Justin Trudeau says abortion rights trump MPs' freedom to vote their conscience

[Machjo]

I am sorry Macho, but your post needs to be shorter and more understandable.

Fine. I'll ask you the same question as before:

Should a woman who sexually assaults a man be allowed to abort the foetus without the father's consent if it is not medically necessary to do so?

The first time I'd asked, your answer seemed to be that she should for the simple reason that statistically men sexually assault women more than the other way around.

If that was your answwer, then I don't undersand its logic. If a male victim and a female perpetrator are standing before ajudge, what do statistics have to do with it? We're talking about her and him, not mankind and womankind.

 

[petros]

Fine. I'll ask you the same question as before:

Should a woman who sexually assaults a man be allowed to abort the foetus without the father's consent if it is not medically necessary to do so?

The first time I'd asked, your answer seemed to be that she should for the simple reason that statistically men sexually assault women more than the other way around.

If that was your answwer, then I don't undersand its logic. If a male victim and a female perpetrator are standing before ajudge, what do statistics have to do with it? We're talking about her and him, not mankind and womankind.

I think she keeps saying she is flawed and it's not fair God made women the reproducers of life without asking them if they wanted to be.

 

[JLM]

And killing babies is OK with you and an MP is not allowed to vote according to the will of his constituents....
How liberal of you!!

And idiots will try to tell you they are not babies!! Well then what are they? Walruses, barnacles? They have all the same components as babies so don't 'buy' any of their bull sh*t! :wink:

If they are respecting the wishes of their constituents , yes .


I have a brother who was born premature at seven months , was he not a baby ?
Bluebird thinks it is okay for a woman to kill a fetus at seven months , I cannot in good conscience agree .

Funny you should mention that, my sister was born two months premature at 7 months and today is a fully functional 71 year old woman. She never had any parts missing either! She was under 4 lbs.

 

[pgs]

And idiots will try to tell you they are not babies!! Well then what are they? Walruses, barnacles? They have all the same components as babies so don't 'buy' any of their bull sh*t! :wink:




Funny you should mention that, my sister was born two months premature at 7 months and today is a fully functional 71 year old woman. She never had any parts missing either! She was under 4 lbs.

About the same as my brother .

 

[Cannuck]

I have a brother who was born premature at seven months , was he not a baby ?

You can call it whatever you want

 

[pgs]

You can call it whatever you want

Well not fetus that's for sure . Hey that reminds me what ever happened to Festus ?

 

[Cannuck]

Well not fetus that's for sure . Hey that reminds me what ever happened to Festus ?

Of course you wouldn't. Why on earth would you call something what it is

fe·tus
ˈfēdəs/
noun
an unborn offspring of a mammal, in particular an unborn human baby more than eight weeks after conception.

Is it any wonder why you are considered silly?

 

[bluebyrd35]

Fine. I'll ask you the same question as before:

Should a woman who sexually assaults a man be allowed to abort the foetus without the father's consent if it is not medically necessary to do so?

The first time I'd asked, your answer seemed to be that she should for the simple reason that statistically men sexually assault women more than the other way around.

If that was your answwer, then I don't undersand its logic. If a male victim and a female perpetrator are standing before ajudge, what do statistics have to do with it? We're talking about her and him, not mankind and womankind.

If, it was a rape, and the father has no interest in raising it .....YES......However, I cannot imagine an underage teenage boy who was raped being capable or wanting to take on the care & support of a child.. Besides, since she raped once, perhaps she should not be allowed to keep it. What guarantee would there be for the safety of the child.

If she is allowed to continue the pregnancy, no claim for support must be demanded..

As for the child, it would be starting out life under the worst possible circumstances with the mother a declared felon, and the father unable or possibly unwilling to provide love & support.

 

[JamesBondo]

Like a boss.


Justin Trudeau says abortion rights trump MPs' freedom to vote their conscience

Women’s reproductive rights trump the freedom of Liberal members of parliament to vote their conscience on abortion, Justin Trudeau said, adding that it’s time that his party “actually defended rights.”

“I have had a lot of Liberals come up to me and say, 'I don’t quite understand, isn’t the Liberal party about freedom and about defending people’s rights?'" Trudeau said in an interview with CBC’s The Sunday Edition with Michael Enright.

