Can Ignatieff distance himself from his past?

JLM

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"This whole Ignatieff thing is simply a shiny object put in front of the population of Canada to distract from the incompetence of this government."- That incompetence saved me two grand on my income tax- hope they are twice as incompetent next year.
 

pegger

Electoral Member
Dec 4, 2008
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"This whole Ignatieff thing is simply a shiny object put in front of the population of Canada to distract from the incompetence of this government."- That incompetence saved me two grand on my income tax- hope they are twice as incompetent next year.

$2 K vs $174 Billion in new debt. Good trade.

I guess stealing from kids bothers me more than others.
 

JLM

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$2 K vs $174 Billion in new debt. Good trade.

I guess stealing from kids bothers me more than others.

You're comparing "oranges" with "apples"- the $2000 was real money that was wisely spent, the $174B is only a projection, hasn't happened & if it does won't for 6 years. You should also take the two grand and multiply by the number of affected taxpayers before making a comparison. You might want to try Accounting Skills 101.
 

TenPenny

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What a childish bunch of stupidity this thread is, people deliberately misinterpreting each other and twisting words, jumping to ridiculous assumptions, and claiming that others said things they didn't say.

It's amusing, that's for sure.
 

Unforgiven

Force majeure
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Mundane for Joe Six-Pack to utter.... Highly damaging to anyone that wishes to lead a nation... BTW - Stating that the only thing he misses about Canada is Algonquin Park IS an insult to every Canadian, apparently except you for which you feel Iggy has bestowed a great honour.

Not Joe the Plumber? :lol:
Yet Liberals have moved ahead in the polls.
I wonder if saying the only thing you miss is Algonquin park is as damaging as focusing on attack ads while the nation is in economic crisis?

First:

Harper also hasn't stated anything about Algonquin Park either?

Harper hasn't opined about how to run his newest bestest adopted nation, the USA.

Or the Canadian one. You remember the one he is Prime Minister of at the moment? Oh wait, there was that one thing he said about the economy, what was it now... Oh yeah, you suck Iggy. Imagine the confidence that instills in the hearts and minds of the Canadian voters. :roll:

The Canadians that wanted a Canadian sponsored free-ride home were (ironically) those citizens that the liberal party wooed as the new-immigrant-vote-that-will-support-liberals-because-they-granted-them-citizenship (it's a proven fact BTW).

Oh I see you have donned the bigot hat of the Conservative party. You must be proud.

Oh, yeah, almost forgot... care to comment on Iggy's ingenious plan for EI and the economy? (I wait with baited breath on this one from you).

Sure, it's a good start by the looks of it. Mind you I only have the Conservatives plan to compare it to. It's a bit like comparing something, with nothing. Sorry I shouldn't call it nothing, Harpers attack ads.

.. Ah yes. When any form of reasonable and rational debate is absent - holler bigotry (or racism).... Typical.

It is what it is. If you don't like being called a bigot, then simply stop acting like one.

No problem understanding people unforgiven, in fact, I fully understand you! You're upset that the liberals are self-destructing. You're choked that Iggy has a 2-dimensional character that has no policy. You're embarrassed on behalf of Iggy and the party that he makes such retarded statements like: "You're on probation".

I think you do. It's not Liberals that are leaving secret documents in TV stations.
It's not Liberals that suspend Parliament to protect their jobs.
It's not Liberals that have a taken surplus budgets and turned them into deficits while sitting behind closed doors thinking up attack ads rather than putting people back to work.

That's the conservative government that does that.

And when the Liberals kick the conservatives out of office Harper will quit like he always does. Like he quit the Liberals, like he quit the Conservatives, and like he quit the Reform parties. Just like he's already quit on the Canadian people who need to get back to work and keep the homes they have invested their lives in.

As for Harper, he's not bitter at all. In fact, he's probably the happiest guy in Canada after all, he is the leader of the nation, his closest rivals have only rejects to choose from as party leader like Dion and Iggy and he has a plethora of very recent and expensive scandals that will dog the liberals for years to come.

Mulroney taking envelopes stuffed with cash! :lol:

He's bitter alright. Even the fracture in the party itself is starting to show and that he can't control the members of his own caucus shows that he has plenty to be bitter about.

You're ship is sinking son and you can whistle all you like. No one is going to toss you a line.

