Nationalize Canadian oil reserves!!!!

mt_pockets1000

Council Member
Jun 22, 2006
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To be fair, the rest of the country sold Newfoundland out (after defacto forcing her to join) to foreign interests simply because it wasn't worth the bother to everyone else in the interests of "national unity".

So why shouldn't Alberta get sold out like Newfoundland? Perhaps allow Companies to export the Oil with no royalties, claim its unfair trade to collect money for resources "Sorry, resources are private property now".

Just claim its a treaty and withhold an appropriate amount of money from out west to even any money collected out.

If there is one thing central governments are good at, its selling out all its component interests.

Finally, someone who has read and understands the history of Newfoundland. Thank you for acknowledging the facts Zzarchov. The situation with Newfoundland will never happen to another province in our dominion. Alberta can rest easy in that regard. The feds knew when they enticed Newfoundland into the fold that the natural resources were just ripe for the picking. There is still an ongoing debate in that province whether the vote to join Canada was legal. Some say the vote was rigged. But I digress...we were talking about Oil Reserves. Although we certainly can draw some parallels from the Newfoundland resource history.
 

gerryh

Time Out
Nov 21, 2004
25,756
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Doesn't say much for the intelligence of newfies....I guess the jokes are close to the mark....they do say, many a truth has been said in jest.
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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CANADIAN ENERGY SECURITY
Easterners could freeze in the dark

The U.S. has a national energy policy that emphasizes self-sufficiency, energy independence and domestic ownership. Why don't we?
GORDON LAXER
The Globe and Mail
May 28, 2007
At a meeting of the House of Commons' international trade committee earlier this month, Leon Benoit, the Conservative chairman, ordered me to stop my presentation as an invited witness. My remarks, he ruled, were not relevant. When his decision was successfully challenged by other members of the committee, Mr. Benoit adjourned the meeting and left the room.
I was astonished. I had spent several days preparing for my presentation, and two days in transit. Later, I learned that Mr. Benoit's behaviour may have been prompted by a secret guidebook for Conservative chairmen, designed to interrupt witnesses challenging government positions.
If so, it backfired. Suppression intrigues people. They want to know what caused the storm.
I was cut off after noting that the United States has a National Energy Policy (a NEP) that emphasizes self-sufficiency, energy independence and domestic ownership.
And while Canada, as part of our bilateral Security and Prosperity Partnership initiative, supports U.S. efforts to wean itself off Middle Eastern oil, I noted that we do not have a NEP of our own.
Indeed, Canada's official goal is greater continental co-operation, at the expense of our own security of supply.
For example, in researching how Canada's energy security would be affected by exporting more energy to the United States, I learned that Canada has no plans, or enough pipelines, to get oil to Eastern Canadians in the event of an international supply crisis.
Further, I was surprised that the government was not even studying Canadian energy security.
The National Energy Board wrote me on April 12: "Unfortunately, the NEB has not undertaken any studies on security of supply." Yet the board's mandate is to "promote safety and security ... in the Canadian public interest."
I asked if Canada, as a member of the International Energy Agency, will establish a Strategic Petroleum Reserve. The IEA was created to counter OPEC's boycotting power; its 24 members are supposed to maintain 90 days of emergency oil reserves.
The NEB replied that Canada "was specifically exempted from establishing a reserve, on the grounds that Canada is a net exporting country whereas the other members are net importers."
But that doesn't make sense. Canada may be a net exporter, but it still imports 40 per cent of its oil - 850,000 barrels per day - to meet 90 per cent of Atlantic Canada's and Quebec's needs, and 40 per cent of Ontario's.
A rising share of those imports, 45 per cent, comes from OPEC countries, primarily Algeria, Saudi Arabia and Iraq. Meanwhile, imports from safer North Sea suppliers have shrunk to 37 per cent.
Many Eastern Canadians heat their homes with oil. Western Canada cannot supply all of Eastern Canadian needs, because NAFTA reserves Canadian oil for Americans' security of supply. Canada now exports 63 per cent of the oil it produces and 56 per cent of its natural gas.
http://www.canadians.org/media/council/2007/28-May-07.html

This is how you build national unity folks. Let them freeze in the east. Un-freakin-believable. Can anyone else here see the unfairness in the NAFTA agreement?

