Occupation for fuck sakes. Why do you listen to the nutjobs?
The first storm completely missed.
Hamas attacks Israel
- Thread starter Serryah
- Start date
The first storm completely missed.
Rubio to discuss with Netanyahu Israeli plan for possible West Bank annexation
Barak Ravid
Secretary of State Marco Rubio is expected to discuss during his trip to Israel the possibility of Israeli annexation of parts of the occupied West Bank in response to the planned recognition of the State of Palestine by numerous Western countries later this month, Israeli and U.S. officials say.
Why it matters: Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu still hasn't made a decision about whether to go for annexation and the scope of such a move. He wants to learn in his meeting with Rubio if President Trump would support annexation, an Israeli official said.
Most of the international community views the West Bank as occupied territory and would consider any Israeli annexations illegal and inflammatory.
The United Arab Emirates (UAE) has warned the Trump administration and the Israeli government that annexation of the West Bank would significantly harm the UAE-Israel peace treaty and the broader Abraham Accords and undermine the president's hopes of expanding them.
Driving the news: On Friday, the UN General Assembly endorsed the "New York Declaration" that was presented by France and Saudi Arabia and that calls for an irreversible path for a Palestinian state.
142 countries voted in favor of the declaration; 10 voted against it, among them the U.S. and Israel; and 12 countries abstained.
Zoom in: The declaration's principles will be the main terms of reference for the leaders summit supporting the two-state solution that will be held on September 22 on the sidelines of the UN General Assembly in New York.
France, the UK, Canada and several other countries are expected to announce the recognition of Palestine during this event.
Netanyahu and Rubio will meet on Sunday and on Monday.
Behind the scenes: Two Israeli officials told Axios that Rubio has signaled in private meetings that he doesn't oppose West Bank annexations and the Trump administration won't stand in the way.
The Israeli claims raised alarm inside the Trump administration mainly because there was no clear U.S. position on the issue and there was a feeling the Israel government was trying to box-in the Trump administration, a U.S. official said.
State of play: In recent days, there were several internal meetings on this issue in the White House and the State Department to decided a public line on this issue that won't leave the U.S. position open for interpretation.
The key concern White House and State Department officials have voiced in these meetings was that Israeli annexation of parts of the West Bank would lead to the collapse of the Abraham Accords and tarnish Trump's legacy, a U.S. official said.
A source with knowledge said the UAE made its position clear again to the State Department ahead of Rubio's trip to Israel.
"The White House obviously engages in a variety of policy discussions related to the Middle East. We do not comment on internal meetings that may or may not have occurred," a White House official told Axios.
What he's saying: Before departing for Israel, Rubio told reporters he is going to discuss with the Israeli government their response to the expected wave of recognitions of a Palestinian state.
"We told the Europeans there is going to be a counter reaction," Rubio said.
The other side: A senior Israeli official said Netanyahu wants to figure out from Rubio how much space the U.S. is prepared to give Israel regarding its response to the recognitions of a Palestinian state, and especially on the issue of West Bank annexation.
The intrigue: Rubio is expected to participate on Sunday in an event organized by a settler group in a politically sensitive archaeological site under the Palestinian village of Silwan in East Jerusalem, a very short distance from the al-Aqsa mosque.
Rubio told reporters on Saturday it is a visit to a historic site and stressed his participation at the event is not political.
Barak Ravid
Secretary of State Marco Rubio is expected to discuss during his trip to Israel the possibility of Israeli annexation of parts of the occupied West Bank in response to the planned recognition of the State of Palestine by numerous Western countries later this month, Israeli and U.S. officials say.
Why it matters: Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu still hasn't made a decision about whether to go for annexation and the scope of such a move. He wants to learn in his meeting with Rubio if President Trump would support annexation, an Israeli official said.
Most of the international community views the West Bank as occupied territory and would consider any Israeli annexations illegal and inflammatory.
The United Arab Emirates (UAE) has warned the Trump administration and the Israeli government that annexation of the West Bank would significantly harm the UAE-Israel peace treaty and the broader Abraham Accords and undermine the president's hopes of expanding them.
Driving the news: On Friday, the UN General Assembly endorsed the "New York Declaration" that was presented by France and Saudi Arabia and that calls for an irreversible path for a Palestinian state.
142 countries voted in favor of the declaration; 10 voted against it, among them the U.S. and Israel; and 12 countries abstained.
Zoom in: The declaration's principles will be the main terms of reference for the leaders summit supporting the two-state solution that will be held on September 22 on the sidelines of the UN General Assembly in New York.
France, the UK, Canada and several other countries are expected to announce the recognition of Palestine during this event.
