Conservative Gurmant Grewal

[Harris 4 PM]

Re: RE: Conservative Gurmant

The Conservative story was (and it's likely changed by now) that the tapes (complete and unedited) were in Stephen Harper's office for most of the two weeks. That pretty much means that nothing was done to them without the knowledge of Harper, MacKay, and/or Norquay.

The information the Liberals say they have is that top Conservative aides were there when the tapes were transferred and transcribed, which is most likely where the editing took plake. That would likely be Norquay and one of his minions. Norquay is the top spinner for the Conservatives...he does nothing without Harper knowing about it and vice versa.

If those tapes were altered, and it certainly appears that they were, it goes all the way to the top.

That flies in the face of logic though. Why would the conservatives try and present these tapes if they doctored them so "crudely" as an expert put it knowing they would be under intense scrutinty. The penalty for screwing up in such a case would be severe, as it kind of has been. If the tapes were doctored by the "highest levels" of the Conservative party then one would think that with their resources they would have done a better job. Furthermore, how does anyone know that the tapes in their entirety were presented to the party in the first place?

Grewal seems like the far more likely culprit if they were doctored. He has the most to hide....perhaps some sentiments about the leader or party he didn't want to get out or the fact that he flirted with the idea more than he let on. Whatever the case, this seems to be when a crude editing of the tape would have happened.

 

[no1important]

RE: Conservative Gurmant

Grewal Stunt a PR Dud.

here

a snippet-

Among those who said they followed the taping affair closely, 32 per cent said they believed the Liberals and 27 per cent said they believed Grewal.

In B.C., it was 33 per cent for the Liberals and 21 per cent for Grewal.

That Michal Smythe wrote an artical in paper today but you need asubscription to view it and I forgot to get a hard copy when I was out, but maybe later.

 

[no1important]

RE: Conservative Gurmant

Here is another interesting link about Grewal. He advised Samuel Doe of Liberia on a on a “green revolution” for Liberia.

click here for full story

 

[Reverend Blair]

That flies in the face of logic though. Why would the conservatives try and present these tapes if they doctored them so "crudely" as an expert put it knowing they would be under intense scrutinty.

The Harperites initially ignored calls to hand the tapes over to an official source though. In fact they initially tried not to release the tapes, complete, to the public.

They were playing for political gain from these, not for justice or to rid parliament from corruption. I think they underestimated public pressure, which has been intense from the outset, then had to release the tapes both to the public then, later, to the RCMP.

They thought public opinion would be on their side and were angry when it was not...consider all of the comments made, here and elsewhere; by professional politicians and amateur spinners, about how "the east" is just protecting the Liberals.

 

[Jay]

"That flies in the face of logic though."


The whole thing flies in the face of logic.


The tapes better be genuine...or I'm going to flip.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Conservative Gurmant

Will you flop and fly too? Get ready, Jay...this one is going to have you voting NDP before it's all done and over.

 

[Andygal]

I cannot believe Grummat Grewel's antics. What the heck is this guy thinking! Well, it seems to me that he's not thinking at all, and never has been thinking, and likely never will be thinking. I cannot fathom why he has not been fired, considering how bad he is making the Conservatives look right about now.

The "stress leave" thing is clearly a cheap trick to hide him and his antics under the rug until things blow over.

 

[mrmom2]

He's not there to serve the people him or his wife its all about the paycheck with those two :x

 

[Karlin]

It is very likely that all spending in Ottawa goes to or through the wrong people.
And that most of the characters in Ottawa are such greedy phart-heads as Grewal. They cant get there without help, and that has to be re-paid over and over. Slimy actions like this Grewal scandal and the sponsorship scandal are the way its done, more often than not.

Most of it never reaches the people or places it was legistlated to go to, but instead is skimmed here and there until its worth about 30% of its original value.
The Indian Residential Schools Abuses money is a good example, where about 70% was spent on Lawyers and so on, and the abused got little or nothing.

Oddly enough, the Conservatives would be even worse for this payola stuff. They are the real corporate minions, they are the AMerican brownnosers.
But no, I am not a Liberal, never ever voted for them. Or the CPC. Rarely even the NDP, but thats the ones who we should give a chance with the reins of power next, just once anyhow. EH?

Karlin

 

[bluealberta]

It is very likely that all spending in Ottawa goes to or through the wrong people.
And that most of the characters in Ottawa are such greedy phart-heads as Grewal. They cant get there without help, and that has to be re-paid over and over. Slimy actions like this Grewal scandal and the sponsorship scandal are the way its done, more often than not.