Let's see...the people in eastern Canada have to import their oil and pay world market prices for it. Alberta exports her oil at world market prices. At the very least, instead of building pipelines to the states, how about you send one or two down east. They'd be happy to pay the going rate for it. Then in case of a world wide shortage at least our country would be self sufficient and major parts of the country would not be left high and dry. Again it all comes back to our federal government lacking the intestinal fortitude to force this issue in the name of national security.

mt_pockets1000, very important statement “in the name of national security” to bad some Canadians do not respect that phrase. BC could be looking down the road TELLING Alberta you can not use our harbor facility so well connected to the Pacific Rim in case Alberta decides to play the roll of the Arab with their presses energy. In time of a national crisis Canada is one country, not 2 or 3 of the 10 provinces feel they are more important than the rest of us. Alberta you want to be self-serving? You will pay big if you need to use our harbor.
 
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Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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Walter; First of all most Canadians are not in favour of 'BIG GOVERNMENT," and it is only the Liberals and the NDP, who see a Canada where government is all things to all people, from birth to death. I'm sorry, but I for one do not want either politicians or bureaucrats deciding for me how my money is to be spent, and the money I am talking about is not only the little bit that is left after taxes, but I am also talking about t6he money they collect as taxes and fritter it away. Alberta like Quebec or any other province for that matter came into the Canadian Federation and by referendum can leave as well. If Canada tries to pull another NEB hijacking of Alberta's oil resources it will give the people of Alberta the motivation to opt out of Canada. The reaiity is that Alberta can survive without Canada, but the reverse is not possible.

If Alberta decides to pull the plug on Canada what happens to Quebec and the other have-not provinces? The feds certainly can't afford to fund these provinces who cannot make it on their own, without raising taxes to a level that we will all wind up in long lines at soup kitchens, and food banks?

As for Canada's Constitution, we are the only democratic country in the world that had no say in the formation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. Because of that fact we have a document that is flawed to the ninths, because not only does in confer more rights on criminals than it does their victims, but it also allows a bunch of appointed and unaccountable members of the judiciary to dictate to our elected representatives, and that is just wrong!



It is not in Alberta’s best interest to pull out of Canada with out the unity of British Columbia. What, is Alberta going to become a nation of its own? That is a dream which will never become reality without BC.
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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well...I know I really don't have to worry about it, because to nationalize the oil industry and have the feds take control of Oil and Gas would require a constitutional amendment. Something that will never happpen because, it's not only Alberta that has oil and gas. BC, Saskatchewan, East Coast..... not to mention, does it stop with JUST oil or will other mining endevours be "nationalized? How about Nationalizing BC's logging industry and stumping fees go to the feds to spread around ALL of Canada. How would that be BC'ers... you guys willing to lose that revenue?

Gerryh, first of all, let us not forget that in a time of national energy crisis the country may have no other alternative but to approve of such constitutional amendment.
Make no mistake about the fact that when we talk about energy we are talking about the blood stream of the country we stop the blood supply to the body and the body dies. Same thing with energy we slow dramatically the flow of energy and the Country’s economy dies. So, there are no winers at the end of this energy crisis.

The logging industry is not the same as forcing people out of their cars.
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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Geez Gerr...now that's what I call going off half cocked. Do you wanna debate or do you wanna start cussin' and swearin' because you're not getting your own way? So you drop a few F bombs and that makes you automatically correct? Or is that anatomically correct? As for balls, perhaps you're referring to those tiny gonads hiding under the belly of your avatar.



Ha hahahahah oh man oh man,,,,,,,,,,,
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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And rightly so. I have no argument with that. Ontario has given it's fair share over the years as well. Right now that province is experiencing some hard times. It's only fair the rest of the country pitch in and give them a helping hand in their time of need. If I recall my history correctly, it was not so long ago when Alberta was on the receiving end of financial help from the rest of the country. It's all relative...who cares.

Believe me, I'm not proud that Newfoundland has been on the receiving end of transfer payments for so long. That's a result of poor government and shady business deals. It's not that we want our hands in your pocket, as you succintly put it. Out of necessity and poverty we were at an economic disadvantage. I'm certainly proud that our province is now able to give back to the rest of the country with our increased revenue from the oil industry.

But this thread is about National Oil Reserves. And if we don't get this straight here and now, there may come a day when we will pay the price for our lack of foresight. Maybe not Alberta so much but certainly the rest of the country.

By the way, how come Alberta only has $14 billion in their Heritage Fund when a country like Norway with similar oil production numbers has somewhere in the range of $298 billion?


It is about being Canadians first before self.
 

