Chinese spaceclaft rands on moon

MHz

Time Out
Mar 16, 2007
41,047
42
48
Red Deer AB
When they planted a flag in Australia suddenly a lot of citizens were convicted of crimes such as stealing a loaf of bread got them a free ticket on the colonization boats, perhaps they are about to name the moon as Australia II and do the same.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,039
196
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Thanks to American mismanagement of their economy and constant Senate and Congress infighting America lost their opportunity for moon's domination. China will have a base on the moon under five years thanks to the all the people that leaked all the top secret government documents.

From a security point of view the free world is f**ked.

Mismanaged? How is it the managers got away with practically the whole nation and you think something went wrong? You're not on the A team. It was the most successful heist in history, rivals the gutting of Imperial Russia. Hey they mismanaged the secret documents as well. The free world disappeared before you were born, unless that was yesterday.
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
21,155
149
63
The Chinese have a long way to go to catch up in this area. The Yanks have been driving around Mars for a few decades.
 

WLDB

Senate Member
Jun 24, 2011
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0
36
Ottawa
The Chinese have a long way to go to catch up in this area. The Yanks have been driving around Mars for a few decades.

Indeed, but the Americans have more or less been just sitting around for about 30 years. Most of the big leaps came in the 20 years before that. Without anyone to really compete with they decided to more or less just coast. When it comes to probes the Chinese definitely have a long way to go but compared to the speed at which the US and USSR went they are doing well. When it comes to manned missions they have a very good chance of surpassing other players in the next ten years or so. A human hasnt been out of low earth orbit in 40 years. Now the shuttle is gone so the US has to piggy back on Russian capsules from the 60s to get into space. The next person to go past low Earth orbit will probably be Chinese.
 

damngrumpy

Executive Branch Member
Mar 16, 2005
9,949
21
38
kelowna bc
Good god why does everything have to amount to dominating something?
No we are not benefitting from cheap consumer goods. More and more
the middle class is becoming the upper poor class. Soon there will be no
middle class then we will really pay as the middle class is the only group
that pays. The poor receive and the real dominant rich evade paying their
share.
Nothing wrong with China being on the moon, America made it and so did
the Russians maybe they can work together to share the riches and be of
value to all on this planet. Unfortunately they will all fight to dominate it and
no one will benefit. The problem is collectively we don't have a lick of sense.
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
21,155
149
63
Indeed, but the Americans have more or less been just sitting around for about 30 years. Most of the big leaps came in the 20 years before that. Without anyone to really compete with they decided to more or less just coast. When it comes to probes the Chinese definitely have a long way to go but compared to the speed at which the US and USSR went they are doing well. When it comes to manned missions they have a very good chance of surpassing other players in the next ten years or so. A human hasnt been out of low earth orbit in 40 years. Now the shuttle is gone so the US has to piggy back on Russian capsules from the 60s to get into space. The next person to go past low Earth orbit will probably be Chinese.
No doubt. The US is too busy squabbling to get much accomplished.
 

BaalsTears

Senate Member
Jan 25, 2011
5,732
0
36
Santa Cruz, California
There was a special zeitgeist among the American people from the end of WWII until the mid-seventies. It entailed a degree of confident optimism coupled with capability that only appears rarely in history. It was the same sort of zeitgeist that was seen in early fifteenth century Ming Dynasty China and in the era of Henry the Navigator of Portugal later in that century.

The specific event that triggered the era of American space exploration was the successful launch of Sputnik by the Soviet Union. Massive federal funding of scientific and engineering education in response to Sputnik enabled the creation of an engineering/military/industrial infrastructure that served as the basis for the US civilian manned space program. The American civilian manned space program is over now except to the extent Americans hitch hike aboard foreign spacefaring vessels. The era was like the blossoming of a wonderful flower. It was an exciting time to be an American.
 

Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
44,442
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Ya right. You were still paying back the US for WWII when they went to the moon.

We didn't need to have the Moon. We had the world. All the Yanks had was a desolate rock. The British were the ones who had it going for them.