Most of it never reaches the people or places it was legistlated to go to, but instead is skimmed here and there until its worth about 30% of its original value.
The Indian Residential Schools Abuses money is a good example, where about 70% was spent on Lawyers and so on, and the abused got little or nothing.

Oddly enough, the Conservatives would be even worse for this payola stuff. They are the real corporate minions, they are the AMerican brownnosers.
But no, I am not a Liberal, never ever voted for them. Or the CPC. Rarely even the NDP, but thats the ones who we should give a chance with the reins of power next, just once anyhow. EH?

Karlin

Absolutely...................NOT. Tax and spend? They would be worse than the liberals. Remember Bob Rae?

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Conservative Gurmant

Remember Brian Mulroney? Remember Grant Devine? Remember Gary Filmon? I doubt you could pick Bob Rae out of a crowd, Blue.

Remember Ralph Klein abusing people in a shelter? Remember Ralph Klein denigrating disabled people?
Remember Ralph Klein signing one of the worst oil deals on the planet?

 

[bluealberta]

Re: RE: Conservative Gurmant

Remember Brian Mulroney? Remember Grant Devine? Remember Gary Filmon? I doubt you could pick Bob Rae out of a crowd, Blue.

Remember Ralph Klein abusing people in a shelter? Remember Ralph Klein denigrating disabled people?
Remember Ralph Klein signing one of the worst oil deals on the planet?

I believe my response was about voting NDP. What all the conservative premiers you mention have to do with that is a mystery, as I am fairly sure they did not vote NDP.

For the record, Ralph did not abuse anyone. Argued with, yes, abuse no.

What oil deal?

Oh, and I remember Trudeau FORCING the worst oil deal on the planet on Alberta, just to get it straight.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Conservative Gurmant

Give it up, Blue.

 

[Ten Packs]

(posted elsewhere, I know...)

More on Grewal: last night, two former business associates disclosed that, some time back, Grewal made a so-called "investment" of $50,000 (for a partnership in carpet store) - as a mandatory requirement to obtain landed immigrant status. Accoording to them he paid one day, received the documents for the transaction, then took the money back the next day.
This could easily threaten his ability to remain in the country!

This guy just blows me away - you couldn't make this stuff up! LMAO!

 

[jimmy123]

It's hard to imagine the Conservatives botching the Grewal audiotape issue worse than they have.

It's politics 101 that if you are going to come forward with something that is ethically questionable to begin with (secretly audiotaping conversations that the other party assumes are private and confidential) you better present everything you claim to have in its entirety, unedited and up front, to avoid even the appearance of coverup or shady practices.

So what did Grewal and the Conservatives do? Well, from what I understand (and please correct me if I'm wrong), Grewal initially stated that he had approximately 4 hours of taped conversations with the Liberals about them offering him plum rewards if he and his wife made the move to the Liberals. When the media (shockingly!) asked Grewal and the Conservatives for the tapes, they initially only produced about 18 minutes of the claimed 4 hours of tape. Then, after the laughter died down, they produced about 2 hours of the apparent 4 hours. Then it's discovered that the tapes have in fact been edited. Harper, obviously not a techinal expert, states that innocent errors were made when copying the tapes to CD, and fills in some of the gaps in the tape. Edits are still found on the now "third version" of the tapes (the Conservatives are apparently unaware that technology has made great strides in the past few decades and there are experts who can tell if a recording has been doctored, and that even during Watergate in the 1970s people were able to determine edits or breaks in the recordings....?).

Also, unlike Grewal's claim, the Liberal representatives never formally offered Grewal any plum jobs on the tapes, just the possibility that an arrangement may be able to be made in the future.......and it seems that Grewal was just as interested in getting all he could from them as the Liberals were in discussing the possibility of giving him some goodies at some point in the future. Now, if this was all in fact a "sting" operation by Grewal as he claims, why was he so afraid to release all the audiotape he had right up front.....after all, if what he was doing was all just an act and he didn't really want the plums the Liberals may have offered him, why not show you have nothing to hide?

To top it all off, Grewal is alleged to have been trying to get passengers on a flight to take a package for him to Ottawa (great idea in this time of global terrorism), then goes on stress leave. No wonder the guy is stressed.....he has dug himself a hole the size of the Grand Canyon.

