Coups arranged or backed by the U.S.A
- Thread starter darkbeaver
- Start date
oh, yeah. i shouldv'e written:
despot governments that are supported by the US as long as they are complesant (chavez made the list before his oil reform)
despot governments that are supported by the US as long as they are complesant (chavez made the list before his oil reform)
You didn't answer though, what constitutes support and benediction in your mind, because these terms ore loosely used and I can't answer you.
ok, here we go:
Governments that may not treat their people right, abuse them, etc. and that would normally be considered amoral may be supported by some powerful countries if they comply to the needs of such country.
For example, the president of turmekistan is 'raping' his people, but there are documented pictures of clinton, bush and even jean chretien with him. Because he provides us with his oil, we close our eyes on the abuse of his people.
Its basically hypocrisy...
Governments that may not treat their people right, abuse them, etc. and that would normally be considered amoral may be supported by some powerful countries if they comply to the needs of such country.
For example, the president of turmekistan is 'raping' his people, but there are documented pictures of clinton, bush and even jean chretien with him. Because he provides us with his oil, we close our eyes on the abuse of his people.
Its basically hypocrisy...
Jay said:
Ive been discussing this topic for the last 2 days. I thought you guys would understand. I was wrong... :wink:
I think not said:
well, i guess the question is why are the US governments always babling about freedom and democracy, if they only implement it in countries who have valuable resources and threaten to stop sharing them (or raise prices, etc.).
If democracy is implemented only where valuable resources are available but refused on the basis of spreading democracy to the poor and opressed, but other 'complying' gornments that abuse their people are tolerated, then it is hypocrisy. And in this, i hope you will recognise this hypocrisy in the gornment and consider this next time the wars, such as iraq and iran will be discussed.
Now, lets not play the offended virgins, embargos have been imposed by the US on countries, such as Cuba and Iraq, so they certainly dont bother using this option. IF they have to, they do it, but this option is only considered when the non complying goverment has nothing to offer (or that an invasion is being planned)
As for finding solutions, it is always the ultimate goal fo any discussion, so perhaps you can help me find some. It is the start to a new world. After all, we are the founding fathers of our children's nations...
The point is that there is no problem with what the USA, and other power countries do for support of despot gornvements (considering the dod eat dog nature of this world and complexities of politics).
But, what we want is to isolate and expose the lie. We are all sold that the good USA want to save the world from oppression, and it is this hypocrisy, unrecognised, that pushes this kind of discussion. They tell everyone that they went to iraq to free the poor and opressed, but truth is that they went for the oil. It wouldn't be that bad if it was jsut that, but young soldiers are dieing for a lie! and in case you wonder, i am canadian, but my very own cousin, american born from florida has been twice to the iraq war: once on the northern turkish border, the other at bassorah; so we understand the fear of losing a relative for f*ckin gaz... :twisted:
Once true transparency is reached, then this discussion will be either useless, or used to find an alternate solution to current behavior.
But, what we want is to isolate and expose the lie. We are all sold that the good USA want to save the world from oppression, and it is this hypocrisy, unrecognised, that pushes this kind of discussion. They tell everyone that they went to iraq to free the poor and opressed, but truth is that they went for the oil. It wouldn't be that bad if it was jsut that, but young soldiers are dieing for a lie! and in case you wonder, i am canadian, but my very own cousin, american born from florida has been twice to the iraq war: once on the northern turkish border, the other at bassorah; so we understand the fear of losing a relative for f*ckin gaz... :twisted:
Once true transparency is reached, then this discussion will be either useless, or used to find an alternate solution to current behavior.
If we're going to start off talking about oil wars, then you have your answer already, I dunno what kind of discussion you are looking for. The US was the primary importer of Iraqi oil when Saddam was in power, it would of been a hell of alot easier and cheaper if the US were to bribe him in maintaining that relationship, but nobody ever answers that question. If it is all about money and oil then surely what I just said makes more sense than a 3 year war, with thousands dead and hundreds of billions of dollars lost.
"but truth is that they went for the oil."
"Once true transparency is reached, then this discussion will be either useless, or used to find an alternate solution to current behavior."
So who is missing out on the deal here? If it's all about the oil, who is being left out of the transparency? I mean you seem to be aware of this, and believe it to be fact.
"Once true transparency is reached, then this discussion will be either useless, or used to find an alternate solution to current behavior."
So who is missing out on the deal here? If it's all about the oil, who is being left out of the transparency? I mean you seem to be aware of this, and believe it to be fact.
I think not said:
check this out: http://www.feasta.org/documents/papers/oil1.htm
there are plenty more articles like this should you feel hungry for more...
RE: Coups arranged or bac
The oil in Euros thing as a prelude to war is one of the silliest things I have ever seen on the Internet.
Why?
Because oil volume is less than 1% of all currency transactions, and
Half the world's oil already is not traded in dollars. Oil is already traded in euros. The dollar is merely the reference benchmark.
Also, driving interest rates to 1% and running large fiscal deficits is about 1,000,000x more important to the determination of whether or not the dollar will continue to be used as the global reserve currency than referencing oil in euros.
The oil in Euros thing as a prelude to war is one of the silliest things I have ever seen on the Internet.
Why?
Because oil volume is less than 1% of all currency transactions, and
Half the world's oil already is not traded in dollars. Oil is already traded in euros. The dollar is merely the reference benchmark.
Also, driving interest rates to 1% and running large fiscal deficits is about 1,000,000x more important to the determination of whether or not the dollar will continue to be used as the global reserve currency than referencing oil in euros.
Re: RE: Coups arranged or bac
Can you prvide proof?
for the others: from the article i sent you, can you see the 'coincidence' of iraq, and next iran and venezuela. hmm, ironic... :roll:
Toro said:
Can you prvide proof?
for the others: from the article i sent you, can you see the 'coincidence' of iraq, and next iran and venezuela. hmm, ironic... :roll:
RE: Coups arranged or bac
Proof?
What proof have you offered?
Some conspiratorial article?
I know a bit about trading and capital flows. This is nonsense.
I've explained this in depth here before a few times. I'm really not all that keen about going into it again.
Proof?
What proof have you offered?
Some conspiratorial article?
I know a bit about trading and capital flows. This is nonsense.
I've explained this in depth here before a few times. I'm really not all that keen about going into it again.
Re: RE: Coups arranged or bac
That's what I think. So I would add that I'm not convinced enough of the stability of the Euro to think it will ever replace the Dollar as a benchmark. How many times have they tried to consolidate Europe? Their track record is poor at best. A little inflation isn't going to make or break America; I wouldn't sweat it.
Toro said:
That's what I think. So I would add that I'm not convinced enough of the stability of the Euro to think it will ever replace the Dollar as a benchmark. How many times have they tried to consolidate Europe? Their track record is poor at best. A little inflation isn't going to make or break America; I wouldn't sweat it.