Hockey Is Back: NHL And Players Reach Tentative Deal, Ending Lockout
- Thread starter CDNBear
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So the beer vendors and cleaners at the arena and the zamboni driver should get an equal piece of the pie too then? After all they all contribute.
You know, mathematically theoretically if we guarantee those who made enough money to be called rich a tad of security and rights to be rich, it could cut the costs of order-maintenance to a point where it's cheeper for them to just pitch in versus build gated communities.
It boils down to good organization and management.
Anyway... what's been going on with the hockey? Sorry gents... I been a tad busy. Some kind of union versus management thing?
I know this might be hard to comprehend/perceive, but it's the kind of problem you like to have.
It boils down to good organization and management.
Anyway... what's been going on with the hockey? Sorry gents... I been a tad busy. Some kind of union versus management thing?
I know this might be hard to comprehend/perceive, but it's the kind of problem you like to have.
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how many people are entertained and enjoy coming to watch you work, and are they willing to pay for
that entertainment, I think not.
they are in the entertainment business, so you could say the same for actors, singers, all of the
professional sports, you do not fit that catagorie.
life is life, my husband was a saw filer, handles huge saws each day, had a few accidents where he was
injured, and his fellow worker many years ago was killed being dragged into the mouth of saws.
we can't pretend that has anything to do with pro sports and other entertainment. the football players
are at a very high risk, it is a dangerous sport, so is hockey, skating on blades that could do severe
damage, and sometimes does, pucks travelling hundreds of miles an hour, and being hit many times during
a game, all of those things have the potential to injure.
Be realistic, see the world as it really is.
There is nothing babyish about any of the pro athletes, they have a place in society, they make others
happy by entertaining them, and they have spent years and years becoming as good as they are.
There is the WHL which I follow and there is Other Hockey League, OHL which I don't.
Good Point, #Juan, it certainly puts the players in a better light, but still think they are over paid by about 85%.
Very true
Unless you're referring to 30 years ago, I don't see how that applies (the highlighted part). Even at the lowest salary for a rookie, the wage element is hardly underpaid and as a 'contractor' they are expected to take care of their own bennies.
The CBA had expired, essentially there was no contract any more. The NHLPA were willing to play under the old terms, but as we saw, the League was not... That said, the difference between a strike and lock-out is really only optics when one considers that there was no agreement to guide all the parties. One might even argue that since the PA didn't accept the new deal offered over 100 days ago (not that they would have), they chose not to play...
anyways, just my take on things
How many of the 30 franchizes are losing money? Is it fair for a few of the franchizes to be supporting the ones losing money? I would guess that one of the problems the money losers is having is the inability to fill seats. How do you fill the seats? By lowering the admission fees! If that is done and they are still losing money then there is one other solution. Reduce salaries! Does that make sense?
This is part of the conundrum on this issue.... The PA wants exposure only to the upside and full shelter from the risk.... On that note, they also want to tap into all of the revenue streams that are associated with the team/league, but aren't interested in kicking in their own revenues like salaries and endorsement money.
Time to grow up here lads.
the admission fees are very low in'those particular' cities who are at the bottom of the 'popularity'
when it comes to interest from fans.
they have great deals to coax people into theirbuilding, and without those great deals, they would sink.
the interest from u.s. media and fans in many parts of the u.s. is almost nil,
and this lockout coming to an end, isn't particular interesting in many parts
of the u.s., not even talked about.
the players also have to pay back, from their salaries a certain percentage all season, as profits go
up and down in the league. They have been doing that for some time.
Great, now maybe Crosby, Iggy, Malkin, et al will live up to the PA's end of the bargain and kick in 50% of their sponsoirship, endorsement and advertising money to the league.
I figure that it's as much hockey related revenue as much as parking and concessions.
you talk as though the nhl gives in to their every wish, but the nhl are tough negotiators, and anything
that the p.a. have, has been negotiated and fought for, seem quite fair when I go through what they
have gained over the years, from owners who make millions, and that is OK, but it is a partnership,
they need each other, can't exist without each other.
this is not a situation where the owners are running the show, and the little worker should do as he
says, this is pro sports, big business, not a factory with workers and bosses.
the nfl, nba and nhl are all part of a big entertainment business where profits are huge, and salaries
are big, the players are a commodity that the owners make money from, so they get their share.
if you danced on the sidewalk for a person who played music, you should get 50% of the take, only fair.
(as long as you can dance well, and he can play the music well, then more money will be made, as
more people will be standing there watching, and willing to shell out.)
without the music and the dancer, 'no' money will be made., they are partners.