Socrates the Greek

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Apr 15, 2006
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That is the problem with immigration today, half of the people that immigrate to Canada they come here to use Canada’s resources for a while and then bolt out of the country with cash and unpaid debt.
To be a good Canadian, the transition takes place under the skin not inside the pocket.
 

mt_pockets1000

Council Member
Jun 22, 2006
1,292
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Edmonton
Doesn't say much for the intelligence of newfies....I guess the jokes are close to the mark....they do say, many a truth has been said in jest.

Exactly how red is your neck Gerry? Crimson, scarlett...

Just for the record, Rick Hillier (a Newfoundlander) just finished leading our troops in Afghanistan, Rex Murphy (a Newfoundlander) who's commentary on CBC can boggle the minds of most people, Gordon Pinsent (a Newfoundlander) who has become part of Canadiana through his many acting roles. Should I go on Gerr....

A mans intelligence is not measured by the number of degrees and diplomas he has hanging on the wall. But you can judge a mans intelligence by the words that come out of his mouth. I'll put you down as a 2 out of 10 Gerry. Oh wait a minute...in the bull**** department you score a whopping 10! Congratulations, you win a steaming heaping pile of Alberta cow****.
 

Zzarchov

House Member
Aug 28, 2006
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Nothing to do with supremacy Zzarchov, it has to do with pure Patriotic Loyalty.;-)

Patriotic Loyalty is the nice way of saying Nationalistic Obedience.

This is Canada, it was never designed (for good or ill) to have a strong central government, its a regional based federal system.

If you want to change the system to fit the new minds of people from more centralized nations around the world, it would seem like your disobeying your own advise about immigrants learning to love the Canadian culture.

Im not saying its right, Im saying thats part of what makes Canada, Canada.
 

einmensch

Electoral Member
Mar 1, 2008
937
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The differential in diesel is even greater, selling at $5.04 a gallon in San Diego County and $2.20 in Tijuana.
 

Colpy

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 5, 2005
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This is Canada, it was never designed (for good or ill) to have a strong central government, its a regional based federal system.

If you want to change the system to fit the new minds of people from more centralized nations around the world, it would seem like your disobeying your own advise about immigrants learning to love the Canadian culture.

Im not saying its right, Im saying thats part of what makes Canada, Canada.

Actually, Zz, I have to argue that point with you.........Canada was intended to be a nation with a strong centralized government. The overwhelming evidence of that is found in the BNA Act.........which reveals the intent of the authors by awarding all "residual powers" to the central gov't, and giving the Federal gov't the power to "disallow" ANY provincial legislation.

The people responsible for our constitution had just watched the USA tear itself to pieces in the Civil War. To them, the main cause of that conflict was the loose construction of the American federation, which left the individual states with most of the power, and Sir John A. had NO intention of seeing that happen here.......

The irony is that the USA, which was meant to be a loose coalition of states, has become a united nation with power residing mostly in Washington......and Canada, which was intended to have a very powerful central gov't ruling over a tight coalition of provinces, has become a loose coalition of provinces....

The best laid plans.....
 
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Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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Exactly how red is your neck Gerry? Crimson, scarlett...

Just for the record, Rick Hillier (a Newfoundlander) just finished leading our troops in Afghanistan, Rex Murphy (a Newfoundlander) who's commentary on CBC can boggle the minds of most people, Gordon Pinsent (a Newfoundlander) who has become part of Canadiana through his many acting roles. Should I go on Gerr....

A mans intelligence is not measured by the number of degrees and diplomas he has hanging on the wall. But you can judge a mans intelligence by the words that come out of his mouth. I'll put you down as a 2 out of 10 Gerry. Oh wait a minute...in the bull**** department you score a whopping 10! Congratulations, you win a steaming heaping pile of Alberta cow****.

mt_pockets, gerry is sometimes a little self centered which makes him spout out some unnecessary verbiage.
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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Actually, Zz, I have to argue that point with you.........Canada was intended to be a nation with a strong centralized government. The overwhelming evidence of that is found in the BNA Act.........which reveals the intent of the authors by awarding all "residual powers" to the central gov't, and giving the Federal gov't the power to "disallow" ANY provincial legislation.

The people responsible for our constitution had just watched the USA tear itself to pieces in the Civil War. To them, the main cause of that conflict was the loose construction of the American federation, which left the individual states with most of the power, and Sir John A. had NO intention of seeing that happen here.......

The irony is that the USA, which was meant to be a loose coalition of states, has become a united nation with power residing mostly in Washington......and Canada, which was intended to have a very powerful central gov't ruling over a tight coalition of provinces, has become a loose coalition of provinces....

The best laid plans.....

Colpy you are well informed about the structure of Government, to bad the Conservatives got it all wrong.