And the Yankee Doodles have nothing to be proud of. They collaborated with the Nazis to go to the Moon, who taught them everything they needed to know about building the technology needed to go to the Moon. It wasn't American technology and ingenuity which sent Neil and Buzz to the Moon. It was Nazi technology and ingenuity. It was probably the most shameful moment in American history after the War of Independence.

Keep dreaming.

Britain has got more chance of putting men on the Moon than Canada has. Canada has sent nothing to space, as far as I'm aware, other than a Lego man. Britain even sent a spaceship to Mars, and only the Yanks and Russkies are the only other people to do that. If Canada tried that, the thing would fall apart on the launchpad. And the Moon is EASY in comparison to going to Mars.

And here's another inconvenient truth I noticed you didn't mention - Britain was just the third country to send hardware into space, after the USSR and the USA. Britain even launched a satellie - Ariel 1 - in 1962. In the 1970s, the British launched the Prospero satellite - and did so on a BRITISH rocket, the Black Arrow. In fact, in the early days, Britain was even considered as being in the space race with the USSR and USA.


Britain's Black Arrow rocket made four launches between 1969 and 1971, launching the British satellite Prospero

Not only that, but the British space industray is very much up and coming. Britain is already a big manufacturer of space satellites - Astrium - but now its space industry is probably the fastest-growing in the Western world.

The future for Britain's space industry seems much brighter than America's.

Britain's booming space industry looks to Mars and beyond

Prototype rovers developed by Astrium in Stevenage are just part of a hi-tech sector targeting rapid growth


Angela Monaghan
The Observer,
Sunday 17 November 2013


Overcoming obstacles … Dr Ralph Cordey with a rover prototype at Astrium in Stevenage, Hertfordshire. Photograph: Graham Turner


Millions of miles above Earth, freezing temperatures, ferocious dust storms and a massive dose of radiation await robots charged with finding signs of life on Mars.

And those are just the known risks. If and when the ExoMars rover mission, led by the European Space Agency (ESA) and planned for launch in 2018, successfully lands on the red planet, it will battle a hugely hostile environment and unknown obstacles as it attempts to drill down into the surface.

Back on Earth, on the outskirts of Stevenage, a 1950s block is the unlikely backdrop for crucial research into this high-risk mission. Here, scientists are carrying out some of the most complex and advanced work in Britain.

It is home to Astrium, the space division of European aerospace group EADS, and a £1bn business in the UK. The company has created a "Mars Yard" at Stevenage, where rover prototypes tackle some of the potential obstacles the real thing can expect to meet. The attempt at recreating some of the conditions on Mars involves large and small rocks scattered on imported sand designed to mimic as closely as possible the properties of Martian sand.



"The surface of Mars is a horrible place. It's bombarded by the solar wind from the sun. It's not like the Earth – the Earth has a wonderful magnetosphere, which protects us from gunk out in the solar system," says Dr Ralph Cordey, head of business development for science and exploration at Astrium.

The rover will have to fend for itself on Mars. It will need to be smart enough to map its course, and understand which obstacles it can overcome and which it cannot.

American rovers have already landed on Mars, but this programme is different, according to Cordey. "We want to do more than just land somewhere and have a look around," he says. "If we can drill down, we may find the remains of things which perhaps were living there several billion years ago, when conditions were much more benign."

As with all such missions, there is no guarantee of success, and the launch date has already been delayed several times. Yet it signals intent from ESA, Europe's "gateway to space", which has 20 member states, including Britain. It is an opportunity to prove that Europe can successfully send a rover to Mars.



Britain's own ambitions in space are also accelerating. The industry is worth about £9bn annually to the UK economy, and employs almost 30,000 people. The target, outlined by trade body UKspace, is to increase that to £19bn by 2020 and £40bn by 2030, potentially creating more than 100,000 skilled jobs over that period.

It would take Britain's share of the global space market from 6.5% to 10% by 2030, building on work already being done in places like Stevenage. The UK currently exports about £2bn of space goods and services every year, with British-manufactured satellites sold around the world – this year to markets in Russia, South America and Canada, among others. But that could and should rise to £25bn, according to an updated space growth action plan, published last week.

In the plan, industry calls on the government to play a bigger role in delivering this long-term vision, by making the UK the best place for entrepreneurs and skilled engineers to grow and create space businesses, and to attract inward investment.

