsmun.
Prisoners "earned" these "rights" by rioting!

Calm

 

[Paranoid Dot Calm]

Yuh Know ....

Unless ordinary folks storm the Parliament of Canada and begin to demand social justice ...... nothing will change. Quit dreamin' .

Governments are looking for any reason to walk away from all the commitments they made within our lifetimes.

The government well knows the anger, disillusion and disappointment within our communities across Canada.

And .... They know that "We're" comin' .

Their worst enemy right now is the internet.

I can easily see the governments using "pornography" as the beginning point of "controlling" internet access.
They will soon only allow "approved" sites to be listed through Google-Search. If your not reputable or have not got a "licence", you will not be listed on any Search Engine.

Presently; the police are bragging about catching perverts and chatroom molesters.
No doubt, soon they will be talking about the internet being a "tool" for terrorists.

They are gonna shut the internet down!

The last thing they need is for ordinary Canadians to share views and opinions with each other.
That would be "terrorism".

Anyone who gets sick and needs medical attention should just go out and slap a policeman (not hard or in anger).
In jail you have more "rights" to medical care than ordinary Canadians.
In jail, they even have an ombudsmun.
Prisoners "earned" these "rights" by rioting!

Calm

 

[Paranoid Dot Calm]

Yuh Know ....

Unless ordinary folks storm the Parliament of Canada and begin to demand social justice ...... nothing will change. Quit dreamin' .

Governments are looking for any reason to walk away from all the commitments they made within our lifetimes.

The government well knows the anger, disillusion and disappointment within our communities across Canada.

And .... They know that "We're" comin' .

Their worst enemy right now is the internet.

I can easily see the governments using "pornography" as the beginning point of "controlling" internet access.
They will soon only allow "approved" sites to be listed through Google-Search. If your not reputable or have not got a "licence", you will not be listed on any Search Engine.

Presently; the police are bragging about catching perverts and chatroom molesters.
No doubt, soon they will be talking about the internet being a "tool" for terrorists.

They are gonna shut the internet down!

The last thing they need is for ordinary Canadians to share views and opinions with each other.
That would be "terrorism".

Anyone who gets sick and needs medical attention should just go out and slap a policeman (not hard or in anger).
In jail you have more "rights" to medical care than ordinary Canadians.
In jail, they even have an ombudsmun.
Prisoners "earned" these "rights" by rioting!

Calm

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Nice American Article

Tibear, you can dress up the system you're advocating any way you want to, but in the end you are advocating two tier health care. The problems with that approach have been detailed in many, many studies. I suggest you peruse them.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Nice American Article

Tibear, you can dress up the system you're advocating any way you want to, but in the end you are advocating two tier health care. The problems with that approach have been detailed in many, many studies. I suggest you peruse them.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Nice American Article

Tibear, you can dress up the system you're advocating any way you want to, but in the end you are advocating two tier health care. The problems with that approach have been detailed in many, many studies. I suggest you peruse them.

 

[zenfisher]

Tibear the point is in Canada you may have had to wait for a little bit longer to see the doctors.Its free.

In the the US, the waiting time may have been slightly shorter. You would have had to pay three doctors.

 

[zenfisher]

Tibear the point is in Canada you may have had to wait for a little bit longer to see the doctors.Its free.

In the the US, the waiting time may have been slightly shorter. You would have had to pay three doctors.

 

[zenfisher]

Tibear the point is in Canada you may have had to wait for a little bit longer to see the doctors.Its free.

In the the US, the waiting time may have been slightly shorter. You would have had to pay three doctors.

 

[tibear]

zen,

If I wait long enough I'll get to see the medical examiner, who is also free.

That's not the point. When someone has a life-threatening medical condition, they will do anything they can to get it dealt with ASAP. Our system doesn't allow for that and so many Canadians go south.

Again, it looks like RB and yourself would rather stick your heads in the sand and pretend that the problem doesn't exist rather than roll up your sleeves and try to get something done.

I agree with alot of RB has to say about the Romanow report, but how to we get these things happening now, without increasing taxes by 10-15%. Canadians aren't prepared to have their taxes raised by these amounts because they still believe the medical system can change without increasing the budget, I sure in I agree but that is the belief.

The system I suggest generates alot of "free" money for the healthcare system which would normally go to further build the US system and attract even more Canadians down south.

