Ok then, what was all of the noise about the gvt money going to shareholders, Sr mgmt and gvt?
I'm in business and I want in on this gravy-train.
Corporate tax cuts are not working
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Ok then, what was all of the noise about the gvt money going to shareholders, Sr mgmt and gvt?
I'm in business and I want in on this gravy-train.
As Walter so graciously pointed out, EMD didn't get any tax breaks, their customers did.
I can see why you would want to ignore that and my question...
I would disagree. If the Federal Government was stupid enough to give money to Caterpillar without any provisions for its leaving the country, then as long as Caterpillar fulfils its end of the legal contract, it's fulfilled its legal obligations.
To penalize it now would be like passing a law today saying that consuming alcohol deserves a five year sentence and then arresting someone for having consumed alcohol yesterday. Clearly unfair.
Instead we ought to treat it as a lesson learnt for future contracts.
Walter didn't prove squat.
The tax breaks primarily benefitted Electro Motive because they were the ones that would profit from selling more trains. Without the tax break, their company never would have profited as much as it did.
Which is fine.
But now they're closing down their plant and focusing on the U.S. market.
But Caterpillar hasn't moved to the US.
People like Fuzzy don't understand how subsidiary companies work. They are separate entities, and though their principle owners may call shots. They stand alone on liability, operating costs, and contracts.
Caterpillar may have been given tax breaks, but Progress Rail and EMD were not.
Why is it Harper's fault that the union negotiated a sh*t deal?... Not once in that article did the CAW spokesman answer the notion that their wages were double that of what the Indiana union was prepared to pay.
The offer was made to the CAW and they turned it down. Caterpillar made the right business decision.... Now, if the CAW had any balls, they'd have raised the money to take the EMD operations over themselves. but it would appear that they don't like risking their own money - just OPM's
OK, using your logic, I did, since I worked in conjunction with Walter, by supplying the link that he used to show who actually got the tax breaks.
Thank you for admitting your error, that EMD did not get any tax breaks.
So, when did Caterpillar move to the US?
Let's not get semantic. I just meant that they're focusing on their U.S. prospects.
It's not a separate matter, it's the heart of the matter... Really MF, if you had the option to buy a car for $40k at location 'A' or literally cross the street to buy the same car for $20k at location 'B', which would you choose?
Yes, we already know you're a well established astroturfer.
As I said, I'm not disputing the feud between the union and management here. I am only stating that the tax breaks to help the industry did not stop a corporation from taking advantage of it and screwing Canadians over.
They could have shut down this plant before 2008, as they knew then that they're workers' pay was "overbloated." But they took the Feds naivety for a photo op as their business op and shut down after pay day.
It isn't semantics. It's business.
I know what I would do.
Fuzzy's reasoned argument draw is empty.Yes, we already know you're a well established astroturfer.
EMD wasn't a subsidiary of Progress rail in 2008.
Even if Cat was liable as you seem to think. How do you justify levying punitive measures against them for a tax incentive to EMD's customers. When EMD wasn't even in Cats portfolio at the time?
Hey Bear, I'm guessing that Fuzzy's answer will be something along the lines of "I'm entitled to my entitlements"
It's not unexpected. By in large, that's the general mumbo-jumbo response expected when he knows that he's been crushed (once again).
Caterpillar ultimately has control over its business units so it would be vicarious. That being said, there is no legislation that allows us to force them to pay back tax benefits if they are not used in national interest. There is the act (the name eludes me now) that might need some amendment after the fallout on this is subsides.
All I am saying is that this Conservative federal government should treat the corporations that want government handouts with a bigger magnifying glass to make sure that they don’t take the money and run.
Agreed. Ever wonder why suing a parent company is so hard? In this case Cat is further insulated by the fact that they do not directly own EMD. Progress Rail wholly owns EMD.
Your problem of course is only further compounded by the fact that EMD was wholly owned by Greenbrier Equity and Berkshire Partners, in 2008.
The Investment Canada Act has needed amending for years. I've said that since Ottawa bailed out Ultramar in Nova Scotia, then paid to gift wrap the refinery and ship it overseas.
Like Lewenza's misuse of the Investment Canada Act, in this case, you are wrong to think it applies to Cat, or even Progress Rail.
Like every sitting government before them, since the Investment Canada Act was legislated.