Andy Green, president of UKspace and former Logica chief executive, argues that while "the UK punches above its weight in the global space business", greater policy support is needed.

The government appears to be taking more notice than in the past of an industry that has been growing at an average annual rate of 7.5% since 2008-09, despite the financial crisis. It has created a UK Space Agency, falling under the umbrella of the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, and is working with industry through the Space Leadership Council.

David Willetts, universities and science minister, increased Britain's budgetary contribution to the ESA last year, making the UK the fourth-biggest partner. "Where things are affordable and deliverable we will do our best to do them," he says, adding that the government will respond to the industry's calls in the new year.

"This is something that is rising up the agenda. When we talk about rebalancing the economy and not being dependent on financial services, we mean we've got to back the hi-tech industries of the future. Space is a classic example of that.

"My test for an industry that's a serious hi-tech growth industry is that they should be growing more rapidly than the Chinese economy. The space industry just about passes that test."

Yet the UK has never been considered a space heavyweight in the same league as the US, China, Russia, France and, increasingly, India. The latter launched a rocket bound for Mars this month.
"Much of the world would see the UK as a consumer and not a producer in the space industry," says Tom Captain, global head of aerospace and defence at Deloitte, who is based in the US.

David Parker, chief executive of the UK Space Agency, acknowledges the problem: "The UK was the third country to have space hardware in orbit in 1962, and has a 50-year history of outstanding achievements in space activities, but if you asked 99% of people in the street they'd be entirely unaware of it."

Largely that is because Britain is virtually absent from the more high-profile business of launching rockets and people into space. But the hopes of industry and the government rest on the ever-expanding list of space technology applications that inform everyday life. Opportunities for growth lie not only in telecoms satellites but in Earth observation, GPS, planetary exploration, weather forecasting, maritime intelligence, piracy monitoring, space tourism, precision agriculture, broadband and so on.

Britain's booming space industry looks to Mars and beyond | Science | The Observer
 
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Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
44,442
996
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Is There Life on Mars? 'Britain and China could win Red Planet race by joining forces'

A MAN will land on Mars within the next 30 years – with the UK spearheading the race.

The British Government has outlined an ambitious plan which could see a permanent base established on the moon from where manned trips to the Red Planet would be launched.

Technology from the UK could be used in a proposed global project to boldly go where no man has been before.

On his return from China, Science Minister David Willetts said: "Our hunger for discovery isn't over. I think in future there will be a base on the Moon and potentially to use that as a way of getting to Mars. But you are looking 25 years ahead.”

Mr Willetts was speaking shortly after joining Prime Minister David Cameron on his recent visit to China, during which he spoke to counterparts in Beijing about the potential for co-operation in hi-tech projects, including space missions.

China launched its first lunar rover mission on the day of the PM's arrival in the country last Monday, with the aim of making a controlled landing on the Moon later this month. The launch was widely seen as a precursor to a possible attempt at a manned landing.
Mr Willetts said that cash from an £80 million Government fund for space co-operation could be used to support deals with the Chinese for collaboration in research and development and commercialisation of projects in space.

"I discussed that with members of the Chinese government during the trip," said Mr Willetts. "We are now going to work on projects that we can work together on. That could include things like putting British science experiments on vehicles launched from China.


The plan to go to Mars would need global co-operation between the US, Europe and China, according to Mr Willetts.

"There is no agreed plan for getting to Mars. We will first of all build our experience by getting more and more unmanned spacecraft to Mars with robotic systems. You then try and bring stuff back from Mars without a human going there. But in the future, I think there will be humans going to Mars. I suspect it will be a global endeavour” he said.

“One of the advantages of the challenge of getting a manned mission to Mars is that it is such a big project that it probably requires global co-operation.

"I think if you got the major powers - the Europeans, the Americans and the Chinese working together - that is possible. It would be very exciting."

Scientists at Stevenage-based Astrium UK have been working on a self-propelled robotic rover vehicle named Bruno intended to be sent to Mars in a joint European/Russian programme due to launch in 2018. Mr Willetts suggested that British technology could also be used to help Chinese lunar exploration.