“Absolutely it is. And the rights that women have fought for over decades to be in control of their own bodies and to control their own reproductive health is not a right I’m going to brush aside to defend the freedom of speech or the freedom to vote a particular way for an MP."

Trudeau has said that any Liberal MP, regardless of their personal beliefs, would have to vote against any proposed legislation that could limit a woman’s right to an abortion.

“If they vote in favour of restricting women's access to abortion, that’s taking away their rights. And that is something that we will not accept in the Liberal party. We are the party of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and that’s a serious, serious position that Liberals have to defend.

"It’s time the Liberal party actually defended rights,” he said.

Asked if his pro-choice policy would essentially kiss off the Catholic vote, Trudeau said that he too is Catholic, and that lots of Catholics were upset when previous Liberal governments legalized divorce and decriminalized homosexuality.

Justin Trudeau says abortion rights trump MPs' freedom to vote their conscience - Politics - CBC News

Getting your news from tyee now?

 

[bluebyrd35]

pgs:- Yet you want to take away our guns because of your moral superiority .[/QUOTE]


HEY, I do not want to take away your guns, only keep the laws we now have concerning such weapons. I want protection from those who attempt to acquire weapons they intend to use to maim, kill, rob, or threaten others with. I do not want weapons sold over a store counter with no background checks. I do not want children shooting each other with guns that are carelessly stored. I do not think it necessary to arm teachers in a civilized country.........If that is wanting to take away your weapons of destruction, so be it.

Tell me why do you worry about abortion, with Canada's gun laws? Do you realize how many of those unwanted fertilized eggs you are trying to protect, could end up on the business end of a gun if people like you got your way to allowing a loosening of our gun laws??.

 

[JLM]

Tell me why do you worry about abortion, with Canada's gun laws? Do you realize how many of those unwanted fertilized eggs you are trying to protect, could end up on the business end of a gun if people like you got your way to allowing a loosening of our gun laws??.

Rather a dumb argument isn't it?

 

[bluebyrd35]

I think she keeps saying she is flawed and it's not fair God made women the reproducers of life without asking them if they wanted to be.

Abortion of fertilized eggs, within a reasonable time is the shedding of undeveloped parasitic tissue. Live with it!! Because it can become an individual person if permitted to, it has not yet achieved human status.

By the way, I chose to keep my twin girls, who were born at 8 months. Besides the danger of them not surviving, and the possibility of brain damage (which was minimal and damage to the liver and kidneys I wanted them. It was MY choice. We were fortunate, after spending a couple of months in hospital, the liver & kidneys came around. However, it took years of special treatment to give them new pathways to the brain. They were especially gifted. I say were, because, one was killed in a motor vehicle accident in her early 20's. The other gave us two grandchildren.

Understand I am not in anyway affected one way or the other, I simply feel, that as much as possible every individual (even women!!)should have as much control as possible over their destiny. That includes their bodies.

Actually the women of Quebec, seem to have a wide range of rights re abortions.

https://www.educaloi.qc.ca/en/capsules/abortion-no-legal-time-limits

 

[Machjo]

If, it was a rape, and the father has no interest in raising it .....YES......However, I cannot imagine an underage teenage boy who was raped being capable or wanting to take on the care & support of a child.. Besides, since she raped once, perhaps she should not be allowed to keep it. What guarantee would there be for the safety of the child.

If she is allowed to continue the pregnancy, no claim for support must be demanded..

As for the child, it would be starting out life under the worst possible circumstances with the mother a declared felon, and the father unable or possibly unwilling to provide love & support.

You do realise that grown men have been sexually assaulted too, right? Why woudl he not be able to care for the child? Sure in most cases that I've read about, it's usually been college men, so still young and possibly not employed. But in some cases his parents might be willing to support him.

Now especially if the woman is older or has money, why couldn't he sue her for child support? He didn't choose to have sex with her. She made that choice. So yes, if he wants the baby and can prove (and that might be the tricky part, granted) that she sexually assaulted him, why shouldn't the law allow him to get the courts to block her right to an abortion? Seeing that she would be a declared felon, the judge is more likely to award the child to the father. But given he never chose to have a child in the first place, why couldn't he sue her for child support too? he may choose that she not get an abortion and choose the child in that sense, but that is only after the fact. He did not choose to have sex with her, and so his choice to keep the baby would merely be the best option among options that the perpetrator had imposed on him. Should she not take some responsbility for her actions?