It frustrates me to no end when people like RB, immediately reject new concepts because it "appears" to go against what they perceive to be a perfect system. We'll never get anywhere if people aren't willing to discuss alternatives.

 

[tibear]

zen,

If I wait long enough I'll get to see the medical examiner, who is also free.

That's not the point. When someone has a life-threatening medical condition, they will do anything they can to get it dealt with ASAP. Our system doesn't allow for that and so many Canadians go south.

Again, it looks like RB and yourself would rather stick your heads in the sand and pretend that the problem doesn't exist rather than roll up your sleeves and try to get something done.

I agree with alot of RB has to say about the Romanow report, but how to we get these things happening now, without increasing taxes by 10-15%. Canadians aren't prepared to have their taxes raised by these amounts because they still believe the medical system can change without increasing the budget, I sure in I agree but that is the belief.

The system I suggest generates alot of "free" money for the healthcare system which would normally go to further build the US system and attract even more Canadians down south.

It frustrates me to no end when people like RB, immediately reject new concepts because it "appears" to go against what they perceive to be a perfect system. We'll never get anywhere if people aren't willing to discuss alternatives.

 

[tibear]

zen,

If I wait long enough I'll get to see the medical examiner, who is also free.

That's not the point. When someone has a life-threatening medical condition, they will do anything they can to get it dealt with ASAP. Our system doesn't allow for that and so many Canadians go south.

Again, it looks like RB and yourself would rather stick your heads in the sand and pretend that the problem doesn't exist rather than roll up your sleeves and try to get something done.

I agree with alot of RB has to say about the Romanow report, but how to we get these things happening now, without increasing taxes by 10-15%. Canadians aren't prepared to have their taxes raised by these amounts because they still believe the medical system can change without increasing the budget, I sure in I agree but that is the belief.

The system I suggest generates alot of "free" money for the healthcare system which would normally go to further build the US system and attract even more Canadians down south.

It frustrates me to no end when people like RB, immediately reject new concepts because it "appears" to go against what they perceive to be a perfect system. We'll never get anywhere if people aren't willing to discuss alternatives.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Nice American Article

Your alternative isn't new, tibear. It's the same alternative that the radical right has been pushing since Mulroney was in power.

Taxes do not need to increase by 10% to 15% to fix health care. That is a scare tactic being used by those who would privatise health care. Even if taxes did increase by that much though, it would still be cheaper than paying for private insurance.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Nice American Article

Your alternative isn't new, tibear. It's the same alternative that the radical right has been pushing since Mulroney was in power.

Taxes do not need to increase by 10% to 15% to fix health care. That is a scare tactic being used by those who would privatise health care. Even if taxes did increase by that much though, it would still be cheaper than paying for private insurance.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Nice American Article

Your alternative isn't new, tibear. It's the same alternative that the radical right has been pushing since Mulroney was in power.

Taxes do not need to increase by 10% to 15% to fix health care. That is a scare tactic being used by those who would privatise health care. Even if taxes did increase by that much though, it would still be cheaper than paying for private insurance.

 

[tibear]

RB,

Lets go over this thread:
- we both agree that Canada already has two tiered health care. Rich can go to US to get immediate health care, poor must stay in Canada and wait and wait and wait somemore.
- poor in our society have poor teeth and poor eyesight and no money to pay for prescriptions(regardless of how cheap they are)
- Romanow report has many ideas which everyone basically agrees are good but the government doesn't have the money to act on very many if any of the recommendations.
- I've put forth an idea that doesn't allow private clinics and allows for more money into the public health system
- You've poo-poo'd the idea because you perceive it as an attack on the public health system. But haven't shown how the system goes against the public health act.

I agree with you that some people on the right see a possibility of making money off the new system. What's so bad about making a profit?? If the system provides better universal care for everyone at a lower cost what is the problem??

The problem I see is that the left, don't want people to make money off of healthcare. Why not??? Could the same arguements be made regarding every other aspect of our lives??? Should the government start to run: food stores, garages, construction companies, etc because the poor should have universal access to all of these as well???

Please find me a quote from anyone you define as "right" that indicates that if private clinics(which I'm not in favour of) do exist that they would not cater to the poor.

 

[tibear]

RB,

Lets go over this thread:
- we both agree that Canada already has two tiered health care. Rich can go to US to get immediate health care, poor must stay in Canada and wait and wait and wait somemore.
- poor in our society have poor teeth and poor eyesight and no money to pay for prescriptions(regardless of how cheap they are)
- Romanow report has many ideas which everyone basically agrees are good but the government doesn't have the money to act on very many if any of the recommendations.
- I've put forth an idea that doesn't allow private clinics and allows for more money into the public health system
- You've poo-poo'd the idea because you perceive it as an attack on the public health system. But haven't shown how the system goes against the public health act.

