Do you believe in "destiny"?

Tecumsehsbones

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Mar 18, 2013
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I'm a complete believer. It is abundantly clear from the scantiest of observations that in some substances, just a little teeny bit weighs a lot, and in others, whole great big gobs don't weigh much at all.

Yep, density rules the universe!
 

Dexter Sinister

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Or... quantum physics: there is no reality without an observer...
I keep trying to tell you, that is NOT a legitimate conclusion from quantum physics, that's the New Age mystic's take on it and it has no grounding in reality. Quantum physics is fully consistent with an objective reality that exists regardless of anyone's or any thing's perceptions of it.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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I keep trying to tell you, that is NOT a legitimate conclusion from quantum physics, that's the New Age mystic's take on it and it has no grounding in reality. Quantum physics is fully consistent with an objective reality that exists regardless of anyone's or any thing's perceptions of it.

Dex. . . give it up.

Seriously, it's just not possible to convince folks that advanced mathematics is not navel-gazing mysticism.
 

Cliffy

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Dex. . . give it up.

Seriously, it's just not possible to convince folks that advanced mathematics is not navel-gazing mysticism.
Einstein was a mystic. Where else did he get his math from except through navel gazing. And Dex has a very narrow view of reality. Besides, I only pose questions. I don't draw conclusions.
 

gopher

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We've gone over the issue of free will vs determininsm a hundred times on this forum. As always, I will be convinced that there is free will when anyone can prove to me that abortion victims choose their fate.
 

Dexter Sinister

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Einstein was a mystic. Where else did he get his math from except through navel gazing. And Dex has a very narrow view of reality. Besides, I only pose questions. I don't draw conclusions.
Unless you know the math, and I'm pretty sure you don't, you can't have any idea where it comes from. Special Relativity requires nothing more complex than high school algebra and geometry, which I concede you might understand, I really have no idea about that. The math for General Relativity, which I'm sure you don't know, is essentially the non-Euclidean geometry developed by creative mathematicians like Reimann and Lobachevsky. The math for quantum theory is mostly advanced partial differential equations and probability and a particular form of calculating energy relationships called the Lagrangian, and I'm sure you don't know that either. No navel gazing or mysticism required. I suppose if you consider insisting on good evidence for any claims about the nature of reality to be a narrow view, I guess I'm guilty on that one, but untestable claims aren't worth anything if you're interested in what's true and what we can find out about it. I'm completely confident that my view of reality is more accurate and complete than yours. And it's not true that you don't draw conclusions, you continue to state quite clearly the conclusion that we create our own reality. Which is not an accurate view, there is nothing anywhere in science that would justify such a conclusion.
 

damngrumpy

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Some say life is like a flip of a coin but, what if you don't have any money, does that
effect your destiny? I know its a basic question but I had to ask it.
 

Cliffy

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And it's not true that you don't draw conclusions, you continue to state quite clearly the conclusion that we create our own reality. Which is not an accurate view, there is nothing anywhere in science that would justify such a conclusion.
I say narrow because you will not consider anything outside scientific theory. Life, for me, is experiential and multi-dimensional. There is far more to reality than can be experienced with the five physical senses. The downfall of this civilization will be its fixation on measuring and quantifying everything. Science has negated spirituality at its own peril. I see science as a knee jerk reaction to religion, an opposite side of the same coin. It would take too long to explain where I have been and what I have learned through experiences outside the realm of science and the five physical senses.

Terence MacKenna coined the phrase psychonaught in describing his life's journey into the inner realms. I like the term because our paths were quite similar (although, I am not an anthropologist like he was). I have, however spent a large portion of my life studying aboriginal culture and spirituality from the inside (like he did). I just don't have some capital letters behind my name. We also came to some similar conclusions from our studies, only he is far more articulate about them.
 

Tecumsehsbones

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I say narrow because you will not consider anything outside scientific theory. Life, for me, is experiential and multi-dimensional. There is far more to reality than can be experienced with the five physical senses. The downfall of this civilization will be its fixation on measuring and quantifying everything. Science has negated spirituality at its own peril. I see science as a knee jerk reaction to religion, an opposite side of the same coin. It would take too long to explain where I have been and what I have learned through experiences outside the realm of science and the five physical senses.