Bruno, one of the new British Mars rover prototypes at Astrium, could go to Mars in 2018

'Britain and China could win Mars race by joining forces' | UK | News | Daily Express
 
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Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
44,442
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Allouette. made Canada the third country to put a satellite in space. What took the inbred Brits so long?

I can't understand why people can't research before they post to make sure what they are saying is right. You obviously haven't done that.
 

Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
44,442
996
113
Whoever green-plussed petros hasn't done their research either. Canada the third country to put a satellite into space? I don't think so.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
96,301
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Moccasin Flats
1962 -
UK - Earth - Success Ariel 1 the first British satellite in space (built by NASA, launched on American rocket)
1962 -
Canada - Earth - Success - Alouette 1, the first Canadian satellite (on American rocket)

NASA built yours. We built our own making us #3

I didn't need to research what I already knew.
 

Blackleaf

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 9, 2004
44,442
996
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1962 -
UK - Earth - Success Ariel 1 the first British satellite in space (built by NASA, launched on American rocket)
1962 -
Canada - Earth - Success - Alouette 1, the first Canadian satellite (on American rocket)

NASA built yours. We built our own making us #3

I didn't need to research what I already knew.

Ariel 1 UK - Launched April 1962 by Nasa.

Alouette 1 Canada - Launched September 1962 by Nasa.

Therefore, Ariel 1's launch in 1962 made the United Kingdom the third country to operate a satellite, after the Soviet Union and the USA.

It's not rocket science.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ariel_1

You also failed to mention that the Alouette 1 was built by de Havilland Canada - an offshoot of the BRITISH de Havilland Aircraft Company. A BRITISH company built the Alouette 1.

And Canada, unlike Britain, has never, as far as I know, ever launched its own satellite on its own rocket.
 
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taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
32,700
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We didn't need to have the Moon. We had the world. All the Yanks had was a desolate rock. The British were the ones who had it going for them.

And the Yankee Doodles have nothing to be proud of. They collaborated with the Nazis to go to the Moon, who taught them everything they needed to know about building the technology needed to go to the Moon. It wasn't American technology and ingenuity which sent Neil and Buzz to the Moon. It was Nazi technology and ingenuity. It was probably the most shameful moment in American history after the War of Independence.



Britain has got more chance of putting men on the Moon than Canada has. Canada has sent nothing to space, as far as I'm aware, other than a Lego man. Britain even sent a spaceship to Mars, and only the Yanks and Russkies are the only other people to do that. If Canada tried that, the thing would fall apart on the launchpad. And the Moon is EASY in comparison to going to Mars.

And here's another inconvenient truth I noticed you didn't mention - Britain was just the third country to send hardware into space, after the USSR and the USA. Britain even launched a satellie - Ariel 1 - in 1962. In the 1970s, the British launched the Prospero satellite - and did so on a BRITISH rocket, the Black Arrow. In fact, in the early days, Britain was even considered as being in the space race with the USSR and USA.


Britain's Black Arrow rocket made four launches between 1969 and 1971, launching the British satellite Prospero

Not only that, but the British space industray is very much up and coming. Britain is already a big manufacturer of space satellites - Astrium - but now its space industry is probably the fastest-growing in the Western world.

The future for Britain's space industry seems much brighter than America's.

Britain's booming space industry looks to Mars and beyond

Prototype rovers developed by Astrium in Stevenage are just part of a hi-tech sector targeting rapid growth


Angela Monaghan
The Observer,
Sunday 17 November 2013


Overcoming obstacles … Dr Ralph Cordey with a rover prototype at Astrium in Stevenage, Hertfordshire. Photograph: Graham Turner


Millions of miles above Earth, freezing temperatures, ferocious dust storms and a massive dose of radiation await robots charged with finding signs of life on Mars.

And those are just the known risks. If and when the ExoMars rover mission, led by the European Space Agency (ESA) and planned for launch in 2018, successfully lands on the red planet, it will battle a hugely hostile environment and unknown obstacles as it attempts to drill down into the surface.