Ironic. You demand that Harper 'bring the country together'?.. You mean repair the rift started by Trudeau and widened by Chretien? For that matter, you want Harper to repair the damage that both Trudeau and Chretien did to Canada/US relations.

Bush attacking Iraq didn't have anything to do with any American alienation at all.
That Chretien didn't jump on the bandwagon of the willing was a master stroke.
That the first thing Harper did was swallow that whole softwood wad may be endearing to those of your with a taste for American junk in your mouth, but the rest of us Canadians don't agree.

I am sure that like many of the blind faith Bush boosters that just can't handle Obama turning things around in the US, you too will find it difficult to stomach Canada returning to balanced budgets, a growing economy and low unemployment rates. Ready the gripe and bicker hat my boy you're going to nee..... Oh I see you never removed it. :roll:

Iggy also decided what kind of America that he wanted AS AN American.

So now his American citizenship is in dispute as well? Oh my you lot are one's to cast unfounded aspersions aren't you.

Nope... Just making sure that everyone gets to hear Iggy's opinions of Canada.

I see. And when did you become a spokesman for Iggy anyway? Oh yes that's right, when there was no idea what to do with the faltering economy, skyrocketing unemployment rates and record bankruptcies. It's about then that you and the Conservatives figured you better start telling everyone what someone else's opinion was. :lol:

That's pretty funny man.
 

JLM

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Nov 27, 2008
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What a childish bunch of stupidity this thread is, people deliberately misinterpreting each other and twisting words, jumping to ridiculous assumptions, and claiming that others said things they didn't say.

It's amusing, that's for sure.

That's par for the course. Are we here to win debates or get at the truth? One of the problems with debates is they are often done in fragments. Most debates may have a potential of discussing a thousand points (for sake of argument) yet we keep raising them one at a time to try to gain another foothold. That's the nature of the beast.
 

pegger

Electoral Member
Dec 4, 2008
397
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You're comparing "oranges" with "apples"- the $2000 was real money that was wisely spent, the $174B is only a projection, hasn't happened & if it does won't for 6 years. You should also take the two grand and multiply by the number of affected taxpayers before making a comparison. You might want to try Accounting Skills 101.

JLM - I wrote a response - but I won't publish it, because I become unreasonable on the topic of tax cuts to certain interest groups.

Sufficed to say I am ashamed that my generation is now running a deficit that will most likely have to be paid by my kids (who will have to pay off the debt created from the generation before mine). It's too bad others don't feel the same way. My support will go to the party that will focus on cleaning up the mess we make, rather than to the party that will leave it to yet another generation to clean up, just so I can have a few more $$s in my pocket.
 
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JLM

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JLM - I wrote a response - but I won't publish it, because I become unreasonable on the topic of tax cuts to certain interest groups.

Sufficed to say I am ashamed that my generation is now running a deficit that will most likely have to be paid by my kids (who will have to pay off the debt created from the generation before mine). It's too bad others don't feel the same way. My support will go to the party that will focus on cleaning up the mess we make, rather than to the party that will leave it to yet another generation to clean up, just so I can have a few more $$s in my pocket.

YEp, I agree 110%. A lot of our generation has had it very good. However in our wisdom we didn't elect good leaders to run the country namely Buffoon Trudeau and Buffoon Mulroney. However I don't know what I personally can do to improve things, I worked every day for 35 years, never drew E.I. or Welfare or W.C.B. or spent time in hospitals or prisons and yet paid my taxes faithfully every year. I continue to live fairly well today, but I can go back to eating beans for as long as Harper, Ignatieff or Layton want to lead the way.
 

captain morgan

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Unforgiven; You and i won't agree on anything. I have no problem with that, but it appears that you do.

I am tempted to respond to your 'post' but it is really a waste of my time. That said, rather than either of us rant and rave, why don't we wait for an election and view the results directly.

Iggy has the opportunity to unseat the gvt on the next vote.... This can happen in a matter of days and an election will result. The only question is if the liberals have the balls and the same confidence that you have to actually pull the trigger. They've sat on the fence for Harper's entire time in office and supported the gvt at every turn out of fear of an election.

I have yet to hear any formal position by the liberals on just about everything except for the ingenious plan on EI and their 'demands' that even more money be spent to save the global economy (no details mind you).

Until Iggy forwards something - anything - that the public can consider, the only talking points about Iggy are what the Conservative party decides should be the issues and that, to date, relates to Iggy's questionable opinions on Canada.