No?

 

[petros]

I want protection from those who attempt to acquire weapons they intend to use to maim, kill, rob, or threaten others with

Things like scalpels, caustic saline solutions, forceps, scissors and vaccums?

 

[gerryh]

You do realise that grown men have been sexually assaulted too, right? Why woudl he not be able to care for the child? Sure in most cases that I've read about, it's usually been college men, so still young and possibly not employed. But in some cases his parents might be willing to support him.

Now especially if the woman is older or has money, why couldn't he sue her for child support? He didn't choose to have sex with her. She made that choice. So yes, if he wants the baby and can prove (and that might be the tricky part, granted) that she sexually assaulted him, why shouldn't the law allow him to get the courts to block her right to an abortion? Seeing that she would be a declared felon, the judge is more likely to award the child to the father. But given he never chose to have a child in the first place, why couldn't he sue her for child support too? he may choose that she not get an abortion and choose the child in that sense, but that is only after the fact. He did not choose to have sex with her, and so his choice to keep the baby would merely be the best option among options that the perpetrator had imposed on him. Should she not take some responsbility for her actions?

No?

Roflmfao....... Take responsibility? You are hilarious. The "pro choice" idea of taking responsibility is to murder the child.

 

[bluebyrd35]

Roflmfao....... Take responsibility? You are hilarious. The "pro choice" idea of taking responsibility is to murder the child.

Excuse me .....but did you not read my last post?? I was given the choice of keeping my girls or not....and if I am pro-choice, and could have chosen to "murder" a piece of tissue smaller than my finger tip, what does that tell you.

Also, do you realize the fertility rate of many countries is way down? Most people want babies and many are unable to conceive....so what does that do to your argument.

 

[petros]

I can I lop off your finger tip? The pinkie aka baby finger. It's not all that useful.

 

[bluebyrd35]

You do realise that grown men have been sexually assaulted too, right? Why woudl he not be able to care for the child? Sure in most cases that I've read about, it's usually been college men, so still young and possibly not employed. But in some cases his parents might be willing to support him.

Now especially if the woman is older or has money, why couldn't he sue her for child support? He didn't choose to have sex with her. She made that choice. So yes, if he wants the baby and can prove (and that might be the tricky part, granted) that she sexually assaulted him, why shouldn't the law allow him to get the courts to block her right to an abortion? Seeing that she would be a declared felon, the judge is more likely to award the child to the father. But given he never chose to have a child in the first place, why couldn't he sue her for child support too? he may choose that she not get an abortion and choose the child in that sense, but that is only after the fact. He did not choose to have sex with her, and so his choice to keep the baby would merely be the best option among options that the perpetrator had imposed on him. Should she not take some responsbility for her actions?

No?

Give me a break and quit changing your argument. I believe this whole discussion emmenated from the teacher who conceived a child with one of her students. There were two of these recently, one of which elected to keep the child. You asked me about those, why suddenly switch to adult men??

I really don't think any of those adult men were hauled into the bushes with a knife at their throat, had their house broken into during the night, or kidnapped off the street, just like many women are. They rarely end up dead either....like many women do.. The men seem not have the balls to actually back away from the overtures. Most female rape victims are drugged, over-powered or cornered by someone much stronger than themselves; not by the urge to have sex, and I bet the women fought and screamed if they were half way conscious. How many recorded male rapes included the date rape drug. Even if they were given it they would probably not even realize they had been raped. What excuse do the men give for doing nothing ??

The men & boys raped by men were forcibly overpowered by those stronger or/or armed. Those are very different cases and I have never heard of any of those looking to having an abortion.

Now you asked me if that particular woman should be allowed an abortion......that I answered. For goodness sake, try to be logical and not keep switching to a totally different scenario when you lose.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

Abortion rights should trump everything.

 

[bluebyrd35]

I can I lop off your finger tip? The pinkie aka baby finger. It's not all that useful.

NO. I don't see much danger of you being raped by a woman, and j I know you don't have valid surgical degree. So....what other idiotic comment can you produce??