Geez, I wish every question was that easy. For part of the 9 months "the entity" can survive well in either role as a fetus or post caesarian birth as a "human", so is what you are saying is if it is a human or not depends on location? :smile:
Maryland Abortion Doctors Charged With Murder
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Geez, I wish every question was that easy. For part of the 9 months "the entity" can survive well in either role as a fetus or post caesarian birth as a "human", so is what you are saying is if it is a human or not depends on location? :smile:
NO......A cow's gestation is 9 months......how much time have scientists spent on whether their offspring are sacred and all must be saved no matter what?? Very damn little. However, scientists have spent a great deal of research on improving milk or meat production. Not a thought to brain or communication development. This species is not stupid. They show love, tenderness, anger, fear, curiosity, humour even slyness. So, other than religion why do we treat animals as we do?? Mind you, I enjoy a steak as much as the next person, and milk kept my family solvent for many years. I just think we need to do need to put our ideas of overweaning worth in perspective.
Puleese time to use the fabulous animal brain we have developed over the ages and toss out the old controlling religious influences.. .
What?? why do you attribute an "entity" to a bit of tissue or even to a fully developed new born?? Humans, just like all animals develop!! If the biblical god says life is given in the first breath, where does it say that particular life is actually ensouled (for the religious) It is logical for others to assume that when a baby is given life by a member of the human species, then that is when life begins!! It is free to develop individual awareness.
For the religious:: If we, as souls, have been given free choice, that choice of necessity must begin before birth!! We should get to choose our parents, the time and place of our journey. We are allowed to plan as much as possible our life journey. Because all have the same free choice, we must make agreements and alliances before hand. Because of free choice anyone may reneige on any agreement or ignore any alliance. Soo.....if parents or child reneige on the agreement to engage in a relationship, the results are a miscarriage or abortion. Isn't this is how a reasonable god would set things up.
But hey, if one feels obliged to believe in a cruel or unforgiving biblical one, then we get "Kill all Abortionists" or Kill all Unbelievers". There are slaves of many stripes!!
Why else would two females attempt to save a calf from a prize milk cow if there was?? Life in cows as with humans time can be of the essence.
Call me a 'crazy' person if you like.... I'm pro-life... but ironically, late term abortions are some of the few that I would actually support once I got researching and being honest about my desire to see people live.
Crazy right? But, late term abortions are some of the very few that are actually done to save a mother's life. Make late term abortion illegal, and you preserve the right to abort for convenience sake, while removing the right to abort to save a mother's life. What sense does that make?
I did not know that.
We are back to square one, lol
Yes, now I am firm on mother's right trumping the child.
The abortion question is only a religious question for religious people. Non-religious people have opinions about the subject as well - and it isn't necessarily that abortion should be performed at any time prior to natural birth. Please don't assume that those that believe abortion needs guidlines or regulations are controlled by religious influences. There are, after all, plenty of ways to form an opinion other than to look to religion ... like logic, common sense and decency.
And of course a cow and a calf have monetary value while a fetus is just an inconvenience:roll:
Well, other than the contention that it's your planet, I'd generally agree with your take on "Might is right," being the dominant influence in ethics.
It is very rare for people who are not religious to assert an a priori moral superiority for humans; certainly not one who started from no moral premises whatsoever and worked logically towards a conclusion.
Then, asserting that the death of something human is murder is also equally rare for someone who has sat down and actually contemplated things such as the difference between homicide, suicide, murder and abortion. The person who asserts the equality of any two without attaching "... in my opinion" is reasonably viewed as having accepted the opinion of somebody else dogmatically. And what do you associate dogma with?
But yeah, "Most humans have legs, you have legs, therefore you are a human," is faulty.
I disagree. People indoctrinated with religion may be influenced by what they learned through that religion, but not all people are indoctrinated with religion to the extent that it rules their thoughts. Abortion, in my opinion, is a question of: at what point during gestation does life begin. This is a scientific question, as life is scientifically defined. Life is not defined by a soul or religious books except in religion. Religion is for those that want to believe rather than question.
The whole debate of what defines life is certainly interesting, but the point that concerns me regarding this article is that we know a woman that was 33 weeks pregnant resorted to having an abortion procedure initiated in one state and completed in another state. That doesn't sound like a helpless pregnant teenager or a terminally ill pregnant woman. That sounds like a resourceful, able bodied woman that changed her mind about her pregnancy after the child was viable and who then sought out a shady doctor to carry out the abortion. That doctor should be prosecuted for performing a terminal procedure on a viable child ... as that is the law that was broken.
Depends on the circumstances doesn't it?? For, us our children had great value and choosing to save them was no problem whatever. I wonder, though, just how the 9th child, in a poor, starving family would be greeted?? That 9th, would be much more than a monetary inconvenience wouldn't it?? It could be a death sentence for the whole family!!
Do you know that every year 15 million children world wide die of starvation? Kind of puts the inconvenience of a fetus in perspective doesn't it??
Life begins at conception......the key word here is " begins." There are multiple factors that interrupt the course of those beginnings, many of which are not artificially induced. It is we, collectively, that must decide when that beginning has reached culmination and the individual begins. Certainly until it can exist outside of the womb it cannot be considered other than mere fertilized tissue. Human eggs can be fertilized outside the womb, Does this immediately make them an aware individual?? Hardly think so.
The way you keep sidetracking the issue, moving the goal post...let me ask you....did you ever tell your girls "Eat your vegetables...millions of children are starving in africa, and would like to have what you're leaving on your plate"
Because you are doing the same thing here, posting irrelevant stuff.
Your statement.....Certainly, refering to the OP, as old as 36 weeks, according to you it is more than mere fertilized tissue because it can exist outside the womb..Non?
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You're crazy. The late term abortions mentioned in this article do NOT fall into your pigeon hole. These abortions were performed across 2 states and using a shady doctor. IF the women's health orlife were in danger they would not have needed to seek out this sicko.
Time to flip again.
The difference between homicide and murder is intent. When a woman purposely seeks out an abortion when there is no risk of death or serious harm to either than it is murder. Premeditated.
Personally, I hold all life to be "sacred" (for lack of a better word). Be it an unborn child, a victim of war, or someone like Olsen or Dahmer.
I wondered when someone would put that into coherent sentences.
This is also when it is possible to tell if a baby will be born with serious birth defects which 50 years ago most would die. Now they can become guinea pigs for modern medicine with no thought to the pain and suffering inflicted on the victim or the cost to taxpayers.