From my perspective, Iggy's silence on these ads works more to high-light the notion that Iggy is scared sh*tless and won't force an election despite holding the existing gvt "on probation"... No different than Dion.
 

Unforgiven

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Unforgiven; You and i won't agree on anything. I have no problem with that, but it appears that you do.

How do you know? We haven't talked about anything other than this I don't think. Do you make you mind up about things before they happen with everything?

I am tempted to respond to your 'post' but it is really a waste of my time. That said, rather than either of us rant and rave, why don't we wait for an election and view the results directly.

Like you have something else to do? Come on man, don't kid a kidder.

Iggy has the opportunity to unseat the gvt on the next vote.... This can happen in a matter of days and an election will result. The only question is if the liberals have the balls and the same confidence that you have to actually pull the trigger. They've sat on the fence for Harper's entire time in office and supported the gvt at every turn out of fear of an election.

It's going to happen, count on it.

I have yet to hear any formal position by the liberals on just about everything except for the ingenious plan on EI and their 'demands' that even more money be spent to save the global economy (no details mind you).

If Harper can manage to squeak out of the House and close things up for the Summer as he is clearly hoping to do, then you won't hear much from anyone on the real issues. But sooner or later, he's going to have to have a confidence vote in the house and we'll have an election. The question is, how long can he go on avoiding it? Once an election is called I suppose there will be alsorts of ideas to fix the problems the Harper has caused. Mind you with that there will be alsorts of attacks on Iggy from where he used to live to where he used to work. I think we've heard all that already though.

Until Iggy forward something - anything - that the public can consider, the only talking points about Iggy are what the Conservative party decides should be the issues and that, to date, relates to Iggy's questionable opinions on Canada.

At least he hasn't called anyone a "tar baby".

From my perspective, Iggy's silence on these ads works more to high-light the notion that Iggy is scared sh*tless and won't force an election despite holding the existing gvt "on probation"... No different than Dion.

Dion is gone, Iggy knows that he doesn't need the Bloc and NDP to support him as he and the Liberal party can and will crush the Conservatives based on their own record of mismanagement. Let alone the Chalk River catastrophe, the Multiple times Conservative ministers have forgotten Important secret documents and left them laying around for anyone to pick up. Not to mention all the stuff they promised and never made good on. Appointments, triple e senate, cleaning house of corruption. All still present and accounted for.

When the election is called, then we shall see what's what.
 

Socrates the Greek

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Liberal Party of Canada » By the numbers: Government waste under the 50 billion dollar man

By the numbers: Government waste under the 50 billion dollar man

Published on 29 May 2009


“There’s certainly nothing today that says we should go into deficit.”


- Stephen Harper, October 6, 2008
Consultants: The Harper government spent nearly $1 billion on consultants in its first two years in office – a 42 per cent increase compared to the Liberal government from 2004-06. ...................................



Isn’t that a proof that the Harper bunch have no clue of how an affective Government works? They spend $1 BILLION to find out how.

I wander if the 33% that still today will vote for these losers know what that means for their pockets?



 
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L Gilbert

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Turdeau gov't crap under a guy that added $185 billion to taxpayer debt and that was 3 decades ago when the dollar value was about 5 times what it is today. So 185B x 5 = almost a trillion. Thanks, Pierre
Harper's a novice in comparison.
 

Socrates the Greek

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Turdeau gov't crap under a guy that added $185 billion to taxpayer debt and that was 3 decades ago when the dollar value was about 5 times what it is today. So 185B x 5 = almost a trillion. Thanks, Pierre
Harper's a novice in comparison.

Throughout the History of the Liberals in Canada they did far far far better then the Cons will ever do. The Cons took $12 BILLION S PLUSS AND TURNED IT INTO A WAPPING $50 BILLION DEFECIT TO THIS DAY, who is bad for Canada the answer is clear not the Cons.
 

L Gilbert

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Throughout the History of the Liberals in Canada they did far far far better then the Cons will ever do. The Cons took $12 BILLION S PLUSS AND TURNED IT INTO A WAPPING $50 BILLION DEFECIT TO THIS DAY, who is bad for Canada the answer is clear not the Cons.
How the hell can you say what the Cons "will do"? Are you clairvoyant? If you are then tell me what I am going to do a half hour from now.
Besides, the Glibs are no better than the Cons. Take your blinders off and have a clear, objective assessment of them for a change. IMO, NEITHER party are worth a gob of goose shyte.
Besides, I'd rathewr have another Harpy than another Turdeau. By Turdeau's standards, in 2024 Canada would be 2 and a third TRILLION in debt.
 

pegger

Electoral Member
Dec 4, 2008
397
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Turdeau gov't crap under a guy that added $185 billion to taxpayer debt and that was 3 decades ago when the dollar value was about 5 times what it is today. So 185B x 5 = almost a trillion. Thanks, Pierre
Harper's a novice in comparison.