Netanyahu and Rubio will meet on Sunday and on Monday.
Behind the scenes: Two Israeli officials told Axios that Rubio has signaled in private meetings that he doesn't oppose West Bank annexations and the Trump administration won't stand in the way.
The Israeli claims raised alarm inside the Trump administration mainly because there was no clear U.S. position on the issue and there was a feeling the Israel government was trying to box-in the Trump administration, a U.S. official said.
State of play: In recent days, there were several internal meetings on this issue in the White House and the State Department to decided a public line on this issue that won't leave the U.S. position open for interpretation.
The key concern White House and State Department officials have voiced in these meetings was that Israeli annexation of parts of the West Bank would lead to the collapse of the Abraham Accords and tarnish Trump's legacy, a U.S. official said.
A source with knowledge said the UAE made its position clear again to the State Department ahead of Rubio's trip to Israel.
"The White House obviously engages in a variety of policy discussions related to the Middle East. We do not comment on internal meetings that may or may not have occurred," a White House official told Axios.
What he's saying: Before departing for Israel, Rubio told reporters he is going to discuss with the Israeli government their response to the expected wave of recognitions of a Palestinian state.
"We told the Europeans there is going to be a counter reaction," Rubio said.
The other side: A senior Israeli official said Netanyahu wants to figure out from Rubio how much space the U.S. is prepared to give Israel regarding its response to the recognitions of a Palestinian state, and especially on the issue of West Bank annexation.
The intrigue: Rubio is expected to participate on Sunday in an event organized by a settler group in a politically sensitive archaeological site under the Palestinian village of Silwan in East Jerusalem, a very short distance from the al-Aqsa mosque.
Rubio told reporters on Saturday it is a visit to a historic site and stressed his participation at the event is not political.
So the short version of the above is the term “land swaps” then?
Is “Palestine” going to be interested in voluntary land swaps with Israel?
en.wikipedia.org
Is “Palestine” going to be interested in voluntary land swaps with Israel?
Malaria in Mandatory Palestine - Wikipedia
Not gonna happen. Israel isn't in the position to bargain. Grovel, yeah, bargain, no.Is “Palestine” going to be interested in voluntary land swaps with Israel?
Malaria in Mandatory Palestine - Wikipedia
Ok. I was asking if the short version of what you were posting translated to “land swaps” or not.
Israel is definitely losing the propaganda war, but is it losing the military war (?) and that’s why they need to grovel, etc…after being attacked on Oct 7th then? Just trying to follow your logic.
So you’re saying that “Palestine” isn’t going to be interested in any land swaps then? Hamas is stating that they want EAST Jerusalem as their capital (I’m assuming exclusively) which is also the capital city of Israel, so how’s that going to work? Why is Hamas specifically stating EAST Jerusalem? That’s kinda interesting language unto itself.
Anyway, are Israel & Palestine going to negotiate between themselves over their future borders (?) or is someone/something else going to dictate that for them both at this point then?
If you keep ignoring why Israel was attacked on October 7 and why the world turned on Israel, youre never going to understand and miss every point.
It wasn't propaganda. All anyone needed to do to see the light was listen to the leadership of Israel. Their own history of violence, statements and actions brought the hate on themselves.
Hamas didn't have to do a damn thing, they just let Israel be Israel.
Military wise, in a stated admission from IDF says that 80% of the casualties in Gaza are civilian. Is that success?
Is there any chance there there is Jerusalem AND EAST Jerusalem?
BTW...Ramallah is and has been the Capital for 35 years.
Wow...just wow. So uninformed and naive.
Your interpretation though your filters of why Israel was attacked (at least we both seem to agree that Israel was attacked) on October 7th. The difference seems to be that you justify it & I don’t.
Just because somebody doesn’t agree with your interpretation, doesn’t mean they’re misinformed, or ill informed.
The propaganda has been thick from October 7th including on October 7th, so how can you say this isn’t/wasn’t about propaganda?
From the beginning this has been a dog pile on Israel from the Arab League to Iran and all of its proxies for decades.
Same thing with the Palestinians as there’s at least two dancers in this goat rodeo. There’s not one innocent and one guilty party here…there’s a dozen different parties all with their own agendas here.
This doesn’t even make sense. Whether or not they “had to” is irrelevant in the context of what they actually “did do” and have continued to do, and filmed for their audience as well as to ensure Israel had to follow them back into Gaza.
All that GoPro and cell phone footage from Hamas (& Friends) on Oct 7th in Israel, wasn’t an accident or an oversight, regardless of how you justify this is not being about propaganda.