Since when has any sports owner built their own stadium? Usually is built by the taxpayer under threat of moving the franchise.
this is something the players have been doing for quite some time, not new, a safety net clause
for the league as profits drop at times, seems fair, noone is complaining about it.
I have never understood the jealousy and criticizm against anyone who can make a
very good living from whatever they do, as long as it is legal, the more power to
anyone who can rise to that level, I give them all credit, and i'm not jealous
atall, and don't resent them, never will.
they do not compare to any 9 to 5 worker, or any lineman, or welder or electrician,
no one comes to watch any of those workers work, and pays to do so, and the
bosses do not make big profits from ticket revenue, different world.
all the whining about the money the players make is comical, if any of you had
of made it to the nhl, you would make that money too, and I would have said,
"good for you", the hard work all of your life has now paid off, and hopefully
you can stay in the game for at least ten years, as that is more time than
the average length of time a player plays in the NHL.
They don't work till 65, they have a very short time to make their money at
that level.
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Fair is a relative term... I notice that you make reference to owners that make 'millions' but have yet to recognize that they stand the chance of losing millions as a potential... The PA will never lose millions from the operations as they have salaried, contractual positions.
If these guys want to play in the big league (business world), then it's time to put on the big-boy pants and ante-up to get in the game.
By the way; 'partnership' implies an equal assumption of the actual costs and risks in the venture.. The PA has assumed none.
I'm afraid that it is a situation where the owners are running the show. Fact is, the owners can bring in other players while the PA can't just bring in another league.
Sure they get their share, but in the end, if tehy don't want exposure to the operational risk(s), then don't expect a senior share... That's all I'm really saying
Depends on what the deal is.. Sometimes there are more musicians and fewer dancers which translates into more value for the dancers
Those are complex deals with lease agreements that are volumes thick... Don't be under the impression that gvt is building 9 and 10 figure arenas with no expectation for returns and profit.
Are you saying that Crosby kicks-in 50% of his endorsement money back to the owners?
I'd sure like to see the link on that one
Hair on 'em for having that talent and making big bucks, I have zero problem with that.
... But the problem is (as per the owner's position in this round) based on the notion that the PA wants a big chunk of all of the revenues when they haven't invested one solitary dollar of their own?
I think that I've been pretty clear on that.
They are private businessmen.. End of story... How the money is generated is immaterial, so the argument that it's sports entertainment or that they are not welders is a non-starter.
Business people in the private sector are responsible for themselves - the owners understand this and have chosen to RISK their money, time and resources understanding that there is no guaranteed salary or ROI.
BTW - You still haven't recognized that the actual teams can suffer millions of dollars in losses while the PA membership will NEVER be in a position where they lose money in any year (read: have to shell-out cash at the end of that season).
Not my problem... They made that choice.
You make good points Cap't. I still think the salaries are too high, the reasons being-
1. The price of seats is out of reach for many fans.
2. To play Devil's advocate, lets say the player were paid $500,000 ($1,000,000 for super stars) - they could still save half of what they earn and wouldn't be hurting.
In an 8 year career they'd have amassed over one million (after the tax man has been paid)- how many people have over a million in the bank by age 30?
I think the lockout was a very selfish move by Bettman & Co. (It was all to spite the players with no consideration for the multitude of spin off job many of which are at min. wage or close to it.) The N.H.L. is a very poor corporate citizen.
1. The price of seats is out of reach for many fans.
2. To play Devil's advocate, lets say the player were paid $500,000 ($1,000,000 for super stars) - they could still save half of what they earn and wouldn't be hurting.
In an 8 year career they'd have amassed over one million (after the tax man has been paid)- how many people have over a million in the bank by age 30?
I think the lockout was a very selfish move by Bettman & Co. (It was all to spite the players with no consideration for the multitude of spin off job many of which are at min. wage or close to it.) The N.H.L. is a very poor corporate citizen.
Make no mistake JLM, I have no problem with the players making bags of cash. As far as I'm concerned, that is entirely between them and the team that they negotiate with.
There was a real price that is/was paid by the loss of income to the support staff and I feel that it was/is the responsibility of both the owners AND the players on that front.
Again, my beef relates to the PA demanding a senior share of all of the revenues in addition to the guaranteed salaries when they haven't put one dollar up for the risk.
It'd be like me demanding that you buy a house to flip for profit... JLM puts up all the money to buy the place, hires me to do the renos (my salary) and then I demand that I get 50% of the selling price when the house gets sold.
I wouldn't believe in a million years that you would go for a deal like that, so why should the owners?