Terence MacKenna coined the phrase psychonaught in describing his life's journey into the inner realms. I like the term because our paths were quite similar (although, I am not an anthropologist like he was). I have, however spent a large portion of my life studying aboriginal culture and spirituality from the inside (like he did). I just don't have some capital letters behind my name. We also came to some similar conclusions from our studies, only he is far more articulate about them.
Nope, science deals with that which can be measured and counted. Religion is somebody who would prefer to make his money lying to people to working.
 

Dexter Sinister

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Science has negated spirituality at its own peril. I see science as a knee jerk reaction to religion, an opposite side of the same coin.
Only someone who understands very little about science and religion and their histories could say such a thing, that's a very shallow view. Science is full of spirituality; what do you suppose motivates the people who practice it if it's not the pleasure, the awe and wonder, of finding things out?
 

Walter

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We've gone over the issue of free will vs determininsm a hundred times on this forum. As always, I will be convinced that there is free will when anyone can prove to me that abortion victims choose their fate.
Each time I think you have reached the lowest level of intelligence you start to dig.
 

Zipperfish

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Apr 12, 2013
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I don't think science negates spirituality. It is simply outside the purview of science. If someone says that a supernatural god created the heavens and earth, my response, as a scientist is "Well, science is only concerned with the natural world, so I have no comment on things that are supernatural."

But science is a limited tool in its own right. It's a method of rational analysis. It suffers its own shortcomings, and I would argue it is ultimately faith-based as well.

I myself support the Many Worlds interpretation of quantum physics (in which an "alternate" universe is created for every possible outcome of every quantum event). So, since all posasible realities exist, the idea of destiny becomes meaningless..
 

Kathie Bondar

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There is a parallel universe, the place we live before we are born on Earth. We come here approx. once in a thousand years, that other side is the permanent place, that other side is where your permanent family is formed, the one you have on Earth is temporary.
The objective is to expose you to new learning experiences, something similar to advancing in our educational system.
Like we have school councellors here, on the other side there is a group of people I call life planners. They assemble the people you will be associated on Earth, and introduce you to them. Thus, when you are actually here, there will be a subconscious recognition. Then you are let loose, you are born on Earth, do your best!
When you finish and get back to the other side there will be an evaluation of your performance.
 

L Gilbert

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Destiny as an end result of a life? Sure, I not only believe in it, but I'm pretty sure it's fact. It was my "destiny" that I am where I am and when I croak, that will be my "destiny" at the end of life.
I believe in deja vu, too, cuz I am pretty sure I've been to this thread before.
 

Dexter Sinister

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There is a parallel universe, the place we live before we are born on Earth. We come here approx. once in a thousand years, that other side is the permanent place, that other side is where your permanent family is formed, the one you have on Earth is temporary. [etc.]
Where did you get all that information, and how is it that you know this stuff and nobody else does? I venture to suggest you just made it all up on the basis of no evidence at all.
 

Cliffy

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Where did you get all that information, and how is it that you know this stuff and nobody else does? I venture to suggest you just made it all up on the basis of no evidence at all.
There are hundreds of books that say similar things about origins and destination concerning before and afterlife. Most of it is "channeled works". It is like any other belief system, open to interpretation, acceptance or rejection. It all depends on what a person is willing to believe. Like most people who believe, it really doesn't matter that someone else does or not. Everyone has their life lessons to learn. How they get there is up to them. It is their journey and nobody can tell them how to make it.
 

BaalsTears

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If what you're saying is true then some day I may descend to your level.
What did you possibly gain by that comment?

There are hundreds of books that say similar things about origins and destination concerning before and afterlife. Most of it is "channeled works". It is like any other belief system, open to interpretation, acceptance or rejection. It all depends on what a person is willing to believe. Like most people who believe, it really doesn't matter that someone else does or not. Everyone has their life lessons to learn. How they get there is up to them. It is their journey and nobody can tell them how to make it.
What books have you read on the subject that you could refer us to?