Hamas sure tried to ensure that there wouldn’t be rookie numbers here in an asymmetrical urban combat location of Hamas’s choosing. It’s good to have goals I guess.
The terror group's (Hamas’s, for clarification, as I’m not talking about the PLO mentioned above) statement came after three major global powers indicated they were going to recognize a Palestinian state in the coming months.
Is there any chance the EAST Jerusalem is a part of Jerusalem, and this statement is just to emphasize that Israel will have to move it’s centre of government for its nation before the dog & pony show even happens on September 22nd, ‘cuz don’t want peace breaking out before that vote could happen. That would be bad for PR.
Is there any chance “from the river to the sea” isn’t about eliminating Israel’s existence? The opinion has taken root in Israel, and among many Jews and non-Jews internationally, that the slogan ‘From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free’ is antisemitic, calling for the destruction of the state of Israel and the ethnic cleansing or murder of all Jews living in it, but anything can be justified if someone performs enough mental gymnastics.
What is currently meant with, “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” depends on who is interpreting it and what their motivation is, as opposed to who is actually chanting it and what they actually mean.
Jewish exodus from the Muslim world - Wikipedia
If the UN is going to try and impose it’s will, how many of these nations are UN members currently…
…are going to step up and put their money/land where their mouths are in the Palestine/Israel future borders/land swap thing that will have to happen? I’m assuming somewhere between zero and none?
Will Hamas actually step aside, disarm, disband, etc…or is all of this just more noise to drag this out and eventually eliminate the affront that Israels existence is?
My filters? Facts are filters? You are misinformed and naive. You argued for days that patisseries were fully functional in Gaza after being baited. You wanted to believe it was true so deeply you spent 3 days trying to convince me and yourself it was true. That's the epitome of naive.Your interpretation though your filters of why Israel was attacked (at least we both seem to agree that Israel was attacked) on October 7th. The difference seems to be that you justify it & I don’t.
Just because somebody doesn’t agree with your interpretation, doesn’t mean they’re misinformed, or ill informed.
The propaganda has been thick from October 7th including on October 7th, so how can you say this isn’t/wasn’t about propaganda?
From the beginning this has been a dog pile on Israel from the Arab League to Iran and all of its proxies for decades.
Same thing with the Palestinians as there’s at least two dancers in this goat rodeo. There’s not one innocent and one guilty party here…there’s a dozen different parties all with their own agendas here.
This doesn’t even make sense. Whether or not they “had to” is irrelevant in the context of what they actually “did do” and have continued to do, and filmed for their audience as well as to ensure Israel had to follow them back into Gaza.
All that GoPro and cell phone footage from Hamas (& Friends) on Oct 7th in Israel, wasn’t an accident or an oversight, regardless of how you justify this is not being about propaganda.
Hamas sure tried to ensure that there wouldn’t be rookie numbers here in an asymmetrical her. It’s good to have goals I guess.
View attachment 31074
View attachment 31075
The terror group's (Hamas’s, for clarification) statement came after three major global powers indicated they were going to recognize a Palestinian state in the coming months.
View attachment 31076
Is there any chance the EAST Jerusalem is a part of Jerusalem, and this statement is just to emphasize that Israel will have to move it’s centre of government for its nation before the dog & pony show even happens on September 22nd, ‘cuz don’t want peace breaking out before that vote could happen. That would be bad for PR.
Is there any chance “from the river to the sea” isn’t about eliminating Israel’s existence? The opinion has taken root in Israel, and among many Jews and non-Jews internationally, that the slogan ‘From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free’ is antisemitic, calling for the destruction of the state of Israel and the ethnic cleansing or murder of all Jews living in it, but anything can be justified if someone performs enough mental gymnastics.
What is currently meant with, “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” depends on who is interpreting it and what their motivation is, as opposed to who is actually chanting it and what they actually mean.
I wonder if this will be a consideration in the establishment of “Palestine” with respect to future borders, and “land swaps” that you say won’t even be a consideration? The same with the malarial swamp land that was terraformed (by some group) into something actually useful as opposed to a large geographical health hazard?Jewish exodus from the Muslim world - Wikipedia
If the UN is going to try and impose it’s will, how many of these nations are UN members currently…
View attachment 31077
…are going to step up and put their money/land where their mouths are in the Palestine/Israel future borders/land swap thing that will have to happen? I’m assuming somewhere between zero and none?
Will Hamas actually step aside, disarm, disband, etc…or is all of this just more noise to drag this out and eventually eliminate the affront that Israels existence is?
What propaganda is Hamas using that shifted the perspective of the entire globe and sent the globe towards hate of Israel? What did they do and how did they do it? Explain in full.