3 decades ago I was 5. I didn't have a lot choice back then. Today I do. My experience has been Chrieten/Martin - who ended the deficits and paid down the debt (thanks to the GST (probably the only right thing Mulroney did)), and reducing payments to the provinces (which I support anyways because I think equalization is a sham) vs Harper who threw money at the provinces, increased spending to all time highs before the recession, made stupid (but politically expediant) cuts to the GST, and is now proposing $50B / year deficits....

Harper is an abject failure. I will not vote Conservative so long as he is leader of that party, and I despise him further for basically forcing me to vote Liberal next election to boot his sorry a$$ out of office.
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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How the hell can you say what the Cons "will do"? Are you clairvoyant? If you are then tell me what I am going to do a half hour from now.
Besides, the Glibs are no better than the Cons. Take your blinders off and have a clear, objective assessment of them for a change. IMO, NEITHER party are worth a gob of goose shyte.
Besides, I'd rathewr have another Harpy than another Turdeau. By Turdeau's standards, in 2024 Canada would be 2 and a third TRILLION in debt.


Good day LG, NO BLINDERS HERE, MY FINACIAL STATEMENTS WERE BEST UNDER A LIBERAL GOVERNMENT. As soon as the cons came to power, my business took a 60% DIVE BECAUSE OF THE STUPID METHOD OF COLLECTING THE GST. STUPID THEN MULRONEY MADE THE GST APLICABLE TO BUSINESS ONLY AND NOT IN THE PRIVATE SECTROR. Do you know what that CAUSED? It created an underground market and people did not have to pay GST from the sale of cars to renovations and many OTHER SERVICES THAT WERE GST EXEMPT BEING THAT IT WAS A PRIVATE SALE. I never said I am a clairvoyant but today my friend I use our Canadian political past to stay away from cheating losers like the Cons.

 

L Gilbert

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3 decades ago I was 5. I didn't have a lot choice back then. Today I do. My experience has been Chrieten/Martin - who ended the deficits and paid down the debt (thanks to the GST (probably the only right thing Mulroney did)), and reducing payments to the provinces (which I support anyways because I think equalization is a sham) vs Harper who threw money at the provinces, increased spending to all time highs before the recession, made stupid (but politically expediant) cuts to the GST, and is now proposing $50B / year deficits....
I agree about the equalisation thing.
And I agree that Martin balanced budgets. The problem I have with Martin doing that is HOW he did it. He sacrificed the lederly and students for it all the while doling out nifty goodies to his rich buddies. Martin is a silver-spooned, bombastic a$$hole. BTW, he also supported groups Canada has declared terrorists.

So when you bring up names like Chretien and Martin and still condemn Harper, you are simply displaying yourself as someone with blinders on.

Harper is an abject failure. I will not vote Conservative so long as he is leader of that party, and I despise him further for basically forcing me to vote Liberal next election to boot his sorry a$$ out of office.
I don't like Harpy any more than you do, but I sure as hell won't vote for Iggy when he says stuff that would cost us more, too.
The way out of this is to get people back to work. And spending gobs on EI like Iggy would, or spending gobs on failing businesses like Harpy does, is not what will work.
Spending money on grants and low interest loans to back up companies that look to the future will, IMO.
 

pegger

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L Gilbert - How do you figure? You made the comparision between Trudeau and Harper. I made a comparision between more recent PMs and this one.

I could easily condemn both Martin and Chretien too - I wouldn't use either as pardigms of what a PM should be.

In fact I think comparing any PM to any other PM is a waste of time- they should be judged on their own merits.

Based on that, I cannot think of one positive contribution Harper has made to this country. This country is worse off because of him, and as such he is a failure.
 

Socrates the Greek

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.... and you'd vote liberal in spite of their past shenanigans. Yeah, that's logical.:roll:

No I vote Liberal because the country has done better under the Liberal watch vs the Cons that have no clue what the right hand is doing different from the left.