Back on Earth, on the outskirts of Stevenage, a 1950s block is the unlikely backdrop for crucial research into this high-risk mission. Here, scientists are carrying out some of the most complex and advanced work in Britain.

It is home to Astrium, the space division of European aerospace group EADS, and a £1bn business in the UK. The company has created a "Mars Yard" at Stevenage, where rover prototypes tackle some of the potential obstacles the real thing can expect to meet. The attempt at recreating some of the conditions on Mars involves large and small rocks scattered on imported sand designed to mimic as closely as possible the properties of Martian sand.



"The surface of Mars is a horrible place. It's bombarded by the solar wind from the sun. It's not like the Earth – the Earth has a wonderful magnetosphere, which protects us from gunk out in the solar system," says Dr Ralph Cordey, head of business development for science and exploration at Astrium.

The rover will have to fend for itself on Mars. It will need to be smart enough to map its course, and understand which obstacles it can overcome and which it cannot.

American rovers have already landed on Mars, but this programme is different, according to Cordey. "We want to do more than just land somewhere and have a look around," he says. "If we can drill down, we may find the remains of things which perhaps were living there several billion years ago, when conditions were much more benign."

As with all such missions, there is no guarantee of success, and the launch date has already been delayed several times. Yet it signals intent from ESA, Europe's "gateway to space", which has 20 member states, including Britain. It is an opportunity to prove that Europe can successfully send a rover to Mars.



Britain's own ambitions in space are also accelerating. The industry is worth about £9bn annually to the UK economy, and employs almost 30,000 people. The target, outlined by trade body UKspace, is to increase that to £19bn by 2020 and £40bn by 2030, potentially creating more than 100,000 skilled jobs over that period.

It would take Britain's share of the global space market from 6.5% to 10% by 2030, building on work already being done in places like Stevenage. The UK currently exports about £2bn of space goods and services every year, with British-manufactured satellites sold around the world – this year to markets in Russia, South America and Canada, among others. But that could and should rise to £25bn, according to an updated space growth action plan, published last week.

In the plan, industry calls on the government to play a bigger role in delivering this long-term vision, by making the UK the best place for entrepreneurs and skilled engineers to grow and create space businesses, and to attract inward investment.

Andy Green, president of UKspace and former Logica chief executive, argues that while "the UK punches above its weight in the global space business", greater policy support is needed.

The government appears to be taking more notice than in the past of an industry that has been growing at an average annual rate of 7.5% since 2008-09, despite the financial crisis. It has created a UK Space Agency, falling under the umbrella of the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, and is working with industry through the Space Leadership Council.

David Willetts, universities and science minister, increased Britain's budgetary contribution to the ESA last year, making the UK the fourth-biggest partner. "Where things are affordable and deliverable we will do our best to do them," he says, adding that the government will respond to the industry's calls in the new year.

"This is something that is rising up the agenda. When we talk about rebalancing the economy and not being dependent on financial services, we mean we've got to back the hi-tech industries of the future. Space is a classic example of that.

"My test for an industry that's a serious hi-tech growth industry is that they should be growing more rapidly than the Chinese economy. The space industry just about passes that test."

Yet the UK has never been considered a space heavyweight in the same league as the US, China, Russia, France and, increasingly, India. The latter launched a rocket bound for Mars this month.
"Much of the world would see the UK as a consumer and not a producer in the space industry," says Tom Captain, global head of aerospace and defence at Deloitte, who is based in the US.

David Parker, chief executive of the UK Space Agency, acknowledges the problem: "The UK was the third country to have space hardware in orbit in 1962, and has a 50-year history of outstanding achievements in space activities, but if you asked 99% of people in the street they'd be entirely unaware of it."

Largely that is because Britain is virtually absent from the more high-profile business of launching rockets and people into space. But the hopes of industry and the government rest on the ever-expanding list of space technology applications that inform everyday life. Opportunities for growth lie not only in telecoms satellites but in Earth observation, GPS, planetary exploration, weather forecasting, maritime intelligence, piracy monitoring, space tourism, precision agriculture, broadband and so on.

Britain's booming space industry looks to Mars and beyond | Science | The Observer
ROFLMFAO AGAIN. Looks like BULL**** Man is working hard again today.