Why are you afraid to see what the IDF GoPros are writing as history? Is it too goofy? Youre squeamish of blood and guts aren't you? You've only seen clip of one days video.
What do you think of the thousands others posted since from "both sides"? Goofy?
Kids playing soccer in a street blown to bits is goofy? 5 year old children shot in the head is goofy? Bombing soup kitchens is goofy?
What are you afraid of? there is no fucking way in hell you can say things that are very well documented and verified didn't happen if you had the fucking balls to see them because of your fear. You don't want to see the slaughter live streamed?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Jerusalem
River to the sea again...what's the second part? Palestine will be free? Are they free now? Yes or no? Any other answer is bullshit.
I love your green map. Keep posting It as it shows the outright stupidity of dropping a pile of Europeans who were never a cohesive group to begin with in the middle east and insisting they are cohesive even though their society is falling apart and at odds to the brink of civil war. Did Hamas do that too?
You’ve stated facts, I’ve stated facts, others have stated facts. You’ve stated your opinion, I’ve stated my opinion, & others have stated their opinions on this.
I know this might sound crazy, but, not everyone everywhere is wrong or misinformed or disinformed if they say something contrary to your beliefs and spin on any specific topic including this one.
This isn’t a straight line who’s wearing the white hats and who’s wearing the black hats situation, at all, or at least that’s how I’m perceiving it.
Yeah, then I just stopped bothering to mention it. Wouldn’t matter if the two of us were sitting at the same table at one of them, you’d have still claimed there’s no way it could exist, so I just dropped it.
My instinctive reaction to executive demands like that is to say, “Blow me!” but that’s not conducive to debate & the exchange of ideas, and we’re 318 pages into this one (one of my favourite numbers by the way) so far, etc…so I’m not going to react in that manner, cause this is a virtual playground that I come to for stress relief, and to see others perspectives. I know, strange concept, etc…
So, are you “demanding” the propaganda right from October 7th-8th apparently pre-distributed before October 7th (?) or a full summary of the last two years (?) or the last couple months where they’ve been using these sick kids instead of just malnutritioned people? Stat! Explain in full, etc…?
What the hell are you talking about now? Is this about me not wanting to download a bunch of weird shit onto my work phone still? I don’t download TikTok and all these other weird things onto my work phone. Just not gonna happen.
I think I remember that one or maybe a version of that one or one similar to that one from the last two years…& I’m assuming you’re not talking about Hezbollah bombing that soccer field with a bunch of Muslim kids playing on it in northern Israel, are you?
Anyway, I’m just being facetious here because I know you can only point the finger at the Jews. My bad.There are at least two sides to every story and in this one there’s about a dozen different players and each have their own agenda and nobody’s a saint and nobody’s the good guy….or not, depending on whatever blinders you choose to wear, or not.
What?
I’m glad I bring a little sunshine joy into your life.
You aren't naive even though its taken you 3 years to learn about Smotrich, Ben-Gvir and their Jewish Taliban ways or believing that a fully functional patisserie is operating in a levelled city with no power and water or that Hamas is winning a propaganda war but you won't or can't say how.
I have a shoebox of old phones you can put goofy shit on to see shit for yourself. Want one? Or should I just put the blood and guts on here?
You are so far down a rabbit hole that you can’t even tell that you’re down it, so ok, whatever you say is gospel, to yourself, but it’s gospel. Other people can see the same things you do, but come up with a different opinion using their own mental filters (or framework, or pick your own term), and it doesn’t mean that they are wrong, it means that the situation is complex and nasty.
Not everybody is down that same rabbit hole (or tangent, pick your own term here also) that you are, & it doesn’t mean that they’re ignorant or naïve or misinformed or disinformation or what have you…It just means they’re not on the same tangent that you are.
You can donate those to a woman’s shelter. As long as they can still charge up and dial 911, they’ll be accepted gratefully. Aside from that, fill your boots. If you think you need to post whatever it is you think you need to post here regarding this, maybe it’ll be good for you? I have no idea, & nobody’s gonna stop you, but I’m not sure who you think you’re convincing.
Rabbit hole eh? Can you describe a hole without describing all of its surroundings?
Feel free to use your own terminology, & I’m assuming pretty much any woman’s shelter will gladly take your shoebox full of old phones.
Yes, "rabbit hole." It's a reference to Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, where Alice went down the rabbit hole and ended up in the bizarre reality of Wonderland.
He's saying you're living in a world that exists only in your head, has at best occasional similarity to the world around us, and that you need really, really good meds.
Nailed it, seems to me.
I don’t know any women in shelters, but I know someone who worked at one for a few years, & that’s where all our old phones and chargers went.