I agree with you that some people on the right see a possibility of making money off the new system. What's so bad about making a profit?? If the system provides better universal care for everyone at a lower cost what is the problem??

The problem I see is that the left, don't want people to make money off of healthcare. Why not??? Could the same arguements be made regarding every other aspect of our lives??? Should the government start to run: food stores, garages, construction companies, etc because the poor should have universal access to all of these as well???

Please find me a quote from anyone you define as "right" that indicates that if private clinics(which I'm not in favour of) do exist that they would not cater to the poor.

 

[tibear]

RB,

Lets go over this thread:
- we both agree that Canada already has two tiered health care. Rich can go to US to get immediate health care, poor must stay in Canada and wait and wait and wait somemore.
- poor in our society have poor teeth and poor eyesight and no money to pay for prescriptions(regardless of how cheap they are)
- Romanow report has many ideas which everyone basically agrees are good but the government doesn't have the money to act on very many if any of the recommendations.
- I've put forth an idea that doesn't allow private clinics and allows for more money into the public health system
- You've poo-poo'd the idea because you perceive it as an attack on the public health system. But haven't shown how the system goes against the public health act.

I agree with you that some people on the right see a possibility of making money off the new system. What's so bad about making a profit?? If the system provides better universal care for everyone at a lower cost what is the problem??

The problem I see is that the left, don't want people to make money off of healthcare. Why not??? Could the same arguements be made regarding every other aspect of our lives??? Should the government start to run: food stores, garages, construction companies, etc because the poor should have universal access to all of these as well???

Please find me a quote from anyone you define as "right" that indicates that if private clinics(which I'm not in favour of) do exist that they would not cater to the poor.

 

[Jay]

Re: RE: Nice American Article

My grandfather had to wait over a year for his hip replacement. Of course he turned it down twice because it was harvest. Turns out they send you down the list when you tell them, "Not now." Of course if he would have gone in the first time he would have waited less than three months. If he'd gone in the second time it would have been about eight months. If he would have gone to the doctor when he should have in the first place it would have happened 3 or 4 years earlier.

My father has been getting excellent care for his Alzheimers since day one, including speech therapy. Soon he will have a home-care worker so my stepmother gets a break for a few hours once in a while.

My stepmother and my aunt both received prompt and excellent care for their cancer. Come to think of it, so did another aunt.

My mother has received excellent treatment for her medical problems.

We don't need a hybrid system, Tibear. The US system is more expensive on a per capita basis, is no more efficient for the majority of Americans, and kills poor people. You were yakking about abortion in another thread, so maybe you should compare infant mortality rates. The system you are promoting kills fetuses that are so viable they are already breathing air.

"We don't need a hybrid system, Tibear."

Yes we don't NEED a hybrid system, and we don't NEED the current system.

PS: I’m glad you have experienced good returns from the Health Care system. You are lucky; many haven’t here in Ontario at least.

 

[Jay]

Re: RE: Nice American Article

My grandfather had to wait over a year for his hip replacement. Of course he turned it down twice because it was harvest. Turns out they send you down the list when you tell them, "Not now." Of course if he would have gone in the first time he would have waited less than three months. If he'd gone in the second time it would have been about eight months. If he would have gone to the doctor when he should have in the first place it would have happened 3 or 4 years earlier.

My father has been getting excellent care for his Alzheimers since day one, including speech therapy. Soon he will have a home-care worker so my stepmother gets a break for a few hours once in a while.

My stepmother and my aunt both received prompt and excellent care for their cancer. Come to think of it, so did another aunt.

My mother has received excellent treatment for her medical problems.

We don't need a hybrid system, Tibear. The US system is more expensive on a per capita basis, is no more efficient for the majority of Americans, and kills poor people. You were yakking about abortion in another thread, so maybe you should compare infant mortality rates. The system you are promoting kills fetuses that are so viable they are already breathing air.

"We don't need a hybrid system, Tibear."

Yes we don't NEED a hybrid system, and we don't NEED the current system.

PS: I’m glad you have experienced good returns from the Health Care system. You are lucky; many haven’t here in Ontario at least.