Are there any professional advisors in the Conservative Party camp that can buy a clue has to how to run a serious political party? Do they not know political poison when they see it in the Grewal antics? If this was all planned by Grewal in advance, it appears that it was news to Stephen Harper, as I believe Harper has stated that he didn't know that Grewal was doing this until after the tapings took place. If one of your MPs is going to engage in this risky and potentially politically destructive behaviour, don't you think it would be a good idea if he told you about it first.......unless of course, Grewal's plan from the start was to have it both ways: try to get a plum appointment for him and his wife to switch to the Liberals, and if the Liberals would not give him a firm commitment, then try to look like a hero to the Conservatives by catching the Liberals on tape discussing the trading of politcal favours for his move to the Liberals. Only Grewal can answer these questions, but if this was in fact his real motive, the whole thing seems to have blown up in his face.

 

[peapod]

hehehehehe check this blog out, my goodness I feel kind of bad for conservatives, they are like the keystone cops :lol:

http://bucketsofgrewal.blogspot.com/

 

[Reverend Blair]

If this was all planned by Grewal in advance, it appears that it was news to Stephen Harper, as I believe Harper has stated that he didn't know that Grewal was doing this until after the tapings took place.

Grewal has stated that Geoff Norquay, Harper's head spinner, knew what was going on. If Norquay knew, Harper knew...there is no plausible deniability there.

 

[Harris 4 PM]

That flies in the face of logic though. Why would the conservatives try and present these tapes if they doctored them so "crudely" as an expert put it knowing they would be under intense scrutinty.

The Harperites initially ignored calls to hand the tapes over to an official source though. In fact they initially tried not to release the tapes, complete, to the public.

They were playing for political gain from these, not for justice or to rid parliament from corruption. I think they underestimated public pressure, which has been intense from the outset, then had to release the tapes both to the public then, later, to the RCMP.

They thought public opinion would be on their side and were angry when it was not...consider all of the comments made, here and elsewhere; by professional politicians and amateur spinners, about how "the east" is just protecting the Liberals.

Then why didn't they edit the tapes properly before they realsed them after they did know how tough public scrutinty would be. With modern computer technology it is very easy to edit right down to the nanosecond. So much so that some internet pranks include making people sound like they say completely different things with their own voice. When they released the tapes they KNEW the Liberals would scrutinize it a lot and find any way to discredit....

On the other handle the type of editing that occured (common tape recorder/stereo) very much points to Grewal himself. He would have been far more concerned about his collegues not knowing the whole story of what went on then possibly imagining some day his tape might be looked at by an expert.

 

[bluealberta]

That flies in the face of logic though. Why would the conservatives try and present these tapes if they doctored them so "crudely" as an expert put it knowing they would be under intense scrutinty.

The Harperites initially ignored calls to hand the tapes over to an official source though. In fact they initially tried not to release the tapes, complete, to the public.

They were playing for political gain from these, not for justice or to rid parliament from corruption. I think they underestimated public pressure, which has been intense from the outset, then had to release the tapes both to the public then, later, to the RCMP.

They thought public opinion would be on their side and were angry when it was not...consider all of the comments made, here and elsewhere; by professional politicians and amateur spinners, about how "the east" is just protecting the Liberals.

Then why didn't they edit the tapes properly before they realsed them after they did know how tough public scrutinty would be. With modern computer technology it is very easy to edit right down to the nanosecond. So much so that some internet pranks include making people sound like they say completely different things with their own voice. When they released the tapes they KNEW the Liberals would scrutinize it a lot and find any way to discredit....

On the other handle the type of editing that occured (common tape recorder/stereo) very much points to Grewal himself. He would have been far more concerned about his collegues not knowing the whole story of what went on then possibly imagining some day his tape might be looked at by an expert.

That explanation makes some sort of sense. Of course, it appears that Grewal is a bit of an idiot, so maybe he thought no one would notice?

Grewal screwed up, no doubt, but there were still offers made, and what is unfortunate is that the offer aspect is being completely overlooked as a result.

 

[Reverend Blair]

RE: Conservative Gurmant

Grewal isn't the only idiot in the party, Blue and Harris. Harper's office had the tapes for a long time, so they immediately become suspect. Geoff Norquay knew what Grewal was doing. If the Conservatives listened to the tapes, had them transcribed, and transferred them to disc, why didn't they notice the problems?

Come on. The were playing political games. That's why they didn't want to turn the tapes over in the first place, why they were so reluctant to call for an official investigation.